[Archived] Parents Warn Your Kids!

[dave birch]

Abs, Col is right about abuse to kids, most of it comes from someone they know. Frightening, yes.

[ABBEY]

i know what he means but its me queasy even thinking about it..

[Rovermatt]

Simply locking up sex offenders does little to fix the problem. They learn to refine their predatory techniques when mixing with others of their ilk.

So leave them in there, society's dregs, who cares ?

You know what? I can't disagree with that at all...

Such nonsense talk only perpetuates the problem , Matt . For all the "experts" we have and for all the so called advances in psychiatry and councelling , the number of such offenders always seem to increase . It's time to dispense with the soft approach , stop treating these people as medically sick and treat them instead with new tougher laws that will keep them off the streets . Permanently . The only thing that is preventing real justice today is this obsessional belief by similarly deluded "experts" that only a "liberal" approach to crime can work.

The reporting of the crimes has gone up. This sort of thing has always gone on. Sexual abuse within the family circle is statistically higher than any activities of dirty old men who live with their mothers.

I have no problem about locking up these people. For good if necessary. Yet, whether you like it or not, this sort of deviancy is a severly disturbing illness. Why shouldn't it be addressed?

[ABBEY]

[

I have no problem about locking up these people. For good if necessary. Yet, whether you like it or not, this sort of deviancy is a severly disturbing illness. Why shouldn't it be addressed?

dont care if its illness or whatever ...once they done it its too late they should be shot simple as.

[blue phil]

Totally agree , Abs . Once they've committed the crime - whether its' against members of their own family doesn't matter one jot - then they should forfeit the right to live in society for a very , very long time . Anyone who offends again should be executed . Society's first priority is to look after its own law abiding citizens.

[colin]

I was advocating their complete removal from society, rather than sending them to a trick cyclist and releasing them with a silicon chip strapped to their arse.

Probably my preferred option too.

There should be a more efficient way of treating paedophiles as mentally ill rather than criminals so that taking them out of society for long term treatment is an preferred option to a fixed-term jail sentance.

I'll maintain my stance that the tabloids are scare-mongering scum just trying to whip up hysteria and paranoia.

Correction: they are not trying, they've done it.

I'm a nervous wreck when I lose sight of the daughter in the park. Even though I know that if she meets 100,000 strangers 99,999 of then will look after her.

Strange isn't it, how we have all got ourselves in a right state over something that is highly unlikely to happen?

[blue phil]

Strange isn't it, how we have all got ourselves in a right state over something that is highly unlikely to happen?

Highly unlikely indeed ! But this bloke has been getting away with it for 40 years , and despite being captured before will undoubtedly be plying his trade again in a few years time . What a wonderful liberal society we live in .....

(From tonight's Telegraph - Friday)

Eight years jail for girls' abuser

A PERVERTED pensioner was today starting an eight-year jail term, bringing to an end a 40-year reign of child sex abuse.

Grandfather Eric Green, now 66, was first sent to prison in 1964 for molesting under-age girls.

His latest victims, three of them now adults, had not earlier complained to police about their ordeals at his hands.

Green had carried on his behaviour because he thought he could get away with it, a court was told.

Green's wife had called in officers after suspicions over abuse of one of the victims almost 20 years ago.

He was brought to justice after he sexually attacked a little girl earlier this year and other complainants then came forward.

The defendant protested his innocence to a jury throughout a four-day trial and insisted the complainants' claims were nightmares or lies.

He was found guilty at Burnley Crown Court of 10 charges of indecent assault against four victims between 1973 and 2004.

Green was also given a two-year extended licence period.

He was made the subject of a sex offences prevention order, was placed on the sex offences register for life and was banned from working with children.

Sentencing, Judge Stuart Baker told Green he would probably be in custody for the rest of his life.

Green, of Colne Road, Burnley, had denied the charges against him.

After he was convicted, it was revealed he had been sent to jail when he was 26 for allegations of indecent assault and unlawful sexual intercourse.

The court had been told Green had touched and stroked his victims and made them fondle him.

One of his victims, now 25, had fought back tears as she told the jury how she had not told anybody what happened to her until she was 18 when she opened her heart to her mother.

She said she had not reported the abuse, which took place when she was eight or nine, to police at that stage as she had felt she wanted to move on with her life and put the past behind her.

The woman said she had felt guilty when she heard of the accusations made against Green by the little girl. She continued: "I felt I could have stopped that if I had made a complaint."

Giving evidence, Green told the court none of the victims' allegations was true and swore he had done nothing.

He said three of the complainants had got their heads together and concocted their evidence and continued: "My liberty is at stake here."

The defendant alleged he had been honest with police from the beginning and said the victims' evidence was so graphic it was like something out of a film.

After the jury's verdict, John Sawyer, defending, said Green was supported by his wife and was proud of his family and what they had achieved. He would have to cope with his time behind bars.

Edited November 12, 2004 by blue phil

[Rovermatt]

Strange isn't it, how we have all got ourselves in a right state over something that is highly unlikely to happen?

Highly unlikely indeed ! But this bloke has been getting away with it for 40 years , and despite being captured before will undoubtedly be plying his trade again in a few years time . What a wonderful liberal society we live in .....

No honestly, it is highly unlikely.

Believe it or not Phil, the alternatives to that 'liberal society' we live in, are much worse.

[thenodrog]

Believe it or not Phil, the alternatives to that 'liberal society' we live in, are much worse.

Please spare us all such feeble and empty statements Matt, and explain what you mean.

[colin]

Believe it or not Phil, the alternatives to that 'liberal society' we live in, are much worse.

Please spare us all such feeble and empty statements Matt, and explain what you mean.

As Phil agreed these occurances are highly unlikely to happen, but we, as a society, give them very very high priority.

In a similar vein eight people died in a "train accident" last week and it was all over the front pages. In fact it wasn't a "train accident" it was probably the result of a mentally ill man committing suicide.

Rather like the "Great Heck train accident" of a year or so ago which was reported as being a "train accident" but was in fact a road traffic accident because some dozy sod stayed up all night and then fell asleep while driving his car, rolled off the road, and derailed a train, killing people in the process.

Now imagine that the mentally ill man had not been suicidal and had decided to kill himself (and eight others,) but had instead decided to abuse children.

I'm not certain whether I could accept the theoretical loss of one of my loved ones better or worse because the cause of their death was:

(i) a sick paedophile

(ii) a sick suicide or

(iii) a bloody stupid motorist.

If you want to exact revenge on (i) then logically you've got to do it on (ii) (apart from the fact he's dead anyway) & (iii)

Anyhoo, just to finish off.

Perhaps Rovermatt's comment was to suggest that cutting off people's hands and beheading would be a worthy alternative if you were in that frame of mind, but I'm sure you're not wanting to go up that avenue again. But I'll leave that to him/her to clarify

Allah forbid.

What did you think of our performance today? I reckon we did OK.

Edited November 13, 2004 by colin

[blue phil]

I'm not certain whether I could accept the theoretical loss of one of my loved ones better or worse because the cause of their death was:

(i) a sick paedophile

(ii) a sick suicide or

(iii) a bloody stupid motorist.

If you want to exact revenge on (i) then logically you've got to do it on (ii) (apart from the fact he's dead anyway) & (iii)

It's not a question of "exacting revenge" ; it's a question of punishment (for the crime), prevention (ie - stopping the culprit from repeating), and deterrence (of others by imposing a tough sentence .) You could argue that in sex crimes the deterrence factor is very small - I wouldn't necessarily disagree , but a liberal/lenient sentence is worthless as a safety precaution for the public , however small the risk to them is . It's still a risk that could be minimised further by harsher measures.

Your comparisons with the "suicide" and the motorist aren't really valid . A suicide simply can't be prevented - what can you threaten him with ? And afterwards punishment is irrelevant . No paedophile commits his crime as a suicide measure ! His main priority is to escape justice and offend again.

The motorist who fell asleep is guilty only of an act of stupidity which had tragic consequences . Surely this is not in the same category as the paedo who committed his crime with pre-determined malice. Harsh punishment may be deserved as a deterrent factor , but probably only for that reason .

Out of the three cases you present , only the first could be truly prevented - and then only by a justice system that is willing to confront the problem as soon as it presents itself.

[thenodrog]

I'm not certain whether I could accept the theoretical loss of one of my loved ones better or worse because the cause of their death was:

(i) a sick paedophile

(ii) a sick suicide or

(iii) a bloody stupid motorist.

If you want to exact revenge on (i) then logically you've got to do it on (ii) (apart from the fact he's dead anyway) & (iii)

I'm not legally trained but shouldn't the term 'pre-meditated' apply somewhere in response to the points made in your argument?

[Rovermatt]

Believe it or not Phil, the alternatives to that 'liberal society' we live in, are much worse.

Please spare us all such feeble and empty statements Matt, and explain what you mean.

This 'liberal' agenda or whatever it is that is constantly referred to is preferable to our society being run by the ill-informed hordes who see things in black in black and white and move to administer justice through some sort of crazed mob ceremony. Quite why the 'liberal elite' would want child molesters roaming around our streets praying on kids is beyond me. Yes the laws are weak, but this problem has always existed. Only now is it rightfully coming to the fore. Personally I'm all for these hateful acts being punished by much harsher sentencing. As a civilized society though, are we not above exacting brutal punishments as they do in 'backward' facing cultures such as, erm...Islam?

Edited November 14, 2004 by Rovermatt

[thenodrog]

This 'liberal' agenda or whatever it is that is constantly referred to is preferable to our society being run by the ill-informed hordes who see things in black in black and white and move to administer justice through some sort of crazed mob ceremony.

But how many other countries can you name nowadays whose political / legal system works like that?

[ABBEY]

I'm all for these hateful acts being punished by much harsher sentencing. As a civilized society though, are we not above exacting brutal punishments as they do in 'backward' facing cultures such as, erm...Islam?

well islam or whatever ,what religion has to do with this emotive subject is beyond me .....going back to what colin said earlier about family members....

ive beeb chatting to a friend of mine today whose been telling me about his daughter being abused by his wifes dad and the police have warned him if anything happens then my friends in a lot of trouble...even his wife wants bad ###### for her dad.I didnt know what to say or do ,just feel so bad for t he family and more family members have come forward as well.

[blue phil]

Interesting piece in tonight's LET (Thursday) :

"Sex attack on girl, 15

A 15-YEAR-OLD schoolgirl was subjected to a serious sex attack as she walked home yesterday teatime.

The incident has prompted police to advise women not to walk alone and to carry torches and attack alarms when out after dark.

The teenager was attacked in bushes close to Roe Lee Park at around 4.30pm in what police today described as the latest in a line of similar attacks across Blackburn.

The girl told detectives she was attacked by an Asian man who had begun walking close to her while she was on Whalley New Road.

After tracking her along Ruby Street and Cornelia Street, he began walking next to her along Towpath Street before overtaking her as they approached Roe Lee Park Road.

He then stood in the entrance of Roe Lee Park, before pulling the girl into bushes and putting his hands up her skirt.

The girl kicked him between the legs and screamed and the man ran off.

Insp Steve Haworth, of Blackburn Police, said: "The teenager did all the right things and fortunately she wasn't badly harmed.

"This isn't the first attack like this to have occurred in Blackburn in recent months so we would urge women walking by themselves to take precautions."

The schoolgirl described her attacker as a light-skinned Asian man in his late 20s who was about 5ft 10ins to 6ft tall. His voice was low and he spoke with broken English. He had a distinctive thin moustache running round his mouth."

"The latest in a line of similar attacks " our esteemed local paper reports . Strange ; this is the first I've heard and I keep my ears open on subjects like this . Could it be that such incidents are being kept quiet ? A bit like the recent beatings and stabbings by Asians that were only seriously reported after about seven attacks or more and after two lives were nearly lost ?

Maybe a Stephen Larwence type enquiry should be launched - but in Blair's Britain I fear that such enquiries only apply to the "minorities" . Justice does not apply equally it seems if you're white and working class and the perpetrators are "ethnic".

Now I'm sure that a lot of people will deny these are racist crimes (the usual suspects I presume who refuse to believe our Asian/Muslim brethren are capable of any racist crimes ) but I would suggest that Blackburn is already in the grip of endemic racism of the kind that can be found in many towns across the North - all towns where (surprise , surprise ) there are large Asian/Muslim communities .

Some brave politicians (all too few I'm afraid ) , and in particular the Labour MP Ann Cryer , have drawn attention in recent times to the medieval customs of some of our Asian compatriats with regard to their own women (forced marriages , domestic violence , re-education on the sub continent for those deemed too westernised etc) , and increasingly now to the indigenous women , many of whom are groomed from an early age to be merely sexual play things for young Asians who are contemptuous of the law enforcers who in turn are fearful of the "racist" witch hunt that would inevitably be unleashed upon them if they try and apply the law to Asian/Muslims .

Mrs Cryer - whose views are well known to those of us who are willing to condemn racism from whichever direction it emnates - is now in an unenviable position . Should she continue her brave stance against Islamic corruption and child abuse ? Or should she learn the lesson of Pym Forteyn and Van Gogh in Holland , keep her mouth shut , and save not just her career but maybe even her life ....?

[thenodrog]

Interesting piece in tonight's LET (Thursday) :

"Sex attack on girl, 15

A 15-YEAR-OLD schoolgirl was subjected to a serious sex attack as she walked home yesterday teatime.

This (these) is obviously a very serious offence but imo it will get worse in future. Speak to many women / girls in Blackburn that live near Asian areas and they will shock you regrding the level of vile sexual verbal abuse that they recieve from Asian youth simply because they are white women. It seems that many of these people simply hold no respect for white women and treat them as being lowest of the low in any manner that they feel appropriate.

I suggest that they should be taught more awareness, respect and social skills as children and less warped interpretations of the Koran during their daily visit to the mosque. BTW Does anybody know whether or not the teachings and indeed teachers in these places of supreme influence on childrens development come under any sort of regular inspections or scrutiny by our authorities? To even help with the running of a Cub scout football team nowadays adults must be vetted by the Police to determine suitability. Does this happen in the mosques? And is the 'content and direction' of their teachings ever scrutinised?

[Rovermatt]

...Now I'm sure that a lot of people will deny these are racist crimes (the usual suspects I presume who refuse to believe our Asian/Muslim brethren are capable of any racist crimes ) but I would suggest that Blackburn is already in the grip of endemic racism of the kind that can be found in many towns across the North - all towns where (surprise , surprise ) there are large Asian/Muslim communities .

What about this f***er? He mustn't haven't done it then...

Theno, if these evil Imams have no respect for women in their own comunity, why on earth are they going to respect women from the wider community? It's hardly shocking.

Edited November 19, 2004 by Rovermatt

[thenodrog]

Theno, if these evil Imams have no respect for women in their own comunity, why on earth are they going to respect women from the wider community? It's hardly shocking.

Oh well thats OK then. We'll just have to let em carry on regardless I suppose. There's no point in trying to alter things for the better is there?

You will prob recognise the shocking bit Matt when something similar befalls a female friend or member of your family from people previously 'instructed' by these primitive barstewards.

[colin]

I suggest that they should be taught more awareness, respect and social skills as children and less warped interpretations of the Koran during their daily visit to the mosque.

BTW Does anybody know whether or not the teachings and indeed teachers in these places of supreme influence on childrens development come under any sort of regular inspections or scrutiny by our authorities?

Your second sentence suggests that the first is not really based upon any knowledge at all.

What "less warped interpretations of The Koran" are you thinking about in particular? You have seemingly got slap-bang up-to-date information on Islamic teachings. Care to share this?

But back on the subject

This is a thought provoking article

David Wilson is professor of criminology at the Centre for Criminal Justice Policy and Research

[blue phil]

Interesting article , Colin , about how gullible some do gooders are when they are dealing with these most manipulative of criminals .

Mind you , if myself and a few like minded persons from the real world were to volunteer to be part of the pervert's new found "family" , I reckon I could guarantee with absolute certainty that he wouldn't re offend !!

Maybe the state should do likewise - after all , dead men can't re offend at all ......

Edited November 19, 2004 by blue phil

[Rovermatt]

Theno, if these evil Imams have no respect for women in their own comunity, why on earth are they going to respect women from the wider community? It's hardly shocking.

Oh well thats OK then. We'll just have to let em carry on regardless I suppose. There's no point in trying to alter things for the better is there?

You will prob recognise the shocking bit Matt when something similar befalls a female friend or member of your family from people previously 'instructed' by these primitive barstewards.

Well the way you're going on, it's bound to happen sooner rather than later. Should I start shopping every Muslim I see now or wait a couple of days?

Edited November 19, 2004 by Rovermatt

[BuckyRover]

ive beeb chatting to a friend of mine today whose been telling me about his daughter being abused by his wifes dad and the police have warned him if anything happens then my friends in a lot of trouble...even his wife wants bad ###### for her dad.I didnt know what to say or do ,just feel so bad for t he family and more family members have come forward as well.

What happens when the daughter asks what has happened to her grandad?

"Don't worry I have killed him just for you"

That would make everything ok!

I have moved away from Blackburn but when I read the neanderthal like drivel written on here on topics such as race and crime, it makes me glad I have moved away.

[thenodrog]

I have moved away from Blackburn but when I read the neanderthal like drivel written on here on topics such as race and crime, it makes me glad I have moved away.

Wasn't Peter Sutcliffe from Leeds Bucky?

Weren't there race riots in Bradford in 2001 Bucky?

Better keep on going cock.

[BuckyRover]

No mate, I live in an area that is 39% asian (official demographic records), it's a student area.

I have had no problem's with anybody and if I were to have problem's I would blame it on myself rather than "them" other people.

And I will say for the minority of racist people I know at Uni, they are not the ones who are going to get the firsts. Not by a long shot.

Read into that what you will.

Oh and by the way I loved your conclusive defence, cock