[Archived] Bolton Game 0-1

[ace]

As usual, a contrary point of view gets shouted down by the group-thinking mob.

This is a message board for Rovers supporters, of all opinions and backgrounds, not a showcase to impress to$$ers from other clubs.

According to the new Lenin that is Sir Waggy..your views are irrelevant because you live too far away.

[gillibrand]

According to the new Lenin that is Sir Waggy..your views are irrelevant because you live too far away.

[Exiled in Toronto]

According to the new Lenin that is Sir Waggy..your views are irrelevant because you live too far away.

I never said he was perfect but I support his right to express it as a view

[roversmum]

I read what you are saying Waggy. I was with you when we greeted Paul Ince and spoke of our hopes following his appointment as Manager.

It all seemed to be going so well at first. Rumours came out of Brockhall but we dismissed them as just rumours, and there was constant denial that anything was wrong.

The first result at Everton seemed to seal the matter. An excellent three points. Then doubts began to set in. I baulked at the signing of Robbie Fowler, a man I have little time for. I was willing to give Andrews and Robinson a chance, and I felt that Ince was not to directly blame for Friedel and Bentley leaving - although Friedel's departure nearly broke my heart - there was something about seeing Big Brad between the sticks that seemed to epitomise what Rovers were about and I missed him badly. Players were played in strange positions and the excuse was that injuries left the Guv'nor with no choice. Goals against us began to escalate, but the fans stood steadfastly behind the team and sang their hearts out at matches. However, it began to dawn on some that there was indeed something very wrong happening. Lack lustre performances, still more goals, and Rovers began to slip down to the bottom of the League Table. Eventually enough was enough, and John Williams and the Board had no choice but to act in the hope that our Premier League status might be preserved.

In the summer I hoped for Ten Cate, I did NOT want Sam Allardyce for many reasons which were stated on another thread. However, having supported Paul Ince and hoped that the rumours were wrong, despair began to overcome me as the half season approached. We seemed unable to get even a point, there was little leadership from the touchline and substitutions became even more bizarre. Towards the end, as Paul looked close to tears, I did shed a few myself. I feel sorry for Paul as the dream shattered, but it wasn't just his dream, it was the dream of several thousand loyal fans. Paul, I wish you every success in the future, but you have to work and prepare just as much if not more in the Premier League as elsewhere, a squad of Premiership players, talented as they may be, cannot run themselves.

Now to Big Sam. He ruled himself out of the running in the summer, fair enough. I was glad. I saw him around on tv, and at Rovers occasionally watching the matches from the stands. There was suddenly a decision to be made. Rovers were managerless at a crucial point in the season. Should it be Souness to return as the Saviour? I wasn't sure. I love the guy and thoroughly enjoyed his tenure at Rovers until things began to go wrong and it was quite a relief when he went to Newcastle. The fitness of the squad was a worry at that time and I didn't want that history to repeat itself. I looked at Sam's record, particularly his years at Bolton and there was no doubt that he had done rather well there. However, there was still the question of brown envelopes - although, I reasoned, nothing had ever been proved. There was the alleged long ball football - well, looking at some of the stuff we had been serving up recently, a long ball with someone on the end of it actually scoring a goalbegan to look rather enticing.

And so, Big Sam came to Rovers. The delight of the man as his appointment was announced enthused me. I had seen many smiles from Paul Ince, but this was something different. The Press Conference was refreshing in that the Big Man made it quite clear what he was about and I began to warm to him. I now find myself looking forward to matches once more - and even if we do have the misfortune to go down I feel quite clearly that Sam is the man who will get us back to the Premiership again, a feeling I did not have with Paul Ince.

Waggy, most of us were very sorry that things did not pan out for Paul. However, he is young, the experience will be good for him and he will learn from it.

Things were happening that could not be allowed to continue and the Board had no choice.

Please don't give up on your Rovers because of this. You love the club, and it is the club you support. If that is not the case, and it is Paul Ince that you support, then no doubt you will be able to follow your football at his next club. I don't believe that is the case though and I hope you will reconsider your position and join us as we support our new Manager and enjoy the ride ahead.

[T4E]

I never said he was perfect but I support his right to express it as a view

Even when he's clearly trolling and on the wind-up? Why not just put these comments in the Allardyce thread?

[CrazyIvan]

I read what you are saying Waggy. I was with you when we greeted Paul Ince and spoke of our hopes following his appointment as Manager.

...

I hope you will reconsider your position and join us as we support our new Manager and enjoy the ride ahead.

Spot on and well said.

Edited December 19, 2008 by CrazyIvan

[grizfoot]

I remember this game and thread well, back then we pretty much all hated Big Sam. He doesn't half sprout some rubbish in after match interviews sometimes. But the truth of the matter is the best managers defend their players at all cost, you rarely see Fergie or Wenger come out and critise their own players. They try to take the attention of their players and put it on themselves.

If I remember correctly Big Sam pulled off Diouf within minutes of the dive. Which was another sign that he knew he'd done something wrong. Despite him never criticing Diouf pubically I'm sure he would have had a word with him in private.

[den]

Good post roversmum - and I reckon that's how a lot of feel.

When Sam was at Bolton, I slagged the style of football off, like pretty much every other rovers fan did. That was then, though. Now is now. I thought Sam was the right man for Rovers in the summer, for the simple reason that after Hughes's tenancy, we needed someone who would make, or keep us, hard to beat.

What's the point in holding grudges? If he's the right man, he's the right man - no matter where he's been previously. As for style of football, well, we'll have to wait and see. JW said on the radio this morning that he would love the neat, slick passing game, that wins matches. However, he's never met a fan yet that likes to lose 4-3. He said "results, that's what it's all about". And he's right.

It's a strange stance by Waggy. Firstly he stands by Ince who was crap, simply because he was the manager and all rovers fans should back the manager - then he's not going again because of who the manager is!

Edited December 19, 2008 by den

[tony gale's mic]

if you had read my post on a locked thread,

SEEING THE ORIGINAL THREAD WITH THE POLL On BFS, has been locked this one will do.i cannot believe jw has picked this c555k to manage my team,last night i gave away my season ticket,i simply refuse to watch a team managed by this man.hopefully he will be gone within the year,i do not want rovers to go down,i do not want rovers to lose a game,like some off you so called supporters.i hope he saves us from relagation and finds another job

i cannot and will not watch the rovers whilst he is the manager

Pathetic. And you have the gall to call others "so called supporters".

[leftfooter]

I read what you are saying Waggy. I was with you when we greeted Paul Ince and spoke of our hopes following his appointment as Manager.

It all seemed to be going so well at first. Rumours came out of Brockhall but we dismissed them as just rumours, and there was constant denial that anything was wrong.

The first result at Everton seemed to seal the matter. An excellent three points. Then doubts began to set in. I baulked at the signing of Robbie Fowler, a man I have little time for. I was willing to give Andrews and Robinson a chance, and I felt that Ince was not to directly blame for Friedel and Bentley leaving - although Friedel's departure nearly broke my heart - there was something about seeing Big Brad between the sticks that seemed to epitomise what Rovers were about and I missed him badly. Players were played in strange positions and the excuse was that injuries left the Guv'nor with no choice. Goals against us began to escalate, but the fans stood steadfastly behind the team and sang their hearts out at matches. However, it began to dawn on some that there was indeed something very wrong happening. Lack lustre performances, still more goals, and Rovers began to slip down to the bottom of the League Table. Eventually enough was enough, and John Williams and the Board had no choice but to act in the hope that our Premier League status might be preserved.

In the summer I hoped for Ten Cate, I did NOT want Sam Allardyce for many reasons which were stated on another thread. However, having supported Paul Ince and hoped that the rumours were wrong, despair began to overcome me as the half season approached. We seemed unable to get even a point, there was little leadership from the touchline and substitutions became even more bizarre. Towards the end, as Paul looked close to tears, I did shed a few myself. I feel sorry for Paul as the dream shattered, but it wasn't just his dream, it was the dream of several thousand loyal fans. Paul, I wish you every success in the future, but you have to work and prepare just as much if not more in the Premier League as elsewhere, a squad of Premiership players, talented as they may be, cannot run themselves.

Now to Big Sam. He ruled himself out of the running in the summer, fair enough. I was glad. I saw him around on tv, and at Rovers occasionally watching the matches from the stands. There was suddenly a decision to be made. Rovers were managerless at a crucial point in the season. Should it be Souness to return as the Saviour? I wasn't sure. I love the guy and thoroughly enjoyed his tenure at Rovers until things began to go wrong and it was quite a relief when he went to Newcastle. The fitness of the squad was a worry at that time and I didn't want that history to repeat itself. I looked at Sam's record, particularly his years at Bolton and there was no doubt that he had done rather well there. However, there was still the question of brown envelopes - although, I reasoned, nothing had ever been proved. There was the alleged long ball football - well, looking at some of the stuff we had been serving up recently, a long ball with someone on the end of it actually scoring a goalbegan to look rather enticing.

And so, Big Sam came to Rovers. The delight of the man as his appointment was announced enthused me. I had seen many smiles from Paul Ince, but this was something different. The Press Conference was refreshing in that the Big Man made it quite clear what he was about and I began to warm to him. I now find myself looking forward to matches once more - and even if we do have the misfortune to go down I feel quite clearly that Sam is the man who will get us back to the Premiership again, a feeling I did not have with Paul Ince.

Waggy, most of us were very sorry that things did not pan out for Paul. However, he is young, the experience will be good for him and he will learn from it.

Things were happening that could not be allowed to continue and the Board had no choice.

Please don't give up on your Rovers because of this. You love the club, and it is the club you support. If that is not the case, and it is Paul Ince that you support, then no doubt you will be able to follow your football at his next club. I don't believe that is the case though and I hope you will reconsider your position and join us as we support our new Manager and enjoy the ride ahead.

Perhaps we can have a post of the month award?

[BRFC4EVA]

You're pathetic. There's no other words for it.

Not quite as simple as that, but thanks for your thought out response. 10 years ago, imo, the club were in a very similiar position. A team full of underachieving, overpaid and injury prone players that ended up being relegated. Within 2 years we had forced our way back, in the mean time having cleared away most of the dead wood, played some of the most exciting football we seen in years with a good staple of players through the ranks and brought back a feel good factor to Ewood (remember our home and travelling supports in our first 2 years back in the prem?).

My main point was that if we cannot sta in the prem with a manager who plays attacking good football-then perhaps we are due a 'cleaning out process' I beleive clubs like ours need them from time to time. 8 years ago we returned a far stronger club then we went down as-ive no reason to feel why it should not be like this again.

Furthermore, the hypicrosy on here is incredible-there is an 8 page thread discussing what a pr1ck '###### Sam' is, not all of it was written by Waggy and me....

[den]

8 years ago we returned a far stronger club then we went down as-ive no reason to feel why it should not be like this again.

This let's your whole post down though, doesn't it.

We had Jack Walker's money then. John Williams has said himself many times that if we went down again it would be a financial disaster and it could very well be a long time before we got back again - if ever.

[tony gale's mic]

Not quite as simple as that, but thanks for your thought out response. 10 years ago, imo, the club were in a very similiar position. A team full of underachieving, overpaid and injury prone players that ended up being relegated. Within 2 years we had forced our way back, in the mean time having cleared away most of the dead wood, played some of the most exciting football we seen in years with a good staple of players through the ranks and brought back a feel good factor to Ewood (remember our home and travelling supports in our first 2 years back in the prem?).

My main point was that if we cannot sta in the prem with a manager who plays attacking good football-then perhaps we are due a 'cleaning out process' I beleive clubs like ours need them from time to time. 8 years ago we returned a far stronger club then we went down as-ive no reason to feel why it should not be like this again.

Furthermore, the hypicrosy on here is incredible-there is an 8 page thread discussing what a pr1ck '###### Sam' is, not all of it was written by Waggy and me....

We had lots more money then.

The other teams had far, far less money.

We had bright young players in Duff and Dunn, players who were good even the season we went down but weren't going to leave as they'd been brought through the ranks.

Now anyone remotely good is going to want to leave.

You know squat all about football, now naff off to Turf Moor because we sure as hell don't need fans like you.

[roversmum]

I hold my hand up here, I was one of those who slated Sam on that thread. I do not consider myself too old to be unable to learn a lesson from it.

I felt the same about Robbie Savage and Craig Bellamy, and whilst only a mother could love Craig, once he and Robbie were Rovers I stood squarely behind them and supported them.

I have always believed there is no shame in admitting you were wrong. I will do so if Sam proves to be wrong for Rovers and I will do so if Paul Ince takes over at Newcastle and is a resounding success there.

[tony gale's mic]

I hold my hand up here, I was one of those who slated Sam on that thread. I do not consider myself too old to be unable to learn a lesson from it.

I felt the same about Robbie Savage and Craig Bellamy, and whilst only a mother could love Craig, once he and Robbie were Rovers I stood squarely behind them and supported them.

I have always believed there is no shame in admitting you were wrong. I will do so if Sam proves to be wrong for Rovers and I will do so if Paul Ince takes over at Newcastle and is a resounding success there.

I slated Sam, I was wrong too.

I mean he wasn't the best choice for us in the summer (Laudrup and HTC were), but we should have instantly have seen he was a better choice than Ince.

But now he is the perfect man for the job.

[AggyBlue]

I slated Sam, I was wrong too.

I mean he wasn't the best choice for us in the summer (Laudrup and HTC were), but we should have instantly have seen he was a better choice than Ince.

But now he is the perfect man for the job.

I almost agree with you.

He wasn't the right choice in the summer IMO.

He is the only choice now IMO.

[philipl]

Roversmum, that was a fabulous post.

[Billy Castell]

I read what you are saying Waggy. I was with you when we greeted Paul Ince and spoke of our hopes following his appointment as Manager.

It all seemed to be going so well at first. Rumours came out of Brockhall but we dismissed them as just rumours, and there was constant denial that anything was wrong.

The first result at Everton seemed to seal the matter. An excellent three points. Then doubts began to set in. I baulked at the signing of Robbie Fowler, a man I have little time for. I was willing to give Andrews and Robinson a chance, and I felt that Ince was not to directly blame for Friedel and Bentley leaving - although Friedel's departure nearly broke my heart - there was something about seeing Big Brad between the sticks that seemed to epitomise what Rovers were about and I missed him badly. Players were played in strange positions and the excuse was that injuries left the Guv'nor with no choice. Goals against us began to escalate, but the fans stood steadfastly behind the team and sang their hearts out at matches. However, it began to dawn on some that there was indeed something very wrong happening. Lack lustre performances, still more goals, and Rovers began to slip down to the bottom of the League Table. Eventually enough was enough, and John Williams and the Board had no choice but to act in the hope that our Premier League status might be preserved.

In the summer I hoped for Ten Cate, I did NOT want Sam Allardyce for many reasons which were stated on another thread. However, having supported Paul Ince and hoped that the rumours were wrong, despair began to overcome me as the half season approached. We seemed unable to get even a point, there was little leadership from the touchline and substitutions became even more bizarre. Towards the end, as Paul looked close to tears, I did shed a few myself. I feel sorry for Paul as the dream shattered, but it wasn't just his dream, it was the dream of several thousand loyal fans. Paul, I wish you every success in the future, but you have to work and prepare just as much if not more in the Premier League as elsewhere, a squad of Premiership players, talented as they may be, cannot run themselves.

Now to Big Sam. He ruled himself out of the running in the summer, fair enough. I was glad. I saw him around on tv, and at Rovers occasionally watching the matches from the stands. There was suddenly a decision to be made. Rovers were managerless at a crucial point in the season. Should it be Souness to return as the Saviour? I wasn't sure. I love the guy and thoroughly enjoyed his tenure at Rovers until things began to go wrong and it was quite a relief when he went to Newcastle. The fitness of the squad was a worry at that time and I didn't want that history to repeat itself. I looked at Sam's record, particularly his years at Bolton and there was no doubt that he had done rather well there. However, there was still the question of brown envelopes - although, I reasoned, nothing had ever been proved. There was the alleged long ball football - well, looking at some of the stuff we had been serving up recently, a long ball with someone on the end of it actually scoring a goalbegan to look rather enticing.

And so, Big Sam came to Rovers. The delight of the man as his appointment was announced enthused me. I had seen many smiles from Paul Ince, but this was something different. The Press Conference was refreshing in that the Big Man made it quite clear what he was about and I began to warm to him. I now find myself looking forward to matches once more - and even if we do have the misfortune to go down I feel quite clearly that Sam is the man who will get us back to the Premiership again, a feeling I did not have with Paul Ince.

Waggy, most of us were very sorry that things did not pan out for Paul. However, he is young, the experience will be good for him and he will learn from it.

Things were happening that could not be allowed to continue and the Board had no choice.

Please don't give up on your Rovers because of this. You love the club, and it is the club you support. If that is not the case, and it is Paul Ince that you support, then no doubt you will be able to follow your football at his next club. I don't believe that is the case though and I hope you will reconsider your position and join us as we support our new Manager and enjoy the ride ahead.

Pretty much sums up what I think. Well put.

[BRFC4EVA]

We had lots more money then.

The other teams had far, far less money.

We had bright young players in Duff and Dunn, players who were good even the season we went down but weren't going to leave as they'd been brought through the ranks.

Now anyone remotely good is going to want to leave.

You know squat all about football, now naff off to Turf Moor because we sure as hell don't need fans like you.

Nonce. Dont you dare insinuate that I do not know about football over a msg board just because I have a different opinion to you. You dont know me and thankfully never will. As a season ticket holder who goes to around 1/2 our away games as well-I think clubs do needs fans like me. Considering your attitude to me and the fact you slated Sam in that previous thread yet are now brown nosing him-do we need human beings like you?

With regards to the Jack Walker. He died at the start of the season-I dont remember us making any big money signings whilst down-most of it came from selling off the relegated team. We have lots of young potentially good players, due to the pressures of money invloved in the prem league have not been given fair oportunity.

Oh and do one pr1ck

Edited December 20, 2008 by BRFC4EVA

[47er]

if you had read my post on a locked thread,

SEEING THE ORIGINAL THREAD WITH THE POLL On BFS, has been locked this one will do.i cannot believe jw has picked this c555k to manage my team,last night i gave away my season ticket,i simply refuse to watch a team managed by this man.hopefully he will be gone within the year,i do not want rovers to go down,i do not want rovers to lose a game,like some off you so called supporters.i hope he saves us from relagation and finds another job

i cannot and will not watch the rovers whilst he is the manager

You're either a Rovers supporter or you're not. It really is that simple. It just doesn't matter who the manager is. Anyway I reckon you are exiling yourself for a long time,because Sam is on a 3 year contract and Rovers won't be paying compensation twice even if it goes pear-shaped as some apparently(and bizarrely) seem to hope. What if Sams a rip-roaring success and we stay up and have a great season in 2009-10. You still going to stay away?

[tony gale's mic]

Nonce. Dont you dare insinuate that I do not know about football over a msg board just because I have a different opinion to you. You dont know me and thankfully never will. As a season ticket holder who goes to around 1/2 our away games as well-I think clubs do needs fans like me. Considering your attitude to me and the fact you slated Sam in that previous thread yet are now brown nosing him-do we need human beings like you?

With regards to the Jack Walker. He died at the start of the season-I dont remember us making any big money signings whilst down-most of it came from selling off the relegated team. We have lots of young potentially good players, due to the pressures of money invloved in the prem league have not been given fair oportunity.

Oh and do one pr1ck

I don't give a toss how many games you go to. I'll insinuate what I want - there's most people quite rightly saying relegation would be a disaster for us, some even saying we might go bust - yet you, the wisest man on the board thinks it might be better for us to go down than stay up, so long as we don't have Sam in charge. I slated him before, he was a rival clubs manager and the likes of Henk ten Cate wouldve been better in the summer, but now we're in a relegation struggle he's the best man for the job.

When we went down we were still a reasonably big club, we could attract talent much better than we could now. Now a good deal of the Championship will have better crowds and more money than us. And if you honestly think the likes of Treacy and Olsson compare to Damien Duff and David Dunn you're seriously deluded. Even in the season we went down they were good enough to show their class.

[American]

You know squat all about football, now naff off to Turf Moor because we sure as hell don't need fans like you.

We sure as hell don't need condescending a-hole fans like you.

[tony gale's mic]

We sure as hell don't need condescending a-hole fans like you.

That's a compliment coming from you. Cheers.

It's hard not to be condescending to anyone who thinks relegation would be better for this club than having Sam keep us up, but then I would expect you to side with the idiotic and illogical.

Edited December 20, 2008 by tony gale's mic

[Amo]

Hang on... waggy's thrown in his season ticket, despite telling everyone to shut up and get down to Ewood when Ince was mismanaging us?

Apparently we were all bigots for criticising the regime, but now it looks like the shoe's on the other foot hmm?

[tony gale's mic]

God we were rubbish today. Hoofing the ball upto the front man, lacking imagination, no sign of any goals. Guess some of us were wrong after all...

Edited December 20, 2008 by tony gale's mic