Major Incident In London

[blue phil]

Three posters have been posting views I profoundly disagree with and whose rantings on a thread about the horrific events in London last week I find odious in the extreme.

No doubt they were all for hanging any Irishman they could get their hands on and mass evictions of all Roman Catholics when the IRA was bringing terror to the UK for thirty years.

Not letting the bombers win means not siding with the views of AESF, blue phil or thenodrog.

331295[/snapback]

This is the kind of self righteous , pious garbage that is becoming all too frequent on this forum - in particular the second paragraph which jumps to such ludicrous conclusions from absolutely no evidence that even Flopsy would be able to see the stupidity of it all (if he concentrated very hard ).

As for the third paragraph ; yet more trash written from an ex pat who preaches to us on the subject of immigration from the safety of Malta . The peaceful Christian island of Malta that is where Muslim immigration has not been much much of an issue recently ; maybe that's why it's so peaceful ...?

The obvious conclusion is that after decades of mass , uncontrolled immigration and pandering to the militant , unbending Muslim lobby in the name of multi culturalism , bombs are raining on peaceful people in London - and it will continue if policies aren't changed .

Extreme Liberalism and multi culturalism (NOT Multi racialism I must add ) is at the root of our current troubles . Philipl's words are just words . Just wishing and hoping that one day everyone , catholic , protestant , muslim jew , will learn to live in peace is as much a pipe dream as some of the stupid beliefs that drives Muslims . This is the real world , philip , in places like Blackburn , Bradford , Burnley etc - a million miles away from the fantasy island you dwell in .

[Scotty]

  The obvious conclusion is that after decades of mass , uncontrolled immigration and pandering to the militant , unbending Muslim lobby in the name of multi culturalism , bombs are raining on peaceful people in London - and it will continue if policies aren't changed .

331468[/snapback]

It might be obvious in your warped mind but not in mine. When London, Manchester, and Warrington were bombed by the IRA was that because of "decades of mass, uncontrolled immigration"? No, it was down to terrorism - pure and simple.

I'd suggest that the London bombing have nothing to do with immigration, but a whole lot to do with the war in Iraq and other such perceived injustices - in the opinion of these extremist Muslim groups.

Of course, you could say immigration is the reason these bombers were over here in the first place. However, at the moment we don't know who set off the bombs, or whether they were illegal immigrants or not. They may have been born in this country for all we know at present.

[Scotty]

  Extreme Liberalism and multi culturalism (NOT Multi racialism I must add ) is at the root of our current troubles .  Philipl's words are just words . Just wishing and hoping that one day everyone , catholic , protestant , muslim  jew , will learn to live in peace is as much a pipe dream as some of the stupid beliefs that drives Muslims .

331468[/snapback]

Oh, and I think you'll find that in the vast, vast majority of cases Catholics, Protestants, Muslims, and Jews do live together in peace. You get nutters in every walk of life, and the people who committed these atrocities are simply nutters.

[Flopsy]

so it looks like a bunch of british born amateurs get lucky and kill 50+ people.

Always thought something like this would be carried out by a bunch of unknowns.

And Phil, your starting to make personal attacks.

Your also starting to sound as extremist as some of the people you seem to be so strongly set against.

As for the terrorist debate - If these people are disaffected muslims - which is likely, it appears to be - please tell me if im wrong - that you want the muslim community to be removed from these shores.

As it appears that they are from yorkshire, does that mean we should kick out all yorkshire people too.

And the IRA where all mainly Catholics working towards a united catholic ireland - should we deport all catholics?

A large amount of animal rights activists are christian, should we kick all of them out, or remove all those people who support the RSPCA and other animal cruelty charities?

I await with baited breath your reply.

[HugeChin]

Despite the tragic content of this thread I have found it very interesting to read the posts concerned with the specific events of Thursday and its nice to see the care that some of you show for your fellow members well-being.

This thread is very interesting if you read from beginning to end as it shows how people's opinions changed and what people were thinkingand feeling as more and more information came to light and events unfolded on Thursday.

Its a pity that the arguments about racism etc etc couldn't have been kept in a separate thread away from the the discussion about the bombings as, for me, they merely distract from what the thread should have been about, whatever the title says.

I am sorry to say that, of the four or five forums I regularly read, this forum is by far the most unfriendly that I visit and I seldom post here because of that.

Why am I telling you this? Dunno

My cousin was in London on Thursday and he is safe as was my girlfriends nan and she is also safe. Thank God!

Thoughts are with the chap who's business associate is missing and with that person's family.

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

This will be my last post on this thread, as I'm not going to waste any more time after this responding to petty insults such as being called an "ar5e" by Colin....

The two main points I made in my earlier posts were that illegal immigrants (ie: those who break the law) should be deported; and that extremist muslim clerics like Omar Bakri, who were not born in the UK, should also face deportation.

Are there any board members who believe that illegal immigrants should not be deported?

Does anyone believe that criminal illegal immigrants should be allowed to stay in the UK for as long as they like?

Stuwilky said: "A vote for UKIP is a vote for fascism."

No it isn't. It's a vote for British withdrawal from the European Union.

Perhaps Stuwilky hasn't read their manifesto or the rules governing UKIP candidates. Nobody is allowed to be a UKIP candidate if they have a criminal record or have a track record of extremism. (eg previous member of BNP.)

The two parties have different policies, whereas Eddie seems to be under the impression that UKIP and the BNP are two of the same.

I give up.

You have the sensitivity of a drunken rhino.

On two separate posts I expressed sympathy for the victims of last Thursday's atrocities.

I also quoted some words from Sergeant Steve Betts, a British Transport Police Officer, who gave an interview about the horrifying situation to a national newspaper with a circulation of over a million readers.

Please could you explain why I have the sensitivity of a drunken rhino, when I was merely expressing sadness at the comments that Seargent Betts made in a publication read by over a million people? I made it clear that I sympathise with the victims and my sadness was directed at something which was already in the public domain.

It was Den after all who said:

Don't panic folks, the odds on anyone you know being injured must be absolutely minimal.

So according to one of our moderators, we shouldn't panic and the odds that anyone on here knows someone who is injured "must be absolutely minimal".

Therefore, what was the problem with me expressing sadness at something which was already public knowledge for over a million people?

Not letting the bombers win means not siding with the views of AESF, blue phil or thenodrog.

I notice Philip that you only mentioned three people there.

Did you agree with the comment that 1864 Roverite made when he said that it was time to rid the country of the PC brigade, upset the do gooders and send them on the next plane out with a one way ticket?

Did you agree Philip with the comments that Abbey made when he said that people should be stopped from trying to gain asylum, that beards longer than 5" should be outlawed and that women should be banned from wearing veils that cover their faces?

Did you agree with the comment that SG194 made when he said that it was time to hit back hard and stop all asylum seekers now?

Did you agree with these comments below from Bryan?

Why doesn't he do us all a favour and top himself, preferably in a room full of his converts?

If you disagreed Philip with those views expressed earlier from SG194, 1864, Abbey and Bryan, why did you choose to single out only Blue Phil, myself and Theno?

Scotty was earlier in agreement with Blue Phil on this thread....

And I completely agree with Blue Phil above, this has nothing to do with race at all.

No doubt they were all for hanging any Irishman they could get their hands on.

No, and I didn't mention hanging in any of my previous posts on this thread Philip. Abbey suggested that those who support the bombs should be shot between the eyes. I didn't call for anyone to be killed in my posts.

I also didn't make any comments about asylum seekers in this thread, other than to say that according to the BBC's political researcher, asylum and immigration was an "important issue" with around a third of voters.

The two main points I made were that criminal illegal immigrants should be deported and that extremist clerics like Omar Bakri should also face deportation.

Some people may argue that the likes of Mr Bakri shouldn't be deported, but is anybody prepared to argue that illegal immigrants should be given permission to stay..?

Would anyone like to argue the case on behalf of illegal immigrants?

This is, as I said earlier, my last post on this thread....

[Paul]

It would be nice to log in and go straight to a football thread rather than knowing one has to come here first.

[stuwilky]

Perhaps AESF shouldnt make judgements about what people have or havnt read.

I had a rather interesting chat with my local candidate just before the May election. He commented that "well we'd stop immigration and ship all these bloody muslims out" or words to that effect.

When you stop talking about asylum seekers and immigrants in the same breath and actually recognise that there is a huge difference between the groups of people.

And also recognise that stopping either group of people gaining access to the country would not have prevented these attacks then we might make some progress.

[thenodrog]

I guess we have to accept that there are people out there (and on this mB it seems) who harbour extreme and deep resentment towards anybody they cannot accept as their own or who they decide will blame for their problems. When their views are challenged, they revert to defensive mode and start hurling insults.

331422[/snapback]

Kinell Nayef! Hurling insults is preferable to hurling bombs ffs!

Somehow you appear to be giving the impression that the guilty party here is a few mboard members that you personally disagree with but imo the above description is far more accurate when applied to the real guilty parties i.e. those odious @#/?s whose minds have been warped and addled by a primitive and devisive religion that has no place in modern civilised and educated society into blowing themselves up whilst surrounded by as many innocent people as possible. Wake up and get real ffs!

[blue phil]

And Phil, your starting to make personal attacks.

Your also starting to sound as extremist as some of the people you seem to be so strongly set against.

331492[/snapback]

Flops , I never instigate personal attacks but I reserve the right to respond vigorously if confronted with posts such as Philipl's (quoted earlier) which are based on no evidence whatsoever - merely silly assumptions that are far , far more extreme in their condemnatory intolerance than any of mine .

When I post it is usually to state my views in a considered manner . People don't like my views - I'm used to that - but I won't be desisting because certain posters , after totally misrepresenting my posts , start throwing around stupid labels like "racist" , "arse" "bigots" etc etc . I have never once compained to the mods (about them , yes , but that's only when they stoop to the level of those they should be moderating !) , nor will I in the future . But if you say I'm starting to get personal , then I hope that others are getting similar warnings ....I somehow doubt it .

Your second paragraph BTW is beneath contempt - in comparing me with the bombers and their sympathisers . Hope that's not too personal ...

[thenodrog]

Three posters have been posting views I profoundly disagree with and whose rantings on a thread about the horrific events in London last week I find odious in the extreme............

Not letting the bombers win means not siding with the views of AESF, blue phil or thenodrog.

331295[/snapback]

I couldn't believe that you named me there Philip. I have posted nothing that you could categorise as odious imo. Sure I've castigated a few numpties who do not appear to know what a state of emergency means but I challenge you to be specific and quote any posts on this thread where my views are inaccurate or offensive toward affected people. When you cannot find any then I suggest that you take your head from up your vindictive arse and get back to sipping your red wine whilst gazing at the sunset from your supremely priveledged vantage point and stick to commenting on what appears to be the one thing that you do appear to know something about........ the finances at BRFC.

[Manchester Blue]

Practically everything you post is odious Theno, apart from the football stuff that is. I don't know how you get that Frankie Howerd style of mock hurt down to such a tee but it really doesn't suit.

[blue phil]

It might be obvious in your warped mind but not in mine. 

I'd suggest that the London bombing have nothing to do with immigration, but a whole lot to do with the war in Iraq and other such perceived injustices - in the opinion of these extremist Muslim groups. 

331474[/snapback]

Warped mind eh .....harsh words ...yawn .

If you cast your mind back to my first post (the one you agreed with !) you'll see that I quite clearly stated that this was a CULTURAL war ie , nothing to do with race etc .

On that basis it's logical to assume that if immigration had been strictly controlled over the last decades and confined to those who would quickly assimilate to our culture and values then this nation would be less likely to succumb to such acts of terror . Unfortunately , that wasn't the case and we are now faced with the situation where second and third generation Muslims are quite prepared to strap bombs to themselves and kill innocent men , women and children - what you would describe as their fellow countrymen .

What I would like now at this twelth hour is for the Gov't to realise its mistakes and cease all immigration (legal , illegal , arranged marriages , asylum seekers , the full monty ) from all Muslim countries . You and others may think that's the product of a "warped mind " and extreme but believe me there'd be LESS chances of this war on terror escalating if the Gov't showed some guts and stopped appeasing the Islamic non conformists and rid ourselves of the radicals ( and it's well known who they are ) .

One last point - the war in Iraq was most definitely wrong and certainly hasn't helped matters - but that can never justify (or even fully explain the attacks ) we've suffered . Maybe my critic from Malta would care to explain his very vociferous support for the war when it was launched . Maybe if I wasn't so polite I could have described him as a warmonger who was helping to ferment terror....

[thenodrog]

Practically everything you post is odious Theno, apart from the football stuff that is.  I don't know how you get that Frankie Howerd style of mock hurt down to such a tee but it really doesn't suit.

331519[/snapback]

Turned into Philip have you manc?

It appears that you too cannot find the evidence to back up your vindictive and derogatory comments. I dont want to canvas your opinion I just want your evidence from this thread. Rem you have 2 eyes and 1 mouth....... please try to use them in that order.

[thenodrog]

Warped mind eh .....harsh words ...yawn .

Unfortunately , that wasn't the case and we are now faced with the situation where second and third generation Muslims are quite prepared to strap bombs to themselves and kill innocent men , women and children - what you would describe as their fellow countrymen .

331522[/snapback]

If anyone wants to dig up the thread about 'Terrorist suspects arrested in Blackburn' you'll find that I predicted this type of attack there and received much criticism and ridicule. It goes without saying that I take little satisfaction in being proven correct but I do expect a little humility from those that queued up to criticise.

[Flopsy]

you can give but you cant take can you.(that was meant for Blue Phil btw) Dear god - I do a fast reply and another 2 pages of posts turn up.

And if you think you are being misrepresented - I would have a look at the tone and prose of your posts because to a large section of the posters on this board they appear to be extreame and racist.

Another large section cant understand it because its not in txt speak, but there you go

Do I agree with you, Theno, ASEF or anyone else who wants to try and get immigration or asylum seakers to be the evil that you see them to be, well I dont. I believe that Islam is a religion of peace that has been corrupted by a minority to use it as a vehicle of hate and violence.

But then again Christianity hasnt got a particularly good record in that area either, historically or recently.

But its a free country (just)

On a slightly different note - does anyone want ID cards now? Because I still cant see how it prevents terrorism. Especially this type.

[MCMC1875]

Flopsy's posts continue to be 1) naive and 2) as inflammatory as any other IMO - take a deep breath.

[philipl]

No phil, you chose to ignore all the available evidence.

[Flopsy]

Flopsy's posts continue to be 1) naive and 2) as inflammatory as any other IMO - take a deep breath.

331544[/snapback]

Really Naive?? wow - realistic more like - historically accurate also

[Flopsy]

Oh and I forget, what do you want to do about the situation MCMC? Make useless throwaway comments and remarks - which is my domain thankyou very much - or come up with something realistic and sane

I also want to know how they are inflamatory - im not the one espousing all immigration be stopped and all Asylum seekers sent packing

[MCMC1875]

An interview with Omar Bakri as been broadcast on 5 Live this pm. I heard him say that there are many more 'British Islamic fundamentalists' ready to give their lives. I take no side here, But 1) is he a double agent saying this in public? 2) If so, why are these people not arrested?

[MCMC1875]

Flopsy

Your Christian/animal rights & Catholic/IRA comparisons seem to be off on a tangent.

[MCMC1875]

And Flopsy, as for useless/throwaway comments, have you read my post of 7 July 20.47?

[Flopsy]

Habeus Corpus usually MCMC

although I believe thats been relaxed with the new terrorism laws.

Also - and im speculating here - its better to have these people free and running around (if you know who they are) because you can use them to find out the whole cell and or parts of the organisation.

However this has to mean that Mi5 and the police do it properly - or you have, as happened about 12 months ago - when someone they had under surveillance disapeared and everyone panics - its why Heathrow suddenly had tanks parked outside.

Anti-terrorism is a fine balance - You cant arrest someone for saying that they are willing to give their life for Allah/God/Budda/Chocolate/Rovers - you can only arrest them for either planning an attack or attempting to carry one out. What you can do is keep them under close scrutiny and see who they meet.

Unfortunately Terrorism is extreamly Darwenistic, ie only the cleverest/luckiest/fittest survive - and the last thing they will do is meet with the guys who blather on about self sacrifice/paradise and martydom.

It would be good if their was a simple answer - such as ban the extreamist clerics - but what is likely to happen - and was proved with persecution of the Catholics in this country for example - is that it just becomes secretive and underground, and more hardline and extreame.

[MCMC1875]

That's better Flopsy!