Major Incident In London

[Flopsy]

Next time rovers play in london ithink i will give the underground a miss!

330377[/snapback]

But you'll drive down there - 3000 killed on the roads last year

or get the train - more bombs at main line stations than on the tube.

Dont be so pathetic

[Nayef]

I have now and to be honest my statement still stands - the thread and ASEF's comments are exactly what I expected it to be.

Im currently swaying between "musnt retaliate, it gives them exactly what they want."

to

" So they want a religious war? Fine lets give em one; nuke the ###### and then go in and brush up the dust."

But the moment you start thinking along those lines and wanting to act on them, in my eyes you are no different to the @#/?s of yesterday.

Imagine the scenario in Baghdad. You’re an Iraqi, you’ve a happy family. You hear your country is going to be invaded but you think nothing of it and carry on with your life as normal. Why wouldn’t you? You return home to find that a stray US bomb has just blown up your house and your wife and kids as well, all of whom were completely innocent and had nothing to do with politics.

It’s only a small step then to start thinking “so these Americans/brits want a religious war? Fine lets give them one. Bomb* the ###### and then go in and brush up the dust”

Some of these people then become unforgiving and twisted and foster up hatred of the US or UK or whoever they claim should be responsible. Their families were innocent of all crimes and yet the Americans came along and killed them. The people who died yesterday were innocent of all crimes and yet these arabs or whoever came along and killed them.

Anyway there’s my hypothesis on the matter. This issue is a lot more complicated then what I’m hearing from Blair (“they will not destroy our values”).

But I agree it’s just emotions running high – I felt anxious and then very angry as a Londoner yesterday! If they had touched my sister in London, I would have wanted revenge like you despite being a forgiving sort of person (I think I forgave Graeme Souness much earlier than a lot of people on this mB)

*they don’t have nukes so I’ve had to replace your quote with bombs

[Flopsy]

agree Nayef which is why we should always wait before we retaliate - just lashing out makes it worse not better.

[thenodrog]

Or even Arab muslims!! Perfectly understandable that the authorities are at the moment more likely to search muslims, this is a byproduct of this terrible event.

330376[/snapback]

Thank you Kamy for that piece of excellent common sense.

.........Strange though how 'common sense' is such a rare commodity these days?

[Jimbo]

It was reported on the news today that a passenger who'd just got off the number 30 bus had noticed a young man (not said whether he "looked" like a muslim or not) was behhaving in an "agitated manner" - constantly checking his bag. Haveing lived through an active IRA cell operating in Germany when I was living out there & the IRA bombs in London in the late 80's & early 90's I like to think I'm fairly vigilant - I've made sure people come back & collect bags they've left etc. but the only times I've been nervous/uncomfortble recently, was when (in both cases) a man of middle eastern appearence was sitting near me, cutching a bag, and acting in an agitated and what I would call a nervous manner. As it was, it was my imagination both times, but what do you do - it's not likely you're going to ask the bloke if he's a suicide bomber and you probably won't like the answer either way !

Any way - I had a nice day working from home today as we only had a skeleton staff in & I can dial in - That's a nice little skive - could have done with the 90 minute walk back to Marylebone from the City last night though

[Jimbo]

Well NewTodd - enjoy your walk to Upton Park - I know I'll be on the tube

[MCMC1875]

But what answer would you be expecting if you had reason to ask said question to the suspicious one?

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

This post might well be a little controversial to one or two of our more liberal-minded board members.

Daring to attack illegal immigration (or criminals) is unpopular with some - so for those who really hate my views, perhaps it's best not to read on....

My sympathies are firmly with the families of the 50 people killed as well as the 700 people who were injured in the dreadful attacks.

This was mass murder designed to cause the maximum terror and suffering. The @#/?s who did it (probably in the name of religion) obviously have no respect whatsoever for human life.

Let's hope the fanatics responsible for co-ordinating the carnage can be brought to justice before they blow themselves up in the name of Allah.

According to Met Commisioner Sir Ian Blair (no relation to Tony) it is "blindingly obvious" that a terrorist cell has been operating in Britain.

It's a shame that it wasn't blindingly obvious to the intelligent services before - but at least perhaps the police investigation is making some progress....

I watched Mr Blair's speech yesterday as the lip-quivering charlatan denounced the terrorists.

This was the man of course who pardoned several hundred evil IRA terrorist scumbags and gloried in a job well done. While he's ticked that one off as a success, the nest of vipers he released into Northern Ireland society hasn't exactly turned their attention to knitting socks for seniors.

Some of the Ulster paramilitaries set free prefer to be involved in activities like drug trafficking, armed robbery and "punishment" beatings. After Johnny 'Mad Dog' Adair was released, he continued to be a central figure in the UDA power struggle which left several men for dead after brutal beatings.

After Adair was let loose as part of the Good Friday Agreement, he had to be thrown back in jail again a couple of years later for being a danger to others. You should never let a Mad Dog off the lease....

As Blair gave his usual lip-quivering performance yesterday - the one that he's perfected over the years starting with Diana's death in 1997 - as he began to denounce the terrorists in front of the media, I wondered how the likes of Colin Parry felt about his speech - knowing that it was Mr Blair who let out from jail early the evil scumbags who killed his son Tim in Warrington shopping centre.

While Mr Blair was in Gleneagles to try to ensure the African Continent goes from rags to riches - giving the African countries extra aid (much of which I suspect will end up in the hands of corrupt dictators) - a Home Office report published last week suggested there are up to 570,000 illegal immigrants roaming our streets.

Tony Blair was asked several times by Jeremy Paxman during an election interview if he could give any kind of estimate about the number of illegals wandering our streets. He refused to answer the question.

Perhaps now, after the election, we know the reason why he wasn't too keen to give an estimate. I doubt it would have done Mr Blair any good with voters during the campaign if he'd suggested there were more than half a million criminals (or illegals) walking around the country.

I'd suggest that having 500,000 illegals roaming the streets of Britain is more likely to lead to the situation of extremist elements in the country or a terrorist cell being in operation, compared with a country that has a zero tolerance approach to illegal immigration.

Maybe after Mother Theresa Blair has finished holding hands with Geldof and Bono in their Holy Trinity to alleviate African poverty, he can turn some of his attention to the Muslim fanatics who have been virtually welcomed on to UK shores. (Mr Bakri being an example I raised in my earlier post - an Islamic cleric who came to Britain in 1985 having been deported from Saudi Arabia because of his membership of a banned group.)

It would be nice if Mr Blair could stop pussyfooting around and start to order some more deportations - both of illegal immigrants and some of the extremist clerics like Omar Bakri who preach their hatred.

But then I suppose we would get the human rights brigade in operation, complaining about the unfairness of these criminals having to leave Dear Old Blighty - and Trevor Phillips from the CRE complaining about "racism"....

Edited July 8, 2005 by Anti Euro Smiths Fan

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

I do believe the death penalty is still in place for high treason....make full use of it if the culprits to this atrocity are found.

[Flopsy]

as likely as it is to be islamic terrorists -

if it turns out to be a bunch of well organised anarchists (oxymoron there) who turn out all to be white and middle class

will you kindly shut up?

[broadsword]

I do believe the death penalty is still in place for high treason....make full use of it if the culprits to this atrocity are found.

330540[/snapback]

Er ... would the perpetrators actually be guilty fo treason though?

Would've thought they were more likely to be guilty of mass murder?

[colin]

I do believe the death penalty is still in place for high treason....make full use of it if the culprits to this atrocity are found.

330540[/snapback]

No its not

amnesty international

Smithy,

I don't thinkI have ever seen anyone sink so low as you have in your last post.

You're just an ar5e.

[Drummer Boy]

Last week I went to a Plumbers merchants in Nelson run by a man of Asian origin who was Muslim. He listened to my confused description of the problem I had and told me exactly what was wrong. He then gave me the bit I needed to solve the problem but would not take my money.

I then went to back to B&Q to get a refund on the £20+ of stuff the white staff had conned me into buying.

So what?

Well, I hope the events in London don't create a backlash on this kind man. Not being an admirer of Tony Blair, I was impressed with his observation that whilst this attack is likely to have been perpetrated in the name of Islam the overwhelming majority of Muslims in this country are decent, law-abiding citizens.

A bas***d is a bas***d regardless of his skin colour or faith - the people who carried out this attack should be pursued to their graves, but I worry that the traditional British tolerance will waive and blame the easy (and innocent) targets in our community.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

If the perpetrators are found to be British born Muslims then yes it is treason.

'Violation of allegiance toward one's country or sovereign, especially the betrayal of one's country by waging war against it or by consciously and purposely acting to aid its enemies

Fair play Colin but its my own personnel opinion that the death penalty should be in place for terrorism.......... I'm afraid todays world may necessitate such action now.

Anyway,nothing like a good old hanging and quartering on Tynburn common.

Edited July 9, 2005 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[philipl]

...and how many innocent Irish people would we have murdered by the state as opposed to releasing them pardonned and innocent several years later?

[MCMC1875]

There is an unhealthy demand for kangaroo courts when outrages of this nature take place, which often lead to innocent people being victim to miscarriages of justice. This was probably the case for some IRA trials (hence the overturned verdicts) and perhaps even the Pendle Witches.

Time to keep a cool head and let justice take its course.

[stuwilky]

Isnt it typical how the usual suspects start linking this to illegal immigrants and asylum seekers (with some of them not even knowing the difference between the two).

Drummer boy hit the nail on the head with this line...

"A bas***d is a bas***d regardless of his skin colour or faith"

I have read comments here and elsewhere about banning all Muslims from the country, stopping all immigration (including legal immigration).

Nowt like a knee jerk reaction!

[ABBEY]

well ,ive not posted on here and aint getting into any slanging matches but the scum have in reality declared war,the germans never invaded GB because we never let them,albeit cocting millions of lives.The events in London have had everyone talking but my thoughts are now that EVERY mosque should be closed temporly and then see which "leaders"clerics etc speak out against our country should be arrested .ANY who speak up for the "bombs" or Bin Laden should immediatly be shot between the eyes (drastic and upset a lot of pc paeople BUT ITS WAR FFS!).

Id go as far as banning beards longer than 5" no matter what religion,id ban muslim clothing and id ban women from wearing veils that cover there faces and with immediate effect i would stop every person from trying to gain asylum.

SOMETHING DRASTIC AND UNPOPULAR NEEDS DOING AND IT NEEDS DOING NOW.

Before i get accused of racism or the likes nothing is further from the truth im simpy trying to come up with a way of stoppng these scum @#/?s

[stuwilky]

So banning a beard will make someone less likely to blow something up?

Genius.

[ABBEY]

just an idea stu thats all,anyhows im noot getting in any slanging matches on this thred.

[Eddie]

Yes and making lot's of people angry who had nothing to do with this will stop it, good plan.

As of yet we can't even say 100% sure that this was done by an islamic terrorist group, I really hope it wasn't, even though that sounds so odd.

What we need to do now is to take firm action to prevent such things happening in the future as well as catching whoever has done this, what we don't need to do is lay the seeds for there to be more terrorists in 5-10 years time. Did you want every Catholic church to be closed during the IRA or Real IRA bombings? No. Did the French close every Mosque during the metro bombings by the Algerians? No. So why do it now? What makes this so different from the terrorists we have encountered in the past? Nothing, just America making it a war on terrorism is all.

They are the scum of the earth, of that there is no doubt, but they come from a people who for the vast, vast majority this was an equally horrible event and who are nothing but law abiding.

I find it amazing that as society and technology advance, making events like this even easier with the advent of new forms of weapons and communications that the effect that they can have is becoming even greater. Now this may seem to be a blinding glimpse of the obvious, but I don't mean in terms of the number of lives they can take, the number of buildings they can destroy, I mean in the societal regression they can cause. In these few short days I have seen some members of this board, as well as simply the general public, want to sink to standards so low, barbaric and ignorant that we would have been proud of them centuries ago. Yet somehow intertwined in this they are horrified by the acts of two days ago, judging them by modern ethics, but when we then plan our next action, our next step, we forget about these standards.

You wish to judge these men or women by one set of rules and yet in punishing them you basically want to sink to their level, to a level I dearly hope I never see any society I live in go to.

[Flopsy]

Stus beard is currently 4.9inches thats why hes worried.

Unfortunately Abbey blamming all muslims for what happened is like blaming all Christians for any thing the IRA did.

Cracking a nut with a thermonuclear warhead

[stuwilky]

My beard has now been removed and is currently standing at "lucky" stubble stage.

Where it remain until the Rovers lose. I give it a week.

[Drummer Boy]

Id go as far as banning beards longer than 5" no matter what religion

I think ZZ Top have made some good records, especially pre-Eliminator, and don't want them banned on the grounds of facial hair statements.

Am I missing the point or making one? I'm not sure.

[Rovermatt]

Id go as far as banning beards longer than 5" no matter what religion

330598[/snapback]

Perhaps I'm missing the point but how will banning all beards longer than 5 inches keep us safe?

Edited July 9, 2005 by Rovermatt