[Archived] West Ham United V Brfc 3 - 1 Wham

[roverich]

Reid, Savage, Emerton and Pedersen all have their individual qualities but are just average players I'm afraid.

338924[/snapback]

Pedersen, average? What have you been smoking?! He is a quality player and would walk into many other Premiership teams!

[KimberleyBRFC]

Not a bad squad player but anyone with Todd as a first choice defender is in trouble.

More like what have YOU been smoking

Edited August 14, 2005 by KimberleyBRFC

[percy]

Bellamy quite obviously wasn't fit but hoofing it over the top 30 yards in front of him isn't good enough. I didn't think Kuqi was that bad, him and Bellamy could make a good partnership imo.

This is what worried me yesterday - we showed no sign of being able to use Bellamy's pace to cause West Ham any problems. He's fast, but the service for him was terrible / non-existant. Rather than try and slip a ball through to him to give him something to run onto, the team just lamped the ball forward, leaving him to chase 30-40 yards before watching it bounce out of play. On a couple of occasions the passes were so poor, they'd gone out of play before he'd even set off after it.

Tugay apart, I can't see many players having both the vision AND ability to get the most out of him and it's a worrying thought. Maybe Savage, but given he's going to have alot of defensive responsibilities it might be asking alot.

The 1st 20mins or so we played quite well. Although not totally dominant, we were certainly in control of the match and looking the better team. As scrappy as Todd's goal was, the lead was deserved and even the abysmal hotdog stand service at half time couldn't take the smile off my face. As an aside, I thought the West Ham fans were terrible in the 1st half given the occassion of the day, almost as bad as the seemingly non-existant support usually found at Highbury. We gave them plenty to cheer about after half time, though.

As the 2nd half progressed I couldn't believe what I was seeing and I'm sure I wasn't the only one. The team rapidly seemed to lose it's composure, not only allowing West Ham back into the game, but giving them the incentive to go on and take the 3 points. Too many players were well below par and struggled to try and lift their game, whereas the West ham players were growing in confidence and starting to play some decent football towards the end. I don't think matters were helped when we took Kuqi off and replaced him with Gresko. Initially I thought it would be to provide some more defensive cover for Matteo whilst pushing MGP upfront, but instead it turned out to be more of a defensive move, switching the team to a 4-5-1.

The introduction of Dickov seemed a more positive move. For a short while at least, until Konchesky copped a full on two footed lunge. I didn't think he'd made a big contact with his challenge, but obviously he had. The ref couldn't get to him with his red card quick enough. A 3 match ban and another peice of evidence for those in the media labelling us a bunch of dirty hackers. How long before this stereotyping sets in with the officials and we get yellow and red cards for decisions based on our reputation?

Savage's yellow card meant he was having to play too cautiously in midfield and the two wide players MGP and Emerton were just plain poor. At least Reid puts in plenty of effort. I haven't watched the highlights yet, but even without seeing Emerton's back pass it would still be easy to suggest he offered nothing to the team with or without the ball. I used to be a big Emerton fan and have thought at times the criticism of him was too harsh, but I'm beginning to understand why people don't rate him. It's frustrating enough when he doesn't make the most of his talent when on the ball in an attacking sense, but yesterday he was a complete liability and left Neill with too much to do. There's a bloke in N02 BBE end who slates him rotten, much to the amusement of those of us sat around him. He'd have had a field day yesterday, with reason for once. Losing his place to Thommo against Man Utd seemed to spur Brett on last season, let's hope Thommo recovers soon and can put in some genuine competition for the right hand side slot.

I left my seat just a minute or so before the final whistle, so I didn't see the reaction at the end of the match. How did the players & fans respond? I hope we get right behind the team on Saturday and try and help give them a lift.

Positives? Not many I'm afraid. Perhaps the fact things should only get better is one. The highlighting of our weaknesses another, although only if they're acted upon. If we put in a similar performance against one of the top 6 teams it could be very embarassing. It looks as if we'll need another player or two before the end of August, although as Biddy pointed out at the game yesterday, where would you start? I'd aim for a versatile centre half and creative central midfielder, but it's alot easier said than done.

I honestly thought that even though we may still struggle initially to pose a threat upfront, the solid defensive base of the team would give us enough to work on. We didn't have that yesterday and were well beaten as a result. We missed Nelsen badly and, without kicking a ball, Amoruso has probably moved up to 3rd choice centre half. Mokoena didn't look at all confident playing there, although the team playing badly as a whole didn't help. He doesn't seem to impose himself enough (especially aerially) as a centre half, which is strange given how well he fills the shield role in midfield. Todd looked uneasy beside him even before West Ham starting scoring.

Although I was gutted yesterday, I'm feeling a little more positive this morning. Surely we can't play that badly again? The same players who let us down yesterday put in some great performances last season, so it's not as if they're not capable. Writing the team / players off after 1 bad performance is a knee jerk reaction.

Put it down as a bad day at the office for the Rovers; it happens in football. I'm sure Hughes will be desperate to put things right in the next match. We were well beaten and would have been very lucky to come away with anything given the 2nd half collapse. Hopefully this will give a massive kick up the backside to the players and management and things will improve by the time Fulham come to Ewood. It's not as if miracles need to produced over the next 5 days, the team just needs to recapture the mentality and effort that worked so well last season, when the same team (minus the new strikers) put a run together in the new year that was top half form.

Even though we're upset and disappointed, it's important to try and keep in mind we've only lost 1 game, no matter how badly we've played. There's another 37 to go yet and I'm sure as good as West Ham were in spells yesterday, they wouldn't have done so well if we didn't help by throwing the match away. They'll be a time in the season where the roles'll be reversed and we'll take an easy 3 points from a suicidal opposition performance.

There's no point in worrying yet, a win against Fulham would do us all a world of good.

[roverich]

Why did Hughes risk Bellamy after so little match practice and then the disgraceful challenge of Paul Dickov how low can we go?

338892[/snapback]

If he hadn't risked Bellamy you'd be slating him for picking Dickov over him, saying even on a bad day Bellamy is a better footballer.

At the end of the day, Hammers fans will have been more confident of winning the game than us probably. We were a poor side last season, have a poor record against the Hammers and have only signed two players to change that, one of which came from the league below. Not to mention they were at home. I was expecting a draw in all honesty and didn't expect the players to perform to their best.

I hope they can pull something back against Fulham though or else we will be in for a long hard season again.

[KimberleyBRFC]

I left my seat just a minute or so before the final whistle, so I didn't see the reaction at the end of the match.  How did the players & fans respond? I hope we get right behind the team on Saturday and try and help give them a lift.

From what i saw shortly after i removed my hands from my face.. we clapped the players (well most of us did) and friedel came over the rest sort of flitted off the park clapping towards us

Disappointed Rover

[roverich]

More like what have YOU been smoking 

338927[/snapback]

So you think after yesterdays performance that Todd is good enough and we have no defensive worries?

[S15]

I hope they can pull something back against Fulham though or else we will be in for a long hard season again.

338929[/snapback]

Are you completely demented.

If we lose against Fulham, then Spurs, so what?

If we then win 3 in a row we'll be in the top half.

Saying we are in trouble after 2 games of a season is the sound of a complete idiot.

[KimberleyBRFC]

So you think after yesterdays performance that Todd is good enough and we have no defensive worries?

338931[/snapback]

You didn't state it was based solely on yesterdays game sounded more like a general statement.. but I could've picked worse players than him on the pitch yesterday.

[roverich]

If we lose against Fulham and Spurs we will have picked up no points from the first three games and relatively easy games compared to other opposition in the league. You think the players will still have a bouyant and optimistic attitude? Morale will be rock bottom if we lose our next two games and it will be very hard for the players to recover quickly!

[wandel77]

This is taken for BBC.

Blackburn boss Mark Hughes:

"We expected them to come flying out of the blocks and in the first half we were reasonably comfortable.

"But in the second half they got the initiative and they didn't let go.

"At this level you need eight, nine or 10 players playing well to get results. We didn't have anything like that, which is why we got beaten. That won't happen again."

I think the players know´s it, we know it, so from today i will think positive !!

[S15]

If we lose against Fulham and Spurs we will have picked up no points from the first three games and relatively easy games compared to other opposition in the league. You think the players will still have a bouyant and optimistic attitude? Morale will be rock bottom if we lose our next two games and it will be very hard for the players to recover quickly!

338934[/snapback]

You sound like an over reacting girl. Talking about relegation after two games is rediculous.

Thats the be all and end all.

EDIT: Shillitto, you are too quick to come with the personal abuse. Please curb it.

Edited August 14, 2005 by den

[MarkBRFC]

What a load of bloody drama queens on here.

Disapointing? Yes

End of the world? No.

37 games to go folks,

[SAS]

What a load of bloody drama queens on here.

Disapointing? Yes

End of the world? No.

37 games to go folks,

338939[/snapback]

yes 37 games to go, and if we dont improve it isnt looking good.

the only thing i hope will make a huge improvement is fitness with bellamy and nelsen

[Blackpool_Rover]

I cant be bothered repeating what everyone else is saying. All il say is no more Mokoenna at center back PLEASE!

Ive said all along hes rubbish in that position, he doesnt know what to do, he doesnt look around him and he is the most usefull premiership player in the air ive ever seen. This guy will NEVER win a header. Everytime he gets the ball he looks like a nervous robot. Then when he went into midfield he looked better. Keep him on the bench for when we go 4-5-1 as he is excellent in that position.

Lets just hope we get Nelsen back soon. As for the rest of the seasons cover id much rather have Amo as a backup for center back than Mokoenna. With Amo we know what were getting...good performances agains tthe top teams and good performances with a couple of mistakes and lapses in concentration against the other teams. So if todd/nelsen gets injured we just have to keep our fingers crossed we get lucky with amos mistakes and warn his partner to be ready and quick off the mark when a mistake happens.

Overall it was a horrible day. The west ham fans were excellent and im sure this intimidated some of our players. West ham looked stronger and more up for it than us.

So that was yesterday, it was crap, its OVER. Next week...fulham at home...we need a result! COME ON ROVERS!!

[promoted2001]

It was a dissapointing result, dissapointing performance but all the optimism going round kinda set us up for this. Alls not lost though, I was impressed with Pedersen and Kuqi but Todd and Gresko were diabolical today (even though Todd scored and his usually a rock for us).

We need to build up some fitness and I hate to say it but we need to bring in some more new players.

[Blackpool_Rover]

It was a dissapointing result, dissapointing performance but all the optimism going round kinda set us up for this. Alls not lost though, I was impressed with Pedersen and Kuqi but Todd and Gresko were diabolical today (even though Todd scored and his usually a rock for us).

We need to build up some fitness and I hate to say it but we need to bring in some more new players.

338954[/snapback]

I cant say i was impressed with pedersen and Kuqi. Cusnt see much of Gresko as my seat seemed to be below the pitch. Saw him put in a peach of a cross though. Todd had a bad game. Savage did well before he got booked then went out of the game. Bellamy had no service. Reid was ok apart from his final ball.

[G Somerset Rover]

One quote though has worried me to death:

"We just couldn't deal with Sheringham and Harewood" Hughes

My God, if Hughsey admits defeat against those two, try Defoe/Mido, Crespo/Drogba, Rooney/RVN, Henry/Reyes, Cisse/Mori, Yak/JFH...hell even Camara and Roberts.

We need a centre half and a creative midfielder and fast.

[S15]

What people have to accept is we have changed our system quite drastically, and it might take 5 or so games for us to adapt to this system.

If we suffer in those first 5 games and then go on to have a good season then so be it.

But some people on this bored are pathetic and it's embarrassing to think that some of our fans our absolute cretins.

[drslowman]

Went to Upton Park yesterday quietly confident, expecting a draw at least. Great atmosphere from our end to begin with. I have never been to west ham before but thought it would be a lot louder, but it turned out that we outsung them for the majority of the first half.

"You can shove your f***ing bubbles up your arse" , "Does the council pay your rent?" and " £2 an hour" were singing highlights.

Hughesy lined up with a 442, bellamy and kuqi making their debuts. The game started quite comfortably for rovers, with the hammers rarely getting into the rovers half for the opening 15 mins. Then the goal! A corner kick from the left from pedersen was not cleared and then steered in by Andy Todd, a surprising goal scorer, but not a surprising goal.

We built on this by not allowing the hammers into the game, without looking that dangerous ourselves. We came closest from a savage free kick that was cleared off the line after beating carroll.

It was clear from the first half that it was an opening day fixture. Despite being in front we still looked very rusty. Todds passing was wayward, the axe didnt look comfortable at CB and just about coped with their grandad. Kuqi was inneffective upfront, and bellamy likewise (although it looked as though he was nowhere near fit, cant actually remember him breaking into a trademark sprint).

I was still finishing my beer when the hammers equalised, but i still thought we would get something out of the game, with west ham not looking that great at the back. How wrong could i have been! The secong half was just absolute cack! We lost all organisation at the back and west ham looked dangerous with every attack, the width from etherington and the israeli offered them far more going forward than our own wideman.

About 10 mins into the second half, hughes brought gresko on for the disapointing kuqi, reverting back to the 451 that served us so well last season. We started to get back into the game with gresko actually giving us width on the left, but despite the extra man in midfield we still managed to waste possesion repeatedly. Reid and savage being the biggest culprits, choosing to play difficult crossfield passes in our own half.

However around the hour mark west ham scored thier second, reo coker smashing the ball into the net form the edge of the area giving friedal no chance, where was the defence? i still dont know!

Hughes switched back to a 442 bringing dickov on, but to no avail as west ham scored again, from another defensive error this time from emerton.

Then to cap the afternoon off Dickov got himself stupidly sent off for a two footed lunge on konchesky, what an idiot this guy is!

So a really poor start to the season performance wise. Yes most of the team were awful, with only lucas having a half decent game. But its better to get this type of performance out of the way. The front two have taken a bit of stick, but they really did have no service. Neither emerton or pedersen got down the line and put a cross in from open play and savage and reids passing was awful.

But is not all doom and gloom, i think gresko and nelsen coming back into the defence will shore us up and i think once fit bellamy will deliver. Personally i would put tugay back into the team and drop savage for the next game. I am confident the results will come!

[Guest Eastend Harry]

Drslowman, are you sure you didn't turn up at craven cottage yesterday, The only peep I heard from your lot is when you scored.

Moment of the day, savage thrown into the advertising boards by konchesky, quality.

good luck in the championship

[Shevchenko]

Drslowman, are you sure you didn't turn up at craven cottage yesterday, The only peep I heard from your lot is when you scored.

Moment of the day, savage thrown into the advertising boards by konchesky, quality.

good luck in the championship 

338976[/snapback]

Classy..

[S15]

Drslowman, are you sure you didn't turn up at craven cottage yesterday, The only peep I heard from your lot is when you scored.

Moment of the day, savage thrown into the advertising boards by konchesky, quality.

good luck in the championship 

338976[/snapback]

Nothing like a churpy cockney setting himself up for a big fall....

Think irony might play it's way after yesterdays result...

A kick up the backside for Rovers, making us stronger for the season ahead....

An oh so un needed ego boost for those silly arrogant old timers down at West Ham..

Big Club? No, just a big city mate, hope your prepared for a dogfight, as I feel you'll be oh so more involved than us.

[92er]

IMO Todd has a way to high status among the supporters, some people on this board even thinks he is among the 4-5 best defenders in the league...

338765[/snapback]

I totally agree with you.

[92er]

Open question to board members:

In your honest opinion what does Robbie 'headless Chicken' Savage bring to our game?...............................................

338900[/snapback]

I was disappointed when we signed him and I thought we paid too much for him by buying him in January.I continue to totally have no idea why we signed him but Scotty, whose opinions are often spot on, thinks he will turn out to be an excellent signing.

[92er]

I cant be bothered repeating what everyone else is saying. All il say is no more Mokoenna at center back PLEASE!

As for the rest of the seasons cover id much rather have Amo as a backup for center back than Mokoenna. With Amo we know what were getting...good performances agains tthe top teams and good performances with a couple of mistakes and lapses in concentration against the other teams. So if todd/nelsen gets injured we just have to keep our fingers crossed we get lucky with amos mistakes and warn his partner to be ready and quick off the mark when a mistake happens.

So that was yesterday, it was crap, its OVER. Next week...fulham at home...we need a result! COME ON ROVERS!!

338950[/snapback]

Amoruso was only "effective" when he returned towards the end of his first season and Souness had developed a more defensive formation.

I very much doubt if he could hack it in 4-4-2.

Another player who I don't rate but might be a cb alternative is Matteo.