[Archived] Refs Are Biased By "big" Clubs

[frosty]

Balancing out the big club affect is the reason that I am so in favour of the introduction of video refereeing for important incidents.

Most people are in favour of video evidence being introduced to the game, but the managers of the 'big 4' probably don't want it. Why? Because then, with video evidence, they wouldnt get all the big decisions. The referee yesterday was just scared of giving a penalty to Wigan

[gumboots]

It wasn't just the pen he was scareed of - it was the sending off that would have had to go with it. Arsenal have had Gilberto and Senderos sent off recently but not at the Emirates? This one would have required far more bottle than Dowd possesses.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Most people are in favour of video evidence being introduced to the game,

I'm not ... not totally anyway - maybe for goals and possibly 'off the ball incidents or a penalties but that would be about it for me.

I don't think the refs are bias towards any team really- I just think they are all bad and have no 'authority' to control a game and go off what they actually see rather than what they think they see 'ie their mind is already made up before thinking about something than what they have seen. My reasoning for this is because of the way the rules are interpreted - (why can't they be black and white and who dictates the intepretation?) and the powers that be that enforce and run the rule over the refs with the monitoring of the performances.

I might be wrong on this, but can anybody recall somebody coming out and saying a decision was wrong (not a ref)? So bearing this in mind who would suggest a video replay being used (ref? - what if he feels he was right and if not what is the point of the ref)

Yes odd times refs have done it, which is fair enough and what people want to hear but I still feel this is major part of what is wrong - refs will never call any incident right all of the time and will always make mistakes, however there are times when it is blatantly obvious even from where a ref or assistant is positioned yet they still get it wrong.

Edited February 12, 2007 by CAPT KAYOS

[Zulu]

Sorry, I can't take Jeff Winter seriously, no matter how accurate his comments are on this issue. The man is a prick.

[RoyRover]

I suppose at some level we all knew that refs were bias toward bigger teams, with this book it just rubber stamps our idea.

[Welshrover1981]

Refs will always be on the side of the bigger clubs than the smaller ones. Its always gone on, but the last 5 years with video technology and media interests it is clear that refs will always go towards the big 4 clubs.

yesterday is all too apparent reminder proving this point. I could not believe my eyes when I saw the Ref and the Assistant Ref not flag. It is clear that had it been Henry, or Baptista being man handled then they would have given it.

I agree with Jewell, Refs are only consistent in being inconsistent. How much do the Prem pay for them not being able to handle the pressure and give clear cut decisions. It is a case of using common sense and being fair. Do they realise that at least 10 clubs rely on being able to survive and that decision could cost them millions of pounds in revenue.

When will the FA, Premiership and Referee Association realise this?

[Fife Rover]

Refs will always be on the side of the bigger clubs than the smaller ones. Its always gone on, but the last 5 years with video technology and media interests it is clear that refs will always go towards the big 4 clubs.

yesterday is all too apparent reminder proving this point. I could not believe my eyes when I saw the Ref and the Assistant Ref not flag. It is clear that had it been Henry, or Baptista being man handled then they would have given it.

I agree with Jewell, Refs are only consistent in being inconsistent. How much do the Prem pay for them not being able to handle the pressure and give clear cut decisions. It is a case of using common sense and being fair. Do they realise that at least 10 clubs rely on being able to survive and that decision could cost them millions of pounds in revenue.

When will the FA, Premiership and Referee Association realise this?

As things stand right at this moment the answer to that particular question is ........ never!

They ALL need to be persudaded. At the end of the day the paying mugs (ooops! sorry that should be customer) are the only one's that ultimately can do this. Thinking caps on time for us mugs!! See my earlier post near the top of this page.

Edited February 12, 2007 by Fife Rover

[thenodrog]

Surely the time has come for some kind of organised and co-ordinated protest to be made with maximum publicity. Something along the lines of: A mass boycot of all prem matches by the fans of aggrieved clubs accompanied by the message "Get this sorted out properly and permanently, or this protest goes on until you do". Would require organising by the Association of Football Supporters or some such body.

The protest should also consist of all aggrieved fans stopping buying any newspapers until they back the action.

Just think if ALL the fans of say 14 EPL clubs did this and stuck to it, it would be sorted out in quick time!

Judging by attendance figures I think it's already started Fife!

[colin]

At the threat of making myself very unpopular you lot are all talking rubbish.

The Refs are there to give decisions as they see them. Not as Alan Shearer makes up on "Match Of The Day" that someone was "entitled to go down for a penalty" according to the "rules."

There are the "laws of the game."

If you cant even get the basics right then you have no place commenting on them.

If the ref doesn't see a foul then he can't give it. Fact.

Given that your average player will dive, cheat, feign injury, roll over screaming blue murder, hobble off to the side only to come on three seconds later then it's not much of a challenge for the Referee.

The average premiership player is a cheating git and has his full backing from his manager (Ronalfdo & RFW anyone?)

Over & out

[ace]

If the ref doesn't see a foul then he can't give it. Fact.

Given that your average player will dive, cheat, feign injury, roll over screaming blue murder, hobble off to the side only to come on three seconds later then it's not much of a challenge for the Referee.

I fully accept your point Colin..but what are the other officials ..including the fourth, there to actually do? Harry Dowd was the ref for our game at home to Spurs ..remember the sending of of Tugay ( down to the linesman! ) and the Mido handball which everyone in the stadium saw except for the referee and the linesman.

The level of incompetence by some officials is truely awful and the body responsible for their appointment/licensing should be restructured!

[CAPT KAYOS]

At the threat of making myself very unpopular you lot are all talking rubbish.

The Refs are there to give decisions as they see them.

Colin this is the point I was referring to above - IMO The problem is the refs do not give the decisions as they see them.

There is too much off the field activity in my book and again I refer to question i have raised above.

Welshrover states what we all know - FR backs him and TND ( at last TND not just about the money ) confirms another reason why people are turning their back on the game.

Interesting comment , from Jewell and Hughes last night on the radio - Jewell commented about refs being professional saying they weren't professional as 'professionals' are supposedly good at what they do. Hughes comments where in a way supporting the outburst of Jewel in stating that there should be a medium where managers could vent their feelings and have them heard as it is a highly emotional game and the refs decisions could/are costing people jobs.

Edited February 13, 2007 by CAPT KAYOS

[ihateburnley]

Instead of having breaks in play and /or replays on contentious issues during a game (like in rugby and cricket), why don't they just have a referee (they could even use the fourth official) just watching the game on TV in the dugout. If he sees something that the referee misses or sees that the ball has crossed the line etc, he could just buzz the ref and let him know of the situation.

That way we will get away from this situation whereby the supporter watching at home has a greater understanding of the game at hand.

I'm telling you we're only a couple of years away from having a Big Brother style "vote off the most disliked referee" every week.

[gumboots]

The point surely in the Arsenal Wigan game was how could neither the ref nor the linesman see anything when on the first shot we saw, not the millionth replay, everyone in our house shouted penalty as by all accounts did all the sky pundits, in line with, but further away than the linesman. Were the officials too close? I have no axe to grind with officials in general as my cousin is married to a premiership linesman, but that was a penalty however anyone tries to explain the decision away and if they couldn't see it, with clear sightlines such as they had, then they shouldn't be doing the job. It wasn't an honest error. It was, at the least, gross incompetence, and at worst, something far more sinister.

[CAPT KAYOS]

And in true FA fashion

JEWELL HIT WITH FA CHARGE

[pleasure]

And in true FA fashion

JEWELL HIT WITH FA CHARGE

wigan are thinking about a counter-claim. whether dowd was swearing at wigan players or not, is open to debate, but i couldnt see any difference in jewell/ dowd's conduct, when they sqaured up to each other.

dowd gets no simpathy from me, after his discraceful performance against spurs at ewood.

interesting article in today's times :

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/foo...icle1375336.ece

[USABlue]

Bottom line is, we all know what is going on. It happens way too often to be mere coincidence. I agree it turns the fans stomachs to the point where many of them are staying away. For pity's sake don't the "Big Four" have enough of an advantage with their mega millions and huge squads why on earth do they need help from the officials. The game is over as a sporting contest once you have officials erring on the side of the "big" teams.

Same stuff goes on here in the NBA, certain players commit certain "fouls" or break the laws of the game but due to who they are they get away with it. One of the reasons my interest in Basketball has become so ho hum, I used to love it with a passion, second only to footy. Now I can't even be bothered to watch my local team on TV.

[thenodrog]

Strange that so many managers still speak to the TV camera's directly after a match. Even stranger that their chairman allow em to. I'll wager Sam n RFW's lives are so much easier now without the beeb shoving mikes under their noses and goeding them to overreact.

Whats more when they do choose to speak (Sam last week) people are more disposed to listen.

[Jan]

Strange that so many managers still speak to the TV camera's directly after a match. Even stranger that their chairman allow em to. I'll wager Sam n RFW's lives are so much easier now without the beeb shoving mikes under their noses and goeding them to overreact.

Whats more when they do choose to speak (Sam last week) people are more disposed to listen.

There's a requirement for them to do so after matches. Sir Alex doesn't because he's boycotting the BBC (or at least 5 live). Mourinho hasn't a couple of time, and Wenger, but I think all the rest always have.

[USABlue]

I don't know exactly what the charges relate to since I can't get the link to open. If the charge is related to his after match comments it's ludicrous. I understand that these managers are mandated to speak to the media after games, then how can they be brought up for simply answwering the questions raised by the Media. Bit hypocritical to me. Surely one needs to also tell the press don't ask questions about the refs.

I have suggested in the past and I still believe something will come out at some time, there is a dirty dark little secret here somewhere in this whole officiating fiasco and when it is unearthed it will blow the lid right of the game.

How's that for drama.

[thenodrog]

There's a requirement for them to do so after matches. Sir Alex doesn't because he's boycotting the BBC (or at least 5 live). Mourinho hasn't a couple of time, and Wenger, but I think all the rest always have.

I know about that requirement Jan but if the RFW and Big Sam can pick and choose whether to be interviewed by the Beeb thereby breaking their contractual obligations then I guess all others could do the same.

I wonder if PR type chappies will end up being employed to represent clubs? If so I might apply.

[ultrablue]

Presumably Man U and Bolton get round the contractual obligation bit by sending out their assistants both of whom have unspellable names!

[thenodrog]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/200...89520-19569736/

Thats arse about face! They would be better served by appointing referees who were strong enough in past seasons to stand up to the likes of the old RFW and Jose Mourhino. To admit that their members are susceptable to bullying is a sad indictment of their selection procedures.

Edited August 5, 2007 by thenodrog

[Flopsy]

actually its because the FA dont support the Ref's when they do make the right call. Any player talking back to the ref, yellow card. Abuse from the manger - sent to the stands banned from the ground during the match.

Players banned for three matches for waving imaginary cards. Players banned for the next match if they question any decision.

Thats whats needed if you want ref's to be able to stand up to managers.

[robborover]

I watched the liverpool game yesterday when gerrard slapped that bloke and realised that if he had been sent off then he would be suspended in the premier league for 3 matches. Surely this almost means you can kick the hell out of everyone in friendlies as the ref will be slated if he actually dared to give you a red?

I agree with you flopsy. refs need more support and less criticism.

[daren]

In the Community Shield, I noticed that Chelsea in particular tended not only to crowd the referee but to physically bash into him (while holding their hands out and arguing). This is _not_ on. The players that do it should be sent off immediately.

Refs really get my goat sometimes but it's a difficult job and the way players react so aggressively must be hard. Sure a bit o' cussin' or holding the hands to the head, but screaming at the ref and bumping him? Or Van Persie's petulant punching of the turf? Gotta go.