[Archived] The Breakaway Is Coming

[philipl]

G14 look to avoid the "lottery" of having to qualify

Some interesting posturing-

They need certainty of Champs League millions for future planning they say.

Domestic football is the core of their activity they claim (oh yes and with control of the Champs League they are not going to dictate to the national teams and domestic leagues are they?)

Membership of G14 is closed so no place for Abramovich or Fart Freddie (that was a genuine typing mistake but why correct it?)

Will be interesting watching two of football's most unloved organisations- UEFA and G14- going toe to toe in a battle of strength.

As I see it at the moment, the G14 position is too weakened by anomalies to work. Yes Real Madrid, Man U, Arsenal, AC and Juve are massive clubs but they all have massive weaknesses (Madrid City Council, Glazers, Ashburton Grove debts, Berlusconi's fate when he has lost the Italian Election and no fans respectively). The Rovers can quite comfortably look the likes of Leverkusen and Eindhoven eye to eye financially and has a more impressive trophy cabinet than Leverkusen by far whilst Burnley would be embarassed to get Monaco's home gates.

On that basis only the recently cleaned up Barca looks to be a true mega-club.

Oh and Clelsea who could turn nasty and with £7bn in cash, Roman could cause mayhem just by showing them what he is capable of without actually having to do anything. If he wanted some fun, £100m cash bids by Roman's friends to buy out current owners could quite easily see a third of the G14 change hands.

If this sees the light of day, I think it could be time to refer the G14 to the European Competition Commissioner on the basis of an abusive cartel. If the EU found England's TV rights anti-competitive, the G14 running the Champs League as a closed shop surely stands no chance.

[thenodrog]

imo (and this may be something to do with age I grant you) the Champions League is dull and uninteresting compared to the old European Cup knock out system. It's proving a turn off for the public. G14 only clubs would make it as dull as dishwater.

I've said it before, take away hope, optimism and expectation from football supporters and it'll be as dead as a dodo in quick time.

[frosty]

whilst Burnley would be embarassed to get Monaco's home gates.

Actually, Monaco's stadium only holds 18,000 so they do fair well

[philipl]

The buttock- clenching fear of failure and emotions when you miss out are very much part of the shared experience of following a football club.

Take that away from the football experience and a lot of the loyalty which saw the Mancs fill OT in the old second division would go too.

UEFA are rattled judging by the speed of this response.

I made a mistake, Monaco with their 5,000 crowds are not part of the G14.

Edited March 18, 2006 by philipl

[1864roverite]

let then go and kick every one of them out their respective leagues and ban htem from ever coming back.

They would then soon realise their bread and butter is no beter than they are now.

[RovertheHill]

Absolutely agree. You play in your breakaway Euro league and you eff off from the premier league. No cake and eat it here. Frankly the league would be a better place without you. The extract I found most staggering was the group calling for "more reliable criteria" for participation in the Euro competitions i.e. don't worry about form, fix it so that the "biggest" teams are in. Disgraceful

[AggyBlue]

If the prem's two G14 members do form their own euro midweek league and still play in the prem, how may of their top stars would we see playing prem matches?

None. They'd be saved for the more lucrative euro league.

I'm in agreement with the 'kick 'em out ' brigade.

[Billy Castell]

UEFA and FIFA should get together, and tell the G14 to bog off and form their super Euro League. They should then ban all players from playing in any tournament run by the domestic leagues, UEFA and FIFA i.e. no world cup, European cup or Premiership football for them. It will be like successful chemotherapy for football-initially painful and unpleasant, but ultimately successful in removing the cancer that is so damaging.

However, both UEFA and FIFA will be far too cowardly to do this, and the repugnant cancer that is the G14 will grow and destroy football as we know it.

[OscarRaven]

so as to allow these top-level clubs the opportunity to effectively forward plan so that they can maximise their chances of a 'return on investment' - - Football was great when it was a sport!

Fixing so the rich get richer pure and simple - lack of competetion will ultimatley destroy the game - without even a remote chance to win the league or a cup, really whats the point? To get into Europe? To do what compete in another competetion that can't be won? [if its not quite there now it soon will be]

What is the point?

As I have said the bubble has burst (or the boom is over) and unsurprisingly its clubs like Rovers that suffer. Can we survive a football recession?

[Billy Castell]

If UEFA bow to the G14, as they will, maybe a G20,000 of all the non-G14 clubs in Europe should resign from UEFA and form their own European organisation. Crazy, unrealistic but it may have to come to something like this for football to be viable in the future.

[trueblue]

What got me was the bit about G14 clubs wanting COMPENSATION for players called to International duty !!

FFS! at one time it was an HONOUR for both player AND club to be selected to play for your Country.. now it seems the G14 want PAYING for the privelige of LETTING their players play.

[Fife Rover]

so as to allow these top-level clubs the opportunity to effectively forward plan so that they can maximise their chances of a 'return on investment' - - Football was great when it was a sport!

Fixing so the rich get richer pure and simple - lack of competetion will ultimatley destroy the game - without even a remote chance to win the league or a cup, really whats the point? To get into Europe? To do what compete in another competetion that can't be won? [if its not quite there now it soon will be]

What is the point?

As I have said the bubble has burst (or the boom is over) and unsurprisingly its clubs like Rovers that suffer. Can we survive a football recession?

392004[/snapback]

I know it would be a hard and bitter pill to swallow for the vast majority of football clubs that would not and never could be a part of the G14 setup, but if it happens and you think about it rationally, would it be such a bad thing for the left out clubs?

This same scenario has been the case (obviously on a very much smaller scale) in Scottish football for so many years that few can remember when it was any better. I am of course alluding to the "old firm" setup. But here in Scotland there is an ever increasing feeling that has now become an avalanche; and this is to the effect that most Scottish football fans outside of the old firm (and quite a few within the old firm ) are now of the opinion that the best solution for Scottish football as a whole would be for Rangers and Celtic to just go away and join some other league at wherever will have them. Then the rest of the clubs can really compete on a level playing field for the first time in at least 50 years.

Surely the same would apply in England if the English G14 members were to just beatle off?

Edited March 20, 2006 by Fife Rover

[OscarRaven]

Surely the same would apply in England if the English G14 members were to just beatle off?

392012[/snapback]

Yeah, lets all play in the championship we would do well there.

Missing the point - an even and level playing field for all makes for interesting football unless you tackle that you just end up going round the same circle.

[AggyBlue]

If UEFA bow to the G14, as they will, maybe a G20,000 of all the non-G14 clubs in Europe should resign from UEFA and form their own European organisation. Crazy, unrealistic but it may have to come to something like this for football to be viable in the future.

392006[/snapback]

Under the guise of 'Real Football', where tackles are allowed and players wearing gloves are banned

[Ronin]

I know it would be a hard and bitter pill to swallow for the vast majority of football clubs that would not and never could be a part of the G14 setup, but if it happens and you think about it rationally, would it be such a bad thing for the left out clubs?

This same scenario has been the case (obviously on a very much smaller scale) in Scottish football for so many years that few can remember when it was any better. I am of course alluding to the "old firm" setup. But here in Scotland there is an ever increasing feeling that has now become an avalanche; and this is to the effect that most Scottish football fans outside of the old firm (and quite a few within  the old firm ) are now of the opinion that the best solution for Scottish football as a whole would be for Rangers and Celtic to just go away and join some other league at wherever will have them. Then the rest of the clubs can really compete on a level playing field for the first time in at least 50 years.

Surely the same would apply in England if the English G14 members were to just beatle off?

392012[/snapback]

I'm sure I remember the rest of the SPL clubs declare their intent to resign from the SPL, if Rangers/Celtic didn't do their own TV deal or if the TV money wasn't fairly divided between the rest of the clubs, when the TV deal was being negotiated.

[Fife Rover]

Yeah, lets all play in the championship we would do well there.

Missing the point - an even and level playing field for all makes for interesting football unless you tackle that you just end up going round the same circle.

392016[/snapback]

Who's missing the point? The point I was making is that if you assume the departure of Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal and any others that are or can get membership of the G14, then you have a free hand to re-arrange English football along the lines it used to be i.e. 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th divisions or whatever you want to call them. There will be no super-rich clubs and the new league could legislate for no more takeovers by billionaires. THEN we would all be able to get on with watching and supporting the clubs we love and all would have at least a reasonable chance over time of winning things.

I am also assuming in all this that the TV channels will have followed the G14 lot to wherever and with them will go the Armchair Fans. The real supporters can then get on with doing what I have always done and go and support their favorite team or their nearest team whatever.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Who's missing the point? The point I was making is that if you assume the departure of Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal and any others that are or can get membership of the G14, then you have a free hand to re-arrange English football along the lines it used to be i.e. 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th divisions or whatever you want to call them. There will be no super-rich clubs and the new league could legislate for no more takeovers by billionaires. THEN we would all be able to get on with watching and supporting the clubs we love and all would have at least a reasonable chance over time of winning things.

392051[/snapback]

Sadly if that were to be the scenario you can be assured attendances would go through the floor.

[Fife Rover]

Sadly if that were to be the scenario you can be assured attendances would go through the floor.

392053[/snapback]

Maybe so in the short to medium term but eventually things would settle down and pan out along the lines I outined above. The armchair fans would still be watching TV and "the big clubs" so whatever turns you on! BUT the REAL football fans would be doing what they always have done and watching their favorite teams down at the ground, the only place to be for real atmosphere and feelings of belonging.

This idea would gradually catch on by virtue of the real fans constantly enthusing to their friends , relations , workmates etc about what they see on SATURDAY AFTERNOONS (OH HEAVEN). Hence attendances and Saturdays would return to what they used to be.

[cn174]

What got me was the bit about G14 clubs wanting COMPENSATION for players called to International duty !!

FFS! at one time it was an HONOUR for both player AND club to be selected to play for your Country.. now it seems the G14 want PAYING for the privelige of LETTING their players play.

392007[/snapback]

Well FIFA are about to go to court with Charleroi after one of their players got injured whilst on international duty, and they claim it reduced their chances of winning the league.

Charleroi are being backed by g14

[RevidgeBlue]

The Champions League qualifying stages are as thenodrog said dull as dishwater, and already little more than a cash cow for the bigger clubs already.

However if you take away the last pretence of competitiveness by making the competition guaranteed entry, you would kill the competition stone dead imo and it wouldn't be long before the fans and ultimately sponsors were deserting the competition in droves.

Whist not necessarily agreeing with it, I can however understand in this day and age the calls for compensation for injured players on international duty. If your 90k p.w. asset is out for a month and you slip a couple of places down the League as a result, that's cost you nearly 1.5m.

The FA is hardly a charity these days, they make vast amounts of money on the backs of the England team every time they play. So I can see the argument.

As for kicking the G14 out, not sure about that. I would probably get more satisfaction out of seeing us finish in a Champions League spot with the three G14 clubs and Chelsea in than winning a League without them. Where's the satisfaction to be gained from that? You almost might as well be playing Burnley.

[RovertheHill]

The point is that the rest of football is being dictated to by 18 clubs and it's time to make a stand. Either they play in their league, and their league alone, or they play in the current leagues. But not both, and definitely not bent out of shape to suit their money-grabbing antics. I'm alright jack.

And the suggestion earlier on about players have to play in an official FA/UEFA/FIFA league to qualify for the national team is bang on. See how many big name players flock to join them then when there is no chance of a World Cup to play in, or a European Championship. It will become like the first incarnation of Major League Soccer was in the States - a place where superstars go for one last paycheque. And then it would die, because regardless of that it would be boring as hell. How many English, German, Italian and Spanish fans will tune into Lyon vs Porto do you think? About as many as watch Osasuna vs Mallorca now - b*gger all.

[philipl]

Punishments proposal.

I simply do not see the G14 winning on this one and in fact I can see them taking a fearful beating.

-UEFA has seven associations who have G14 members and 42 who do not.

-The Polish FA has nothing to lose by taking an extremely aggressive uncompromising stance against the G14 and quite possibly a lot to gain.

-A country like Poland can reasonably expect to become a footballing power at club level as their economy grows. UEFA must know that Associations like Russia, Poland, Bulgaria, Romania and Ukraine are as likely to produce as much future growth if not more than places like the UK and Italy where there are clear signs of football being at or beyond saturation point.

-The renaiscance of Eastern European football is evident from the presence of four of the last eight clubs in UEFA coming from Russia, Bulgaria and Romania. But the G14 action is targeted at preventing any footballing power shifts.

-The G14 can hardly look for support amongst the seven Associations where their clubs are based. There is no way that the Premiership is going to make life easier for the Mancs, Arsenal and Liverpool in trying to limit competition so the Football League and the rest of the FA are going to be even less supportive.

So are we going to see a Kerry Packer situation in football?

The G14 will undoubtedly be looking at the feasibility of a break away series but the conditions which pertained in 1970s cricket which gave Packer a partial success simply do not exist in modern football. If this does develop into a ruck, the biggest winners will be Chelsea who are in the perfect position as the world's richest club and sitting within the "establishment".

Edited March 21, 2006 by philipl

[philipl]

The point is that the rest of football is being dictated to by 18 clubs and it's time to make a stand.  Either they play in their league, and their league alone, or they play in the current leagues.  But not both, and definitely not bent out of shape to suit their money-grabbing antics.  I'm alright jack. 

And the suggestion earlier on about players have to play in an official FA/UEFA/FIFA league to qualify for the national team is bang on.  See how many big name players flock to join them then when there is no chance of a World Cup to play in, or a European Championship.  It will become like the first incarnation of Major League Soccer was in the States - a place where superstars go for one last paycheque.  And then it would die, because regardless of that it would be boring as hell.  How many English, German, Italian and Spanish fans will tune into Lyon vs Porto do you think?  About as many as watch Osasuna vs Mallorca now - b*gger all.

392163[/snapback]

I think you are right. In fact the G14 would disintegrate before this happened. Glazer, Berlusconi and Agnelli would be in favour of a World Series as perhaps would clubs from the smaller leagues- Porto, PSV and Ajax. Whether Barca and Real could agree on anything is open to question.

I doubt the French trio would do anything that was perceived as against the interests of France or so obviously "anglo-saxon".

There are probably enough traditionalists at Arsenal to win the day against so long as their debt repayment remains on schedule and 19 Premiership matches are key to that.

Which leaves Liverpool who will say yes, no, how much, hang on we're playing Blackburn on Sat er Friday er Sunday, er lets ask the HJC, how many hubcaps did you say we need to build the new Anfield?....

[philipl]

Opening skirmishes as UEFA threatens to fight back.

UEFA's G14 resolution passed.

I hadn't realised that the G14 had presented a £500m bill for use of their players in international games!

UEFA threaten expulsion from all competitions including domestic leagues if clubs form a breakaway competition.

I guess that the Glazer influence is coming at the European level initially. And disguising upping the Mancs' season ticket prices effectively by an increase equivalent to the cost of a season ticket in the Riverside.

Edited March 23, 2006 by philipl

[blue phil]

These developments are like a silver lining on a dark cloud . Just maybe the big clubs will bugger off to the mega boredom super league and let the remaining clubs redress the power struggle that has for too long been a money making machine for the top league players . Consequently wages could come down , followed by admission prices and genuine enthusiasm for the game as a "peoples'" game would return .

In 5 years time the leagues could dictate terms to the big clubs desperate to return - wage caps , squad sizes , more equitable TV money distribution , etc . In the meantime - look at this season's league table - well managed clubs like the Rovers and Bolton could be challenging for the title . Well worth it !