[Archived] Congratulations To Newcastle United

[blue phil]

Shearer is no Dalglish intellectually and would have been an unmitigated disaster imo, I said as much at the time. BUT he does have one thing in common with Kenny....neither would come anywhere near us without JW type wealth to hand.

If Shearer is no Dalglish intellectually (which is very questionable) then both are way above Ince in that department . It's the individual that counts not some beliefs about age and experience nor some silly rules put forward by the Prem league .

There's very little evidence at this moment in time to suggest that Shearer will be a bad manager in the long run . Great players can make great managers . Inexperienced managers can prove effective - as Barcelona showed this season .

We should remember that Shearer was first offered the job years ago when still a player . We ended up with someone whose credentials were far superior ...........Ray Harford !

Whether Shearer could have done better with the players at Ewood than the dross at Newcastle we'll never know ...not even you Gordon

[TimmyJimmy]

Going for the hat-trick I see timmyj.

boom boom nice one gord, I'll set 'em up and you knock 'em down

Seriously though if there was real big money riding on the outcome, and I mean a lot of it so the silly stuff was put aside and we had to think carefully about outcomes - does anyone truly think that before retirement age both Shearer and Ince won't have managed a top club and won something.

Bet they both will and I have a sneaky feeling you and others would join in with that bet as well. You know that they will turn out good - eventually.

We all get better

[JAL]

Glad to read Tugay4England and Tony gales mic take on John Williams and the board in completely getting the recruitment of a suitable manager wrong for Blackburn Rovers football club last summer.

There was some alarming errors of judgement that came to light that question their integrity to take the club forward certainly for me .

[jodrell]

It looks like Newcastle staff are paying the price of relegation.

Newcastle Axe 120 jobs as staff pay price for Premier League relegation.

But not many players going yet.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/200...15875-21400292/

[leftfooter]

If further proof was necessary as to why Newcastle are where they are:

"..No disrespect to the Championship, but Newcastle are too big a club to be down there..." says 60K per week, Damien Duff.

The likes of Scunthorpe and Doncaster mightl beg to differ.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/foo...icle6359141.ece

[tony gale's mic]

Absolutely, Mark Hughes was a complete disaster.

Okay I should have included international in that if we're being pedantic, but it should be pretty obvious that achieving excellent results against the likes of Italy, Argentina, Czech Republic, Germany and Croatia with a Wales side which had been through its poorest run for years isnt remotely comparable to either Ince or Shearer's records.

[Majiball]

With zero experience no, after this season it should be made law, never again.

I was all for Shearer with the right coaches (Iain Dowie is not included on that list), but imagine say Shearer and a Steve Clarke combo. Now though no chance.

This season has really highlighted how blaise we are to learning how to coach/run a club in this country. I do believe we are the only country in europe that has ever appointted/allowed the appointment of un-qualified people taking over football teams.

But with reference to JW let me ask you this put yourself in his shoes, Ince was appointted and the first desicion he would have taken to the chairman is his back-room team selections. Paul was obviously told by JW that at least one had to have premiership experience, this implies it was discussed before the appointment. So Paul presents the names Matihus, Sargent major, Robinson and Finally the experienced one Knox.

3 of them were always coming, it would have been discussed before he signed, now the last one was even recommended by Ferguson. the trouble is he's one of Fergies best mates and had 3 years experience the last way way back in 1996???. But yet reccomended and probably to our chairman as well by fergie (I would be gobsmacked if he hadn't done this). So he fits the bill that was laid out.

So your New manager who your convinced is going to do really well put forward his team you make some calls get some good feedback (fergie & smith, rangers, again they worked together in the prem and are great mates). I would have thought he would have been unsure about it, but Paul has filled the brief, and he would have come very highly reccomended.

So what do you do???? If you say no chance, Paul your barking!!!! their not good enough, when Paul believes they are , can you imagine what that would have done to their working relationship, it would have been over period.

Or do you do what all football fans ask (normally), have faith in the man you appointted and back him.

Now you can't absolve him of all blame, but he's no fool and would have asked around. But what bleaker future could we have had if he'd said no. Having a chairman and a manager who don't like each other would have seen us below spurs probably.

Call it a no win situation. But its a choice I would not like to have to make.

He should also be praised for bringing in Sam and also aiding in getting in Diouf and Givet. But as I said he can't be absolved of all blame but he's done well previously and loves our club (you can't fail but see it when he talks about the club), he will always back the manager and do all in his power to find money and funds and try to improve the club.

We couldn't ask for more, give him another chance.

[jodrell]

It's getting better for the Toon.

DECADES of bad management and reckless spending have begun to unravel in horrific fashion on Tyneside.

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/sport/3340...ash-crisis.html

[AussieinUk]

It's getting better for the Toon.

DECADES of bad management and reckless spending have begun to unravel in horrific fashion on Tyneside.

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/sport/3340...ash-crisis.html

I see standards are high at NOTW..

"But I am not so wealthy now. I put my money into it and I tried my best. But I except my best was woefully short. I am genuinely sorry about what has happened."

Except? shouldn't that be accept?

Re: the article.. You couldn't write a better script for the downfall of the barcodes!

[thenodrog]

If Shearer is no Dalglish intellectually (which is very questionable) then both are way above Ince in that department . It's the individual that counts not some beliefs about age and experience nor some silly rules put forward by the Prem league .

There's very little evidence at this moment in time to suggest that Shearer will be a bad manager in the long run . Great players can make great managers . Inexperienced managers can prove effective - as Barcelona showed this season .

We should remember that Shearer was first offered the job years ago when still a player . We ended up with someone whose credentials were far superior ...........Ray Harford !

Whether Shearer could have done better with the players at Ewood than the dross at Newcastle we'll never know ...not even you Gordon

boom boom nice one gord, I'll set 'em up and you knock 'em down

Seriously though if there was real big money riding on the outcome, and I mean a lot of it so the silly stuff was put aside and we had to think carefully about outcomes - does anyone truly think that before retirement age both Shearer and Ince won't have managed a top club and won something.

Bet they both will and I have a sneaky feeling you and others would join in with that bet as well. You know that they will turn out good - eventually.

We all get better

I guess we'll just have to let the passage of time prove me right again guys. And it will. Mark my words there's not a top manager between them.

[thenodrog]

I was all for Shearer with the right coaches (Iain Dowie is not included on that list), but imagine say Shearer and a Steve Clarke combo. Now though no chance.

This season has really highlighted how blaise we are to learning how to coach/run a club in this country. I do believe we are the only country in europe that has ever appointted/allowed the appointment of un-qualified people taking over football teams.

What would Shearer bring to the party except a big cost? He is neither coach nor management material.

[thenodrog]

He should also be praised for bringing in Sam and also aiding in getting in Diouf and Givet. But as I said he can't be absolved of all blame but he's done well previously and loves our club (you can't fail but see it when he talks about the club), he will always back the manager and do all in his power to find money and funds and try to improve the club.

We couldn't ask for more, give him another chance.

Irrelevent..... it's not our decision to make majiball.

JW'd praised for bringing in SA ? Hmm ....if he'd done it in summer and not cos by Dec SA was the only man that was available and affordable who could get us out of the hole the entire management had dug for us! Rem by all reports JW had to be forced to sack Ince!!

It must be tough making correct decisons all the time but rem JW is very well rewarded. Waggy and Tris could have made the same decision and no doubt for much less money...... I guess waggy would have kept faith in Ince though and when his hand had finally been forced by the board he'd have sulked and watched from the pub!

[thenodrog]

It's getting better for the Toon.

DECADES of bad management and reckless spending have begun to unravel in horrific fashion on Tyneside.

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/sport/3340...ash-crisis.html

Basically the lessons of LUFC have not been learned. Wot a good do, and ultimately superb news for English football! Here's to a few more Billy Big Time clubs eating dirt for the next decade.

How many years have successful businessmen run football clubs according to different rules than their businesses? It's resulted in houses of cards all over the country which are now being ruthlessly exposed by the financial crisis. Ashley is so stupid that according to that report he has now had to dip in his personal wealth to provide enough transfer funding to retain a bad management team!!! Will the fool never learn? Hull, WBA, Stoke, Wolves, Brum and Burnley will barely have spent 20m between em in the last two years. I'm convinced that Shearer, Ashley et al haven't got a brain between em. It's like the old joke, whats got an IQ of 50,000?..... A full St James Park.

Luvin it!

[broadsword]

The odds definitely favour them dropping another division straight away.

They might get back to the Premiership quicker if they folded the club and started Newcastle Phoenix United in the Blue square.

[Majiball]

What would Shearer bring to the party except a big cost? He is neither coach nor management material.

He's always been spoken about as a man who would make a great manager, even Jack offered him the job (or is that a wives tale?). He's a big figurehead would have drawn in positive media attention and aided in attracting players of some caliber.

As I said that was then, I've seen too much disaster happen this year through that route.

Irrelevent..... it's not our decision to make majiball.

JW'd praised for bringing in SA ? Hmm ....if he'd done it in summer and not cos by Dec SA was the only man that was available and affordable who could get us out of the hole the entire management had dug for us! Rem by all reports JW had to be forced to sack Ince!!

It must be tough making correct decisons all the time but rem JW is very well rewarded. Waggy and Tris could have made the same decision and no doubt for much less money...... I guess waggy would have kept faith in Ince though and when his hand had finally been forced by the board he'd have sulked and watched from the pub!

No its not our desicion, but I've read a few comments on here over the months asking why he didn't say no to the coaches, I just wanted to highlight why he had a no win situation with that choice. I don't know exactly what happened but its not rocket science.

Sam would have gone down like a kick in the balls in the summer we all know that. We can't say what would have happened but can you imagine 3,000+ less fans each game. Financially it would have been a disaster (not that it didn't become one). Sam wasn't the right choice in the summer, the outcome was too unpredictable.

JW obviously was convinced Ince was the next big thing (Ince must talk a fantastic game), but the finacial implications in sacking him and his staff as well as hiring new ones, probably took every penny we'd made in the summer and that we were getting from the trust. Its been a long time since we've had a bigger budget than 5M. He stuck to his guns against adversity a trait I admire, not many do nowadays. But the desicion was in the end made and it saved us. you can garuntee JW won't make that mistake again.

I realise its not happened in the ideal way but we got there in the end and we stayed in the league.

He's well rewarded yes, as are most in football, but he's done more good than bad for our club and when you look at the rest of the premiership, I'm delighted we have JW and not one of the other monkies that do the job. JW did make mistakes he knows that just as we do, but he's gotten more right than wrong.

[thenodrog]

He's always been spoken about as a man who would make a great manager, even Jack offered him the job (or is that a wives tale?). He's a big figurehead would have drawn in positive media attention and aided in attracting players of some caliber.

As I said that was then, I've seen too much disaster happen this year through that route.

No its not our desicion, but I've read a few comments on here over the months asking why he didn't say no to the coaches, I just wanted to highlight why he had a no win situation with that choice. I don't know exactly what happened but its not rocket science.

Sam would have gone down like a kick in the balls in the summer we all know that. We can't say what would have happened but can you imagine 3,000+ less fans each game. Financially it would have been a disaster (not that it didn't become one). Sam wasn't the right choice in the summer, the outcome was too unpredictable.

JW obviously was convinced Ince was the next big thing (Ince must talk a fantastic game), but the finacial implications in sacking him and his staff as well as hiring new ones, probably took every penny we'd made in the summer and that we were getting from the trust. Its been a long time since we've had a bigger budget than 5M. He stuck to his guns against adversity a trait I admire, not many do nowadays. But the desicion was in the end made and it saved us. you can garuntee JW won't make that mistake again.

I realise its not happened in the ideal way but we got there in the end and we stayed in the league.

He's well rewarded yes, as are most in football, but he's done more good than bad for our club and when you look at the rest of the premiership, I'm delighted we have JW and not one of the other monkies that do the job. JW did make mistakes he knows that just as we do, but he's gotten more right than wrong.

You may have a point but when should a club be run for 3000 intellectual pygmies whjo carn't tell their arse from their elbow? JW's son is in the business of PI /marketing. One might argue that it should be his job to sell a new manager to the fans rather than make do with an incompetent.

[Hughesy]

Those 3000 would soon of come back had we been up to around 8th, rather than 18th!!

Im pretty sure we would have a much healthier team, and also be looking forward to even more cash to spend this summer.

[LeChuck]

Sam would have gone down like a kick in the balls in the summer we all know that. We can't say what would have happened but can you imagine 3,000+ less fans each game. Financially it would have been a disaster (not that it didn't become one).

If 3,000 less fans turned up for every home league match this season, we'd only have lost out on £1.15 million (using a fairly generous £20 as average ticket price).

Sam for a whole season would have been worth a lot more than that in terms of prize money for league positions.

[joey_big_nose]

If 3,000 less fans turned up for every home league match this season, we'd only have lost out on £1.15 million (using a fairly generous £20 as average ticket price).

Sam for a whole season would have been worth a lot more than that in terms of prize money for league positions.

Its amazing how context affects these things though. If Sam had come in the summer the fanbase would have seen him in a generally negative light, and it would have been really hard for him to win them over. There would have been a lot of people against him, far more than just Waggy, and people would have measure him against Hughes. It would have been difficult for him to do his job - like Megson at Bolton - agaist constant sniping.

Because he saved the club Sam is now treated as a hero, the club is buzzing and the vast majority of fans are behind him. The comparison is made against Ince rather than Hughes which makes him look good. His job is a lot easier as a result.

[LeChuck]

It's a very good point, I agree. I made a tongue-in-cheek post when Sam was appointed that JW had pulled off a stroke of genius by appointing the worst man he could find for a few months, so that he could get past the Facebook brigade who stopped Sam coming in the summer.

It's odd that Megson continues to attract criticism at Bolton, you'd think he'd be enjoying similar status to Allardyce here as Bolton were certain for the drop under Sammy Lee.

[thenodrog]

If 3,000 less fans turned up for every home league match this season, we'd only have lost out on £1.15 million (using a fairly generous £20 as average ticket price).

Sam for a whole season would have been worth a lot more than that in terms of prize money for league positions.

Lee informed us two years ago that the average ticket price overall was just £13! And thats before they were reduced! I'd wager that your 1.15m might be substantially less now LeChuck.

[Majiball]

You may have a point but when should a club be run for 3000 intellectual pygmies whjo carn't tell their arse from their elbow? JW's son is in the business of PI /marketing. One might argue that it should be his job to sell a new manager to the fans rather than make do with an incompetent.

No it shouldn't, but when your a club like us that lives on a financial tight-rope (proven by cut-backs blamed on finishing below expected) it has to be considered. Don't forget that 3,000 does not include all the people who come who don't use the internet.

Its just not any easy choice, the safe option was to not select him as there where other candidates of good calibre (or percieved good calibre)

I do believe this season has woken up a few people at the club the cut-backs are a result of whats happened this year, we got it wrong once, and its cost us everything (financially).

PR is an on-going issue at the club, I wasn't even aware we par-took in it.

Its amazing how context affects these things though. If Sam had come in the summer the fanbase would have seen him in a generally negative light, and it would have been really hard for him to win them over. There would have been a lot of people against him, far more than just Waggy, and people would have measure him against Hughes. It would have been difficult for him to do his job - like Megson at Bolton - agaist constant sniping.

Because he saved the club Sam is now treated as a hero, the club is buzzing and the vast majority of fans are behind him. The comparison is made against Ince rather than Hughes which makes him look good. His job is a lot easier as a result.

It is isn't it.

Sam's here now, we're safe, hopefully now we can move on and up, with skill and labour.

[Tris]

You may have a point but when should a club be run for 3000 intellectual pygmies whjo carn't tell their arse from their elbow?

Ooops!!

It's a very good point, I agree. I made a tongue-in-cheek post when Sam was appointed that JW had pulled off a stroke of genius by appointing the worst man he could find for a few months, so that he could get past the Facebook brigade who stopped Sam coming in the summer.

The Facebook group had no bearing on any decision. What might have done are the local soundings taken by the LET, which really is about the most accurate indicator of how the money paying customers of BRFC might react to an appointment.

They ran a poll on June 4th 2008 which drew about 1000 votes, and only 13% wanted Allardyce. The picture didn't get any better as other candidates dropped out, and the reality of how local people viewed Allardyce was summed up on June 13th -

the vast majority of Rovers fans seem fiercely opposed to the idea of him being appointed

So you and JBN may well have a point, that the appointment of SA 12 months ago could have done more harm than good back then. Ignoring Facebook is one thing (and as I said - it wasn't a factor) .. but ignoring your ST holders and local fan base is quite another. Rovers can't afford to do that.

[leftfooter]

Geordie boy Bruce etches his name in to Newcastle folklore - not!

Sunderland boss Bruce targets Sebastien Bassong

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/nufc/newcas...72703-23804404/

Please Sam, of you're reading this, after years of seeing our managers and best players either unsettled, plundered or both by the Barcodes, can we join in the bidding?

[tony gale's mic]

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/sport/Shea...ns39.4159103.jp

It does worry me that JW seemed to base his decision so heavily on that LET poll. Shearer and Ince were 1st and 2nd, Shearer was first approached and then Ince was second to be approached. I still struggle to believe 46% of our fans wanted Shearer as our boss after Hughes; we laugh and laugh at Newcastle fans but that's a very poor reflection on the level of insight some of our fans seem to have.

Of course it should be a factor, but the reality is we have men who are paid handsomely to make these decisions based on a lot more than just public polls. I'm sure other things came into play, but on the other hand it does seem like it influenced the decision far more than it should've done.