[Archived] Bash the Nurses Thread...

[ihateburnley]

Why are people so obsessed about defending nurses all the way? At the end of the day, they are professionals that go out to earn a wage like the rest of us. They knew the wages on offer before they took the job like the rest of us. They trained and worked hard to get where they are like the rest of us.

Now why can't they just knuckle down and stick it out like the rest of us? Or look for a new job? I'm 21 and instead of going to Uni and studying for the promise of a 'good job' at the end of it, I decided to go work in a factory and have a think about what I wanted to do for a career. I'm now earning a lot more than your 'average nurse' (if the figures on here are to be believed).

People need to accept the fact that they may have made a bad career choice. If the conditions/pay are so crap, then they shouldn't take on a job in the first place. If enough people refused, there would be a desperate shortage and they would have to put the pay up. Simple.

[blue phil]

At a time when most students come out of university with £15-20,000 of debt we are busy paying people to train as nurses and then exporting them aroiund the world. Ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous

Yes , but to counter that loss we use a fair portion of our foreign aid budget to teach health care workers in the third world ............and then steal them to work over here .

All part of the global employment system , Paul ; I thought you were in favour of it ....

[joey_big_nose]

My point was that somebody was trying to tell me that being a nurse was a difficult job to qualify for and that they were highly trained, and that this simply not true. A nursing "degree" could be obtained by the most retarded of individuals and is "studied" whilst you are being trained. I say this because a old friend of mine's wife is now a nurse and believe me, she has a poor IQ for a glass of water. Not a single GCSE above a "C" yet is now a graduate.

As for your mindless twaddle about classics, nobody ever claimed that it was a providing you with useful tools to get a job. That is the purpose of vocational courses, once the preserve of polytechnics. Degrees are an academic exercise designed to improve your mind and to train you into ways of thinking and proccessing information, none more so than a classics degree.

If you want to learn skills that get you a job, that's fine. To suggest that Oxbridge graduates with Classics degrees are struggling to gain empoyment is laughable.

And as for your psycho analytical babble, my position is consistent and clear. Individuals should take account of their own situations and be responsible for their actions and omissions. If you are in a low paid job, then get a better paying job. For any nurse to moan that they are underpaid is risible. Is this a great surprise to them? Have they suddenly received a 50% pay cut? Of course not.

They entered the job with their eyes open. If they were brighter and better skilled they would be GP's, and don't even get me started on them.

Whatever yo are paid to do, do it to the best of your ability. From road sweeper to brain surgeon, that is my philosophy. If you get it wrong, you should get a rollocking. That does not happen with nurses, or indeed any other healthcare professionals as they are over protected by their regulatory bodies.

Some of thats pretty much fair enough. I do agree you don't want to over coddle jobs to provide too much of a comfort zone. But equally you don't want to live in the law of the jungle because that invites exploitation- just look at the US job market. You need a happy medium.

As for the oxford classics thing, these good old boys are finding things difficult. You seem like a man who knows a bit about business- if you look at any major company you will see that the majority of top positions are occupied by professionals who studied qantitive degrees- whether that be business, accountancy, finance etc. Increasingly Physicists and mathmaticians are making inroads. Of course I am not saying an Oxbridge grad won't get employed but if they study stuff like Classics their opportunities are diminishing. I study history myself so I am a victim of that trend too.

As for the 'psychobabble', my point is that if you want a decent society then act in a decent way. You philosophy from your posts (which I accept are no rounded judge of an individual) seems to be essentially dog eat dog with little consideration for others outside your own personal appraisal of the situation. If that was the universal mindset we would be in a lot more crap than we are now for all the relentless efficiency we would reap. You cannot build a society on selfishness.

edit- forgot about nurses. Well I don't know any nurses myself unfortunately so I cannot comment on that on a personal level. There do seem to be others on the board who do know someone who would take you up on that interpretation.

[joey_big_nose]

Surely this should be bash the GP’s thread, if you want to see a sector of the NHS which are overpaid its GPS and management. Under Labour the UK GP has become on average the highest paid in Europe above countries whose GP base have better technical training and nations with a higher cost of living. I think the figure is over £90,000. And yes whilst they have a tough stressful job they should be paid in line with GP’s from other similar nations

To contextualise this a bit in a privatised medical market pay would be much higher. There are not enough doctors to go round as it is and they would be able to charge much higher rates. In Britian on this front anyhow, the tax payer gets a pretty good deal.

Its a lot of money but even a standard GP is one of the most highly trained individuals in society.

[Flopsy]

just as an aside - does anyone want a Trident thread to be started?

[blue phil]

No ...we can always divert this one :ph34r:

[thenodrog]

Already done that and no one appears to give one about it.

here

http://www.brfcs.co.uk/mb/index.php?s=&amp...st&p=498917

[colin]

Strictly speaking this is not really adding to the debate on the pay of nurses...but it would be really interesting to know the jobs of those who are slagging the nurses; how much they earn compared to an average nurse & (optional) how they see themselves contributing more to society than the nursing profession.

[thenodrog]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/foo...icle2638251.ece

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/foo...icle2641700.ece

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport...s_fulfilled.php