[Archived] Oh Boy, I'm Not Too Sure I'm Excited About This....

[Uddersfelt Blue]

Why on earth would anyone on earth want to spend billions on buying a small town club who nobody likes and will never ever be able to compete with the city clubs in terms of support?

If its for the TV revenue, well that wont last because the BIG clubs will eventually do their own TV deals. That is if they don't break away from the Premiership to join a European League first

[salothsar]

Why on earth would anyone on earth want to spend billions on buying a small town club who nobody likes and will never ever be able to compete with the city clubs in terms of support?

If its for the TV revenue, well that wont last because the BIG clubs will eventually do their own TV deals. That is if they don't break away from the Premiership to join a European League first

The kind of people, especially the Americans, who are buying into premier league clubs at the moment have experience at developing a brand. Whereas I hate the idea of football becoming more like a marketing exercise this appears to the way things are going and others are in danger of being left behind. Rovers are an unfashionable small town club. Therefore, for someone with the ambition and know how, starting from a low base, could become much bigger and, more importantly more able to compete with the top 4.

A few people have said why do we need tis, we are doing fine as we are. I think this is true at the moment but will not be the case in the relatively near future. I know takeovers don't appeat to have done West Ham or Villa much good at the moment but I think they will benefit in the long run. For me its - jump on the bangwagon or get left behind.

[bluebruce]

Why on earth would anyone on earth want to spend billions on buying a small town club who nobody likes and will never ever be able to compete with the city clubs in terms of support?

If its for the TV revenue, well that wont last because the BIG clubs will eventually do their own TV deals. That is if they don't break away from the Premiership to join a European League first

Billions? I imagine Blackburn wouldn't cost anywhere near that. We're probably one of the cheapest clubs in the league to purchase, and with a big influx of TV cash imminent to slightly offset any investment. And we have minimal debts, of course. I think we make a rather interesting proposition, and I'm surprised there haven't been big, concrete offers we've heard about. As for the BIG clubs doing their own deals...well, we ought to put ourselves in the shop window then, eh? If they break off first, sod them. But we were one of the BIG clubs last time we got huge investment, don't forget.

[neekoy]

Any chance someone wants to come forward and just give us money??

Surely Rovers would qualify for government assistance/welfare?

[modes98]

From BBC Gossip column:

Blackburn Rovers could be bought by foreign buyers after initial talks were held with chairman John Williams. (Daily Mail)

[philipl]

The same John Williams interview is circulating and circulating- I doubt there is any news.

My guess is that John Williams simply did a "market tester".

There are people out there looking to buy into EPL clubs and wannabe EPL clubs. The general perception was that Rovers are not for sale at all so given that we can all assume Jack's Will requires the Trustees to do their very best for the club, they would be remiss not to let it be known that they would listen to approaches if there is someone who could do better for BRFC than they can.

This bit you will have heard before:

- that probably means any new owner putting more than £6m a year into the club as a gift

- it means any sale has to be in conformity with the Will's stipulations

- short of making BRFC a global megabrand (and 15 other EPL clubs dream of the same whilst 4 already are), it is hard to see how a new owner could fulfil the wishes of Jack and turn a profit out of doing so.

I remain convinced that Rovers' current ownership structure will give the club a competitive edge over the clubs burdened by the debts new owners incurred getting rid of the old ones. From what I can see, all the largesse of the new owners is being heaped on the clubs' balance sheet as debt at the moment.

That competitive edge given by the ownership structure is already evident in the Rovers' ability to cut ticket prices aggressively. Being purely speculative here, but if Rovers see this is a success and have improved gates to give them confidence again in 2008/9, then Rovers could easily be offering EPL football at 50% of the cost of watching an inferior product at the neighbours.

[thenodrog]

That competitive edge given by the ownership structure is already evident in the Rovers' ability to cut ticket prices aggressively. Being purely speculative here, but if Rovers see this is a success and have improved gates to give them confidence again in 2008/9, then Rovers could easily be offering EPL football at 50% of the cost of watching an inferior product at the neighbours.

Well done Gunner I think you are getting there. 'Team Lanky' by stealth and financial muscle rather than through open co-operation. Who cares? It's totally necessary cos there are too many clubs in our hinterland. The method matters far less than the end result.

btw I wonder if this initiative will reclaim some Chorley casuals from the clutches of Notlob and Wigan?

[Damage]

Exactly Philip!

Abramovich apart, all the nouveau "investors" will be looking to make a profit over the medium/long term i.e. make a net-withdrawal from income generated by the club. Whereas the current arrangement sees a net-contribution from the current owners. Now the only way for investors to make a reasonable return on investment and leave the club in a better position than at present is to increase revenue massively (£15m+ per season?) over and above what the current owners would be able to do. This cannot be generated locally from gate receipts, local commercial deals etc. Neither can I see any mega-sponsorship deals of the type currently enjoyed by BIG4littlesoul clubs. I just can't see the commercial argument for any potential buyers.

Why do people/organisations buy football clubs?

1. Altruitic reasons - love of the club/place/game

2. Egotistic Reasons - personal status/kudos or fun

3. Commercial reasons - to make a profit

Investor-type 1 would be welcomed with open-arms but I can't imagine the club would be lucky enough to have two UncleJ's within a couple of decades.

Type2 would be very dangerous - in the longer term generally leads to club disintegration and being put back a couple of decades (abramovich apart ---- so far).

Type3 would have to be able to show me a rock-solid business plan for the next couple of decades for me to start thinking it might be a good thing.

And remember, money can't buy you happiness or even a decent football team. Just ask Graeme Souness or Brian Kidd! Could MH have got a better set of players for £25m than Bentley, Nelsen, Warnock, Samba, Benni ???

[yoda]

Don't forget that it was Jack Walkers MONEY! that transformed our club from second division hopefuls to founder members and winners of the PL. Remenber all the T shirts with loads and loads of money on them!

And Jack Walkers moto "THINK BIG"

If we can compete with the bigger clubs (I don't belive we are a small club) with new investment, like we have in the recent past, then the trustees should go for it.

They have enough nouse to try and ensure that any deal is right for the Rovers.

[thenodrog]

And remember, money can't buy you happiness or even a decent football team. Just ask Graeme Souness or Brian Kidd! Could MH have got a better set of players for £25m than Bentley, Nelsen, Warnock, Samba, Benni ???

No one can predict such events. Other signings and the knowledge that BRFC were amongst the 'big hitters' would no doubt have raised our profile. If that had happened it's odds on Bellamy would have stayed. Gudjonnsen and / or Mido might have signed before or alongside Benni and Stilan Petrov might be plying his trade at ewood too. The big question is whether we would ultimately have been any better off over the past season though as none of the above have broken any pots for their respective new clubs have they? It does show that our best signing was the manager though so maybe he and his team deserve a lump of that 25m.

[RevidgeBlue]

This is really very old news that everyone is getting excited about.

Part of John Williams mandate from the Trustees, probably the major part, has been to seek new investment ever since he was appointed chairman and the new streamlined executive Board was formed nearly two years ago. In fact with Rovers relatively debt free situation and excellent performance under Hughes I'm surprised there hasn't been a lot more interest than there seemingly has.

If there is any chance of the right amount of investment coming in we simply have to take it. There's no if's and buts. Things look extremely rosy under the current TV arrangements but they won't necessarily last for ever. The Premiership will try to maintain the collective element of the income redistribution for as long as possible but sooner or later the day may come when all clubs have to negotiate their cut individually with the TV Companies at which point we'll be struggling. As with buying players, the best point to attract an investor is when things are going well, not when it's too late and you are already struggling.

The bottom line is that if the manager isn't right, we'll struggle no matter how much money is pumped at it. However whilst Mark Hughes has worked a minor miracle on zero net funding in the market but there may only be so long he can do that for. Even if he can, better to have extra spending power in reserve. Plus is anyone telling me that he wouldn't be far more likely to stay at Ewood longer if he can compete at a higher level in the transfer market?

I can't really believe that if takeovers are good enough for bluechip British clubs like Liverpool and ManUre in an attempt to keep up with Chelsea, some of our fans are saying one isn't good enough for "good old Blackburn Rovers"!

[American]

No one can predict such events. Other signings and the knowledge that BRFC were amongst the 'big hitters' would no doubt have raised our profile. If that had happened it's odds on Bellamy would have stayed. Gudjonnsen and / or Mido might have signed before or alongside Benni and Stilan Petrov might be plying his trade at ewood too. The big question is whether we would ultimately have been any better off over the past season though as none of the above have broken any pots for their respective new clubs have they? It does show that our best signing was the manager though so maybe he and his team deserve a lump of that 25m.

Petrov was my thought, as well. With an outside investor, we might have had a chance to get him.

[RevidgeBlue]

Petrov was my thought, as well. With an outside investor, we might have had a chance to get him.

Gudjohnsen was my thought. He might still have preferred to warm his backside at Barca than come here but at least we'd have been able to stump up the wages and 8m fee without a second thought.

As it is if we are to go on to the "next level" immediately I think we need to firstly not lose any of our better players in the summer and then get a Bellamy or Gudjohnsen quality player in as the other main striker thus allowing Derbyshire to continue to improve.

Neither of those are cheap, if somone comes in with "a double your wages offer" for one of your stars, you sometimes have to increase their salary as a goodwill gesture just to hold onto them.

That's before you even start to think about bringing anyone else in.

[FourLaneBlue]

These "investors" are hardly likely to just come in and splash their cash while not expecting anything back. Abramovich apart.

Ultimately they will want to see some return on their investment. The owners of Man U have been putting up ticket prices and Spurs are the first Prem club to PUT UP ticket prices for next season.

Be careful what you wish for. While we should always be open to possibilities we don't NEED an investor. We are being well-run and so shouldn't let any old Tom, Dick and Harry flashing their cash take over the club.

[RevidgeBlue]

Be careful what you wish for. While we should always be open to possibilities we don't NEED an investor. We are being well-run and so shouldn't let any old Tom, Dick and Harry flashing their cash take over the club.

We don't at the moment, but we might if say the make up of the next TV deal changes dramatically. You have to act when the odds are in your favour not when you're backed into a corner.

Anyway as I say, this is nothing new and the tribal footie headline blows it out of all context. In the LT JW said preliminary talks had taken place but nothing more concrete than that.

[FourLaneBlue]

We don't at the moment, but we might if say the make up of the next TV deal changes dramatically. You have to act when the odds are in your favour not when you're backed into a corner.

If the TV deal changes so dramatically we won't be an attractive prospect whatever so expect ticket prices whacked up to try and partly compensate.

We have already been lucky enough to have a Jack Walker and we won't get another. Therefore we are looking at prospective owners looking to take something out of the club in terms of profits. There may be some investment but ultimately they will be looking to make a profit. Therefore leaving us saddled with the debt.

Forest, Sheff Wed, Leeds all spent too much chasing players and on wages. When they faltered those in charge didn't put their cash in but left as soon as they could. At least we know the Trust won't just leave us should things go wrong...

[Damage]

Exactly FLB!

If push came to shove and the club had to generate more money in a new world order premier league, what options would be open to our new investors looking to salvage their investment? I don't want to be looking at a Cleveland Browns situations at ewood!

People should reflect that this situation could easily arise - the experiment with MK Dons has not worked but to rebrand a premier league club from small catchment area to big city without premier league club (Bristol, Leeds!) is a simple matter. And do you think the media would give a toss?

[ABBEY]

I don't want to be looking at a Cleveland Browns situations at ewood!

the blackburn broncos has a ring to it

[Mr. E]

I know there is nothing concrete yet but I would be absolutely opposed to any foreigner who can't even pronounce/doesn't know the first thing about Rovers taking control of us. I don't care about the money, we are one of the last few decent clubs in teh top flight remaining and I'd like us to keep it that way.

[FourLaneBlue]

People should reflect that this situation could easily arise - the experiment with MK Dons has not worked but to rebrand a premier league club from small catchment area to big city without premier league club (Bristol, Leeds!) is a simple matter. And do you think the media would give a toss?

Bit too early to say it hasn't worked with MK Dons...they are going for promotion and had over 8,000 there on Sunday for a League 2 match...more than Wimbledon managed for many Premiership games. Add the new 22,000 stadium which will be ready for next year (and it is be expanded to 32,000) and they could be a club to look out for.

Not that clubs can just be moved anymore (the FA has brought in new rules) but even so...we need to be careful a new owner doesn't come and start listening to thenodrog or we may have a new home next to the M65!

[Parasyte]

It wouldn't surprise me if Blackburn was in some sort of contact with people a lot of the time, just nothing concrete. Also, Gaydamak saw potential in Pompey, and there is surely more in Rovers... Pompey had a solid base, like us, a well regarded manager (however wrong it is), like us, but unlike Pompey, we have great facilities already, which would shave one HELLUVA chunk off any spending by anyone looking to invest, basically, in Sky money. So long as the Sky deal runs, people will want a chunk of English football, so we may as well ride it for all its worth, because weather we have a rich backer or not, when the Sky money disappears (which it will, be it 10 years or 100), ALL the clubs, mega-rich or not, will be elbow deep in Number 2. If between now and then we can be run like a cottage industry happy meddling for mid-table or going hel lfor leather at something greater, then I know what I'd prefer. We missed the Champs league by a few meagre points last year - I know I'd give my right arm to think we could be doing that, and more EVERY season; consistent ECL football. Bearing in mind that's the arm I 'polish the furniture' with, that's quite a statement.

[Fife Rover]

Well done Gunner I think you are getting there. 'Team Lanky' by stealth and financial muscle rather than through open co-operation. Who cares? It's totally necessary cos there are too many clubs in our hinterland. The method matters far less than the end result.

btw I wonder if this initiative will reclaim some Chorley casuals from the clutches of Notlob and Wigan?

Now let me see!.........Who was it that said "the end justifies the means?" Was it Theno?

[Tris]

If there is any chance of the right amount of investment coming in we simply have to take it. There's no if's and buts. Things look extremely rosy under the current TV arrangements but they won't necessarily last for ever. The Premiership will try to maintain the collective element of the income redistribution for as long as possible but sooner or later the day may come when all clubs have to negotiate their cut individually with the TV Companies at which point we'll be struggling.

I can't really believe that if takeovers are good enough for bluechip British clubs like Liverpool and ManUre in an attempt to keep up with Chelsea, some of our fans are saying one isn't good enough for "good old Blackburn Rovers"!

Very short term thinking Rev. At the moment, we are unique in the PL in having long term support from the trustees. It appears to be written in tablets of stone by Uncle Jack - a situation we as fans must be very happy with, and I'd suspect that elements of the trustees would be very unhappy with.

When you're overseeing the awesome rise of flybe - buying planes, buying bits of British Airways etc - then it must be gut wrenching to have to throw a few million quid into a black hole on a whim of the man who put both organisations on the map - one with head and one with heart.

But they have to do it. Selling out to a quick win merchant looking to milk this latest TV deal would be a disaster - it would free the trustees from their current obligations and would leave Rovers massively exposed.

Sure - we've seen lots of new foreign money come into the Prem since next seasons TV millions were announced, and even before that at Chelsea and Portsmouth. What we haven't seen is the fallout when one of these mega investors decides to cut and run. It won't be pretty. If we became the latest to take the short term cash, there is also a massive danger that (as the smallest) we'd be the first to be destroyed when the falsely elevated TV cash cow lies down for the last time.

Season ticket sales will be up next season, subsidised by the same TV cash which might attract investors looking for a quick buck. When that TV cash goes, the investors will be gone in a shot - and so will the floating fans. And the club will go tits up and end up two divisions down.

Keep it as it is - Uncle Jack managed to leave a legacy which guarantees a steady future for the club. We must not sell that unique insurance for any pot of gold - however big and attractive in the short term.

[bluebruce]

I could be mistaken Tris, but I'm sure I read somewhere that the Trust money only has to be pumped in for a set time. Once it stops, we could well be buggered.

[Tris]

I could be mistaken Tris, but I'm sure I read somewhere that the Trust money only has to be pumped in for a set time. Once it stops, we could well be buggered.

I don't believe that is correct - based on this interview in the LET with Paul Egerton-Vernon 6 years ago. I've not read anything or heard anything in the meantime to indicate that Jack's wishes for the well being of Rovers have ever been altered (or ignored) by the shareholders.

What is the Trust fund, how does it work and who exactly are the trustees?

Basically, we are shareholders and I think that's really all that's relevant as far as the football club is concerned. The trust fund was structured by Jack Walker to provide on-going support for the club for the forseeable future and arrangements have been made to ensure that support is there now and for the years to come.

The point is there has been a change in personnel. Jack Walker clearly used to be the man at the sharp end in terms of the public face. But, regretfully, nobody can replace Jack Walker. It would be nice for the fans if we could say here is Jack Walker number two, but he doesn't exist. What does exist is a dynamic business which I believe will be sufficient to fund the club for the foreseeable future to enable the wishes of Jack Walker to be achieved.

But just to re-emphasise the point, we are long-term not short-term players. Our objective is to make sure that the club thrives and plays at the highest possible level.

We don't need to float, that's the wonderful thing about the Rovers. Rovers don't need a public flotation in order to achieve the objectives other clubs set themselves. We would only float if it was in the interests of the club to do so and there are a number of reasons why you float. Principally, of course, it's to raise funds for the club. I would love to see a situation where we are soon full to capacity and would have to look to building a new stand. We may also be able persuade one of the TV companies to take a stake in the club, but the reason to seek a listing would not be because we can't afford to run the club, because we can. Jack Walker made arrangements to ensure that was the case.

IMO, you don't cast that sort of commitment aside for the sake of a foreign investor looking to milk some quick TV money.