[Archived] Friedel Deal For Love, Not Money

[CrazyIvan]

Because you're just as stubborn in your own viewpoint.

Friedel thinks he is better off at Villa, because they have ambition. He even stated that he thinks Randy Lerner is a fantastic owner who will lead Villa to success. He thinks that Villa are superior to Rovers, and who can blame him? Bentley thinks that Spurs are superior, and Hughes thinks that City are superior. If they thought otherwise, they would have stayed at the club.

We are going nowhere under Williams, and we need to make a change.

What viewpoint am I stubborn in then?

[Hasta]

As Brian Johnson once sang:

"Come on, come on, love me for the money, Come on, come on, listen to the moneytalk"

[Frisky Jim]

Everything you have espoused on this thread.

I notice that you haven't attempted to refute my viewpoint that Brad Friedel left Blackburn Rovers because of a lack of ambition at the club. That Friedel was willing to leave the club irrespective of who was in the Ewood Park hot-seat suggests that a lack of ambition was the cause. Why else would he leave?

[Exiled in Toronto]

Friedel thinks he is better off at Villa, because they have ambition. He even stated that he thinks Randy Lerner is a fantastic owner who will lead Villa to success. He thinks that Villa are superior to Rovers, and who can blame him? Bentley thinks that Spurs are superior, and Hughes thinks that City are superior. If they thought otherwise, they would have stayed at the club.

I don't see how anyone can argue with that, but I think you are wrong in directing your ire at Williams. I believe that being up for a sale for a year and then withdrawing the 3 million knocked the stuffing out of quite a few at Ewood. No need to invest was probably interpreted as 'no need to progress', and we should not be surprised that the more ambitious professionals took the hint.

[rowz]

Because you're just as stubborn in your own viewpoint.

Friedel thinks he is better off at Villa, because they have ambition. He even stated that he thinks Randy Lerner is a fantastic owner who will lead Villa to success. He thinks that Villa are superior to Rovers, and who can blame him? Bentley thinks that Spurs are superior, and Hughes thinks that City are superior. If they thought otherwise, they would have stayed at the club.

We are going nowhere under Williams, and we need to make a change.

[CrazyIvan]

Everything you have espoused on this thread.

I notice that you haven't attempted to refute my viewpoint that Brad Friedel left Blackburn Rovers because of a lack of ambition at the club. That Friedel was willing to leave the club irrespective of who was in the Ewood Park hot-seat suggests that a lack of ambition was the cause. Why else would he leave?

My viewpoint is everything I have espoused on this thread? Which is what exactly? I was having a debate with T4E about his assertion that Friedel left because of Ince which has been proved to be false by Brad himself.

Your assertion is based on your own viewpoint which is that J Williams has to go because the club has no ambition. It's been proven that debating this with you on other threads is utterly pointless. You won't change your opinion and you are welcome to it.

What I would love to hear from you is what YOU would do in J Williams place, how you would show ambition with a club that has little money. The one thing that annoys me is the utter negativity that some people keep on spouting. You have a bee in your bonnet about J Williams and that's all you ever talk about. It is like listening to a broken record...

I'm not a happy smiley everything is wonderful sort of person but I am someone who will give others a chance to prove themselves, in this case Ince, which is more than some people are prepared to do for whatever reason. Let Ince prove himself one way or the other before you write him off. Blaming Ince for Friedel leaving is just ridiculous and has proved to be so which is what this debate was all about.

[Beta Ray Bill]

Absolutely right it is. I'm glad you finally got there. I'm not claiming it as unequivocal fact - purely that I believe it is the case - followed by several points that lead me to believe I may be right. Points that still remain unanswered.

I suggest you never apply for a job that uses verbal reasoning questions as a part of the recruitment process....

"Brad Friedel was happy at Rovers. Paul Ince was appointed as Rovers manager. Brad Friedel leaves.

Does this mean that Paul Ince's appointment lead to Brad Friedel's depature?"

a ) yes that conclusion follows from the statements

b ) maybe that conclusion requires more information

c ) no that conclusion does not directky follow

Your thought process leads to ... no job offer. And certainly not on Newsnight.

[T4E]

OK, I wont.

[thenodrog]

The day after Hughes left, Friedel handed in a transfer request. The club hadn't even drawn up a shortlist of managerial replacements, so all this talk of Brad leaving because Ince was taking over is very very wide of the mark.

Giving credence to my 'source' 3 weeks ago that Brad intended to go to Man City with Hughes etal. It appears in hinsight that Villa's offer, as nicko* suggested, 'blew City right out of the water'.

*Also blows nicko's repeated statements about Brad being perfectly happy at BRFC right out of the water too. Oh and also Bentley's gone too despite AN saying his refusal to sign was not a big issue. Sorry all you 'nickoteens' who hang on the masters every word.

[T4E]

Assuming you believe it Gord. Which is hard to do, if you read the link I posted on the page before.

As Jan suggested, it would appear that ranks are being closed.

[rowz]

so.Brad left due to lack of ambition did he ?

just like Lucash [West Ham instead of Liverpool -ffs]

just like Ashley Cole leaving Arsenal ,Beckham going to play baseball in the states and every other mercenary that kisses the badge one week and then puts in a transfer request the next.

The truth is we can't compete with most of the established prem. teams on wages.So, unless we have oustanding success[and with it the increased income from TV,UEFA etc] the players will be tempted by improved contracts elsewhere.

The players don't live in semis at Feni ; or even 'large detached' at Brockhall anymore ,they train 'they play and they sod off - who do you see in the LET presenting prizes at junior football - almost always Dunny or Matty.

If Brad wanted to leave its his decision,the board were not prepared to match the Villa offer ,but I suspect the 'ambition' he seeks concerns money more than medals.

"money does'nt talk it swears" Bob Dylan

"don't p#ss down my back and tell me it's raining" The Outlaw Joesy Wales

[bellamy11]

*Also blows nicko's repeated statements about Brad being perfectly happy at BRFC right out of the water too. Sorry all you 'nickoteens' who hang on the masters every word.

'Nickoteen' is such an apt and clever word on at least two levels. You've outdone yourself, Gordon!

[FourLaneBlue]

'Nickoteen' is such an apt and clever word on at least two levels. You've outdone yourself, Gordon!

How long do you reckon he has secretly spent thinking that one up?

[Frisky Jim]

My viewpoint is everything I have espoused on this thread? Which is what exactly? I was having a debate with T4E about his assertion that Friedel left because of Ince which has been proved to be false by Brad himself.

Your assertion is based on your own viewpoint which is that J Williams has to go because the club has no ambition. It's been proven that debating this with you on other threads is utterly pointless. You won't change your opinion and you are welcome to it.

What I would love to hear from you is what YOU would do in J Williams place, how you would show ambition with a club that has little money. The one thing that annoys me is the utter negativity that some people keep on spouting. You have a bee in your bonnet about J Williams and that's all you ever talk about. It is like listening to a broken record...

I'm not a happy smiley everything is wonderful sort of person but I am someone who will give others a chance to prove themselves, in this case Ince, which is more than some people are prepared to do for whatever reason. Let Ince prove himself one way or the other before you write him off. Blaming Ince for Friedel leaving is just ridiculous and has proved to be so which is what this debate was all about.

You still cannot refute the notion that Friedel and other personnel have left the football club due to a lack of ambition. Indeed, you have described attempting to do so as 'utterly pointless'. Nice of you to concede the argument.

As for what I would have done in Williams' place - I would've backed the previous manager with sufficient funds to progress. As Mark Hughes proved himself in the transfer market, I would have trusted him to spend the money wisely to ensure progress was made. And before you retort with the Leeds United point, I'm not advocating a kamikaze transfer policy, I would have rewarded him with sensible yet substantial funds for doing so well for us. I certainly wouldn't have provided him with peanuts like Williams. Let's not forget that Williams harped on about qualifying for the Champions League, yet didn't back the manager with sufficient funds. Not the first time he has used the smoke and mirrors tactic, is it?

As for giving Ince a chance, I'm prepared to wait and see how this all pans out. But considering Friedel and Bentley have left, with Santa Cruz and Warnock possibly following, and according to Nicko a disinterested Benni McCarthy, perhaps you can understand why some Rovers fans are rather unhappy.

[thenodrog]

Assuming you believe it Gord. Which is hard to do, if you read the link I posted on the page before.

As Jan suggested, it would appear that ranks are being closed.

'Methinks they protest too much'.

I must say it is might unusual for a player who has left a club to feel any need to bother to make such subjective denials. Also Lee sounds like he is quoting from a script. It appears to me that the truth will be difficult to determine.

Whatever it is just another issue that no one could have predicted just 2 months ago. The club imo is in a serious tailspin.

How long do you reckon he has secretly spent thinking that one up?

About 2 seconds tbh. Genius usually works like that FLB...... but I guess you'll never know.

[CrazyIvan]

You still cannot refute the notion that Friedel and other personnel have left the football club due to a lack of ambition. Indeed, you have described attempting to do so as 'utterly pointless'. Nice of you to concede the argument.

As for what I would have done in Williams' place - I would've backed the previous manager with sufficient funds to progress. As Mark Hughes proved himself in the transfer market, I would have trusted him to spend the money wisely to ensure progress was made. And before you retort with the Leeds United point, I'm not advocating a kamikaze transfer policy, I would have rewarded him with sensible yet substantial funds for doing so well for us. I certainly wouldn't have provided him with peanuts like Williams. Let's not forget that Williams harped on about qualifying for the Champions League, yet didn't back the manager with sufficient funds. Not the first time he has used the smoke and mirrors tactic, is it?

As for giving Ince a chance, I'm prepared to wait and see how this all pans out. But considering Friedel and Bentley have left, with Santa Cruz and Warnock possibly following, and according to Nicko a disinterested Benni McCarthy, perhaps you can understand why some Rovers fans are rather unhappy.

I didn't concede the argument as you put it, just said it is pointless to argue with you because nothing could possibly change your mind and to debate the point is useless and a waste of time.

Where would you get the funds from? That is the question I think everyone would like an answer to. I don't believe you are correct in asserting there was no backing for Hughes. 10 million sounds like a decent enough amount. How much would you like to give to a manager? From where? Make that clear and I'll listen to your argument some more.

IF Santa Cruz and Warnock leave then I'll be worried. McCarthy often looks disinterested so nothing new there. Some fans will always be unhappy and believe the worst of the club and management. I'll give Ince a fair crack of the whip before coming back on here and saying what I think of his management of Rovers.

[FourLaneBlue]

About 2 seconds tbh. Genius usually works like that FLB...... but I guess you'll never know.

Aye...I believe you drog!

[Hasta]

You still cannot refute the notion that Friedel and other personnel have left the football club due to a lack of ambition.

You can't accept that Brads primary reason for leaving was money.

If Villa came in for him offering the same salary as at Rovers do you believe he would have gone ??

[thenodrog]

You can't accept that Brads primary reason for leaving was money.

If Villa came in for him offering the same salary as at Rovers do you believe he would have gone ??

Definitely........ To Man City.

[Frisky Jim]

I didn't concede the argument as you put it, just said it is pointless to argue with you because nothing could possibly change your mind and to debate the point is useless and a waste of time.

Where would you get the funds from? That is the question I think everyone would like an answer to. I don't believe you are correct in asserting there was no backing for Hughes. 10 million sounds like a decent enough amount. How much would you like to give to a manager? From where? Make that clear and I'll listen to your argument some more.

IF Santa Cruz and Warnock leave then I'll be worried. McCarthy often looks disinterested so nothing new there. Some fans will always be unhappy and believe the worst of the club and management. I'll give Ince a fair crack of the whip before coming back on here and saying what I think of his management of Rovers.

Why do you think Brad Friedel left? And while we're at it, why do you think that Bentley and Hughes left?

I would have given Hughes in the region of £20 million. Hughes would've brought in quality with that, and we would have put in a real challenge towards the CL qualification. Qualification would have seen a return on that outlay, and would have allowed us to bring in further quality. Hughes easily got the better of Wigan, Boro and Newcastle - teams that have wealthy benefactors. I believe that Hughes' shrewd dealings would have seen us challenge Liverpool for 4th place. Everton did it, we could have done the same. An opportunity missed, I feel. Had we failed to qualify, that would've meant the following season's budget would have decreased, but Hughes would've probably got a couple of gems in for little money. I would have rewarded him for doing such a good job.

We lost a real gem when he left, and if Hughes believed that City was a better bet to showcase his managerial talent, then that just goes to show how little he thought of Rovers' prospects.

If Villa came in for him offering the same salary as at Rovers do you believe he would have gone ??

Yes, because Villa have ambition. You can't accept that Aston Villa is a far more ambitious football club than Blackburn Rovers.

[CrazyIvan]

Why do you think Brad Friedel left? And while we're at it, why do you think that Bentley and Hughes left?

I would have given Hughes in the region of £20 million. Hughes would've brought in quality with that, and we would have put in a real challenge towards the CL qualification. Qualification would have seen a return on that outlay, and would have allowed us to bring in further quality. Hughes easily got the better of Wigan, Boro and Newcastle - teams that have wealthy benefactors. I believe that Hughes' shrewd dealings would have seen us challenge Liverpool for 4th place. Everton did it, we could have done the same. An opportunity missed, I feel. Had we failed to qualify, that would've meant the following season's budget would have decreased, but Hughes would've probably got a couple of gems in for little money. I would have rewarded him for doing such a good job.

We lost a real gem when he left, and if Hughes believed that City was a better bet to showcase his managerial talent, then that just goes to show how little he thought of Rovers' prospects.

Yes, because Villa have ambition. You can't accept that Aston Villa is a far more ambitious football club than Blackburn Rovers.

When it comes down to it, they all left for monetary reasons. Where would you find 20mil? Come on, tell me that? It's all very well saying 'I'd do this...' 'I'd do that...' but you don't do the job and you have the same amount of knowledge as the rest of us when it comes down to exactly how much money Rovers actually have.

Villa have a Billionaire funding them. And yet can you tell me who they've bought this season to show the ambition you say they have?

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

[''IF Santa Cruz and Warnock leave then I'll be worried.''

You wont be the only one pal!

[Hasta]

Yes, because Villa have ambition. You can't accept that Aston Villa is a far more ambitious football club than Blackburn Rovers.

First of all if you believe that Friedel would have gone to Villa on the same salary as at Rovers then you are very naive. I had hoped that you would have seen some sense as to admint that money was at least a significant, if not the primary, motivator. I've never really noticed your posts. However, the fact you completely dismiss the "at least double" salary being offered as a factor tells me that other people are correct and your obvious issues against JW and the club is stopping you having a balanced opinion.

As for Villa being far more ambitious that Rovers then yes I can accept that. They probably do have genuine ambitions and beliefs to try and break into the top 4 within the Premier League. They also do have Randy Lerner, a man with a personal fortune rumoured to be around if not over £1billion. For the amount of money that is probably available at their disposal, they should be setting their ambitions a damn bit higher than Rovers.

[Frisky Jim]

When it comes down to it, they all left for monetary reasons. Where would you find 20mil? Come on, tell me that? It's all very well saying 'I'd do this...' 'I'd do that...' but you don't do the job and you have the same amount of knowledge as the rest of us when it comes down to exactly how much money Rovers actually have.

Villa have a Billionaire funding them. And yet can you tell me who they've bought this season to show the ambition you say they have?

I would have given Hughes the money with the proviso that should he fail, it would have to be cut back in the following two seasons. I think that this would be sensible and not the ridiculous Leeds United policy. I wouldn't put the club in financial peril like Peter Ridsdale.

Sadly, Villa do indeed have a billionaire running the club, and I think that they will improve further while we stand still, or get worse. They've bought a pretty good goalkeeper this summer, and will probably take Liverpool to the cleaners with Barry. They still have the likes of Young and Agbonlahor at the club, and a very good manager who wants to take the club to a higher level.

[CrazyIvan]

I would have given Hughes the money with the proviso that should he fail, it would have to be cut back in the following two seasons. I think that this would be sensible and not the ridiculous Leeds United policy. I wouldn't put the club in financial peril like Peter Ridsdale.

Sadly, Villa do indeed have a billionaire running the club, and I think that they will improve further while we stand still, or get worse. They've bought a pretty good goalkeeper this summer, and will probably take Liverpool to the cleaners with Barry. They still have the likes of Young and Agbonlahor at the club, and a very good manager who wants to take the club to a higher level.

Where would you get this money from?