[Archived] Rovers Sold ??

[Paul]

If he gets the funds and gets us to the next level ............

Don't get me wrong but what is this mythical "next level" everyone keeps talking about? I would say Rovers success over the last 20 years is pretty damned impressive, expecially so in the last five, presuming we put that in perspectyive with the time under Dalglish. Is the "next level" is Champions League? I'm not sure regular UEFA cup football can be classed as a step forward.

[Hasta]

I know there are many people on this MB who do not have a ST but are valuable supporters to BRFC but pls do not think that your opinion should even have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30year supporter.

Very loose statement that. My brother gets to about 8 or 9 league games a year. The others he can't make because his shifts at work are inflexible. For this reason he's not had a season ticket since the mid 90's. He's gone down since early 80's. Does his opinion only have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30 year supporter?

15 year season ticket holder. That'd be 1992. Daglish, Jack Walker and all that. Not commited enough before the bandwagon then? Does that make your opinion worth only 5% that of those who had ST's through the 80's?

Most people on here care deeply about BRFC. Otherwise we wouldn't be here. Some people don't go down as much as others. Some live away, some have other commitments. However their opinion on this thread on this matter carries as much weight as anyones else whether you like it or not.

[b12_simon]

Don't get me wrong but what is this mythical "next level" everyone keeps talking about? I would say Rovers success over the last 20 years is pretty damned impressive, expecially so in the last five, presuming we put that in perspectyive with the time under Dalglish. Is the "next level" is Champions League? I'm not sure regular UEFA cup football can be classed as a step forward.

I'd say that regular UEFA Cup football is a definite step up. This season we were very lucky: finishing 10th and the 2 clubs above us not applying for the Interdoodah.

[Billy Castell]

I just wish they'd get a bloody move on if it is to happen. It is taking ages, and I'd like Hughes to have some proper money to spend.

[Rover down South]

Daren, I think if you read some previous pages you might find that I have already made my thoughts obvious!

Thanks for the northern steroetype!

I can tell that you have a ST and visit ewood regularluy!

I know there are many people on this MB who do not have a ST but are valuable supporters to BRFC but pls do not think that your opinion should even have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30year supporter.

I am sick of the armchairs on here influnecing debate! What input have you made to the club!?

Until you have serious committment do not even bother me with your opinions. In the past, "supporters" financial committment/input to the club was something of a laughing matter but now we are on the brink of takeover by "investors" it is only right that people who have more financial input to the club have the louder voice!

If Lee wants to PM me I will gladly give him my patron number and he can verify my committment to the club - 15 years ST plus kids for 5 years and now extra kid plus merchandise. I dont want to offend but I am sick of nouveau armchairs telling me how MY club should be run!

I am also sending this message to current and prospective owners that I am against and will not support any takeover by anybody who seeks to use BRFC as a vehicle for profit! FULL STOP!

BRFC IS A FOOTBALL CLUB FOR BLACKBURN! IT SHOULD STAY THAT WAY!

I'm a massive Blackburn fan, however, it is not possible for me to get to Ewood Park on a regular basis as I live down in Sussex. I try my hardest to get to away games that are within sensible distance (i.e Fulham, Portsmouth, Chelsea..... etc) to give the team my support. When Watford & Charlton got relegated that was two less I could visit.

I'd love to be able to get to every game, it is just not realistic in terms of costs to drive all that way, watch the game, stay over night & drive back the following day, it would cost me thousands every season.

I also purchase the clubs home & away shirts every season (or every time a new one is out), also training tops, polo shirts & jumpers. So that is part of my financial input to the club.

I've not been a member of this messageboard for very long, but have visited every day at some point to see people's views on the club & to find out the recent going's on. The vast majority seem good people, but you get the odd few who have to criticise all the time. If I lived in/near Blackburn, I could guarantee you I would be there every match.

As for the potential takeover, I want what's best for the club in the long run & I am sure the Walker trustee's do too, so lets trust them to do what they think is right.

[American]

What people seem to be not seeing what Nicko is saying between the lines is that Williams has non-football related plans as well to make this investment work.

[daren]

Daren, I think if you read some previous pages you might find that I have already made my thoughts obvious!

Thanks for the northern steroetype!

I can tell that you have a ST and visit ewood regularluy!

I know there are many people on this MB who do not have a ST but are valuable supporters to BRFC but pls do not think that your opinion should even have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30year supporter.

I am sick of the armchairs on here influnecing debate! What input have you made to the club!?

Until you have serious committment do not even bother me with your opinions. In the past, "supporters" financial committment/input to the club was something of a laughing matter but now we are on the brink of takeover by "investors" it is only right that people who have more financial input to the club have the louder voice!

If Lee wants to PM me I will gladly give him my patron number and he can verify my committment to the club - 15 years ST plus kids for 5 years and now extra kid plus merchandise. I dont want to offend but I am sick of nouveau armchairs telling me how MY club should be run!

I am also sending this message to current and prospective owners that I am against and will not support any takeover by anybody who seeks to use BRFC as a vehicle for profit! FULL STOP!

BRFC IS A FOOTBALL CLUB FOR BLACKBURN! IT SHOULD STAY THAT WAY!

Very loose statement that. My brother gets to about 8 or 9 league games a year. The others he can't make because his shifts at work are inflexible. For this reason he's not had a season ticket since the mid 90's. He's gone down since early 80's. Does his opinion only have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30 year supporter?

15 year season ticket holder. That'd be 1992. Daglish, Jack Walker and all that. Not commited enough before the bandwagon then? Does that make your opinion worth only 5% that of those who had ST's through the 80's?

Most people on here care deeply about BRFC. Otherwise we wouldn't be here. Some people don't go down as much as others. Some live away, some have other commitments. However their opinion on this thread on this matter carries as much weight as anyones else whether you like it or not.

Thanks, Hasta. Y'know, after the (very enjoyable) "Foreign Rovers fans" thread, damage's attitude makes me sick. I've supported blackburn for 17 years, bought jerseys, posters and other merchandise, but I live in Ireland and until recently it's been financially impractical for me to visit Ewood park. When I got the chance, though I did last season and I'll be visiting again next season - thanks to the friendly atmosphere I got when I visited last time. Obviously I didn't meet some stuck up idiot like damage who is obviously one of those supporters who thinks they're better because they've supported for longer. These are the fools that drive many people away from football - this came up on the MLS thread. I don't feel superior to those who started supporting between then and now. I'm proud to have introduced a few new people to the Rovers (mainly by never shutting up about us!) and I'm delighted to talk to people about us.

I've consistently stated that many of the folks from Blackburn don't know how lucky they are to have such a great club in their town. It'd be great to be able to take a short trip to Ewood, but I can't. Does that make me less of a fan than damage? Or my opinion any less valid? I certainly don't think so. And what's this about Blackburn being a club for the town? It's for the town, the region and whoever wants to support it, as far as I can see. Except for dingles, obviously.

I called damage out because he has, all through the thread, given out ponderous, yet extremely vague warnings of doom. I want him to tell us what he means! Does he forsee a Leeds? Or something less catastrophic? A Lancashire United? Cheerleaders? What? What about the source of the cash that he alludes to?

We all know, NOW, that Jack bought the club for the love he had for it. But I find it hard to believe that at the time there wasn't at least some resistance to the idea of him buying the club. The situation MAY be different, but we. don't. know. This is why I'm trusting in the Trust (ha), the board and Rothschilds. I would love to see Rovers get to the "next level", which I see a challenging for the Champions league for a few seasons. I'm not entirely enamoured with DW, but he's a hell of a lot better than Glazier, Thaksin or any of the others I could mention or think of.

Anyway, rant over...

[tcj_jones]

Deleted

[tcj_jones]

How sad that even the prospespt of money is enough to make people forget about thwe source or consequences!

What a fine world we ligve in!

I wouldnt mind but I have 30 years investment in this club and most of you have about 300 posts!!

Buy a ST and get your butt down to EP and I might respect your yearning for the champs league!! Otherwise pls leave us alone.

For all your morals on the subject you still consider your support an "investment"...

[Rover down South]

Thanks, Hasta. Y'know, after the (very enjoyable) "Foreign Rovers fans" thread, damage's attitude makes me sick. I've supported blackburn for 17 years, bought jerseys, posters and other merchandise, but I live in Ireland and until recently it's been financially impractical for me to visit Ewood park. When I got the chance, though I did last season and I'll be visiting again next season - thanks to the friendly atmosphere I got when I visited last time. Obviously I didn't meet some stuck up idiot like damage who is obviously one of those supporters who thinks they're better because they've supported for longer. These are the fools that drive many people away from football - this came up on the MLS thread. I don't feel superior to those who started supporting between then and now. I'm proud to have introduced a few new people to the Rovers (mainly by never shutting up about us!) and I'm delighted to talk to people about us.

I've consistently stated that many of the folks from Blackburn don't know how lucky they are to have such a great club in their town. It'd be great to be able to take a short trip to Ewood, but I can't. Does that make me less of a fan than damage? Or my opinion any less valid? I certainly don't think so. And what's this about Blackburn being a club for the town? It's for the town, the region and whoever wants to support it, as far as I can see. Except for dingles, obviously.

I called damage out because he has, all through the thread, given out ponderous, yet extremely vague warnings of doom. I want him to tell us what he means! Does he forsee a Leeds? Or something less catastrophic? A Lancashire United? Cheerleaders? What? What about the source of the cash that he alludes to?

We all know, NOW, that Jack bought the club for the love he had for it. But I find it hard to believe that at the time there wasn't at least some resistance to the idea of him buying the club. The situation MAY be different, but we. don't. know. This is why I'm trusting in the Trust (ha), the board and Rothschilds. I would love to see Rovers get to the "next level", which I see a challenging for the Champions league for a few seasons. I'm not entirely enamoured with DW, but he's a hell of a lot better than Glazier, Thaksin or any of the others I could mention or think of.

Anyway, rant over...

Absolutely spot on there Daren.

[Damage]

OK Hard nosed reply here.

This is a thread about potential takeover of the club.

Many people on here are posting very positve opinions about the proposed takeover. Nothing wrong with opinions BUT I want to ensure that current and potential owners are aware of the feeling of people who actively contribute to the clubs revenue streams. Anyone reading this MB would think that 90% of BRFC fans are in favour of DW takeover and that may be correct . However no-one should confuse the opinion of fans with that of supporters. I want to make sure that my voice as a SUPPORTER is heard above the voice of FANS from Ireland/Australia/USA/Devon/Shadworth who do not contribute to the revenue streams of BRFC.

You might ask why I make a distinction when we all love the club? For me it is simple. Owners and propsective owners will view future revenue streams as being of the utmost importance. Apart from TV money where is that future revenue going to come from? Selling shirts in the far east? Internet subscriptions for overseas fans? Selling shirts to punters on the south coast? Or maybe selling season tickets to people who have a long history of previous purchases? IMO anyone looking at BRFC must first and foremost ensure that they keep the FINANCIAL SUPPORT of current ST holders - that must take priority over the sentiment of fans near and far. (I do not want to belittle anyone's emotional connection to the club here. Just stating hard-nosed business logic).

Next we come to possible takeover of the club. It has been inferred that I am opposed to change but this is not true. In fact I would love nothing more than a club that is dynamic on and off the field and welcome any change that is in the longterm interests of the club. However I am against THIS takeover. Mainly because of the nature of the people involved - venture capitalists who I believe will be looking to turn a fast buck but do not understand football or BRFC (however much nicko claims that DW is a rovers FAN!! ). Why do we need to get hitched with the first person to express an interest? Would you marry the first person to give you a compliment? They could turn out to be the world best spouse but just as likely to be a psychopathic axe-killer. There are other options like playing the field and finding a more reliable suitor. However many on this MB are taken in buy the romance of a 25M transfer-fund warchest and a fan-chairman! Nicko has painted a very good portrait (whether intentional or not) but the figures just dont add-up and any concrete "facts" are less than inspiring for me.

I believe the risks are too high for BRFC and we should seek an option that offers greater security. So now I am making it clear to these propspective owners that as a long-standing SUPPORTER I will not meekly accept their using BRFC as a vehicle for profit. Maybe there is not a lot I can do but I WILL NOT SUPPORT their profiteering and will not renew Season Ticket (Adult plus 2 kids) if they try. Of course others may have different opinions but I bet it will take the emotional input of significant numbers of FANS to replace the lost financial support of a single ST holder.

[daren]

Damage, thanks for the reply! I know what you mean. I was (more than a little) miffed at the apparent attitude in your previous posts, but now I see what you're saying.

Fair enough.

[Rainmaker]

You really are a muppet, categorizing Rovers supporters like that.

Besides, I don't think you wanna compare your "following rovers budget" with a foreign supporter.

Most likely a foreign supporter will most likely have to splash out more than the price of your season ticket just to attend ONE game.

[Damage]

Very loose statement that. My brother gets to about 8 or 9 league games a year. The others he can't make because his shifts at work are inflexible. For this reason he's not had a season ticket since the mid 90's. He's gone down since early 80's. Does his opinion only have 5% of the wieght of a 15year ST holder and 30 year supporter?

15 year season ticket holder. That'd be 1992. Daglish, Jack Walker and all that. Not commited enough before the bandwagon then? Does that make your opinion worth only 5% that of those who had ST's through the 80's?

Most people on here care deeply about BRFC. Otherwise we wouldn't be here. Some people don't go down as much as others. Some live away, some have other commitments. However their opinion on this thread on this matter carries as much weight as anyones else whether you like it or not.

I make no apologies for my language - it is not meant to be beliigerant or insulting - howvere the future of BRFC is at stake and this is no time for diplomatic beating around the bush. I want to make it clear to prospective owners that first and foremost they should consider the opinion of people that contribute financially to the club. After all if they want to make a success of any takeover they will need financial revenue not sentiment.

If you were prospective owner how would you begin to weight peoples opinions. Personally I would look to future potential financial contribution and in order to judge that I would look at historical contribution. If your brother is likely to continue his historical trend of 8/9 matches per season then I would judge his opinion (on the takeover) to be worth under 50% of the opinon of season ticket holder (19 matches plus cups). Similarly I would judge the takeover-opinion of someone who attends no matches as being worth somewhat less than 5% of ST holder (assuming that they dont not make financial contribution in some other way).

Yes 92 was my first ST. Didnt need to buy ST pre-92 as never a problem getting tickets. I totally admire anyone who had ST during the 80s and is still a ST holder. They are what football should be about and I would have to accept that their opinion would have more clout that mine. Unfortunatley I dont think there will be many of them about! I know many people who had STs for the first time in 92 and lots more who had them pre-92. Sadly I cant name more than a few who still have them!

[Eddie]

You're a very small minded man. Take for example how much you spend getting to your home game on a Saturday and try comparing that to a foreign fan (as has been pointed out). I live relatively close by being in Paris, but it would still cost me £250-300 to attend a single home game, now if I attend 10 home games a season am I then a more important supporter than you? Do I get more of a say? Then think about those who travel from Austrlia, Asia or North America. It would be like me saying your opinion doesn't even matter on this board as you only have less than 100 posts. By your logic you better not contribute next time a messageboard improvement or any debate regarding the future of the website comes up. Nonsense.

[Damage]

You really are a muppet, categorizing Rovers supporters like that.

Besides, I don't think you wanna compare your "following rovers budget" with a foreign supporter.

Most likely a foreign supporter will most likely have to splash out more than the price of your season ticket just to attend ONE game.

You totally misunderstand what I have said. When I talk about the value of opinions and contribution, I am talking about the value of the contribution as viewed by propsective owners. I realise that some people spend lots of money getting to matches and I greatly admire that. It is immensely laudable that someone from Norway for example would spend several hundred pound travelling to Blackburn to watch a premiership match. I salute anybody that supports the club in such a way. However, a £25 ticket is worth a straight £25 to the club irrespective of whether you spend a thousand pounds on airfares or forty calories on jogging to get the match. The thousand pound is sentiment! Just like spending 10 hours a day on club messageboards is also sentiment. It may represent an immense investment to the person spending the money or time, but it is worth exactly nothing on the clubs balance sheet! Harsh words but true.

[Eddie]

Well if you what to rate your contribution to the club that way, your season ticket and new shirt is a drop in the ocean to them, so why don't we just ask SKY who they would like to own us?

[Hasta]

Damage,

•You'll be very lucky if a prospective owner takes the opinion of supporters in general into account - let alone break the value of their opinion down depending on financial contribution.

•If you have a season ticket in the Bburn End is your opinion worth less than someone who pays more for a ST in the JW central but worth more than someone in the Riverside outer?

•I might spend for example £400 a year on my season ticket including extras such as drinks, travel getting to ewood in a season. Some of our overseas fans may well spend over £2,000 travelling over to see only 4 games a year. If i lived in North America I doubt i would do that. Does this mean that I am a better SUPPORTER but a worse FAN than them?

Damage, If all this panned out as you suspected, what to you think the most likely outcome and future scenario for Rovers would be if the DW consortium takes over.

I don't mean doomsday or worst case, just how you think it will pan out.

(just curious - for the record I am very concerned about the deal and won't be overly sorry if it falls through. On the other hand I know nothing about the selling a club, the need to sell our club, the alternative interested parties and the intentions of DW)

[Damage]

I live relatively close by being in Paris, but it would still cost me £250-300 to attend a single home game, now if I attend 10 home games a season am I then a more important supporter than you?

From the viewpoint of prospective owners, your income would be worth approx 50% of mine.

From the viewpoint of other supporters at the match (including myself) your committment to supporting BRFC would be worthy of immense kudos.

Please see what I am trying to do here. I am opposed to the DW takeover.

Prospective owners must be looking at revenue streams. They should be interested in future purchasing intentions. I have made my intentions clear.

Im sure your continued good-sentiment will be important to prospective owners, but it doesnt show on the balance sheet.

[stuwilky]

You're a very small minded man. Take for example how much you spend getting to your home game on a Saturday and try comparing that to a foreign fan (as has been pointed out). I live relatively close by being in Paris, but it would still cost me £250-300 to attend a single home game, now if I attend 10 home games a season am I then a more important supporter than you? Do I get more of a say? Then think about those who travel from Austrlia, Asia or North America. It would be like me saying your opinion doesn't even matter on this board as you only have less than 100 posts. By your logic you better not contribute next time a messageboard improvement or any debate regarding the future of the website comes up. Nonsense.

You arent reading what he is saying properly.

Looking at the spend WITH THE CLUB is vital for any business.

[Rainmaker]

Im sure your continued good-sentiment will be important to prospective owners, but it doesnt show on the balance sheet.

Which makes your opinion worth diddly-squat compared to for example Sky og bet24...

[Damage]

Well if you what to rate your contribution to the club that way, your season ticket and new shirt is a drop in the ocean to them, so why don't we just ask SKY who they would like to own us?

You are completely correct their Eddie. SKY already dictate how the premiership operates. As for BRFC, I imagine that SKY would be happy if BRFC were to be takenover by charlatans, asset-stripped, relegated and be replaced by a "proper" club with lots of fans to pay TV subscriptions like Leeds/WBA/Wolves/Sheff.

[sussexrover]

I'm confused as to this right to have a say argument - as somebody who now lives far enough away that regular attendance is not a viable option I still believe i contribute fairly significantly. Currently I attend 3-4 home games a season, does that mean i only contribute a 6th of an ST to the club, so only have a 6th of the opinion - however, when I go I drag another 5 people along who wouldn't otherwise go (under the its the only way they will see me banner) - so is my indirect contribution of another 5/6 worth a whole say?

Its all v confusing. I appreciate the argument you are trying to make - but those people in America/Asia/wherever will also be contributing by buying shirts etc. Why don't we just welcome the opinions of people who care about the club and who by spreading the word further can help the club grow.

[Billy Castell]

I guess I have no right to any opinion as I've not been able to see a game for 10 years now. Do the teams come out to The Final Countdown or The Boys are Back in Town? Whatever happens it would be hilarious if a freak mix-up led to Boro Pat being put on the big screen.

[daren]

Heh, everyone's making the same mistake I made earlier, which is that damage is not talking as himself - he's talking as a potential owner trying to suss out who's worth what to the club in terms of direct revenue. In that case, ST holders (members) are probably worth more than someone who spends more getting there, but attends one or two games a season.

Either way, I don't think here is the right place for this discussion. Why not try and get a few ST holders together and see if you can't come up with something more concrete. Opinions on the internet are 200 a penny and worth even less, generally, to the people with cash and influence