[Archived] England's Injury Crisis

[bluebruce]

It's nothing like ball tampering. Both teams had to use the same pitch.

Exactly what I was about to say.

[bluebruce]

It's nothing like ball tampering. Both teams had to use the same pitch.

Exactly what I was about to say.

Edit- God dammit.

[USRoverME]

glad you beat me to it M-K, was thinking that same thing

Same thing with the "they got to train on it 10 time, we got it once" moan

[bblue]

Not related to England but still about the qualifiers...Scotland are sending all their hard work down the drain...2-0 down in Georgia!

[USRoverME]

and Zurab not in the side or on the bench for Georgia, curiously. They seem to be playing a side with a lot of youngsters, the Georgians.

[John]

Zurab was playing and did well.

[Tris]

and Zurab not in the side or on the bench for Georgia, curiously. They seem to be playing a side with a lot of youngsters, the Georgians.

Played all 90 minutes, at least some as captain.

"Did well"? Did well not to concede at least one penalty because the ref wasn't looking.

[gumboots]

Not only did both sides tonight play on the same pitch but every other side who's played russia had to play on it too and did so without whingeing. There's no excuse for not performing to the best of your ability even if your ability is limited and there's no excuse for tactical ineptitude in the choice of the subs you send on or what you do when you've just thrown away a lead. Doesn't Kipling say "If you can keep your head while all around are losing theirs" or words to that effect? Well, that's just what McClaren didn't do. He needed to calm his team down and keep them focussed and instead he throws on 3 random subs and expects them to rescue the game.

[speeeeeeedie]

So far the excuses are;

The pitch - why? Supposed quality footballers should be able to play on pristine flat ground. Watering field turf softens it to make it more "grass like" therefore making it better for them to play on.

The lack of video referees - as pointed out Rooney was marginally offside, so put that one to bed.

The substitutes - they didn't play, or only got 20 mins, how can they be blamed?

McClaren is blaming the ref. Some are blaming Gerrard for his miss. Some Robinson for his spill, some the defenders for not reacting quickly.

All in, we got beat when we shouldn't have. Regardless of what happens in our last game the FA needs to look into development from the ground up in England as the cream of our country are struggling to qualify in a group we should have walked, and our finest coaching brain is limited in his tactical nous at international level. There have been threads on here about the state of the game, this qualification debacle just shows how bad it is.

[Guest Kamy100]

Played well for 65 minutes and then the team went to pot. As has been said before it our inability to keep the ball that eventually cost us. Prior to the first goal we started to lose possession to easily, the Russians got on top and we crumbled. Very bizarre substitutions from the manager which just added to the confusion.

Still I wouldn't cancel those tickets to Austria/Switzerland as I can see Russia failing to beat Israel and that will take us down to a showdown with Croatia.

I have been saying for 4 years that the England players are vastly over-rated and it the teams constant inability to maintain and use possession that will continue to cost us against teams the stronger teams.

[Tris]

Not only did both sides tonight play on the same pitch but every other side who's played russia had to play on it too and did so without whingeing.

Without wishing to appear rude, don't bother to post if you haven't bothered to check the facts.

Russia played Croatia at the Lokomotiv Stadium, Israel at Dinamo, Estonia and Andorra in St Petersburg and Macedonia back at Lokomotiv. All on grass.

Taking England to the plastic for the most critical game in the group, having 10 days for the home side to get used to it, and then treating it artificially by watering the plastic was all done to maximise percentage chances in favour of the home side.

No game at that level should ever be played on a synthetic surface - as evidenced by the UEFA instructions that a grass pitch must be laid in that stadium for the Champions League final next year.

[SuperStella]

Downing at Left Back

NUFF SAID

[bblue]

struggling to qualify in a group we should have walked

Very true, at least for the fact that if you claim you're aiming for a high finish in the tournament, beating the likes of Croatia and Russia to get there should be just protocol.

[John]

Pitch is a lame, lame excuse.

As a home team, you will always try and get any advantage you can. UEFA have presumably allowed Russia to play on their surface - just face it and try to accept it, England are not good enough.

[Tim Southampton Rover]

Didn't deserve to win that game as we didn't create enough clear cut chances. I don't even remember Owen having a shot on goal at all.

I wonder what the odds are that Stevie Mac is to be replaced by Jose if we fail to reach the tournament?

[philipl]

At least we are closer to seeing the back of McClown.

Its a win win for England- don't qualify and we get rid of an utterly rubbish manager.

One glimmer of hope for England, there is apparently a competition NOT to qualify best from the current groups. Heard this from Moscow this evening so I don't know quite whether to believe it but Germany 0 Czech Republic 3 tonight supports the theory.

Here goes- there are four groups of four in the Finals with only one seeding bucket which contains:

Switzerland (hosts)

Austria (hosts)

Greece (holders)

Best group winner from the qualification matches.

The other twelve places are on a free draw except for avoiding countries already faced in the qualification stage.

SO Germany deliberately threw the game tonight reckoning that having a 3 in four chance of getting one of Switzerland, Austria or Greece (ie being a non-seed) is better than running the risk of a Group of Death of, say, Germany (seeded as best Group winner), Italy, Spain and Holland.

Greece are middlingly useful but having by far the two weakest teams to have reached the European Finals in a long time (Switzerland and Austria) seeded is altering the desirability of being seeded and therefore not having the chance of playing them.

If that's true, Croatia might well be desperate not to get anything at Wembley.

Can anyone check if this is true?

[Fife Rover]

Downing at Left Back

NUFF SAID

The game was lost before Downing came on; he's not to blame.

[Mozzer]

the bench today was so negative..

as soon as a seen the bench i thought if england happen to be losing and need a goal the bench wouldnt provide it(and it didnt)....

i was actually thinking mclaren is turning it around, dropping lampard, called bentley up despite the saga, but the bench today-i thought he lost the plot...3 full backs on the bench..

theres a friendly coming up against austria next month, so hopefully bentley gets a chance-swp was very poor today..

[gumboots]

Without wishing to appear rude, don't bother to post if you haven't bothered to check the facts.

Russia played Croatia at the Lokomotiv Stadium, Israel at Dinamo, Estonia and Andorra in St Petersburg and Macedonia back at Lokomotiv. All on grass.

Apologies. would usually check but for once took what they stated on the radio (can't remeber which station) as fact!

[bblue]

The "both teams played on the same surface" thing is a cliche in my opinion. Why shouldn't it matter? You've got a team who's playing in cold weather, rough terrain on which you need a very good physical condition to perform and they're playing like this for most of their home games. If you're introducing synthetic surface and wet it enough to make it a challenge to get a good pass through, you're going to unsettle your opponents quite a bit, if they're coming from a country where pitches are impecable throughout the year and technique counts more than stamina. At least that's how I see things.

[Flopsy]

The pitch is a feeble excuse Tris, they didnt look to bad on it for 60 minutes, I cant see how it made Gerrard miss that chance, or Bobbinson to palm the ball straight to the strikers feet, or Campbell to head over from 6 yards or the fact that we couldnt pass water, had no threat on the flanks and such a gash substitutes bench that when we needed an injection of pace that we had none.

Still another nail in 15th Choice Steve's coffin - although I fear a "Mike Basset" style qualification

[modes98]

Pitch is a lame, lame excuse

I agree and i can't help but feel the media gave the england team a ready excuse weeks before the game. Every other line in the sky commentary was about the pitch.

England were average for 60mins and then couldn't handle the on fire striker. McClaren shouldn't be in the job and if somehow we make it then he should not be in charge for the European Championships. There are alot of very good managers out there, not english but that doesn't matter, and we need one.

[jim mk2]

Without wishing to appear rude, don't bother to post if you haven't bothered to check the facts.

Russia played Croatia at the Lokomotiv Stadium, Israel at Dinamo, Estonia and Andorra in St Petersburg and Macedonia back at Lokomotiv. All on grass.

Taking England to the plastic for the most critical game in the group, having 10 days for the home side to get used to it, and then treating it artificially by watering the plastic was all done to maximise percentage chances in favour of the home side.

No game at that level should ever be played on a synthetic surface - as evidenced by the UEFA instructions that a grass pitch must be laid in that stadium for the Champions League final next year.

Without wishing to appear rude, that is nonsense for all the reasons stated elsewhere.

Even lame duck McClaren refused to blame the pitch for yesterday's debacle.

Yet again, England are in danger of not qualifying for a major tournamnt, a return to normal affairs after the excellent qualifcation record under Eriksson.

For those xenophobes who derided Eriksson and insisted that the next coach be English, this is the consequence when you over-promote someone not up to the job.

England have won one trophy (and reached one final) of a leading tournament in their history. Compare and contrast with Italy, Germany, France and Brazil. For supposedly one of the world's leading football nation (and home to allegedly the best league in the world), England's international record is pathetic and embarrassing.

[McClarky]

I thought England played really well for an hour, as well as they've played for ages. After that the midfield seemed to stop closing people down and it went horribly wrong for 15 minutes or so. I know Stevie G is beyond any form of criticsm but was he not the main culprit for this? He disappeared from the game when he was most needed and also missed a simple chance to wrap up the game.

On saying that the choice of subs was strange. Why 2 spare left backs and only Crouch as a striker, you can have 7 subs in all can't you? Most tactical subs are made to try and save games so why have only 1 forward on the bench, and what about Bentley? McLaren will certainly get sacked if we don't qualify, and rightly so, but it does seem ironic that this result comes after a decent performance.

[gazsimm]

Why play Owen and Rooney up front, they can't play together. Heskey caused them all kind of problems at Wembley, with his height so why did he did not start with Crouch