[Archived] Thick Gits

[roversmum]

I don't think you have read my post properly, Chesh. I absolutely agree with what you say. What I am saying is that my daughter is not getting these benefits when others who are less deserving are - that is what I am complaining about. Carer's Allowance is for those who look after a disabled person and there are strict rules about it. I don't see that I should have to defend my daughter but she has never acted irresponsibly (she actually begged for sterilization after the second) - the younger three were conceived whilst using contraception and of the three relationships which produced the children - these guys all seemed very responsible at the time, all had good jobs which two of them still have but do not deem that they should contribute to their children's maintenance - the excuse of one of them was that he cannot see his child because they have moved away despite us offering to make arrangements for her to travel to him. If you have never had a relationship with someone that turned out to be a mistake then you are a very lucky man.

As far as social housing goes, there is a need for it and I don't have a problem with it; what I do have a problem with is people not respecting the property in which they live and at least keeping it clean.

Apologies for going further off topic but I needed to say that.

[Paul]

Carer's Allowance is for those who look after a disabled person and there are strict rules about it.

So frigging strict that genuine cases do not get there entitlements - which is not a dig at roversmum and her daughter, I know them both, - but it is a fact the mugs who tell the absolute truth about their situation get nothing while those who lie through their teeth get the whole shooting match. Rant over!!

[Paul]

Like it or not it's the "system" that produces such parents . And like it or not those families are growing ever greater in numbers with every generation . Labour still discriminates against the notion of family . They despise the idea of middle class normality - which is ironic because that's the only group they cater for in reality . Those in so called poverty they keep there with sh1te schools and a worse benefit system .

I have to come back on this phil. I understand completely where you are coming from and I agree the situation is getting worse as we appear to now have 2-3 generations of parents and children in which the parents haven't a clue on how to raise kids. I'm not sure you can blame all this on Labour, the Tories didn't have a great record here. While there are some instances of real poverty in this country the vast, and I mean vast, majority enjoy a decent standard of living. Defining the poverty level is very difficult, but I suspect it's a damn sight higher in the UK than many parts of the world. Those who scream poverty and say the magical "THEY" (whoever they may be) should do something about it often have real difficulty getting their priorities right. What comes first, fags, booze and Sky or the kids?

It's too easy just to mouth platitudes that parents are to blame ...and even easier just to look after number one and pretend all is rosy . Only the government can provide the right environment to break the cultural void in our society.

It isn't platitudes, it's the truth. Now forgive me if I'm wrong but I'm sure I've read posts from you complaining of the nanny state. Where is the dividing line? These people have to help themselves as well as the state giving support. If you visit poor areas of blackburn you will find people on very low incomes maintaining high standards of cleanliness etc in their houses, you'll find others who live in squalor under much the same economic circumstances. You can't blame any politician for that. I use the example as just one way in which home life is dependent on parental attitude.

The evidence on the streets of every town at weekends proves the opposite . Compare it with life in similar sized towns abroad next time you go on hols .....that is if the Brits (of all classes and from all types of schools) haven't got there first.

Which is why successive governments have got it wrong for the past 40 years or so. When I was a lad, and I'm not joking here, if the local bobby caught you up to no good you knew you were in deep trouble when your Dad heard about it. This type of discipline has been lost completely and replaced by yobs and chavs who have no respect and consequently no chance in the future. I don't think you truely believe you can divorcre the influence of the family in this area. Respect comes from example, which is best set by parents it is for schools, teachers, governments to support and reinforce this but it is not for those bodies to teach it. in the first place.

[blue phil]

We'll have to agree to disagree , Paul .

Parents aren't going to break the cycle of what I call "spiritual poverty" after coming through the worst of the state schools . Their children have even less chance even if they have two parents at home . And so it goes on in a downward spiral until we all are subject to gun toting gangs roaming the streets .....

So you tell me how a remedy can be found if not by strong intervention from the state in the form of real disciplined schools and a taxation and benefit system that positively puts family values first and foremost ? Real intervention like that is a million miles away from the nanny state we are seeing now . Yob families aren't going to reform themselves that's obvious to me - they just breed .

(Oh ...and I regard the Tories' record as abysmal in this area - but not as bad as the social engineering Labour Party )