[Archived] Rovers Young Guns

[JAL]

Aaron Doran looks the best of the young lad,s though i've yet to see this lad Andy Howarth whose already played first team football on the back of very limited reserve football.

[DeadlyDirk]

Not so much of a youngster these days by today's standards but Tony Kane has joined League One side Carlisle on loan until the end of the season.

He seems to be another who ulitmately wasn't good enough like so many of our youngsters in recent history. He turns 22 at the end of the season, in this day and age you probably need to be playing at a higher level by now to have any future in the premiership, the fact that we only have Simpson and a makeshift right back in Ooijer at the moment suggests he isn't in future plans.

[rover6]

Care telling us how you came to the same conclusion as those people?

Okay, so I didn't mean to imply that I had seen McCubbin play. However, I was confused as to why this unknown and unprominent (if that's a word) player was given a new contract. I read comments from regular watchers of the U18s and reserves and they could give me no good reason, being equally perplexed.

Now, he's on loan in the non-league. It makes no sense.

BTW: Good luck to Tony Kane. Hope he does "a Garner" at Carlisle. He did well at Cercle Brugge (who rejected the chance to take on many of our reserves) so I see no reason why he can't forge a good career. He was quite good at Stockport, incidentally - and Treacy wasn't. I put Treacy's failure down to the possible same reasons Derbyshire couldn't get a Plymouth game, but maybe it was indicative of his ability rather than anything else.

[Majiball]

Didn't Derb's manage 13 apps with no goals whilst at Arygle, mostly as a sub, in his short stint. Thats not bad considering.

The change of manager didn't help his cause but he is still highly spoken off down there.

[Ronin]

Didn't Derb's manage 13 apps with no goals whilst at Arygle, mostly as a sub, in his short stint. Thats not bad considering.

The change of manager didn't help his cause but he is still highly spoken off down there.

I work with an Argyle fan and he definitely still speaks highly of him, but does agree that the change of manager didn't help at all. He also rates Gallagher as well!

[Majiball]

The staff rated him too.

Just read this:

Academy

good to see one club trying new ideas for their academy.

[speeeeeeedie]

Just a thought in relation to JAL's comment about the shoddy reserves in another thread.

Should clubs not adopt a policy of making the youth a separate entity? The average manager lasts 3 years (too long?). If they always chop and change staff consistency goes out of the window. Having a youth team coordinator reporting directly to the chairman/chief exec, not the manager, may make it easier to build a successful set up. Any thoughts? I've said over and over that our youth teams aren't the best because of our proximity to Manchester and Liverpool. Maybe a radical shift could entice a new breed of potential 1st teamers without having to play the increasingly ridiculous transfer game.

[Parsonblue]

Just a thought in relation to JAL's comment about the shoddy reserves in another thread.

Should clubs not adopt a policy of making the youth a separate entity? The average manager lasts 3 years (too long?). If they always chop and change staff consistency goes out of the window. Having a youth team coordinator reporting directly to the chairman/chief exec, not the manager, may make it easier to build a successful set up. Any thoughts? I've said over and over that our youth teams aren't the best because of our proximity to Manchester and Liverpool. Maybe a radical shift could entice a new breed of potential 1st teamers without having to play the increasingly ridiculous transfer game.

We already do this. Bobby Downes is in charge of the Academy and reports to the chairman. The first team manager has no say in the running of the Academy. However, the system clearly isn't working and if we do manage to avoid relegation we can but hope that Big Sam is allowed to get involved in the Academy. At Bolton he worked very closely with Chris Sulley who looked after the Academy there.

[Stonesrick]

I went to watch the reserve team against Newcastle on Monday in which we lost 1-0. Pretty decent in the first half but 2nd best after that (sound familiar?).

As has previously been highlighted there seems to be a lack of youngsters coming through the Academy since the days of Duff and Dunn.

Without wanting to put a negative slant on things but there was only one player who looked as though he has the potential to make the grade and that was Aaron Doran. He has a presence about him, quick thinking, gets stuck in and most important of all plays with his head up and sees things in front of him.

[onlyoneDuff]

I believe Doran was just awarded the U17 Irish player of the year

[speeeeeeedie]

We already do this. Bobby Downes is in charge of the Academy and reports to the chairman. The first team manager has no say in the running of the Academy. However, the system clearly isn't working and if we do manage to avoid relegation we can but hope that Big Sam is allowed to get involved in the Academy. At Bolton he worked very closely with Chris Sulley who looked after the Academy there.

Cheers I did not know that. Next question; is he up to the job?

[Majiball]

Perhaps people should start voicing their concerns over this.

Dunn thats it in 10 years, I cannot think of a single academy manager that has kept his job with a track record like that. Plymouth equal that, Tranmere, Crewe, Bristol City exceed it, four clubs whose total budgets added together do not even come close to ours, let alone their facilities. Two of them by the way are academies, not centres of excellence as are Tranmere and Plymouth. All of them have changed their youth managers in the last ten years, but yet have better records, Puzzling.

Bobby Downes is water tight, he must be so in with the right people, its impossible to fathom how he still has a role at our club. I suppose he'll still be here when my kids old enough, but I can tell you right now I wouldn't even entertain a trial from our club for him (should it happen) with him in charge. I do pity Simon Ireland & co must work hard holding it all together. My biggest worry is will some of our coaches hang around a couple have good backgrounds.

We are dinosaurs in this aspect, not my words. I spend a lot of my life at academies everyone knows someone and they all know who's good and who's bad.

The bull-###### excuse that we are in a footballing black spot is crap, tranmere are there as well (sorry I'm fed up with that excuse).

Sam's involvement is a must, if its an issue remove the issue, I hope this is a point Sam pushes home he's the only one who could. Even then it would take years to get going again, reputations are easy to lose and hard to get back.

I'd like to see some of whatever money comes in from RSC's eventual transfer spent sorting it out. Do we even have a sports scientist on the staff at Rovers academy? That should be proof enough we are still in the stone age, even Tranmere have two.

Sorting the academy out would in the long run aid in keeping us in this league. We've produced less premiership players than a club in league one on the verge of bankrupcy.

Good Job Bobby,

[JAL]

There was one player playing on Monday night whom I thought very highly of, but after watching him play or more to the point I didnt realise he was playing he looked so spent, so ordinary, so lacking in his play was Olsson.

I just hope he was ill or had another excuse for his below par performance, come to think of it, he looked very poor against Bolton reserves.

Perhaps people should start voicing their concerns over this.

Dunn thats it in 10 years, I cannot think of a single academy manager that has kept his job with a track record like that. Plymouth equal that, Tranmere, Crewe, Bristol City exceed it, four clubs whose total budgets added together do not even come close to ours, let alone their facilities. Two of them by the way are academies, not centres of excellence as are Tranmere and Plymouth. All of them have changed their youth managers in the last ten years, but yet have better records, Puzzling.

Bobby Downes is water tight, he must be so in with the right people, its impossible to fathom how he still has a role at our club. I suppose he'll still be here when my kids old enough, but I can tell you right now I wouldn't even entertain a trial from our club for him (should it happen) with him in charge. I do pity Simon Ireland & co must work hard holding it all together. My biggest worry is will some of our coaches hang around a couple have good backgrounds.

We are dinosaurs in this aspect, not my words. I spend a lot of my life at academies everyone knows someone and they all know who's good and who's bad.

The bull-###### excuse that we are in a footballing black spot is crap, tranmere are there as well (sorry I'm fed up with that excuse).

Sam's involvement is a must, if its an issue remove the issue, I hope this is a point Sam pushes home he's the only one who could. Even then it would take years to get going again, reputations are easy to lose and hard to get back.

I'd like to see some of whatever money comes in from RSC's eventual transfer spent sorting it out. Do we even have a sports scientist on the staff at Rovers academy? That should be proof enough we are still in the stone age, even Tranmere have two.

Sorting the academy out would in the long run aid in keeping us in this league. We've produced less premiership players than a club in league one on the verge of bankrupcy.

Good Job Bobby,

What about the wonderful John Williams and the board for maintaining this position or am I not allowed to say such things.

[Majiball]

In fact, sod it I've had enough someone please PM me Mr williams Email ( if anyone has it) I'll send him a lovely long email.

[Majiball]

What about the wonderful John Williams and the board for maintaining this position or am I not allowed to say such things.

TBH I almost added something along those lines. I just don't want to he's done so much good for us, far more than bad. I don't expect our or any chairman to know a good coach from a bad one? but perhaps its time he started asking around other clubs what they think? perhaps he should speak to our coaches at the academy?

[JAL]

TBH I almost added something along those lines. I just don't want to he's done so much good for us, far more than bad. I don't expect our or any chairman to know a good coach from a bad one? but perhaps its time he started asking around other clubs what they think? perhaps he should speak to our coaches at the academy?

To be fair we dont really know the full story behind what goes on but yes, I think we should be saying 'hey cant we do better than this' and questioning the mission or role of the academy and what is expected.

Maybe our hopes and expectations are far too high for what the academy can realistically acheive.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

To be fair we dont really know the full story behind what goes on but yes, I think we should be saying 'hey cant we do better than this' and questioning the mission or role of the academy and what is expected.

Maybe our hopes and expectations are far too high for what the academy can realistically acheive.

I don't think that our aspirations are too big. When Jack diverted funds to the academy, the aim was to bring at least one player a season through which would be an addition to the first team squad. For several seasons we've not had. Mission Failed I'd say.

[cn174]

At the Bobby Mimms thing the other week he said that in his opinion there isn't enough contact between the first team and the academy players. The academy play down at the bottom and it is very rare that they mix - when really they should be playing along side them and looking up to the professionals to see what they need to do to get there.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

He isn't really a young 'un anymore but Gally just put Plymouth in the lead.

[The Prof.]

M Utd Academy - at Lammack! Look at more players than Rovers. Sack Downes.

Liverpool Academy at Preston! ditto.

Never seen a Rovers scout at our U/7 or U/8 games. Talked to Liverpool scouts, Everton scouts, (too far) Burnley Scouts (wouldn't go). Never seen a Rovers scout. Sack Downes.

School games - We did well with 3 years below our age group. Never seen a Rovers scout. Sack Downes.

If you shine at rollerball/rugby at JJB Rovers will look at you. Sack Downes

Junior will be a maths prof anyway but thats not the point- Sack Downes.

In fact. I will be having a word. Promise.

[stuwilky]

Liverpool have just signed a few players from Primary Schools in Leyland.

[Blue blood]

Went to the carlisle game today and saw Kane play right back. I know we're a bit short on decent right backs, but there was no indication that Kane will make the grade (compared to one or two other loan signings in that division). League 1 is about his level, and some decent tackles and blocks were mixed in with him being easily outmuscled for the ball on numerous occassions.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

M Utd Academy - at Lammack! Look at more players than Rovers. Sack Downes.

Liverpool Academy at Preston! ditto.

Never seen a Rovers scout at our U/7 or U/8 games. Talked to Liverpool scouts, Everton scouts, (too far) Burnley Scouts (wouldn't go). Never seen a Rovers scout. Sack Downes.

School games - We did well with 3 years below our age group. Never seen a Rovers scout. Sack Downes.

If you shine at rollerball/rugby at JJB Rovers will look at you. Sack Downes

Junior will be a maths prof anyway but thats not the point- Sack Downes.

In fact. I will be having a word. Promise.

So let me get this straight. Do you want to sack the Womble from Wimbledon? Its just that you are making your point clear enough

[Majiball]

Ok this is for all those with concerns about the academy.

I am having a chat with JW (cheers Tris) and this is the main area I wish to discuss. Now I'm sure I will not be able to respond completely, as I will probably be asked not to repeat certain things. However provided it does not bend or break that trust, I would be happy to pose any questions you have and respond as I can.

[American]

I would ask the following: One of the few positive steps the club seems to be making recently is scouting in Ireland for teenagers who show some promise. Do they plan to expand that program and look at youngsters from other countries where there wouldn't be permit/residency issues, like a poor man's Arsenal?