[Archived] Why Do We Have No Money

[waggy]

we did not make funds available to sparky in the transfer window and it looks like it is going to back fire on us big time

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

Mark Hughes has used only 21 players in first-team matches in the Premiership this season - which is the joint-fewest number of players used by any Premiership club. (For example Portsmouth, one of our rivals for a European place and who spent £25m last summer, have used 28 players in the Premiership this season.)

After yesterday's disappointing goalless draw against Reading, Hughes told the media that our players were "flat and lacking in spark" after the midweek friendly games. "The players were a bit tired," he said.

I suspect that what we saw at the Madejski Stadium yesterday was an indication that the overall strength and quality of the squad isn't as good as Hughes would like - and we may miss out on a place in Europe as a result of it.

We sold Robbie Savage in January and didn't replace him. Some of the other fringe players in the squad such as Bruno Berner and Keith Treacy haven't covered themselves in glory this season, particularly when they were allowed to take part in the shambolic performance against Coventry in the FA Cup.

I fear that despite PhilipL's bold assertion at the start of the season that we had "the strongest squad in Rovers' history" sadly that isn't the case and a number of players in the squad aren't good enough.

Another indication of this was the fact that PhilipL was almost wetting his pants in excitement at the thought of Maceo Rigters joining our club. But Rigters has now buggered off to Norwich on loan, with Hughes clearly feeling that we won't miss his so-called "talent" for the remainder of the season.

If we do indeed miss out on a place in Europe this season following displays on the pitch which Hughes said were "flat and lacking in spark" then in my view the board and trustees need to look at themselves in the mirror and ask themselves if they did enough to support our manager, who has already spoken this season of his frustration at working within such a tight budget.

Instead of giving our club an extra £3m to spend, the trustees now say that they see "no immediate need to invest in the squad".

If the trustees had watched some of our abysmal performances this season against Coventry, Larissa and in the 5-3 defeat against Wigan, they ought to recognise that there is a need to invest in the squad.

Incidentally, following on from the news that one particular section of the Walker trustees is investing £1.2bn in new jets for the airline Flybe, (it's planned that Flybe will have a total fleet of 82 aircraft completed by 2009), it's been revealed today that Flybe has asked actors to fill empty seats on flights.

An advert from Flybe said that over a hundred actors were needed and would be paid more than £80 a day if they were prepared to fly to Ireland. Another offer appeared on Flybe's website advertising "free flights to Dublin this weekend" and offering 200 free return tickets to the public. The unusual generosity from Flybe is down to their desire to avoid a commercial penalty on passenger numbers.

It would be nice if the Walker Trustees could be a bit more generous towards Mark Hughes and perhaps give him the funds to buy a decent player or two in the summer. At the moment the trustees are giving Rovers nothing. Zilch. Not even a free packet of peanuts that they dish out on their airlines.

Link: "Flybe asked actors to fill empty seats on flights"

[92er]

At least MH has been told he will get money in the summer.

[thenodrog]

Instead of giving our club an extra £3m to spend, the trustees now say that they see "no immediate need to invest in the squad".

I can understand them keeping their powder dry aesf. Given that the top 4 are virtually unassailable and we are in the chasing pack in 7th place with no chance of relegation and out of every cup we are only playing for place money. The signs are that we are preparing to invest in the squad in the coming months so from a sensible business point of view I think we are doing the right thing. Rem it's not just about buying new players it's about paying em too!

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

The disappointment for me was the fact that we are supposed to be chasing the position of securing a European position for next season - and yet again failed miserably ( at home ).

In our last five matches we've dropped too many points. A dismal draw at home to Fulham was followed by a defeat at Upton Park - a venue where we've got an abysmal record over the last decade away to West Ham.

I hoped that our positive performance in the 3-1 win at home to Wigan might act as a catalyst for some improved displays until the end of the season, but in our last two matches we've again dropped points in the 0-0 draw against Reading. This was followed by another two points dropped against Spurs on Saturday.

I'm afraid that 6 points out of a possible 15 in our last 5 matches isn't good enough if we seriously want to be playing European football next season, particularly when you consider that in all five of our last games Rovers were playing against teams which are below us in the table. It's simply been a case of too many points dropped.

Our esteemed chairman John Williams, meanwhile, claimed in January that Rovers were "challenging for a Champions League place". Frankly I thought at the time that John's words were wildly over-optimistic and that the chances of us finishing in the top four were extremely slim to say the least, particularly when the purse strings were pulled so tight.

I hope that in the summer Mr Williams and the trustees will recognise that it's very difficult competing for a European place when you've got no money to spend.

It has to be said though that our European performances both this season and last season have been extremely disappointing. I remember after Larissa beat us in the 1st Round of the UEFA Cup, Colin said: "I'll keep an eye on Larissa's results" - well if you didn't Colin, they finished bottom of Group A in the UEFA Cup, with precisely no points. (Everton topped Group A with 12 points.)

Larissa are nothing more than a mediocre mid-table Greek team and it was a humiliation for our club that they beat us, with Rovers performing so abysmally. Last season we were beaten in the last 32 of the UEFA Cup by Bayer Leverkusen - with the Germans going on to lose 0-3 at home to Osasuna in the quarter-final 1st leg (losing 4-0 on aggregate.) I noticed that last week Leverkusen were beaten 1-4 at home in their quarter-final 1st leg UEFA Cup tie against Zenit St Petersburg.

Leverkusen are clearly not that great. Sadly neither are we. Rovers unfortunately have a tendency to lose possession too cheaply, which you simply can't afford to do when playing European football. Until Mark Hughes can sort out the fact that we give the ball away too often, then our performances in Europe (if we actually get there for next season) will once again be disappointing.

Our team lacks pace in certain areas, meaning that we're not quick enough on the counter-attack. Combine that with the fact that we give the ball away too often and frankly we've got problems when playing in Europe.

Our squad needs investment in new players in the summer. Let's not kid ourselves that we've got a great team, because we haven't.

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

On a more serious note I think today illustrated the desperate need for a specialist right back, a creative midfielder, a left winger and someone to play up front alongside Roque.

I think you're right that the shambles yesterday at St Andrews did illustrate the need for our squad to be strengthened in the summer.

The result yesterday against Birmingham was desperately disappointing. Aston Villa haven't beaten West Ham away at Upton Park for 12 years since 1996, so there was always a decent chance that Villa would again fail to get 3 points at Upton Park yesterday. Typically though Rovers blew their chance of a top six place when a win would have given us a place in the Intertoto.

I'm disappointed that we've missed out, but I do think that if we'd qualified for Europe it might have papered over the cracks for some people, including perhaps those on the board. They might have taken the view that everything is hunky-dory, when in reality we've had some bitterly disappointing results this season and there seem to be clear deficiencies in certain areas of the squad.

On the main Birmingham thread some people have blamed Hughes and some have blamed the players. I think Hughes has made a few mistakes this season but I don't want to slaughter the guy. I do feel that some of the players need to take a look at themselves in the mirror and ask if they gave absolutely everything in all the games. There have been several performances this season which I think were unacceptable, including the Larissa and Coventry debacles and the 5-3 humiliation away to Wigan.

But as well as the players taking some of the flak, I feel that the trustees need to ask themselves if it was the right decision to declare: "We see no immediate need to strengthen the squad."

Mark Hughes complained that the players were "tired and lacking in spark" after the 0-0 draw away at Reading. Perhaps if the trustees had been willing to be a bit more generous with funding in January, giving Hughes the money to buy one or two quality players in the January transfer window, then it would have been possible to have rested a couple of the players who were particularly "tired and lacking in spark".

This might have made a big difference at the end of the season, meaning the difference between finishing 6th and 7th. Hughes has made it clear that he would like to see funds spent on new players and I hope that in the summer the board and trustees are not so parsimonious with the cash.

Rovers get £10.08m prize money for finishing 7th, compared with, for example, to Wigan who get £5.04m for finishing 14th, Sunderland who get £4.32m for finishing 15th, Bolton, who get £3.6m for being 16th and Fulham who get £2.88m for finishing 17th. It would be nice to see the board allocating the £10m we earned in prize money to give to Mark Hughes in the transfer market.

[thenodrog]

It has to be said though that our European performances both this season and last season have been extremely disappointing. I remember after Larissa beat us in the 1st Round of the UEFA Cup, Colin said: "I'll keep an eye on Larissa's results" - well if you didn't Colin, they finished bottom of Group A in the UEFA Cup, with precisely no points. (Everton topped Group A with 12 points.)

Larissa are nothing more than a mediocre mid-table Greek team and it was a humiliation for our club that they beat us, with Rovers performing so abysmally. Last season we were beaten in the last 32 of the UEFA Cup by Bayer Leverkusen - with the Germans going on to lose 0-3 at home to Osasuna in the quarter-final 1st leg (losing 4-0 on aggregate.) I noticed that last week Leverkusen were beaten 1-4 at home in their quarter-final 1st leg UEFA Cup tie against Zenit St Petersburg.

Leverkusen are clearly not that great. Sadly neither are we.

I rated Larisa too aesf and thought they would progress further but after knocking us out and being very unlucky at Goodison they did nowt, so what do I know? I do think that a really good striker could have transformed them to a very decent outfit.

In the Bay Arena we were well on top in the opening exchanges and if Roberts had converted a 'gimme' we could well have gon on to win that. Instead we were sussed by em, gave away cheap goals and were lucky in the end to get back in contention.

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

At least MH has been told he will get money in the summer.

Well MH buggered off in the summer, partly one suspects because he was so infuriated at the pitiful amount of money he was given to spend.

It's been reported that over the last five years Blackburn Rovers have been the lowest net spenders in the Premiership. I haven't checked the exact figures, but we are certainly near the bottom of the table in terms of net expenditure on players.

Nicko suggested recently that Sam Allardyce was annoyed and very unhappy towards the end of the January transfer window because he was denied the funds by the board to buy a particular player.

I can understand them keeping their powder dry aesf. Given that the top 4 are virtually unassailable and we are in the chasing pack in 7th place with no chance of relegation and out of every cup we are only playing for place money.

I wonder if you have now changed your view on this Gordon?

You said in March 2008: "We have no chance of relegation" - which was the case specifically for last season. But with a bit of foresight from the board, they should in my view have been alert to the longer-term dangers.

The board should have been aware that firstly Hughes would be inclined to leave if adequate funds were not provided for him. Secondly, if the manager replacing Hughes turns out to be poor - which was certainly the case with Ince - then we would find ourselves in a relegation battle in 2008/09, given the poor overall quality of the squad and the lack of expenditure on quality players.

In January 2008, amid press reports that Hughes was keen on taking over from the sacked Mr Allardyce at St James' Park, John Williams defiantly told The Guardian: "Why should Mark want to leave? We are challenging for a Champions League place".

I feel that frankly Mr Williams was in denial. His belief that Rovers could finish in the top four whilst only spending a pitiful amount of money was ridiculously over-optimistic. It was far more likely, in my view, that rather than qualify for the Champions League, Rovers would actually find themselves deep in a relegation battle the following season if money wasn't spent in the transfer market.

I feel that the seeds of our current plight were sown in January 2008. Robbie Savage was sold to Derby - rightly in my view because I think his legs had gone and he's been hopeless ever since he left. The big mistake for Rovers was not replacing Savage adequately and leaving us desperately short of quality in midfield.

Seems like I was the only one who thought Grella was absolutely pathetic. Twin him with Andrews and what do we have - a central midfield not good enough for league one - never mind the championship.

I thought Grella was woeful too. Combine him with Andrews and the partnership is nowhere near good enough.

Grella and Andrews as the starting central midfielders is probably the worst starting combo in the Premiership.

After our 1-1 draw at home to Middlesbrough in October, the Liverpudlian clown Raymond Mathias claimed in an interview with the Lancashire Telegraph that Vince Grella was as good as any midfielder in the Premiership.

Mathias seemed to think that Grella is as good as Fabregas, Gerrard, Scholes, Carrick, Alonso etc. With clowns like Mathias working under Paul Ince, no wonder we've struggled this season.

Keith Andrews would not get a place in Burnley's side and that REALLY is a damning verdict!

Don Howe used to say: "8 times out of 10, a match is won and lost in midfield. The midfield is the key to winning football matches."

I tend to agree with that point of view. The midfield defines the pattern of play, where possession is won and lost, and where chances are created for the strikers. Forwards don't usually create chances out of thin air. The midfield provides the service to the strikers and also provides the defensive protection for the back four.

Our midfield is pants. Hence why we are currently in the bottom three and facing a massive scrap to survive. Should Rovers be relegated, perhaps the men in the dock, so to speak, should be the board and the trustees for failing to financially invest in the team, particularly in midfield.

The board were also to blame for appointing Paul Ince from League Two, a man well-known for his arrogance and a man who could barely string a coherent sentence together, let alone adequately provide the necessary tactics and management skills needed for top-flight football.

There's a massive difference between League Two and Premiership football. Sadly the board couldn't see it. They seemed to have the ludicrous belief that just because one former Man United player in Mark Hughes was successful, so Ince would be successful too. Try telling that to the fans of Middlesbrough, Bradford City, West Brom and Sheffield United. Bryan Robson - a former midfield partner of Ince at United - has been sacked at every single club he has managed.

It really made me massively angry the way that some people had the argument: "Paul Ince has played under Alex Ferguson. So he must know what he's doing. Ince must have learned a lot from Fergie."

Absolute rubbish!

As well as appointing a tactically incompetent and arrogant man like Paul Ince, sadly the Rovers board also didn't have the foresight to be aware that a lack of proper investment in the team could have huge repercussions for the long-term future of our club.

[LDRover]

I've said elsewhere that the board's failure to make funds available in January was playing Russian Roulette with the club's future at this level. However, I think there are 3 bullets in the chamber as opposed to one in this deadly game as believe it's about a 50-50 chance on us staying up.

Was it really Allardyce assuring the powers that be the squad is good enough? I'm not so sure, and having seen his demeanour in recent interviews I'm inclined to believe that even more.

I'm not saying that it's as simplistic as to spend 10 million to save 40 million but surely after so little investment over such a sustained period January was the time to make a statement of intent? Especially given the board's insistence after the summer window that money would be spent in January - I'm sure we all remember the statements about 'keeping our powder dry' (there I go again!).

I really fear for us at the moment.

[RevidgeBlue]

Was it really Allardyce assuring the powers that be the squad is good enough? I'm not so sure, and having seen his demeanour in recent interviews I'm inclined to believe that even more.

I don't bwelieve that either, Sam hasn't seemed full of the joys of spring at all in recent interviews and worryingly seemed to concede that we couldn't expect to compete with a team like Villa in his post match interview yesterday, further that we could play our very best at Old Trafford and still get beaten!!!

We all know it won't be easy but I think he should be talking bullishly about organising ourselves properly and making it as difficult as possible for them over there etc. etc.

[broadsword]

It's one thing not to throw good money after bad in giving a manager an obscene amount of money and it doesn't make any difference, but there's a minimum level of investment that has to be made I think, to keep the club in the Premiership. And we haven't made it in my book, we're rock bottom of the spending league table.

I think after a certain point of investment, there is a law of diminishing returns, and I would not advocate financial lunacy. But conversely, I think we're miles away from a make-safe amount of investment. Ince was sacked because the trust was panicking about having to sell the club when it's in the Coca Cola. that's great, but having a manager who is capable is only one part. You have to give him some money.

At the moment we're trying to compete in the World Rally Championship with a rusty Morris Minor.

It will back-fire in the end, it's just a matter of time.

[RevidgeBlue]

At the moment we're trying to compete in the World Rally Championship with a rusty Morris Minor.

Or to use a comparison I've used in the past, trying to keep our "Ferrari" (TM Stan Ternent) running at peak performance whilst never sending it in for servicing at the prescribed service intervals. (The transfer windows)

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

The most depressing part of this being we as Rovers fans can see whats coming but cant do anything about it.

We appear to have owners that want shut of us and wont invest but yet again the question must be asked what will our value be if relegated....I just wish to hell the money men would make their minds up as to what exactly they want from OUR club!

[brightonrover]

There's some interesting debate here but what it seems to come down to is the club's skint. No one could meet the conditions set down to buy the club before the start of the credit crunch and, now that's really starting to bite, no one has the cash.

With only £3M coming in from the trust and low gates and revenue, there's not enough money to bring in the quality of players needed to improve the squad. We may just have enough to stay up this season but it's also quite possible that we'll go down.

Even if we fight off the drop in 08/09, there's no real reason to believe that things will get better in the future as Blackburn is a low profile team in a league where money really is starting to count. Rovers are not a good potential investment and, even if we could find another JW figure, they wouldn't be able to compete with billionaires from around the world.

That sounds really negative I realise but I think that's the reality of our position.

[RevidgeBlue]

There's some interesting debate here but what it seems to come down to is the club's skint.

I think "skint" is an entirely relative term seeing as the last set of figures will allegedly reveal an operating profit of 7m.

Whether the Trustees are "skint" is also extremely doubtful imo.

[thenodrog]

We have reduced the ST prices massively without increasing attendance figures enough to cover that cost. I said it was not a good idea at the time but was heavily outnumbered. We cannot hope to fill our ground and match our rivals with merchandising / sponsorship / corporate revenue, so I guess an inability to compete financially had to be expected. Not difficult to work out is it?

[Parsonblue]

I suspect that even if we dodge relegation this season - which I seriously doubt - we are merely postponing the inevitable for another twelve months. The Trust are clearly not prepared to invest in the club for if they were they would surely have done it in January. Our very future hangs in the balance and the Trust have sat on their hands during the past month.

I can fully understand that the Walker family don't want to put money into the club because they have no interest in it. Blackburn Rovers was Jack Walker's passion while members of the family are obviously not quite as keen and obviously would want to spend money on things that interest them. However, from a business point of view, I would have thought that some investment was necessary if only to maintain the club as a Premier League outfit in order to try and attract potential buyers. Blackburn Rovers as a Championship club would be unlikely to attract anyone and would surely lose more money than by staying in the Premier League. Attendances will fall dramatically, sponorship and corporate hospitality deals will be harder to find and exposure in the media will shrink even more. I think people are wrong to try to compare the Rovers with Burnley and Preston and suggest that we might do as well as they do on a small budget.

Both our neighbours are much smaller operations. The upkeep of our ground is more expensive, we have a senior training centre to maintain and an Academy. Both Burnley and Preston would spend much less on these areas.

I fear that relegation will see the start of a decline that is similar to that of the late sixties when the club slipped into the Third Division and was virtually bankrupt. The fact that the Trust have not acted in January to avert such a possiblity suggests to me that money is not only tight but is virtually non-existant at Ewood Park.

[den]

I can fully understand that the Walker family don't want to put money into the club because they have no interest in it. Blackburn Rovers was Jack Walker's passion while members of the family are obviously not quite as keen and obviously would want to spend money on things that interest them.

Nothing to do with the Walker family, is it?

[brightonrover]

We have reduced the ST prices massively without increasing attendance figures enough to cover that cost. I said it was not a good idea at the time but was heavily outnumbered. We cannot hope to fill our ground and match our rivals with merchandising / sponsorship / corporate revenue, so I guess an inability to compete financially had to be expected. Not difficult to work out is it?

But the money 'lost' by reducing ticket prices wouldn't be anywhere near enough to make a difference in the current transfer market. A couple of million quid here and there won't buy and pay the wages of a couple of really good players and even the £7M profit mentioned above isn't close to what would be needed.

Yes, 'skint' is relative, relative to many other clubs with a lot more cash either through big gates, wealthy investors or both. We haven't got and have no prospect of getting either so we need to be realistic in our expectations.

We support a small town club with a limited fan base and we need to get used to the fact that we're going to struggle to stay in the top division, let alone compete in it. We've been lucky that Mark Hughes was able to work miracles with a limited team on a tight budget but that's not always possible and we're now seeing that.

[RevidgeBlue]

We have reduced the ST prices massively without increasing attendance figures enough to cover that cost. I said it was not a good idea at the time but was heavily outnumbered. We cannot hope to fill our ground and match our rivals with merchandising / sponsorship / corporate revenue, so I guess an inability to compete financially had to be expected. Not difficult to work out is it?

As at last season I think about 75% of the shortfall in admission prices had been made up by increased attendances leaving us with a shortfall of c 1m.

A pretty fair trade for an increase in turnover from c 40m to c 54m due to increased TV Revenue?

[Parsonblue]

Nothing to do with the Walker family, is it?

I assume the Trust run Jack Walker's business interests and that these are run on behalf of the family. I also assume that the lack of spending at Ewood Park is because the Trust are trying to safeguard other areas of the business empire that they look after. In the present financial climate I can understand why no money has been spent but in football if you are not moving forwards you are going backwards. You can't stand still and I believe that is what we have tried to do over the past twelve months. Ultimately, the value of Blackburn Rovers in the Championship is going to be a lot less than Blackburn Rovers in the Premier League.

[dr_awol]

The most depressing part of this being we as Rovers fans can see whats coming but cant do anything about it.

We appear to have owners that want shut of us and wont invest but yet again the question must be asked what will our value be if relegated....I just wish to hell the money men would make their minds up as to what exactly they want from OUR club!

The most depressing part has been the past year, this time last year, I could see rovers doing what villa are doing this year, but we never maintained the momentum. Now with RSC going in the summer, I’m certain we will stay up this season, next season without some proper investment I fear we will be one of the contenders for the drop.

[RevidgeBlue]

Yes, 'skint' is relative,

I would suggest it's also relative compared to the majority of clubs across Europe.

[den]

I assume the Trust run Jack Walker's business interests and that these are run on behalf of the family. I also assume that the lack of spending at Ewood Park is because the Trust are trying to safeguard other areas of the business empire that they look after.

As I understand it, the trust carries out JW's wishes, not the families. This bit is guesswork:- but maybe the family have representation on the trust, but they are bound by Jack's wishes before he died, not their's now.

[Bazzanotsogreat]

Just a quick note- Rovers earnings were circa 45 million from tv/prize money in the last accountable year a rise of around 20 million from the season before. With the latest TV deal this will rise to circa 50 million for a 17th place finish.

Furthermore the reported 7m profit if before transfer dealings. So in reality Rovers have probably made a 12-14 million pound profit. Without any owner investment.