[Archived] American Presidential Elections

[American]

By far not her only chance. If McCain wins, he isn't getting any younger, and she is still relatively young. Had she dropped out a few weeks ago, she'd have had a real shot 4 years from now, but now she's just pulling a Teddy Kennedy who ruined any chance he had at the presidency when he challenged Carter at the convention in 1980.

[Eddie]

You're right, her only chance is if McCain wins the election, but even then I think her chances in 2012 would be fairly slim. The nature of modern-day politics is such that once you have lost an election you generally don't recover.

[philipl]

Who is this air-head Trotta bint????

Clinton H is history as in never made it, never will.

Clinton B is history in made it, looked great because of George Worst-ever-President Bush but stupidly reminded everybody of all his failings whilst supporting Hillary so will now get a realistic as opposed to a rose-tainted assessment.

[Eddie]

Bill Clinton was a very good President, he didn't need George W Bush to fail in order to prove that. He was considered a good President during his terms and straight after he left. The failures of the Bush administration do make him look better, particularly when it comes to how he handled the economy, but to say that he is only considered to be a success as a result of a later failure is incorrect.

[philipl]

Re-read what I posted and you will see you have misread what I said.

W makes Clinton look like superman. What I am saying is his behaviour in the Hillary campaign means there will be a more balanced assessment of his Presidency, not that he wasn't a good President.

As they say, history gets to be written by the winner and the Billary campaign will be summed up as incompetent, inconsistent, pre-internet era/out-of-touch, surly and down right nasty round those edges where Bill was lurking. Billary will become a case study on how to lose from an overwhelmingly winning position and quite possibly on how to fail to manage the closure of a losing campaign to your best advantage.

My head says she'd be better than McCain but my emotional reaction is now much more anti-Clinton than anti-McCain.

That is one extraordinary achievement for her campaign to have cheesed me off that much.

[Eddie]

I absolutely understand what you said and I disagree with it. Clinton was a very good president, regardless of what followed. Anyone who either considers his current behaviour when judging his terms in office or has decided to reconsider their previous opinion as a result of it shouldn't really be listened to when it comes to political analysis.

[Rovermatt]

Clinton was an excellent President but some of his behaviour in this campaign has undoubtedly tainted his image.

[Eddie]

He's lost the plot at times, which is surprising for someone who handled himself well even at the most difficult of times. I suppose seeing your wife run is an entirely different form of pressure.

[philipl]

I absolutely understand what you said and I disagree with it. Clinton was a very good president, regardless of what followed. Anyone who either considers his current behaviour when judging his terms in office or has decided to reconsider their previous opinion as a result of it shouldn't really be listened to when it comes to political analysis.

No you don't eddie because I am saying how I perceive how he will be judged.

You only need to read what all sorts of people are writing about Bill now compared with ewhat was written before the Billary campaign to understand that Bill has reminded a lot of people about the darker sides of the Clinton Presidency.

[Bazzanotsogreat]

Clinton was one of the best presidents the US has ever had. The end

As for his personal life , i coudn't give a monkies who he bonked or if he has made a clown in his wife's somewhat bothced attempt in the democratic candidate race. As for “dark-sides” name a president or politician that hasn’t been involved in shady deals or shenanigans?

Clinton’s worst mistake as president was not dealing with Al-Qaeda earlier and properly; that is for another debate though. His economic & societal record was second to none.

[Billy Castell]

Hillary Clinton is like The Terminator-She absolutely will not stop. Just when you she her in the middle of a big explosion, and she is dead, she marches out of the flames in the form of a damaged metal skeleton.

[American]

Rumor (since sqashed by her) is that she is ready to concede that Obama has enough delegates to win. Won't say she's dropping out of the race, though.

[philipl]

Would be interesting to hear whether the States-side posters identify with Finkelstein's arguments in this Times article. It is an interesting angle but I don't know whether it is simply a political theorist's point of view.

[American Rover12]

I think its a little bit of a few things:

A historical analyzation / tie-in to present day through some pretty specific though weak links.

A few conspiracy theories

Some common sense

Not a bad article at all, but nothing I'd change my mind over.

[philipl]

Thanks.

Incidentally, I think Clinton self-destructed last night. By continuing to play hardball, she now makes Obama look very weak if he selects her as VP.

Plus there is the problem that McCain will endlessly quote Clinton against Obama if she is on the ticket.

[Rovermatt]

I don't think she will be on the ticket to be honest. Obama's no idiot and understands the baggage she brings. In any case it's his call now and no end of political jockeying from Clinton will ensure her and Bill's place as VP.

A question (if I may) for our American members: who are you going to plump for in November?

[Flopsy]

I think that Hillary wont get the VP ticket, not because she wouldnt be good at it, but because it'll be hard enough to get swing voters to come out for a black candidate, let alone a black candidate with a female running mate who's Hillary Clinton.

I think they could cope with one or the other, but not both. Does my broad sweeping stereotyping do a great diservice?

[American]

The interesting part is, Rev Wright aside, Obama has transcended race. I don't view him as the African-American candidate, I view him as the northern liberal with a message of change.

The interesting thing about Obama is that I don't agree with most of what he stands for, but I am going to vote for him (unless he picks Hillary). For the first time in my life, I find myself agreeing with Michael Moore:

Moore writes that Obama's experience and voting record isn't as important as his "basic decency" and ability to inspire.

"What we are witnessing is not just a candidate but a profound, massive public movement for change", Moore writes. "My endorsement is more for Obama The Movement than it is for Obama the candidate."

I'm sick of voting for the lesser of 2 evils and am glad to have found a true leader who inspires.

[Flopsy]

Good, shame we havent got anything like that over here, I suppose NuLabour was that in '97, it worked out well

[Rovermatt]

The interesting part is, Rev Wright aside, Obama has transcended race. I don't view him as the African-American candidate, I view him as the northern liberal with a message of change.

The interesting thing about Obama is that I don't agree with most of what he stands for, but I am going to vote for him (unless he picks Hillary).

In what ways do you disagree with Obama? Do you know others who will take the same attitude and vote for him based on his persona rather than his views?

[Eddie]

I really don't like all this change nonsense. It's all the same stuff, different packaging.

George Bush aside...he was damaged goods.

[rog of the rovers]

Heard Obama's speech last night and too be fair I found it incredibly boring. Where was this supposed charisma?

I think Hilary will be a part of the cabinet, or a senior official, but not the Vice president. I always liked John Edwards, and he's clearly an Obama fan, I think he'd be the perfect running mate, and a potential president in 8 years time. He's everything that American's love, a good christian from a small town in South Carolina.

I know he was Kerry's running mate, and was criticised for lack of experience, but his experience must be a positive now.

[USRoverME]

Personally, I don't think I can ever put Bill C high on a list of "greatest presidents ever" regardless of what he did on his wife's campaign trail. But then again, a lot of that is because I feel he was stagnant on some issues that are of importance to me, and went too far with some policies I disgree with. I think he looks much better in the rearview mirror in contrast to his predecessor, who can make anyone look good. If I had to rank them right now, I'm positive Clinton isn't in the top 5 preisdents, and likely outside the top 10. But then again everyone's view is different. But I'll be glad once its confirmed that Bill won't be in the White house again.

Personally, this will be the most difficult presidential decision I've had in a while. Washington is broke, can Obama actually fix it? If I end up thinking yes... I might go for him, but if I had to vote today, its McCain. His Iraq policy is not "100 years of war" as the media likes to spin it. He's certainly not 4 more years of George Bush. I've been convinced that McCain is the type of person who will "cross the aisle" to do what he thinks is right, which is something I hold in high regard. But then again, McCain is just about my "perfect storm" in terms of credentials right now, a veteran, moderate conservative with experience and the aforementioned "willingness to do what's right" even if its in the face of the party line.

[American]

My big problem with McCain is that he masquerades as a Republican, but he is pro-big government on too many issues. Who the heck is he to tell Baseball how to run its business? Who is he to tell people how much they can donate to an election? We think the Patriot Act is taking away our freedoms now, it will be nothing compared to what he will be willing to do.

[Eddie]

I'm left wing and I'm pro-big government but anti-patriot act. Don't think the government should be involved in baseball, simply because it doesn't matter, but I do think that a limit should be put on the amount you can donate to an election and the amount candidates can use. Think of the millions upon millions that has been wasted just so to win your vote? Not even for the actual election...

I'd also echo the fact that McCain's willingness to look beyond party politics and choose the policy he himself most believes in makes him something of a rare candidate, even if it looks as if he's had to temper this in order to gain support. At this moment in time I would vote for him. The Iraq War is the most important issue for me and his policy in this area is the one I most agree with, we simply cannot withdraw until we have established at least some form of government and stability, it is our mess. A close second to that is the enviroment and the economy, where neither candidate particularly impresses me although Obama would shave it.