[Archived] Let's Have Fun!

[Fife Rover]

fife if we hadnt taken risks in the cup we could have been at wembley

I see, so are you blaming Treacy for that failure by the whole team to show any semblance of team work, or even will to win? How many people had been slaughtering MGP for months prior to that, and calling for Treacy to be given a chance?

[LeChuck]

Anyone who'd seen the reserves, would'nt even have considered starting this topic.

Derbyshire wasn't standing out for the reserves though was he?

Personally I think two players should be given a number of games between now and the end of the season; Kane** and Treacy. Most of us have acknowledged the need for a specialist right-back, so seeing if Kane is up to the job could save us money and time in the summer. Apparently he impressed on loan at Cercle Brugge (aren't they top division in Belgium?), picking up some man of the match awards, and he's been included in the Northern Irish full squad and has played for both Northern and Republic of Ireland U21 sides. He has a decent pedigree, I'd hate to think we'd bring in a right-sided version of Berner in the summer before trying Kane first.

Treacy might not have played well against Coventry, but it would be ridiculous to expect him to out-perform the seasoned regulars, the entire team was atrocious that day. As with the right-back situation, it's obvious to most of us that Pedersen needs seem competition, so unless Peter comes back on the radar we should persevere with Treacy for a few games and see what he can do. Again, if he's up to it we've saved ourselves a lot of money and hassle in the summer.

Even if it appears they're not up to Premiership standard, simply playing them for a few games will up their value massively. As Jon Douglas showed, simply playing Premiership football and being young will give you a decent sale value, regardless of how well you actually play. It's a shame we don't have any central midfielders on the verge of the first team, as that's the other (and probably most important) problem position.

fife if we hadnt taken risks in the cup we could have been at wembley

You're actually trying to blame a 4-1 defeat on Treacy? Who else in that line-up did you consider a 'risk'? Edit: Forgot Rigters played that game, neither can be held responsible for the team conceding four goals though.

**Edit: If there's ever a reason for trying Kane, HERE IT IS! Specifically, from that article:

The Australian international had missed the draw against Fulham the previous weekend, but returned to action against West Ham United on Saturday only to be replaced at half-time by Zurab Khizanishvili.

Not that I think Zurab is a bad player, but as we have seen, a replacement for Emerton he is not. Kane could never be worse than Zurab was at City.

[ABBEY]

am i hell blaming treacy?where did i say that?

[Fife Rover]

am i hell blaming treacy?where did i say that?

Well which particular risks in the form of playing youngsters were you referring to Abbs?

[LeChuck]

You blamed it on taking risks, and Treacy was the only major risk (probably Rigters as well, I forgot about him when I made that post initially).

[American]

treacy wasnt being targeted? where you there ? i was and he was slaughtered!!!

MGP was also slaughtered when he first came here - OK, maybe a bad example!

And Den, I see how blooding a youngster really caused WHam to lose a match....

[stuwilky]

What I reckon we should do is play all the kids and find out that none of them are good enough, then I think we should moan in the summer when we dont spend any money, and we have to sell simply to break even because we lost 4 places in the league, worth however many millions we might have spent.

[ABBEY]

What I reckon we should do is play all the kids and find out that none of them are good enough, then I think we should moan in the summer when we dont spend any money, and we have to sell simply to break even because we lost 4 places in the league, worth however many millions we might have spent.

thats more or less what i was implying ,mind you its not like chucky to jump on everything i say thogh is it?

[den]

There isn't the slightest suggestion that any of the youngsters are anywhere near good enough for the premier league.

It's also interesting that in the main, the people wanting some of the kids in the first team are people who haven't seen any of the youngsters play, wont have to watch the first team when and if they do play - nor can they say, reasonably, which of the kids are ready. It's easy to pick a name from a list and put it forward, anyone can do that, - yet hughes obviously doesn't see anything even remotely worth consideration. Nor do I.

[LeChuck]

I can't remember the last time I replied to anything you wrote Abbey, but apologies if you think I'm doing that.

Having said that, you've neatly avoided answering who the 'risks' were.

[ABBEY]

wasnt avoiding anything chuck , just think that by cramming kids in so early in the season is a recipe for disaster just as not playing a full strenght team in the cup cost us mega.

[ABBEY]

There isn't the slightest suggestion that any of the youngsters are anywhere near good enough for the premier league.

It's also interesting that in the main, the people wanting some of the kids in the first team are people who haven't seen any of the youngsters play, wont have to watch the first team when and if they do play - nor can they say, reasonably, which of the kids are ready. It's easy to pick a name from a list and put it forward, anyone can do that, - yet hughes obviously doesn't see anything even remotely worth consideration. Nor do I.

and if he did he would.

[Fife Rover]

Hmmmmm! What's the title of this thread? "Let's Have Fun"; we are certainly doing that aren't we?

[stuwilky]

thats more or less what i was implying ,mind you its not like chucky to jump on everything i say thogh is it?

It doesnt really matter who says it, or who doesn't.

I cant think of a single reserve player who is good enough (in my entirely untrained opinion) for top flight football, admittedly its been a few months since I watched them last but I dont believe the staff at Brockhall to be miracle workers.

Perhaps it would be fun to watch, but the financial risks are untold.

[American]

Did you think Derbs was good enough Stu?

[stuwilky]

Did you think Derbs was good enough Stu?

No, and I still dont believe he is either. Not for where we want to be.

He may pop up with a goal occasionally, but IMHO he is not be a 15+ goal a season striker YET. He might be in the future.

Of course, that is me trying to be rational, Id absolutely love it if I was wrong, a local kid popping goals in for fun before walking home after the match. The stuff of dreams.

[Claytons Left Boot]

How come West Ham weren't slaughtered given that they gave a debut to a young lad?

Still waiting.................

[philipl]

To quote a West Ham contributor somewhere, Sears had been scoring for fun at every level they played him at.

It comes back to the issue that the young players closest to breaking into the Rovers first team have been suspended or injured when the possibilities might have been there and rest ain't up to it at the moment.

The Coventry experience points to the stupidity of playing a weakened side at any time in any competition. We should have gone into that game with the strongest side possible and we could have been contemplating winning the FA Cup now.

[ABBEY]

To quote a West Ham contributor somewhere, Sears had been scoring for fun at every level they played him at.

It comes back to the issue that the young players closest to breaking into the Rovers first team have been suspended or injured when the possibilities might have been there and rest ain't up to it at the moment.

The Coventry experience points to the stupidity of playing a weakened side at any time in any competition. We should have gone into that game with the strongest side possible and we could have been contemplating winning the FA Cup now.

dont often agree with you but thats what i was saying....we COULD?SHOULD ? be at wembley in the big one or at least the semis v pomps

[M-K]

Surely there are other people who see our position in a fairly positive, stress free way?

Our survey says...

X

[Billy Castell]

It was worth a try. Get back to moaning and stressing then you lot, since that's what you all love. What a miserable, negative bunch you are. Deep down you want to go the same way as Bradford and float around the 3rd division with no money, just so you can take comfort in your team being rubbish. And you want it to rain every day, have your house broken into, have a crazy Muslim extremist move in next door etc. All this so you can say, 'well my life is crap, so why bother'.

I was diagnosed with clinical depression when I was 13 and I seem happier than most here! Come on, let's enjoy our football, its not like one of our family will be killed after the loss to West Ham. We're in the top division, are not in trillions of £ of debt, and don't have Vladimir Romanov as our owner.

[Claytons Left Boot]

To quote a West Ham contributor somewhere, Sears had been scoring for fun at every level they played him at.

I agree that Sears is probably better than most of our prospects from the youth/reserves but that's not the point. The argument that ensued was that if we were to play say one youth player, we would get slaughtered and I do not see how that could be the case.

[rover6]

Anyone who'd seen the reserves, would'nt even have considered starting this topic.

That's the thing about the reserves. The conditions are everything against showcasing talent. The pitch is generally poor, the weather conditions are nearly always terrible, the opposition are full of cloggers. Furthermore, the reserves play once a blue moon - there is no opportunity to build any continuity of performance (aka form) and with the line-up shifting every time, there's hardly opportunity to create any team unity.

You can't really judge players on reserve games - unless, perhaps, you watch a whole season or two. People were saying that MGP was worse that Javi De Pedro on the basis of reserve games. Matt Derbyshire was a lightweight little-hoper etc.

A young Damien Duff would shine in almost any condition. But we're not looking for Duffs - we're looking for Derbyshires. That is, players who aren't genii but can make a useful impression on the first team, given a chance.

(Den, you asked, I would like to see Kane or Nolan given an opportunity. They're amongst the seniors at reserve level, both have had spells on loan and they're regulars for their relative U21 international sides. This is especially impressive of Nolan because his favoured position is CB but he plays RB for Ireland. WHy not have one of these guys on the bench to make 5/10 minute sub appearances in games to build their confidences? Hughes rates them because they've been given extended contracts - so when can they get their chance?)

This isn't a case of plucking names out of the air. It's a belief that the club should follow a systematic policy of positive integration of youth players. The best performing reserve players should, by right, get first team opportunities. If they don't impress, they leave. There shouldn't be this nonsense of keeping players into the early 20s with no first team appearances.

[ABBEY]

This isn't a case of plucking names out of the air.

how do you make this decision then? cm? guesswork?? im confused as you never go to any rovers game im just curious thats all.Fair do's i know you can watch 1st games online or telly but how do you see reserve games?paul sturrock springs to mind

[USABlue]

We were heading for at least a draw at WHam until what happened? A youngster made his first team debut and scored the winner for them! Would that have happened if Curbishley had not taken the risk and stuck with the old tried and tested? We will never know the answer to that, but we do know his gamble cost us 3 points.

Wouldn't it be 1 point cost us if we were heading for a draw??? Sorry, feeling all nit picky today