[Archived] Roque Santa Cruz Thread

[Hughesy]

Cant see him leaving in January, unless we got a crazy £20m+ offer, which I doubt will happen.

[broadsword]

The board would never allow it, surely they could see that if Roque goes, rovers go (down).

We're in deep enough doo-doo as it is, with no Bentley, no Friedel.

Cant see him leaving in January, unless we got a crazy £20m+ offer, which I doubt will happen.

Why wouldn't a £20m+ offer happen?

City are swimming in cash.

[Hughesy]

They offered an amazing £8m for him at the end of the last window, why would their valuation of him (after a few niggling injuries) just of jumped 150%?

[broadsword]

I don't remember that offer? Where was that reported?

I doubt, if they did offer £8m, that they'd just increase it to 20 plus, they're not divots. But they'd just keep on coming back with increased offers.

if the reports that they want him are true of course.

The point I was trying to make is that 20 mill is just a few barrels of oil to City. They won't blink at 20 mill, if they really want Cruz, and he's top of tehir list.

[Hughesy]

Yeah I agree they are loaded but I just dont see them paying what we value him at, so it might be a game of cat a mouse, where the cat eventually gets the mouse, but maybe not until the summer.

It was reported in the press as a £12m offer, nicko told us the truth was that it was only £8m.

[broadsword]

Well, let's hope it doesn't happen, at least not in Jan, because things are bad enough now. If Cruz goes, we're screwed.

[philipl]

Yeah I agree they are loaded but I just dont see them paying what we value him at, so it might be a game of cat a mouse, where the cat eventually gets the mouse, but maybe not until the summer.

It was reported in the press as a £12m offer, nicko told us the truth was that it was only £8m.

That offer was made when Thakson was there and they were flogging players off behind Hughes' back. My guess is it was little more than a PR stunt at Rovers expense.

Now they are owned by ADUG and since they offered £35m for Berbatov and splashed £32m for Robinho, it is a whole new ball game.

[broadsword]

Ah, Hughesy had me believing that that 8 mill offer was made by ADUG.

In that case then, if they really do want him, they aren't going to p*** about with an 8 mill offer. They'd probably initiall offer double that.

[Majiball]

I have to say I'm expecting a bid in Jan, and a tempting one. If they think Jo's worth 18M then what price RSC, well have we not already named our price? 18M I believe was quoted in one article.

As we all know selling RSC in Jan is a no brainer, it will cost us. But there is another angle, RSC is not doing the business we are not playing to his strengths. I wonder whether he is enjoying his football at the moment? 20M+ could plug a lot of the holes we have at the moment, but I lack faith in Ince to spend it correctly.

Personally if they do bid 20M or so I think we will be waving goodbye to him.

I'm not convinced that our current striking options fit in with the style of football Ince is trying to play. We do not create openings in the final third, I think its partly down to the strikers lack of movement. We currently retain the ball well in phases but just can't open them up. RSC will always play centrally he should its his game, but when you add in another striker IE Roberts who's doing the same you limit yourselves. Our best front two in recent years was Benni and Roberts at the tail end of 06/07, Benni wonders all over the place, Roberts stayed in the middle.

At the end of the day the RSC situation is irrelevant, the manager situation must be sorted first which ever way its going to go. That will dictate what happens to RSC.

[Hughesy]

I think a bid is a gaurantee - it purely depends on the substance of the offer. I know our position, but surely £20m+ has to be looked at seriously.

Would people be happy for the club to sell Roque for say £20m if we could spend the money wisely and sign 2 good strikers of say Martins/ Bellamy/ Ashtons level of ability?

[John]

As much as Roque is a nice guy, he won't enjoy being in a relegation scrap. I know he has been injured, but I think enjoyment is a key factor for him.

Hopefully we can keep him until the summer.

[Manc Rover]

I think a bid is a gaurantee - it purely depends on the substance of the offer. I know our position, but surely £20m+ has to be looked at seriously.

Would people be happy for the club to sell Roque for say £20m if we could spend the money wisely and sign 2 good strikers of say Martins/ Bellamy/ Ashtons level of ability?

The guy was immense for us last season but for one reason and another, he has been below par this season. Is this down to injuries, form or the fact that we don't create chances like we did when Bentley was here? As for spending the money wisely, forget it! We probably won't see much of it on players and end up getting some lower league no mark or trialist that nobody has ever heard of. Therefore, I would not be happy to sell him for the above reasons.

[joey_big_nose]

Seeing as we should already have 6-10m to spend on players from the summer sales, we don't really need to sell to buy. Plus one of our biggest challenges has been continuity.

Even a massive offer for Roque should be resisted till the summer because we cannot affor to chop and change too much. End of Jan to start of May is only 3 and a bit months. If Roque wants to go (which I don't think he neccessarily will unless it is a CL club that comes in) I think we can hold on to him against his will for that one and he will need to play for a move.

So I am not too worried. His current form also is likely to ward off offers of 12m+ imo (which we will reject anyway), and I suspect Hughes may not get the backing he wants for players who are not big names like Cruz and Warnock. They will be looking to dine on a higher table, and Hughes could be sacked in three weeks anyway.

[gumboots]

I think a bid is a gaurantee - it purely depends on the substance of the offer. I know our position, but surely £20m+ has to be looked at seriously.

Would people be happy for the club to sell Roque for say £20m if we could spend the money wisely and sign 2 good strikers of say Martins/ Bellamy/ Ashtons level of ability?

If it's 2 of those 3 then no. Not because ability and variety wise it might not be a good idea but remind me when Ashton or Bellamy last played a run of games and I don't see newcastle selling Martins because they don't need to. If you just mean that sort of level and type of player, not specifically them, then still no because what we'd be looking at would be unproven in the premiership as they'd probably be foreign imports, with all the potential they bring but also all the possible problems with them not settling. I appreciate it may well be what we have to go for, but if you're asking me, then no way.

[philipl]

What is always forgotten by supporters are wages.

For Rovers to be OK as a Premier League side for the foreseeable future wages and income have to be kept in balance.

Yes we might be able to sell RSC for £20m and buy two of the suggested list. But the wages would be probably 2.5 times what we are paying Roque and that is a total no-no for the Rovers.

And every transfer involves a 15%+ leakage in fees for the player/agent.

[Hughesy]

Roque - Say £20m fee and £60k a week wage

Fowler - Get rid and save £5k a week + his performance wage

2 players of the sort of level I was talking, not necessarily them. If its a foreigner or two then the wages would be lower, surely? I reckon we could get 2 good strikers in for a total of £80k a week. With the cash we must have from summer then surely its possible if Roque was to leave??

Come on Philip, not that long ago you was telling us we could afford Alonso.

[philipl]

Roque - Say £20m fee and £60k a week wage

Fowler - Get rid and save £5k a week + his performance wage

2 players of the sort of level I was talking, not necessarily them. If its a foreigner or two then the wages would be lower, surely? I reckon we could get 2 good strikers in for a total of £80k a week. With the cash we must have from summer then surely its possible if Roque was to leave??

Come on Philip, not that long ago you was telling us we could afford Alonso.

You are talking the proverbials here

Martins £85K per week

Bellamy £75k per week

One player on Alonso's £70k a week perhaps but do not go thinking that £60k = £85k + £75k which is what you were suggesting.

No way are you going to get a proven goal scoring Premiership forward on less than £60k a week.

Putting this into context, Roque costs us £3.5m a year and Martins and Bellamy together would cost us £9m a year by the time NI is added. That is in the face of a probable reduction in matchday and commercial revenue of £3m a year and a loss of Sky prize money (assuming Ince can drag himself into work to help lift us one place) of £7.5m.

Doesn't work.

Just as with Bentley, it is bonkers both from a playing standpoint and an economic standpoint for Rovers to lose their best players.

[CrazyIvan]

(assuming Ince can drag himself into work to help lift us one place)

Why did you put this in your post? I can only think of one reason. Trolling...

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

What a desperate situation the club will be in if Cruz is allowed to leave in January....god help us all with the bumbling Roberts leading the attack!

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Seems to me there's no smoke without fire. If he does wants to leave the club has a big decision to make- A) Make him adhere to his contract until the summer at least ( My option). Sell him and hand the money to Ince to fritter away on no-marks who most of us have either never heard of or forgotten were still playing. That's your choices folks.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

Relax ...... Hughes won't be at City come January......Fingers crossed

[allanncd]

Selling Roque in January would be even worse than the needless sale of Sherwood exactly 10 years earlier and we all know where that led to. That ranked as the worst decision Kidd made. The player must be held to his contract at least until the summer. There is far more to lose financially but not doing so.

[47er]

Selling Roque in January would be even worse than the needless sale of Sherwood exactly 10 years earlier and we all know where that led to. That ranked as the worst decision Kidd made. The player must be held to his contract at least until the summer. There is far more to lose financially but not doing so.

Should have hung onto Bentley for another year as well or at least till we had a replacement. 3 years to go on his contract meant his value in the transfer markey wouldn't have slipped.And if he sulked then he should have been left out till he didn't. I think he'd have come round to keep his England place.

[LeChuck]

What a desperate situation the club will be in if Cruz is allowed to leave in January....god help us all with the bumbling Roberts leading the attack!

There's absolutely no way we can keep a top class striker if we're struggling against relegation in January.

Given Carew's injury and attitude problems, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see Villa come in with a serious bid for him given that the top four is in sight for them this season.

[philipl]

There's absolutely no way we can keep a top class striker if we're struggling against relegation in January.

Given Carew's injury and attitude problems, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see Villa come in with a serious bid for him given that the top four is in sight for them this season.

It will take a lot more resolution and guile than the management tried with Bentley- I can just imagine RSC's agent getting him practising insouciant folding of his arms!

Back to more serious worries. On Sunday we will (hopefully) see an opposition without anyone capable of getting on the end of crosses into the box.... hopefully Spurs' spending money is all going on the new stadium or they could be joining the list of bidders.