[Archived] Nicko's Thread Part 3

[Blue n White Rover]

That's your opinion.

Personally I don't think appointing someone who's spent every season but-one managing Dutch also-rans qualifies as 'imaginative and exciting'. History shows that appointing people based on what a club achieved during their stint as assistant is a terrible move. Take away Barcelona and Chelsea from his CV and what is really there? Precious little in my opinion.

The fact is you can't take away his achievements with Chelsea and Barcelona. Avram Grant would not have gone this far without his help.

Take away Fergie at Man U and what does he have on his CV?

[nicko]

That's your opinion.

Personally I don't think appointing someone who's spent every season but-one managing Dutch also-rans qualifies as 'imaginative and exciting'. History shows that appointing people based on what a club achieved during their stint as assistant is a terrible move. Take away Barcelona and Chelsea from his CV and what is really there? Precious little in my opinion.

Well if they pick Big Sam don't complain...

Would he be in the running for the Panathinaikos job I wonder?

[Brownie]

Brian Kidd never was a manager.

Steve McClaren was manager of Middlesbrough and England.

It's not a comparison with Ten Cate.

Ten Cate was the power at Barca and Chelsea - Kidd and McClaren were happy to bask in Fergie's glories.

No comparison at all.

And he IS the original 'Nicko Ripsnorter' !

[leftfooter]

Brian Kidd never was a manager.

Steve McClaren was manager of Middlesbrough and England.

It's not a comparison with Ten Cate.

Ten Cate was the power at Barca and Chelsea - Kidd and McClaren were happy to bask in Fergie's glories.

No comparison at all.

It's just a cheap rhetorical ploy by LeChuck to avoid answering the question Nix; he knows if he answered it yes or no he looks stupid either way, so he makes an inane statement disguised as a question.

[iamarover]

Shearer cut HIS tie with Rovers years ago - He know longer likes Rovers supporters, he said as much a few years ago when playing for newcastle against Rovers when he was booed throughout the game.

He said words to the effect that he gave his heart to the club when he played for Rovers and was disgusted with the way he was treated on his return to ewood in a newcastle shirt etc. I believe he said at the time "thats it as far as I am concerned with Blackburn"

Anyway he is happy to stay with the B lackburn B ashers C lub

And he, at the time, was right. That was a disgraceful way for Rovers fans to treat what was the greatest player ever to don the Halves. And we spat in his face because he went back to his home town club..... Appalling.

But the way he has played this has been similarly galling. What must Tommy Craig and Mike Newell be thinking after being dangled the big time and then arrogantly snatched from them? No. Never return to the scene of the crime. And so it has proved.

Who now? It just has to be Bilic.... He has that Sparky feeling to him. Admittedly he has probably one eye on the West Ham job but I have a feeling he would snatch at this one. He loves England and our football. He is a Rover in the making.

[deftangel]

Take away Barcelona and Chelsea from his CV and what is really there? Precious little in my opinion.

Take away Bolton from Allardyce's career and what has he done?

[LeChuck]

The number of comments on this thread along the lines of "BFS is the best because he can guarantee survival"

Not that I particularly want him, but far from being "guarantee us survival", it is "guarantee to compete for European places" because that's what his Bolton record shows.

I'm amazed that people think 6 months at a club in a terrible state like Newcastle should be taken more notice of than the four outstanding years that preceded it at Bolton.

[RovertheHill]

That's your opinion.

Personally I don't think appointing someone who's spent every season but-one managing Dutch also-rans qualifies as 'imaginative and exciting'. History shows that appointing people based on what a club achieved during their stint as assistant is a terrible move. Take away Barcelona and Chelsea from his CV and what is really there? Precious little in my opinion.

I believe a certain Mr Mourinho started life as a translator before moving up ever-so-slightly. It's about the person themselves so quoting Kidd is as irrelevant as you think HTC's record as assistant is.

[LeChuck]

Take away Bolton from Allardyce's career and what has he done?

How does that even make sense?

What BFS achieved at Bolton is incredibly relevant, in fact it's probably the most relevant thing any candidate will have on their CV.

What was achieved at clubs whilst Ten Cate was assistant is completely irrelevant.

[Dunnfc]

Landrup has seriously got to be 1st choice now and thanks to Shearer Rovers look an embaressment and look to have cocked things up.

Landrup,

Bilic,

Zico,

Antic,

Martinez,

Correa,

Blanc,

BFS

Have all surely got to be talked to in my opinion.

[nicko]

Big Sam's Bolton record was:

Play-off defeat, play-off win, beat the drop, just beat the drop, mid-table, flirted with the top six and made Europe, slumped back, started dipping...quit after moaning too much.

Checking for the Champions League finals in there and the surprise title successes in unknown places.

Still looking...can someone help.

[spencey7]

To quote my earlier post regarding managerial experience and honours LeChuck (the point of which was to highlight how embarassing it is for Blackburn to even be considering Allardyce when Ten Cate is interested):

This appointment will ultimately come down to how Blackburn Rovers Football Club see's itself in the coming years. Will it be about economy, survival (hopefully) and "accepting our station"? Or about daring to dream what this small town club could achieve?

By the way, Ten Cate when IN CHARGE of Ajax led them to joint-top of the league, missing out on the title by one goal. He won the Dutch Cup the same season. During his time - in his own words - Ajax "played 41 games, gained 92 points and scored over a hundred goals."

I think our squad is as good as what he had at Ajax. Bring him in.

Here's the key question LeChuck - Why is Ten Cate's record "irrelevant", but not Allardyce's miserable failure at Newcastle?

[LeChuck]

I believe a certain Mr Mourinho started life as a translator before moving up ever-so-slightly. It's about the person themselves so quoting Kidd is as irrelevant as you think HTC's record as assistant is.

You're right, he did. Then he made his name at a small Portuguese club, before showing how excellent he was at Porto. Mourinho was still a young up-and-coming manager when Chelsea appointed him.

If Ten Cate had anything about him wouldn't he have achieved something in his own right before being 53 years old? His managerial certainly suggests he's nothing 'special', I'm not even sure how you can draw comparisons with Mourinho.

[RovertheHill]

Big Sam's Bolton record was:

Play-off defeat, play-off win, beat the drop, just beat the drop, mid-table, flirted with the top six and made Europe, slumped back, started dipping...quit after moaning too much.

Checking for the Champions League finals in there and the surprise title successes in unknown places.

Still looking...can someone help.

Probably in a brown paper bag in the office safe ...

[nicko]

You're right, he did. Then he made his name at a small Portuguese club, before showing how excellent he was at Porto. Mourinho was still a young up-and-coming manager when Chelsea appointed him.

If Ten Cate had anything about him wouldn't he have achieved something in his own right before being 53 years old? His managerial certainly suggests he's nothing 'special', I'm not even sure how you can draw comparisons with Mourinho.

Did Mourinho make a Champions League final?

[Blue n White Rover]

Big Sam's Bolton record was:

Play-off defeat, play-off win, beat the drop, just beat the drop, mid-table, flirted with the top six and made Europe, slumped back, started dipping...quit after moaning too much.

Checking for the Champions League finals in there and the surprise title successes in unknown places.

Still looking...can someone help.

http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/1290700.jpg...930FDCFC4C15FBB

Better than the CL in my opinion

[LeChuck]

Big Sam's Bolton record was:

Play-off defeat, play-off win, beat the drop, just beat the drop, mid-table, flirted with the top six and made Europe, slumped back, started dipping...quit after moaning too much.

Checking for the Champions League finals in there and the surprise title successes in unknown places.

Still looking...can someone help.

You managed to make four years as a top-eight side sound like it was a blip, when in fact it was by far the most sustained period in all of that.

I'm also checking for Champions League finals and title successes on Ten Cate's managerial CV. Still looking...

Found some on Rijkaard's and Avram Grant's...

[philipl]

spencey7's post above your's is a very solid reply LeChuck.

[LeChuck]

Did Mourinho make a Champions League final?

He won it.

What's your point?

[iamarover]

Well if they pick Big Sam don't complain...

Would he be in the running for the Panathinaikos job I wonder?

No he wouldnt...

But didnt the Chelsea players hate Ten Cate? My worry is that this pretty aggressive bear man could upset the Rovers applecart. How would he approach Bentley? I take your point that sometimes these overpaid dilettantes need a kicking, but is that attitude really only appropriate at Ajax, Barca or Chelsea? Bilic seems more a players man... and ... what happened at Ajax? Was he popular? Seems a strange move Ajax no.1 to Chelsea no.2. Never explained. Looks wrong.

[spencey7]

spencey7's post above your's is a very solid reply LeChuck.

That's why I don't expect a reply....

[nicko]

No he wouldnt...

But didnt the Chelsea players hate Ten Cate? My worry is that this pretty aggressive bear man could upset the Rovers applecart. How would he approach Bentley? I take your point that sometimes these overpaid dilettantes need a kicking, but is that attitude really only appropriate at Ajax, Barca or Chelsea? Bilic seems more a players man... and ... what happened at Ajax? Was he popular? Seems a strange move Ajax no.1 to Chelsea no.2. Never explained. Looks wrong.

He had scrapes with some of the Chelsea players - did that stop them going all the way last season? Somebody had to have a word. It worked, but didn't make him long-term allies at the club which cost him a little in the end.

Ten Cate left Ajax because they had let him down with their promises of spending. He went to Chelsea because the 'Dutch' element at the club knew how good he was.

Maybe they didn't have Sam's number...he was about to start his long spell out of work at roughly the same time.

[LeChuck]

To quote my earlier post regarding managerial experience and honours LeChuck (the point of which was to highlight how embarassing it is for Blackburn to even be considering Allardyce when Ten Cate is interested):

By the way, Ten Cate when IN CHARGE of Ajax led them to joint-top of the league, missing out on the title by one goal. He won the Dutch Cup the same season. During his time - in his own words - Ajax "played 41 games, gained 92 points and scored over a hundred goals."

I think our squad is as good as what he had at Ajax. Bring him in.

Here's the key question LeChuck - Why is Ten Cate's record "irrelevant", but not Allardyce's miserable failure at Newcastle?

I'm getting tired now, I think I might give in after this...

The Dutch league isn't comparable to ours. Ajax's squad might be as good as ours, but then they're not facing the quality of teams we are every week. Ajax in our league wouldn't finish with over a hundred goals and joint top.

Ten Cate's record is irrelevant because he was an assistant, they're not his achievements. History shows appointing assistants on the back of another managers success is ludicrous. Allardyce's failure isn't irrelevant, I just don't think 6 months at a club in a mess should outweigh four fantastic years before that.

[LeChuck]

That's why I don't expect a reply....

My eyes skipped over it because my post wasn't quoted, I didn't realise it was directed at me when glancing through.

[RevidgeBlue]

Disappointed by the Shearer news even though I was expecting it.

I previously stated my view that Shearer would politely listen to what we had to say then politely decline - which is exactly what has happened.

It must however be worrying that he's chosen to withdraw without even getting to the formal interview stage. Pretty grim news on the budget front I reckon.

If we miss out on Ince as is starting to look possible then imo the field is looking extremely thin. Ten Cate couldn't be more wrong for us in our current delicate position imo.

It's starting to point more and more towards Allardyce imo and really we were told a week ago in the tabloids that he was John Williams first choice. Could have got him in straightaway and avoided this interview process charade.