[Archived] Stepping Stone Or Mersonaries

[cravenblue]

as we have now seen sparky go and ultimately used rovers as a stepping stone to bigger things, would people prefer our next manager or players to use us as a stepping stone, meaning we are being succesful, or a club that attracts players at the end of their careers using rovers as the last big pay day?

[Rovermatt]

I don't want Paul Merson as manager. He'd be rubbish.

[yoda]

as we have now seen sparky go and ultimately used rovers as a stepping stone to bigger things, would people prefer our next manager or players to use us as a stepping stone, meaning we are being succesful, or a club that attracts players at the end of their careers using rovers as the last big pay day?

Why has it to be those 2 choices?

[cravenblue]

because thats the type of club we are and always will be unfortunately

[RovertheHill]

I think we all need to stop talking about loyalty in football - the ONLY loyal people are the fans - the rest are employees who have other motivations. The days of a Bob Paisley or a Matt LeTissier are probably long gone. So yes, we are probably a stepping stone but let's put it into perspective - we are relatively near the top of the pile - there are lot more in worse positions than us. And frankly, everybody is a stepping stone of sorts. If Ronaldo goes to Real Madrid you could argue he's used Man U as a stepping stone. Bit different I know but the same real point - everybody moves around in football these days.

[S15]

When Man Utd have to hold off interest for best players, I think it shows we cannot sulk too much.

There is always a foodchain, it's just annoying to feel as if you've been ambushed by a similar species.

[Mr. E]

I want someone who is loyal and feels passionate about Rovers. Why is this such a crime to ask?

[b12_simon]

I want someone who is loyal and feels passionate about Rovers. Why is this such a crime to ask?

It's not a crime, it's just unrealistic. The game's changed and that change happened long before MH asked to be allowed to talk to Citeh.

[RoversFanUSA]

I'd play for them if they'd have me. Im passionate about Rovers! Id play for them cheap to..

[Flopsy]

you say that now

to the fans its a religion, as a player/manager, its a job.

[jim mk2]

Is a "Mersonary" a member of Paul Merson's family or a dyslexic mercenary ?

[ElTwis]

It's not a crime, it's just unrealistic. The game's changed and that change happened long before MH asked to be allowed to talk to Citeh.

Very true, players, managers, coaches....in reality, and with the odd exception, aren't bothered about the club or the fans. Thats modern football.

[Mr. E]

Very true, players, managers, coaches....in reality, and with the odd exception, aren't bothered about the club or the fans. Thats modern football.

But as I asked in my other thread...then what exactly are we supporting? What is Blackburn Rovers except the people who work for it? Is it not the football team and the manager that shape and define what the club is about?

[Drummer Boy]

But as I asked in my other thread...then what exactly are we supporting? What is Blackburn Rovers except the people who work for it? Is it not the football team and the manager that shape and define what the club is about?

A football club is an institution - it is bigger than the players or manager of the day and is an intrinsic fabric of the town/city in which it is based. The fans are probably the only constant - with most clubs these are born not created; however, there are exceptions (cf big four whose fans have no such affiliation with the town of their birth). We are supporting an expression of local affiliation or an affiliation/empathy with a particular club and the club reflects its origins and its fanbase. To give an idea, I'm a BRFC supporter and will be whoever is the manager be it Mark Hughes or Mark Lamarr. I may comment adversely on the appointment of the latter and criticise the board in extremis; however, I will still be a Rovers fan. That's just the way it is, isn't it?

[roversWASmylife]

Its a job for players, if another company was to double your wages in a year, would you take it?

I would.

[RovertheHill]

Its a job for players, if another company was to double your wages in a year, would you take it?

I would.

Interesting question. In general - yes I would. If it involved working for someone, shall we say, with a bit of a murky past as far as human rights is concerned then I wouldn't. But hey, that's just my opinion

[American]

Very true, players, managers, coaches....in reality, and with the odd exception, aren't bothered about the club or the fans. Thats modern football.

Not saying that you are making this point (wouldn't want to say that and make someone go into a snit), but I think the loyalty wouldn't have been their before bosman, that it was just a forced loyalty. They were so underpaid before that a lot of them needed second jobs.

In many cases the spending goes too far (like a neighboring club who pays 102% of turnover in wages for a midtable squad), but at least the players have choice now. For everyone that says they would play for their hometown team, remember that Paul Scholes doesn't play for Oldham (that's his boyhood club, right?) even though he could, at much less pay and less honors.

[promoted2001]

You cant blame players or managers. Its a job for them. They probably enjoy it but there are very few players who are 100% loyal to their team and will never leave. Remember when Rooney pulled up his everton shirt to reveal "Once a blue, always a blue"? We all know how that ended. I have no loyalty to my job, if i get offered more money i take it, simple as.

Players and managers are the same and fair play to them. We may not like it but its the way it is.

[stuwilky]

But as I asked in my other thread...then what exactly are we supporting? What is Blackburn Rovers except the people who work for it? Is it not the football team and the manager that shape and define what the club is about?

No.

The players and staff are employees of the institution.

Players come and players go.

[ElTwis]

Not saying that you are making this point (wouldn't want to say that and make someone go into a snit), but I think the loyalty wouldn't have been their before bosman, that it was just a forced loyalty. They were so underpaid before that a lot of them needed second jobs.

In many cases the spending goes too far (like a neighboring club who pays 102% of turnover in wages for a midtable squad), but at least the players have choice now. For everyone that says they would play for their hometown team, remember that Paul Scholes doesn't play for Oldham (that's his boyhood club, right?) even though he could, at much less pay and less honors.

Interesting.

I suppose it's easy to assume modern morals and the huge amount of money in the game have shaped players and staff members loyalties and changed them from those common place 30 or 40 years ago.

I've never played any sport at a professional level, nor was I around before football was such big business so I can only make assumptions as to the driving forces behind peoples seeming increasing lack of loyalty towards the club that pays their wages. It would be interesting to get opinions from ex professionals from the 60's up until now.

Surely though, the very nature of a sportsman dictates that they want to test themselves and achieve as much as they can. There's only a few clubs that can offer you that nowadays, the top 4 dominate and will continue to do so. Unless your hometown team is one of these there is little choice but to go for a move when it's possible and seems to be an upward move, the money is incidental. I think Hughes probably falls into that category. On the other hand, people who perhaps are not good enough to be at a Champions League level have a choice, chase as much money as you can or find a club you like and stay there as long as you can. Rovers are very lucky to have some great examples of the latter, Tugay, Friedal, Nelsen but like all clubs have been affected by the former also, Neill, Bellamy.

[Mr. E]

No.

The players and staff are employees of the institution.

Players come and players go.

Then what is the "institution", precisely? Is it the football ground? Is it the town/fans? If it's the latter, I still don't see how the two are connected. What does it matter that Ewood Park is located in Blackburn when everyone who works for it and is responsible for its success would very well like to be working somewhere else? Every time we score a goal it's not some sort of testament to the town and its fans, since the player most likely would rather be at City or United doing the same. The town of Blackburn and the football club Blackburn Rovers have only a superficial geographical location in common - it's like wherever McDonald's has its headquarters doesn't mean it represents that city at all.

If the employees loved working/living there and all their ambition was directed towards making Rovers a great club and honoring the town/fans, you could make the argument that BRFC is the club of Blackburn. But without that it becomes just another business that operates within a close proximity of the town.

I hope at least it makes sense where I'm trying to get at.

[ElTwis]

Then what is the "institution", precisely? Is it the football ground? Is it the town/fans? If it's the latter, I still don't see how the two are connected. What does it matter that Ewood Park is located in Blackburn when everyone who works for it and is responsible for its success would very well like to be working somewhere else? Every time we score a goal it's not some sort of testament to the town and its fans, since the player most likely would rather be at City or United doing the same. The town of Blackburn and the football club Blackburn Rovers have only a superficial geographical location in common - it's like wherever McDonald's has its headquarters doesn't mean it represents that city at all.

If the employees loved working/living there and all their ambition was directed towards making Rovers a great club and honoring the town/fans, you could make the argument that BRFC is the club of Blackburn. But without that it becomes just another business that operates within a close proximity of the town.

I hope at least it makes sense where I'm trying to get at.

It's been an awful long time since clubs were made up of people from that town, city or area.

Poeple tend not to stay where they were born, there's opportunities everywhere and it's so easy to get from place to place. Myself, I grew up in Kendal, moved to Leeds and trained there and now I'm moving to Jersey. I'm still a Rovers fan but if I was a player where should I play?

.

[bob fleming]

Then what is the "institution", precisely? Is it the football ground? Is it the town/fans? If it's the latter, I still don't see how the two are connected. etc etc etc

Well here goes.... It's all that - but mainly it's the fans that make the football club. The club resides in Blackburn and is undoubtedly the greatest asset the town has and has been for a number of years (then again there is that bridge going up and all that rubble in the town centre for competition) not only that but most of our fans come from Blackburn as well - or did do at one point.

When WE, not Benni or Roque or Brad, WE score a goal I generally celebrate like a nutter. It doesn't matter who has scored - he's wearing blue and white halves and could come from Saturn for all I care. He has scored a goal for Blackburn Rovers. He might want to sod off to Man City or Everton, obviously bettering themsleves immeasurably in the process, but keep it to yourself and try your best every single match and I can accept that.

The club might be owned by people in Jersey in our instance (or further afar for a lot of other clubs, but who cares about them?). The one constant is the fans. For most, from a very early age you pick your team your going to support, hopefully most will pick their local team, of course more and more will no doubt pick one of the top four (but again who cares about them?). Personally I only chose the Rovers when I was 11 - or rather they chose me when we moved here. I love 'em to bits (I've not had a drop I should point out at this stage!)

The Rovers

Ewood Park

Blue and White Halves

The Blackburn End

The Riverside

Nuttall Street

All unique. Our ours. All say more to me about supporting the club than any individual ever has (with the exception of possibly Jack Walker who probably should be in the above list but let's not split hairs right now).

Players come and players go, we've done pretty well when it comes to "loyalty" recently (Tugay, Brad). It makes little odds though. Whilst we'd all like to see Roque up front next season, and I'd be bitterly disappointed if he sods off to Old Trafford, that's just the way it goes. It's crap. But football is crap isn't it? Support one of the top four or be prepared to be bitterly disappointed on a regular basis.

Stoke and Hull rejoice as they get promoted. Anyone wonder what they'll be doing in 12 months? Like I said it's crap isn't it? Boring and predictable.

BUT it's the best this town has to offer by a country mile and whatever happens I'm proud to be a Rovers fan. I'm not trying to be corny (I'll not post one of those Blue and White smiley kit things at this point just in case it devalues what I'm trying to say). Boring and predictable. A bit like most of us - we'll be back next season hoping that we can be top 10 again, hoping to win a cup again, but most of all just being there at Ewood Park supporting Blackburn Rovers.

[philipl]

bob, that was just wonderful!

Brilliant.

[IAN57]

Bob, That said it all.

Brilliant.