[Archived] Do You Approve Of The New Manager?

[Sandiway Blue]

Just for the purpose of balance, wasn't Hughes a 'work in progress' during his time with us? He improved - as we did - the longer he stayed. Shame he went, perhaps inevitable - but they've all got a shelf-life. The key is knowing when it is - a la Souness.

If Ince can be judged by the criticism on here declining - he's done superbly. Equally, he's bound to make some mistakes - he will have his Ritgers & Bruno Berners for sure - but it's the overall result surely that's important?

Spot on !

The time for judging is at the end of the season.

For a club with our limited resources to bring in better quality players will take time as we cannot afford to make costly mistakes.Ince first has to do a THOROUGH assessment of our playing staff,and the only way he can do this will be by watching them play competitive games,which in itself will take at least half a season.

I suspect there will be many people on here who will be disappointed come the end of this transfer window because i don`t think we will make a `big money signing`.

We have enough quality to stay out of trouble this season,then Ince can identify targets that will really improve the team as a whole.

[DingleBaiter]

But Hughes was a success because, more often than not, he got it spot on in the transfer market. Rigters and Berner were very much exceptions, because on the whole Hughes got it spectacularly right; Bentley, Santa Cruz, Bellamy, Samba, Nelsen, Warnock...it's an impressive list.

If Ince can't get it right in the transfer market then we'll be screwed, there are no two-ways about it. He's got to prove he can adequately replace our most creative force, and at the moment there is no signing of that happening. It's a very worrying time in my opinion, and if Ince doesn't get it right in this window then we could undo all the good work done under Hughes very quickly.

It's a good point, but not altogether fair - as you're covering all bases.

I'd suggest if any manager can't get it right in the transfer market, they'd be equally rogered too. Suggest a manager, in the current climate, who's success isn't a direct function of his transfer dealings?

Let's be clear about one thing, Ince has helluva job to follow Hughes - if only because he's a replacement, looking to grow into the role (hopefully quickly). Ince is in a lose-lose situation if one is going to put so much emphasis on this transfer window. Hughes always was given time to go about his transfers in a timely, prudent, wise manner - and it worked, on the whole. Okay, Hughes didn't have to replace someone as crucial as Bentley so quickly, but I refer back to the analogy of shopping in Aldi then going into Marks & Spencer only to blow all your money, not get what you want and fart all night.

Ince buys no-one - bad.

Ince buys players the 'fans' don't rate (though what do they know?) - bad

Ince buys someone like Joaquin to excite the fans, and he tanks - bad

Ince buys someone like Pennant, who two managers of the top 4 haven't been able to get his Mojo back, he only gets worse for us - bad

One of Ince's first moves in the transfer market was for a guy coveted by several sides, who ended up going to Serie A - bad?

Ince signs a potential crowd-pleaser, attack-minded, skillful as a fire Juggler on acid superstar from Chile - bad?

Ince waits to find the right player, at the right price - bad??

Personally, I think Ince is playing it exactly right for now. Hughes must not have identified a replacement for Bentley either, or JW would know about it. Given Bentley wanted to go last season, could one suggest Hughes must be short-sighted then? Not at all. Like any argument, there's at least two sides. For all the moaners having coronaries about Fowler and Andrews, they've not arrived yet - so clearly it's not a favour fest, is it? He's looked at enough players, and doesn't seem to be spending for the sake of it (contrary to many previous managers) - so is it not likely he'd do the same as Hughes? Weigh up, set a price, set a priority, then play the long game? I think so.

Fact remains that whatever is done, or not, this transfer window, won't be the 'be all and end all' - it will be a factor. Whether that proves minor, or major, comes down to two things - how much the moaners want to make it so, and the bigger picture over the fullness of time.

[RevidgeBlue]

If Ince can't get it right in the transfer market then we'll be screwed, there are no two-ways about it. He's got to prove he can adequately replace our most creative force, and at the moment there is no signing of that happening. It's a very worrying time in my opinion, and if Ince doesn't get it right in this window then we could undo all the good work done under Hughes very quickly.

All that said, it's by no means certain that that Hughes would have found it any easier than Ince to replace Bentley within our budgetary constraints.

And for all Sparky's 'good work' he left Ince with a rather sterile looking midfield with options such as Mokoena, 38 year old Tugay and Vogel

[thenodrog]

The time for judging is at the end of the season.

No it isn't, it's ongoing. No club can afford a myopic 'wait and see' approach anymore if results leave them in the bottom 6 cum November.

Roque seems to disagree with you:

“We are working, thinking and doing things better than last season. That’s what ambition is all about - to become better year after year.”

Well I disagree with him too. He put in the worst performance of his BRFC career on Sat. 2nd proper match into Ince's tenure of the job and he was sluggish, passionless and lethargic.

Anyway how can you tell who was the fittest side on sat when you are residing in Oz? TV screens are often deceiving.

[iamarover]

Anyone who has the remotest thinking that Steve McBrolly could have done this job instead of Caesar Ince should check this out:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6l9BFJYiPxA

Just as you thought he couldnt get any worse for the former leader of the flower of England.

[tonyoz]

No it isn't, it's ongoing. No club can afford a myopic 'wait and see' approach anymore if results leave them in the bottom 6 cum November.

Well I disagree with him too. He put in the worst performance of his BRFC career on Sat. 2nd proper match into Ince's tenure of the job and he was sluggish, passionless and lethargic.

Anyway how can you tell who was the fittest side on sat when you are residing in Oz? TV screens are often deceiving.

RSC was disappointing wasn't he? He was excellent at Everton though - so hopefully it's not the 2nd season Benni curse. (That was under Hughes, mind you.)

Strangely, I am off tonight to blow my tax rebate on a new telly. I am going to ask for one with a better perspective.

[RevidgeBlue]

Well in terms of ACTUAL signings and not rumours, I think our acquisitions have been pretty solid.

Robinson, Simpson, Villenueva, Grella.

A right winger with pace and flair and that would be a pretty good window.

[den]

Too early to call Robinson "solid".

Wasn't impressed with Simpson.

Know nothing about Villanueva yet.

Know nothing about Grella, - but his experience suggests he should be able to do a job.

We need a right winger - full stop. We need an attacking CM, as well.

[T4E]

Well in terms of ACTUAL signings and not rumours, I think our acquisitions have been pretty solid.

Robinson, Simpson, Villenueva, Grella.

A right winger with pace and flair and that would be a pretty good window.

It's still very much up in the air, but I agree it looks very solid.

A lot depends on how Carlos gets on (could be anything), if Robbo can get back to his best, and if Grella is an improvement on Vogel then we're looking better than last season for sure. Simpson is a bit of an anomaly - if he's great, he probably doesn't stay. Tricky position to be in.

Agreed on the last bit too - a top class winger could turn this in to a very good Summer indeed. Which was unimaginable a month ago.

[incecticide]

Well I disagree with him too. He put in the worst performance of his BRFC career on Sat. 2nd proper match into Ince's tenure of the job and he was sluggish, passionless and lethargic.

Impossible to blame Santa Cruz. Spending 90 minutes lumping the ball into the box from all angles hoping he'll get on the end of it is no kind of service.

[Uddersfelt Blue]

Too early to call Robinson "solid".

Wasn't impressed with Simpson.

Know nothing about Villanueva yet.

Know nothing about Grella, - but his experience suggests he should be able to do a job.

We need a right winger - full stop. We need an attacking CM, as well.

I suspect we'll have to rely on Dunny for the attacking CM role

And please can we stop Robinson from hoofing the ball into the top tier of the Blackburn/Darwen end stands every time he gets it!!!!

[incecticide]

Saw Spurs score a lot of goals with those a couple of years back - Keane running onto Mido flick ons. We should be trying the same, particularly with Roberts' pace and RSC's aerial ability.

[JAL]

Too early to call Robinson "solid".

Wasn't impressed with Simpson.

Know nothing about Villanueva yet.

Know nothing about Grella, - but his experience suggests he should be able to do a job.

We need a right winger - full stop. We need an attacking CM, as well.

Thats more like an accurate asessment of of the players Ince has brought in so far then revs, I think we'd all like to see the back of Benni MaCarthy so another forward would be on the wishlist.

[Sandiway Blue]

No it isn't, it's ongoing. No club can afford a myopic 'wait and see' approach anymore if results leave them in the bottom 6 cum November.

I would agree with you,but can you honestly see us struggling this season?

Ince has already identified the fact that teams are cutting through the centre of our midfield like a knife through butter which is why he has brought Grella in (of course whether he is a good enough player for this position is open to scrutiny).I think he is waiting to see what becomes available in January for the right sided position.

With half the season gone and new players settling into their teams,we have more chance of finding a player that might not be happy with being sat on the bench,thus giving us more chance of bringing him to Ewood.

We have enough quality to see us do ok but as i say we just have to be patient.

I suspect we'll have to rely on Dunny for the attacking CM role

And please can we stop Robinson from hoofing the ball into the top tier of the Blackburn/Darwen end stands every time he gets it!!!!

Tbh i think if Robbo turns down the gas a bit,i think it could turn out to be quite a potent weapon on the counter attack.

[67splitscreen]

Bit more accuracy, is what"s needed.

Could be a 10 goal a season player.

[Sandiway Blue]

Bit more accuracy, is what"s needed.

Could be a 10 goal a season player.

Yup needs to score more than the 1 in 137 ratio he had at spuds!

[waggy]

paul ince has blooded more youngsters than hughes did in 4 years i salute you

[imy9]

A comment that Toshack and other Welsh fans have made previously about Hughes.

[gumboots]

It's odd isn't it that when someone is your manager you're prepared to overlook their faults but when they look like leaving you or actually go you realise just how much certain things irritated you. I remember thinking Souness was quality and thne just before he went thinking "I'm tired of the same old excuses." Then when Hughes came I listened to his interviews thinking "Great!" and now when you hear him trotting out the same phrases about City as he used about us you just think, "How boring." I'm warming to Ince. I was never one of those who welcomed him with open arms but nor was I one of those prepared to commit suicide when he was appointed. He doesn't seem to have done much actually wrong yet - although I have been away for 5 weeks so have missed stuff going on because 5 live was occupied with the Olympics and we're not headline news anyway.

[Ronin]

A comment that Toshack and other Welsh fans have made previously about Hughes.

He'd probably rather just stick to his comfort zone, as a certain Mr Cook has said.

Do agree with Gumboots, we certainly have the blue & white blinkers on when players and managers are at Rovers, but once they leave, looking at them from the outside and in a different light, our perspective of them does change. Funny that

I can certainly see Citeh turning in a Rovers clone.

[imy9]

I think that this logic applies to all football fans, I am sure if Rafa Benitez left tomorrow, Liverpool fans would say that he wasted a lot of money on average players and that they have actually gone backwards in the league by finishing 4th under him- would they think that now?

[tonyoz]

It's odd isn't it that when someone is your manager you're prepared to overlook their faults but when they look like leaving you or actually go you realise just how much certain things irritated you. I remember thinking Souness was quality and thne just before he went thinking "I'm tired of the same old excuses." Then when Hughes came I listened to his interviews thinking "Great!" and now when you hear him trotting out the same phrases about City as he used about us you just think, "How boring." I'm warming to Ince. I was never one of those who welcomed him with open arms but nor was I one of those prepared to commit suicide when he was appointed. He doesn't seem to have done much actually wrong yet - although I have been away for 5 weeks so have missed stuff going on because 5 live was occupied with the Olympics and we're not headline news anyway.

Yes.........very interesting that. I liked Souness and supported him longer than most. But, in the end, it was such a relief to see him go - especially the way it happened. I wanted Hughes from the start. I lauded his successes and found it easy to overlook his shortcomings. I think I saw what I wanted to see sometimes. I worried when rumours of him moving on hit the media. Eventually though, it dawned on me that we were watching crap a lot of the time.

I was still disappointed when he went.......not that I retained any affection for him....when anyone (player or manager) decides he doesn't want to be a Rover any more, I take the rejection personally. It's just that I couldn't see any obvious replacement.

The greatest fear was the appointment of a journeyman.... No! Every time we get in this position, I have a fantasy........ that we manage to unearth someone special. I know Laudrup was a favourite with many but he just didn't cut it with me. I bet he couldn't find us on a map. Then Paul Ince was mentioned. I never liked him as a player but there's no doubting that he has something. He was made captain just about everywhere he went. He had a flawless, embryonic managerial career and it seemed that everyone who has worked with him rates him.

Well, that was enough to fire up my fantasy again. I know it's a long shot but, so far, I like what I see. I can't wait for the West Ham match..........on my new telly!

[Exiled in Toronto]

Yes.........very interesting that. I liked Souness and supported him longer than most. But, in the end, it was such a relief to see him go - especially the way it happened. I wanted Hughes from the start. I lauded his successes and found it easy to overlook his shortcomings. I think I saw what I wanted to see sometimes. I worried when rumours of him moving on hit the media. Eventually though, it dawned on me that we were watching crap a lot of the time.

I was still disappointed when he went.......not that I retained any affection for him....when anyone (player or manager) decides he doesn't want to be a Rover any more, I take the rejection personally. It's just that I couldn't see any obvious replacement.

The greatest fear was the appointment of a journeyman.... No! Every time we get in this position, I have a fantasy........ that we manage to unearth someone special. I know Laudrup was a favourite with many but he just didn't cut it with me. I bet he couldn't find us on a map. Then Paul Ince was mentioned. I never liked him as a player but there's no doubting that he has something. He was made captain just about everywhere he went. He had a flawless, embryonic managerial career and it seemed that everyone who has worked with him rates him.

Well, that was enough to fire up my fantasy again. I know it's a long shot but, so far, I like what I see. I can't wait for the West Ham match..........on my new telly!

Very similar to my emotional journey with the last three managers, each of whom I was very excited about when we appointed them, and still am with Ince. When I was a lad, on the day Ken Furphy joined I was down at the front entrance at 8am to get his autograph, and he told me I was the first to do so and how nice it was.

The thing I don't get with the fence-sitters, "I'll give him until xxx, then decide", be it about Ince or Andrews, is how exactly does that differ in any way from the definition of following the bandwagon? i.e. I'll wait until it's completely obvious one way or the other, then will jump on whichever bandwagon it is. That's not support, in fact, assuming it's a positive bandwagon, it sounds exactly like glory-hunting.

Supporting the manager in his early days isn't about being right, it's about helping him become a success.

[CrazyIvan]

The thing I don't get with the fence-sitters, "I'll give him until xxx, then decide", be it about Ince or Andrews, is how exactly does that differ in any way from the definition of following the bandwagon? i.e. I'll wait until it's completely obvious one way or the other, then will jump on whichever bandwagon it is. That's not support, in fact, assuming it's a positive bandwagon, it sounds exactly like glory-hunting.

Supporting the manager in his early days isn't about being right, it's about helping him become a success.

I think you've simplified this too much. I'll support Ince because he is Rovers manager but I still maintain we won't KNOW whether he'll be a success or failure (and whether he is the right man for the job) until 10 games gone at least. I see good signs as I've said a lot recently but I will reserve judgement. I don't see that as being a bandwagon jumper but being realistic. He gets my support and I'll sing Paul Ince's Blue and White army as loud as ever but he has to prove himself as a professional manager at the highest level to all of us.

I'll support Andrews as well, I don't boo any of Rovers players and I never will (I don't honestly see the point in that!) and if they put the shirt on a prove themselves to be honest and hardworking as well as skillful then they will always be a Rovers hero to me. That's one of the reasons someone like Craig Short is a Rovers hero while David Bentley just isn't (there's a bit more in it that that but you know what I mean...). (It also helps if they score against Burnley...)

[RoverJoexx]

The thing I don't get with the fence-sitters, "I'll give him until xxx, then decide", be it about Ince or Andrews, is how exactly does that differ in any way from the definition of following the bandwagon? i.e. I'll wait until it's completely obvious one way or the other, then will jump on whichever bandwagon it is. That's not support, in fact, assuming it's a positive bandwagon, it sounds exactly like glory-hunting.

Supporting the manager in his early days isn't about being right, it's about helping him become a success.

Well said EiT.