[Archived] Local Government Strike

[Paul Mellelieu]

Amongst the worst paid sections of the public sector.

Lagged behind NHS workers, coppers and teachers for a decade. About time we got a pay rise rather a pay cut.

[Ste B]

From my experience of working with local government they are all lazy workshy @#/?s who know they have jobs for life.

[Paul Mellelieu]

QUOTE (Ste B @ Jul 16 2008, 06:45 ) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

From my experience of working with local government they are all lazy workshy @#/?s who know they have jobs for life.

Cheers Steve.

[broadsword]

No sympathy at all, sorry.

From what my mate told me who used to work at a council, half the people go on strike without really knowing why.

Is it reasonable to expect a pay-rise for librarians and road-sweepers when we're goign full speed ahead into a recession. You must all be in a dream-world.

[Paul Mellelieu]

No sympathy at all, sorry.

From what my mate told me who used to work at a council,

"

Glad to see you've thought it through.

[Ricky]

This is the first strike action I've not supported Paul. We've had a pretty raw deal through Job Evaluation and had very little support from Unison throughout the process.

I thought long and hard about this one but just felt that I couldn't justify losing two days pay and pension contributions. I can't see them getting anywhere near 6% unfortunately.

I took a £5k hit on job evaluation and Unison did very little at all.

[Paul Mellelieu]

This is the first strike action I've not supported Paul. We've had a pretty raw deal through Job Evaluation and had very little support from Unison throughout the process.

I thought long and hard about this one but just felt that I couldn't justify losing two days pay and pension contributions. I can't see them getting anywhere near 6% unfortunately.

I took a £5k hit on job evaluation and Unison did very little at all.

I don't know many people jumping up and down in joy about the strike, but my view if that once the vote is taken you have to support it.

[BuckyRover]

It's embarassing.

I suggest they all move to the private sector where they can have their wages based on performance rather than some pseudo performance appraisal which rates everybody the same (because we are all equal).

I have many friends who work in local government and all their stories make me equally mad. They really do need to enter the real world.

We need the tories to get in and trim the excessive public sector work force. It has become ridiculous.

[Paul Mellelieu]

It's embarassing.

I suggest they all move to the private sector where they can have their wages based on performance rather than some pseudo performance appraisal which rates everybody the same (because we are all equal).

I have many friends who work in local government and all their stories make me equally mad. They really do need to enter the real world.

We need the tories to get in and trim the excessive public sector work force. It has become ridiculous.

Have you got any facts to back up "what your mates tell you".

If the Tories get back in be prepared to wait 2 years for a routine NHS operation.

[broadsword]

So we're meant to disregard first-hand information related by trusted acquaintances, and instead "think it through properly"?

I don't know where you think the money will come from for an above-inflation pay-rise?

[Paul Mellelieu]

So we're meant to disregard first-hand information related by trusted acquaintances, and instead "think it through properly"?

I don't know where you think the money will come from for an above-inflation pay-rise?

Bryan,

Local government pay has lagged behind most other sectors over the last two decades, despite meeting all the efficiency targets set by government. I could say hat fi you want good quality public services you have to pay for them.

For starters, we could:

a. Tax the rich more

b. Stop fighting wars

c. Abandon nuclear weapons.

[broadsword]

I think we only fight wars because they are profitable, and lie to the public by saying they are a noble cause. No-one will be brave enough to give up nuclear weapons, and blithely taxing the rich more isn't the answer either, they are the ones who generate prosperity for the country.

Perhaps I got it wrong, but I thought that the council pays council workers, is it actually central govt?

[Paul Mellelieu]

I think we only fight wars because they are profitable, and lie to the public by saying they are a noble cause. No-one will be brave enough to give up nuclear weapons, and blithely taxing the rich more isn't the answer either, they are the ones who generate prosperity for the country.

Perhaps I got it wrong, but I thought that the council pays council workers, is it actually central govt?

Council budgets are derived from a mixture of council tax income, income form certain services and from a central government grant.

[broadsword]

Given then that there is a 7.5 billion pound hole in public borrowing and councils are unlikely to put council taxes up, I'm not sure where the money will come from?

[Ste B]

Taxing the rich, to pay Paul !

Thats the plan.

I've seen how they work first hand and if the unions were more pragmatic rather than insisting on wasting money, then there may actually have been more to go around.

[BuckyRover]

My parents work in the public sector too (for the employment service).

They strike more often than I get holidays in a year.

If the conditions are so bad, why haven't you moved to the private sector?

You are in a dreamworld. Final salary pensions, more holidays, flexi-time, no need to work hard to gain promotion. Most people do not get these benefits (apologies if you do not).

Although I heard a story the other day that they aren't totally opposed to sacking people. A worker whose job it was to assess if council tenants needed kitchen repairs was caught sniffing a tenants underwear, TWICE!

Great stuff!

[broadsword]

Assessing whether they need underwear repairs?

[yoda]

Looks like it is not only me that thinks you should join the real world Mr Mellelieu

QUOTE (Ste B @ Jul 16 2008, 09:45 ) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

From my experience of working with local government they are all lazy workshy @#/?s who know they have jobs for life.

That would account for all the single mothers

trouble is it's not a "job" for life, they either retire early with a pension or go on extended sick leave! then get a pension.

[adopted scouser]

As this government dies an ugly death, looks like the Unions are starting to smell blood. Back to the 70's, shop stewards, picket lines etc.

Pathetic and dated. If you are unhappy with your 'lot', go and work somewhere else.

[Tris]

Blimey ... feel the love!!

I bet you're glad you started this thread Paul, the support is flooding in in waves!

[jim mk2]

Amongst the worst paid sections of the public sector.

Lagged behind NHS workers, coppers and teachers for a decade. About time we got a pay rise rather a pay cut.

Give up your final salary scheme pensions (funded by council tax payers) for the horrors of private-sector money purchase pensions and people might have more sympathy for you.

[yoda]

Give up your final salary scheme pensions (funded by council tax payers) for the horrors of private-sector money purchase pensions and people might have more sympathy for you.

No chance of that Jim, Mr Mellelieu is an expert on pensions

[Paul Mellelieu]

I don't really get the level of hostility to union members campaigning for better pay when they've seen their pay slip behind most of the other comparable sectors. I can only speak about those people I know who work in caring and other professions who do this work because they have a sense of doing public good. Why is it that media types, people in advertising, those who develop, market and sell worthless products fill their pockets, but a care worker or a social worker who deals in the day-today misery of many people's lives get year-on-year less than inflation pay increases?

Jim,

The richest 10% of households get 50% of pension-related tax relief. The public sector pension schemes are only partly funded by employers, we pay in too. Many private sector employers have had these schemes too, (paid for by you and me through the goods and services we purchase) but are unwilling to support them. We have amongst the worse pension arrangements in western Europe, and pensioner poverty on a par with the poorest EU-15 nations, when we have the biggest economy.

.

[Paul Mellelieu]

Give up your final salary scheme pensions (funded by council tax payers) for the horrors of private-sector money purchase pensions and people might have more sympathy for you.

None of these groups of workers have given up their pension schemes. Part of the (unwritten) deal in the public sector is that for comparable work our pay is less than the private sector, but that we do get other benefits. Right now we are too far behind the private sector.

The early exit schemes (which are virtually non-existent now) were encouraged by the Tories to get unemployment down - the Germans took a similar tack and are now spending E200m trying to get people over 50 back into work.

Ste B,

Indeed tax the rich to pay me more.

[BuckyRover]

I don't really get the level of hostility to union members campaigning for better pay when they've seen their pay slip behind most of the other comparable sectors. I can only speak about those people I know who work in caring and other professions who do this work because they have a sense of doing public good. Why is it that media types, people in advertising, those who develop, market and sell worthless products fill their pockets, but a care worker or a social worker who deals in the day-today misery of many people's lives get year-on-year less than inflation pay increases?

Jim,

The richest 10% of households get 50% of pension-related tax relief. The public sector pension schemes are only partly funded by employers, we pay in too. Many private sector employers have had these schemes too, (paid for by you and me through the goods and services we purchase) but are unwilling to support them. We have amongst the worse pension arrangements in western Europe, and pensioner poverty on a par with the poorest EU-15 nations, when we have the biggest economy.

.

You think the private sector hasn't been getting below inflation pay rises?

It's only at director level where they are getting inflation busting bonuses. Big pay rises have been off the cards for years now.

It's a shame really, I need more money to afford the increases in council tax (mine went up £100 last year).