[Archived] Nickos Thread

[Eddie]

We'll have someone at his game today. That is for sure. It isn't that I totally doubt what Nicko is saying, but with JW having said it in public, I can't see it not being true.

[DingleBaiter]

No no it's not a playing thing with me. Where did you get this idea?

I've been honest and said I havn't took my seat yet this season and will make my mind up when I have seen them play a few times.- read the posts - my point is I don't think he is in charge behind the scenes -see transfers- and he is certainly having some trouble convincing SOME players he's in charge of them.

When I see them play I'll make a comment on his teams playing style and managerial approach then.

If I want to speculate on a messageboard I will. However I won't

a. come to Ince's instant defence whatever - like some people are doing. People have to earn my respect. Or

b. re-write other peoples posts so it says something completely different. There is just a little too much of that on this board IMO.

Good reply! Am always eager to hear people's views, everyone's got stuff to offer - even the dafties!

Equally, agree Ince - or anyone - should not be blindly defended, although do think the balance of criticism against him is a) biased prejudiced c)without firm, incontrovertible evidence in a lot of cases.

I think the perception of him not being in control behind the scenes is served by being fed all this information on here (though not saying it's a bad thing), as even Nicko backtracks sometimes, as the situations change back and forth, or information is just clarified/discarded. I'd suggest the average bloke on the street isn't 10% as informed as anyone reading this thread, and probably doesn't even think about the off-field stuff.

However, it's fair to say, different managers/clubs have different procurement methods. I believe for instance, Dalglish was similar to Hughes in that they identified players they fancied, put priorities to the backroom/board/executive staff and let them deal with it.

IMO Ince is working very closely with JW for the obvious reasons, getting to know him but also being schooled in how things work here. For all the talk on here, and outside, I still believe Rovers are held up as being a well-run club (apart from the Jersey conspiracists) and feel sure they're trying to replicate the Hughes modus operandi that worked so well before. I certainly don't believe Ince to be as much as a patsy as say, oh a certain Welshman in Manchester at present. JW & Finn always seemed to be very closely involved off-field on the player recruitment front, so it's reasonable to think they would be more so with an inexperienced manager - both new to the club & this level of football.

Someone I trust, that seems very knowledgeable on these sort of things, told me (before he came) that Ince was one of these managers who delegated a lot & placed massive trust in the staff around him, shunning a lot of the 'day to day' stuff, which seems to be a modern approach to the game (especially with continental sides & younger managers). Even King Kenny had a similar view, almost like a figurehead, and Harford often dealt with incoming players as well as the suits. Personally, I'd like the best person to do the best job his skills make him the best at - if this means JW doing the player acquisition (but not identifying) then so be it. Off-topic a mo, maybe that's why Simon Williams is in his job - he's doing a better job than Beamo at least

Apologies if you felt I'd altered your post, just wasn't clear on your comment about Ince not being in charge, hadn't realised you weren't commenting on the matchday body language. Was responding to your post 'as is' without having read, nor remembered, everything from other threads/posts, so much so didn't realise you hadn't seen him 'in play' so to speak.

I found it interesting to watch the interactions with Ince & JW yesterday in the first half in the directors box, was quite enthused to see Williams being so actively involved as opposed to typical suits at a game.

Anyways, your post (and reply) was nice & balanced, wish more were like that on here ..

Nicko - any more news of potential triallists coming in? Was it true they looked at a couple of young forwards last week (Swedish? maybe) - more for future development though than immediate entry into the squad?

[thenodrog]

It's not a lack of communication. But a bit of lack of respect.

Respect Nicko? Hmmmmm I wonder if players and their agents actually started showing some respect to

1. Their employers the football clubs

2. to the terms of their footballing contracts

and

3. to the people whom pay their wages on the terraces

whether it might just prompt a bit more respect in the other direction?

You continually bang on about these little tin gods being insulted / offended when asked to come for a trial / loan, but is it any wonder when they can turn out to be crocked / slow / unable to trap a wet sandbag / George Weahs first cousin / the real Corrado Grabbi etc etc that the clubs cant simply tear up contracts and eff em off without a backward glance or fear of legal reprisals like the bloody players can.

How about "Excuse me Carlos err sorry Mr Kickaball........ We're willing to offer you a contract to pay many millions of pounds over the next 3 years for your services.... so would you mind playing a little bit of footy first cos your face is a bit indistinct in that grainy YouTube clip that your agents sent and the other team looked like they were from Div 2 of the Sunday League.

Sauce for the goose.

[Ewood and I Would]

All becomes clear...

[Eddie]

[T4E]

Mathias

[roversmum]

All becomes clear...

What at?

[The Prof.]

It's Ince's cunning new game plan.

He'll sign Zigic as well and the pair will wander side by side down the pitch playing head tennis with each other with the opposition unable to get anywhere near the ball.

All we need now is a corner taker!

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Respect Nicko? Hmmmmm I wonder if players and their agents actually started showing some respect to

1. Their employers the football clubs

2. to the terms of their footballing contracts

and

3. to the people whom pay their wages on the terraces

whether it might just prompt a bit more respect in the other direction?

You continually bang on about these little tin gods being insulted / offended when asked to come for a trial / loan, but is it any wonder when they can turn out to be crocked / slow / unable to trap a wet sandbag / George Weahs first cousin / the real Corrado Grabbi etc etc that the clubs cant simply tear up contracts and eff em off without a backward glance or fear of legal reprisals like the bloody players can.

Sauce for the goose.

Top stuff Theno....lack of respect? dont make us laugh nicko FFS!

[Silencio]

Good reply! Am always eager to hear people's views, everyone's got stuff to offer - even the dafties!

Equally, agree Ince - or anyone - should not be blindly defended, although do think the balance of criticism against him is a) biased prejudiced c)without firm, incontrovertible evidence in a lot of cases.

I think the perception of him not being in control behind the scenes is served by being fed all this information on here (though not saying it's a bad thing), as even Nicko backtracks sometimes, as the situations change back and forth, or information is just clarified/discarded. I'd suggest the average bloke on the street isn't 10% as informed as anyone reading this thread, and probably doesn't even think about the off-field stuff.

However, it's fair to say, different managers/clubs have different procurement methods. I believe for instance, Dalglish was similar to Hughes in that they identified players they fancied, put priorities to the backroom/board/executive staff and let them deal with it.

IMO Ince is working very closely with JW for the obvious reasons, getting to know him but also being schooled in how things work here. For all the talk on here, and outside, I still believe Rovers are held up as being a well-run club (apart from the Jersey conspiracists) and feel sure they're trying to replicate the Hughes modus operandi that worked so well before. I certainly don't believe Ince to be as much as a patsy as say, oh a certain Welshman in Manchester at present. JW & Finn always seemed to be very closely involved off-field on the player recruitment front, so it's reasonable to think they would be more so with an inexperienced manager - both new to the club & this level of football.

Someone I trust, that seems very knowledgeable on these sort of things, told me (before he came) that Ince was one of these managers who delegated a lot & placed massive trust in the staff around him, shunning a lot of the 'day to day' stuff, which seems to be a modern approach to the game (especially with continental sides & younger managers). Even King Kenny had a similar view, almost like a figurehead, and Harford often dealt with incoming players as well as the suits. Personally, I'd like the best person to do the best job his skills make him the best at - if this means JW doing the player acquisition (but not identifying) then so be it. Off-topic a mo, maybe that's why Simon Williams is in his job - he's doing a better job than Beamo at least

Apologies if you felt I'd altered your post, just wasn't clear on your comment about Ince not being in charge, hadn't realised you weren't commenting on the matchday body language. Was responding to your post 'as is' without having read, nor remembered, everything from other threads/posts, so much so didn't realise you hadn't seen him 'in play' so to speak.

I found it interesting to watch the interactions with Ince & JW yesterday in the first half in the directors box, was quite enthused to see Williams being so actively involved as opposed to typical suits at a game.

Anyways, your post (and reply) was nice & balanced, wish more were like that on here ..

Good post Dinglebaiter.

My problem with the idea that Ince as a "delegator" is the quality of the staff he has surrounded himself with and is delegating to. Ray Mathias does not have the credentials to be running BRFC and international footballers on a day to day basis. How can you argue that his record suggests otherwise?

You may argue that Ince trusts Mathias because of the MK Dons/Macclesfield experience but that would just lead me to refer to my previous paragraph. His record is not befitting of BRFC. I had assumed that Ince would be bringing in true Premier League staff to assist him.

I would ask what exactly Ince's purpose is if he is not doing the day to day running of the club? Surely his "media persona" is more of an embarrassment than a positive point? What is your opinion on how he conducts himself?

The dealings with Castillo and Annan appear messy, we seem to seriously be targeting a poor lower division journeyman, Robinson is a poor keeper IMO and surely there is no positive angle to giving Robbie Fowler a trial. Villanueva could be good but we can't be sure of that.

I have many other concerns but these are some of the main ones...

[nicko]

lack of respect? please. we all know rovers are one of the best clubs with regards to conducting business.

frankly, if a couple of agents have been spinning a story to you alan, its your choice if you want to believe them.

in any case, even if he did think he was coming and then the club changed their minds - they are perfectly within their rights to do so.

i'm very pleased to hear we are being cautious with our money. we can't afford to waste a single penny.

Neither Castillo nor Pennant stories came from agents.

Rovers contacted Castillo and asked him to come over. He thought he was getting a three-year contract. It turns out it was only a trial.

Annan has been on the Rovers radar since Mark Hughes's time. They fixed it with BOTH of his clubs in Norway for him to come over and sign. It changed.

Respect Nicko? Hmmmmm I wonder if players and their agents actually started showing some respect to

1. Their employers the football clubs

2. to the terms of their footballing contracts

and

3. to the people whom pay their wages on the terraces

whether it might just prompt a bit more respect in the other direction?

Fine, if you are happy to lose out on players by shifting the goalposts and get a name for it, then great...

See where it takes you.

[The Prof.]

Good reply! Am always eager to hear people's views, everyone's got stuff to offer - even the dafties!

Equally, agree Ince - or anyone - should not be blindly defended, although do think the balance of criticism against him is a) biased prejudiced c)without firm, incontrovertible evidence in a lot of cases.

I think the perception of him not being in control behind the scenes is served by being fed all this information on here (though not saying it's a bad thing), as even Nicko backtracks sometimes, as the situations change back and forth, or information is just clarified/discarded. I'd suggest the average bloke on the street isn't 10% as informed as anyone reading this thread, and probably doesn't even think about the off-field stuff.

However, it's fair to say, different managers/clubs have different procurement methods. I believe for instance, Dalglish was similar to Hughes in that they identified players they fancied, put priorities to the backroom/board/executive staff and let them deal with it.

IMO Ince is working very closely with JW for the obvious reasons, getting to know him but also being schooled in how things work here. For all the talk on here, and outside, I still believe Rovers are held up as being a well-run club (apart from the Jersey conspiracists) and feel sure they're trying to replicate the Hughes modus operandi that worked so well before. I certainly don't believe Ince to be as much as a patsy as say, oh a certain Welshman in Manchester at present. JW & Finn always seemed to be very closely involved off-field on the player recruitment front, so it's reasonable to think they would be more so with an inexperienced manager - both new to the club & this level of football.

Someone I trust, that seems very knowledgeable on these sort of things, told me (before he came) that Ince was one of these managers who delegated a lot & placed massive trust in the staff around him, shunning a lot of the 'day to day' stuff, which seems to be a modern approach to the game (especially with continental sides & younger managers). Even King Kenny had a similar view, almost like a figurehead, and Harford often dealt with incoming players as well as the suits. Personally, I'd like the best person to do the best job his skills make him the best at - if this means JW doing the player acquisition (but not identifying) then so be it. Off-topic a mo, maybe that's why Simon Williams is in his job - he's doing a better job than Beamo at least

Apologies if you felt I'd altered your post, just wasn't clear on your comment about Ince not being in charge, hadn't realised you weren't commenting on the matchday body language. Was responding to your post 'as is' without having read, nor remembered, everything from other threads/posts, so much so didn't realise you hadn't seen him 'in play' so to speak.

I found it interesting to watch the interactions with Ince & JW yesterday in the first half in the directors box, was quite enthused to see Williams being so actively involved as opposed to typical suits at a game.

Anyways, your post (and reply) was nice & balanced, wish more were like that on here ..

Nicko - any more news of potential triallists coming in? Was it true they looked at a couple of young forwards last week (Swedish? maybe) - more for future development though than immediate entry into the squad?

Well - I think you've hit a key point in here. Who makes the loan/stay/transfer decisions. Because we're lucky we'll ask Nicko eh?

Nicko -

Who decided Annan should be subjected to this Trial/Transfer/Loan/Lump it scenario? In your opinion will it continue? and if so what effect will it have on attracting players?

[thenodrog]

Bentley was happy to stay until his head was turned. Why else were your club offering him a new contract for so long and, quite rightly, claiming they were making progress on it. They were.

Have you ever admitted to being wrong Alan...... ever? You plainly told us all not to worry that Bentley signing was not a problem and that Brad was completely happy to be at Blackburn Rovers. No matter how many words you wrote after that you have plainly been proven wrong / misinformed. Now I've no probs with that, we all make mistakes ...... it's why they put rubbers on the end of pencils.... but you so easily take umbrage with all and sundry if it's ever pointed out on here. You provide much good info without doubt but just try a little humility sometimes when you are wrong.

Otherwise I might just start keeping a scrap book of your articles which appear in the popular press.

[hawkiiz]

Annan has been on the Rovers radar since Mark Hughes's time. They fixed it with BOTH of his clubs in Norway for him to come over and sign. It changed.

that was before this week wasnt it. when he could not get the work permit?

yesterday, START said they had not received any bid from anyone. there is interrest from rovers, arse, french and spanish clubs.

why would svein mathisen all of a sudden start lying?

[nicko]

Have you ever admitted to being wrong Alan...... ever? You plainly told us all not to worry that Bentley signing was not a problem and that Brad was completely happy to be at Blackburn Rovers. No matter how many words you wrote after that you have plainly been proven wrong / misinformed. Now I've no probs with that, we all make mistakes ...... it's why they put rubbers on the end of pencils.... but you so easily take umbrage with all and sundry if it's ever pointed out on here. You provide much good info without doubt but just try a little humility sometimes when you are wrong.

Otherwise I might just start keeping a scrap book of your articles which appear in the popular press.

I knew you were bone-headed, but I didn't have you down as thick.

How many times do we have to go over this?

Bentley and Friedel were happy at your club. Their circumstances changed. Bentley reverted to type and eventually got a move. Brad got a wonder contract at Villa and left.

You had him signing for Man City because he liked the goalkeeping coach.

Feel free to start a scrap book. You obviously have the time.

[thenodrog]

Mathias

Hey I spotted him yesterday on the touchline. I thought it was some old geezer who had started wandering and I was just about to help him back to his seat when I found out who he was.

[The Prof.]

that was before this week wasnt it. when he could not get the work permit?

yesterday, START said they had not received any bid from anyone. there is interrest from rovers, arse, french and spanish clubs.

why would svein mathisen all of a sudden start lying?

This links to my above points - havn't they seen enough of him? We could potentially have lost £10m on the Bentley transfer by refusing to buy him outright in initially. If Annan comes on a loan we'll end up in the same situation with sell on clauses etc. These are not £7-10m players on huge wages are they? In effect they are squad player type fees. Get some perspective on it Rovers.

[T4E]

Hey I spotted him yesterday on the touchline. I thought it was some old geezer who had started wandering and I was just about to help him back to his seat when I found out who he was.

He's just trying to lull us all in to a false sense of security. The doddering old codger routine, oldest trick in the book. Is nothing sacred to this guy?!

[The Prof.]

I knew you were bone-headed, but I didn't have you down as thick.

How many times do we have to go over this?

Bentley and Friedel were happy at your club. Their circumstances changed. Bentley reverted to type and eventually got a move. Brad got a wonder contract at Villa and left.

You had him signing for Man City because he liked the goalkeeping coach.

Feel free to start a scrap book. You obviously have the time.

Ignore Gordon for now Nicko - Who is making the buy/loan/trial decisions at Ewood?

[hawkiiz]

This links to my above points - havn't they seen enough of him? We could potentially have lost £10m on the Bentley transfer by refusing to buy him outright in initially. If Annan comes on a loan we'll end up in the same situation with sell on clauses etc. These are not £7-10m players on huge wages are they? In effect they are squad player type fees. Get some perspective on it Rovers.

i think so to. and i believe annan will be sold sometime between 8 o'clock tonight and midday wednesday. who get him i have no idea, but rovers can get him if they want.

[nicko]

that was before this week wasnt it. when he could not get the work permit?

yesterday, START said they had not received any bid from anyone. there is interrest from rovers, arse, french and spanish clubs.

why would svein mathisen all of a sudden start lying?

Rovers have been watching Annan for months...since he first came over a year ago. He was asked over just to let the new manager see and give his approval. Check John Williams's very positive quotes. Then, the manager decides to go down another route with both Annan and Keith Andrews - and revert to moving for the MK Dons player.

Start have had an approach from a Spanish side, willing to pay more money than either Rovers or Arsenal were/are talking about. However the player wants to come to England AND play.

[donis1410]

nicko

players I would like to come in:

RIGHT WING - Seb Larsson or Joaquin

CENTRAL MID - Keightly or Annan

UPFRONT (if benni leaves) - Poldolski

Do you think we have a chance or will be going in for any of the above?

[thenodrog]

No matter how many words you wrote after that you have plainly been proven wrong / misinformed.

I knew you were bone-headed, but I didn't have you down as thick.

How many times do we have to go over this?

Bentley and Friedel were happy at your club. Their circumstances changed. Bentley reverted to type and eventually got a move. Brad got a wonder contract at Villa and left.

You had him signing for Man City because he liked the goalkeeping coach.

Feel free to start a scrap book. You obviously have the time.

Hook, line and sinker! Ever heard the term 'Pride comes before a fall'? Just admit it.... you were wrong at the time. You'll only make it worse for yourself in the long run if you don't. G'wan you'll feel better for it I'm sure.

btw I'm still of the opinion that if Villa had not come in once he'd decided to go that he would be at City. But just like you I'll never know for sure will I?

Cue hordes of nickoteens lining up to defend their 'Master Po'.

[nicko]

Nicko - Who is making the buy/loan/trial decisions at Ewood?

It's a combination of existing and new targets...and depends on the player in question.

Annan was on the books, had to be checked and then the manager gives a decision.

Castillo was a new name, brought in by the manager - with the chairman doing the arrangements - and the manager ultimately said no thanks.

Villanueva was off DVDs, the chairman does the finances, but the manager made the decision.

Fowler is obviously the manager's decision - as will be whether he stays or not.

Robinson speaks for itself.

Simpson was a bit of a freak of nature.

Andrews will be the manager's decision, but the board will have to back him.

The manager tells the chairman who he wants and the chairman tells him what the cost is - and how it fits.

I believe a manager should ultimately decide who he wants or you have trouble ahead. If he gets it wrong, he gets sacked in time. If the chairman or the board get it wrong, who is accountable?

[The Prof.]

Rovers have been watching Annan for months...since he first came over a year ago. He was asked over just to let the new manager see and give his approval. Check John Williams's very positive quotes. Then, the manager decides to go down another route with both Annan and Keith Andrews - and revert to moving for the MK Dons player.

Start have had an approach from a Spanish side, willing to pay more money than either Rovers or Arsenal were/are talking about. However the player wants to come to England AND play.

Thanks Nicko - i think Ince should be in charge - perhaps regarding JW and Ince, maybe they could talk a bit more.