[Archived] Keith Andrews - Rovers Newest Signing

[Jonnolad]

Can't believe I'm allowing myself to get involved in this, but -

The last point you made was a hypothetical one about Sir Alex Ferguson signing Keith Andrews and playing him in the Champions League final. Yet, at the start of the sentence you pointed out yourself that Sir Alex Ferguson would never be at all interested in signing Keith Andrews.

So what do you think that proved, exactly?

Let me ask you one question. Is your entire point that since Sam Allardyce has given Keith Andrews a game in the Premier League, that means he's a good player? If not, what is your point? Please try to sum up succinctly and try to hold in the verbal diarrhea.

But Sam Allardyce hasn't given Keith a game in the Premier League though has he? Sam Allardyce has started Keith Andrews in the vast majority of Premier League games since he became manager - he even starts him out of position. Therefore it surely wouldn't be a crazy assumption to say that Sam Allardyce consistently choosing Andrews to start means he actually thinks the player is decent. Yet a number of posters are suggesting this is in fact a crazy assumption - Den says Sam Allardyce consistently choosing Keith Andrews to start isn't an indication of Sam's assessment of the player either way. Go figure.

My point is and always has been Andrews is a decent player incidentally. This is backed up by all the points Den has kindly listed - mysteriously it has never been countered by any points from the detractors to back up their view, only excuses to attempt to explain my points away.

[T4E]

Believe it. On the one hand you claim not to read his posts and yet feel the need to add to a debate about points that Jonno has made (how does that work), you then very eloquently point out that a fellow member of the board is a freak and wants to have a sexual relationship with Andrews, which I must add furthered the debate greatly.

Debate: To engage in argument by discussing opposing points all I see at the moment are people attacking a member for holding a point of view and as it is different to theirs people feel the urge to insult!

I actually don't think my opinion is different to Jonno's. I personally think Andrews is a decent enough squad player, no more than that, but I would accept anything over 2m for him. I have no idea what Jonno's opinion on that is, because I've drowned in his 120 odd posts. Hence why I asked him to clarify in my last post.

[LeChuck]

A thing worth noting...imy6 and BuckyRover were two of Ince's biggest sympathisers when he was here. I reckon if we brought Shaun Goater out of retirement they'd tell us he was good enough. I wish I hadn't made a childish reply to the 'covered in glory' post now because I thought of serious point instead. Never mind though.

A big point in the debate has gone missing somewhere - the argument (for a while at least) was whether Sam was selecting him because he rates him or because his hand was forced by injuries.

Did Andrews play in midfield at all for the last 10 games or so? Seems to me he was either on the bench or being an emergency right back. With Jacobsen signed and Emerton back, I think we'll really see next season whether Sam rates him or not. My guess is he'll hardly start games at all.

[T4E]

But Sam Allardyce hasn't given Keith a game in the Premier League though has he? Sam Allardyce has started Keith Andrews in the vast majority of Premier League games since he became manager - he even starts him out of position. Therefore it surely wouldn't be a crazy assumption to say that Sam Allardyce consistently choosing Andrews to start means he actually thinks the player is decent. Yet a number of posters are suggesting this is in fact a crazy assumption - Den says Sam Allardyce consistently choosing Keith Andrews to start isn't an indication of Sam's assessment of the player either way. Go figure.

My point is and always has been Andrews is a decent player incidentally.

The bit in bold there isn't something to be latched on to - I wasn't suggesting Sam had only given Andrews one game. It was just a turn of phrase.

So the corrolation is, Sam thinks he's good enough, therefore he's undeniably good enough? Seems like a bit of a leap - what's wrong with everyone judging for themselves?

[imy9]

I actually don't think my opinion is different to Jonno's. I personally think Andrews is a decent enough squad player, no more than that, but I would accept anything over 2m for him. I have no idea what Jonno's opinion on that is, because I've drowned in his 120 odd posts. Hence why I asked him to clarify in my last post.

You couldnt have said that before insulting him? I havent read 120 posts from Jonno, probably about 10 but got the jist of his argument pretty quickly, surely an intelligent man like yourself could have done so too

[Jonnolad]

I actually don't think my opinion is different to Jonno's. I personally think Andrews is a decent enough squad player, no more than that, but I would accept anything over 2m for him. I have no idea what Jonno's opinion on that is, because I've drowned in his 120 odd posts. Hence why I asked him to clarify in my last post.

Then why do you feel the need to resort to insults?

I'll guarentee you wouldn't do it if we were discussing this face to face, so to do it here seems weak.

[spencey7]

So the corrolation is, Sam thinks he's good enough, therefore he's undeniably good enough? Seems like a bit of a leap - what's wrong with everyone judging for themselves?

Herein lies the great divide on BRFCS.com:

The "Sam Knows Best" Crowd vs Those Who Think For Themselves.

[Jonnolad]

The bit in bold there isn't something to be latched on to - I wasn't suggesting Sam had only given Andrews one game. It was just a turn of phrase.

So the corrolation is, Sam thinks he's good enough, therefore he's undeniably good enough? Seems like a bit of a leap - what's wrong with everyone judging for themselves?

No, I'm saying that he's good enough for all the reasons that Den listed, not just for that reason (I can't be arsed re-listing them - scroll back a couple of pages for yourself).

I've no problem with people holding a different view mind, but don't take the hump if I point out you have nothing to back up that opinion and there's is a host of stuff which points to the contrary. Seems fairly simple to me.

[imy9]

A thing worth noting...imy6 and BuckyRover were two of Ince's biggest sympathisers when he was here. I reckon if we brought Shaun Goater out of retirement they'd tell us he was good enough. I wish I hadn't made a childish reply to the 'covered in glory' post now because I thought of serious point instead. Never mind though.

A big point in the debate has gone missing somewhere - the argument (for a while at least) was whether Sam was selecting him because he rates him or because his hand was forced by injuries.

Did Andrews play in midfield at all for the last 10 games or so? Seems to me he was either on the bench or being an emergency right back. With Jacobsen signed and Emerton back, I think we'll really see next season whether Sam rates him or not. My guess is he'll hardly start games at all.

Which automatically means that we must be incorrect about Andrews, neat theory. Imy9 Lechuc felt that after the Portsmouth game Ince's reign should be over, unlike many I wanted to give him a chance, he failed and we suffered but I am giving the same support for Sam. Hindsight is a wonderful thing

Shaun Goater was never a top international player and one of the greatest premier league players ever was he? Oh right becuase I think that was the reason I willing to give Fowler a chance on a pay as you play deal.

[T4E]

You couldnt have said that before insulting him?

Unfortunately not.

Then why do you feel the need to resort to insults?

I'll guarentee you wouldn't do it if we were discussing this face to face, so to do it here seems weak.

If we were face to face and you went on and on and on and on and on about Keith Andrews I would have no problem telling you that you are a freak. Or was it the bit about bumming you didnt like?

[Jonnolad]

Herein lies the great divide on BRFCS.com:

The "Sam Knows Best" Crowd vs Those Who Think For Themselves.

But it's not just the "Sam knows best" crowd though is it.

It's those who think for themselves, Sam knows best, Trappatoni knows best, Roy Hodgson knows best, stats know best, journalists know best vs those who think for themselves.

That's the very clear problem Andrews detractors like yourself have - you have nothing to back up your opinion than "I know best". That's fine but don't pretend it's anything different.

[imy9]

Unfortunately not.

If we were face to face and you went on and on and on and on and on about Keith Andrews I would have no problem telling you that you are a freak. Or was it the bit about bumming you didnt like?

Thats a shame I thought that you had more intelligence and class then to resort to cheap insults.

[Jonnolad]

If we were face to face and you went on and on and on and on and on about Keith Andrews I would have no problem telling you that you are a freak. Or was it the bit about bumming you didnt like?

Big man eh, lol

No worries though fella - pm me before the next home match.

[T4E]

Big man eh, lol

No worries though fella - pm me before the next home match.

Er.........dude.............I'm not really in to that sort of thing.........

[den]

Den says Sam Allardyce consistently choosing Keith Andrews to start isn't an indication of Sam's assessment of the player either way.

For goodness sake, again you don't read what people say. You twist words continually.

I said that Allardyce picking KA doesn't mean he's a good Prem player. Totally and completely different.

[spencey7]

That's the very clear problem Andrews detractors like yourself have - you have nothing to back up your opinion than "I know best".

How about the fact that he languished in the lower leagues for his entire career up until his best mate bought him for Blackburn?

Er.........dude.............I'm not really in to that sort of thing.........

[BuckyRover]

I thought he had played in the Premiership with Wolves?

[cn174]

I thought he had played in the Premiership with Wolves?

I just had a look on Soccerbase, it doesn't seem like he did play for them in the Prem.

[BuckyRover]

"To gain playing time, he spent half of the 2003–04 season on loan at Stoke City and the latter half at Walsall. He did however return to Molineux in between to make his only Premier League appearance (against Newcastle United)."

Source: Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Andrews_(footballer))

[S15]

Andrews is crap. We all know he's crap, and none of us want him in the team. The only reason people are arguing is because they dislike each other more than they dislike Andrews.

Either way sell him, he's crap.

[broadsword]

On and on it goes, where it'll stop, nobody knows!

[imy9]

Andrews is crap. We all know he's crap, and none of us want him in the team. The only reason people are arguing is because they dislike each other more than they dislike Andrews.

Either way sell him, he's crap.

you don't speak for me,andrews is not crap,his performance against Italy highlighted that one for me

[den]

One final go at summing up this thread.

Plenty of people think he's a decent squad member. The majority of these don't want him to be starting regularly.

Plenty of people simply don't think he's good enough - end of.

A small minority of people think he is good enough for this league and would be happy to see him starting regularly.

Anyone disagree with that?

[BuckyRover]

Den's final thought

Summed up well.

[FourLaneBlue]

you don't speak for me,andrews is not crap,his performance against Italy highlighted that one for me

Andrews is not crap you are right. It is just that he is not very good either. As part of the squad he is ok but he does not have the quality we require to be a regular starter. Must say I am disappointed we did not take the Fulham money if it was near the 2 million or so suggested as it would have represented a good profit and allowed us not to have use...how shall I say this...such decent but very limited players.

However, if it had been Sam or Hughes who had brought him in instead of Ince he would not have been vilified quite as much. There is a whiff of him being Ince's golden boy and that association has tainted him - along with his career path - somewhat out of perspective to what he has done on the pitch.