[Archived] Fans Forum (2/09/08)

[yoda]

this has to be the most funniest post in years ,well worth a grooby!!!! improved the image of the rovers .You mustnt talk to people in town then.Imgoing to ask how will it bring 5-10 more fans ,please show me evidence of your ramblings.We have people around us at ewood and they was asked would they or bring more into the ground with a prayer room ,their exact words were "will it (Please don't use that word again) as like,its bullshit man".

have thoughtsd for other religions?????WHY!!

ITS A FOOTY GROUND FFS NOT A BLOODY PLACE FOR PRAYING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I THINK ABOUT WINNING IN A FOOTBALL GROUND AND DONT GIVE A FLYING ###### IF THE PEOPLE BEHIND ME ARE BLACK ,WHITE ,PINK,BROWN OR WHATEVER ,THERES ONE RELIGION ON ON A SAT AFTERNOON AND THATS BLACKBURN ROVERS....

Correct

[leftfooter]

hi, I hope you don't mind but I've taken out some of your unnecessary qualifiers so that it reads more like the race war epithet it is intended to be. It should now fit nicely on the back of an A5 combat 18 fleaflet if you wish.

you do know that even christianity has it's fair share of nut jobs too?

Your little nugget of voluntary self-delusion was well anticipated.

Whilst it is true that Leviticus does have its fair share of gouging of eyes and stoning of unbelievers, this might come as a surprise to you, but since then there has been the New Testament (you know love thy neighbour, Jack Smethhurst and all that?) and nearly half a millennium ago the West experienced the Renaissance (you know the triumph of science and reason over superstition and religious indoctrination?).

Today, there are 57 member countries of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference (as many as Heinz varieties), of which 41 sign up to state persecution of adulterous women and homosexuals and ten have decreed that they be put to death. There are plenty Saudi imported Imams, in Lancashire and elsewhere who preach the same message (and much worse).

How many of the 'Christian nut jobs' you mention are up to the same?

If the club wants this kind of baggage, fine. That's its prerogative, but let's not sneak tit in through the back door of the toilets and let's have an honest debate about it.

[thenodrog]

You're pathetic.

Thats not on Den. Leftfooter has not insulted you so there is no need to go against the guidelines by insulting him. You should know that better than anybody! You really do need to offer more than that Den, or simply back away.

[leftfooter]

You're pathetic.

Tut tut Den.

Get over yourself!

Try to use your brain, that's what people generally do in an open debate, rather than revert to childish cat calling.

[ABBEY]

GORDYWORDY ..your wrong dude!!!

mods ex mods or admin can say what they want....its like a certain admin chappie who thought it ok to adresss people as " a ###### stirring halfwit!" and then offer no apology !!! do as i say not what i do,springs to mind.

[leftfooter]

Thats not on Den. Leftfooter has not insulted you so there is no need to go against the guidelines by insulting him. You should know that better than anybody! You really do need to offer more than that Den, or simply back away.

I never thought I would hear myself utter the immortal words, but...."....Hold my jacket Theno..."

[Hasta]

I suggest putting the issue of the MFR to a vote of all season ticket holders and for those fans that have a record of attending x amount of home matches over a given number of seasons.

That should settle all arguments in a truly democratic fashion.

Would you be against that?

I would imagine leftfooter that most people object to it's location and not the 'whole idea' as you seem to have done in your piece above. If this had been built as a portacabin round the back of the Riverside most people wouldn't really object. I'm sure some would object but on a vote I think you'd find that the majority of people don't object to the building of the room, just it's location.

Whether the whole idea of the MFR is correct (it's even got it's own abbreviation like RFW now !!) I doubt. I don't think long term it will bring any significant number of fans in. However I have no issue with the club for trying it. It has just been poorly planned.

[ABBEY]

gords not here ..ive got yer cowt maty

[thenodrog]

Back on topic....

IMO the Fans Forum is a sham and always will be, aimed at placating the masses with token gestures and so deflecting pressure from the board.

I dunno how it started, I dunno how anybody would get on it if they wanted or felt that they had something to offer. I think one or two have left (Glenn?). I don't think it has a mandate from supporters, it may even be cliqueish but I do think you are being a bit over harsh there MCMC! Every last one of them will be long term BRFC fans concerned enough about the club to give up some of their spare time.

[leftfooter]

hi, I hope you don't mind but I've taken out some of your unnecessary qualifiers so that it reads more like the race war epithet it is intended to be. It should now fit nicely on the back of an A5 combat 18 fleaflet if you wish.

you do know that even christianity has it's fair share of nut jobs too?

Come on then mikeyliu.

You make some quite brazen and unsubstantiated assertions, supported by no reason or intellectual rigour.

I've answered you x 2 and yet you have absolutely nothing to offer in reply.

Where are you; too busy looking through Wikipedia??

[MCMC1875]

I dunno how it started, I dunno how anybody would get on it if they wanted or felt that they had something to offer. I think one or two have left (Glenn?). I don't think it has a mandate from supporters, it may even be cliqueish but I do think you are being a bit over harsh there MCMC! Every last one of them will be long term BRFC fans concerned enough about the club to give up some of their spare time.

I don't doubt their commitment for one minute Theno (I know Neil D) but my point is that it is an undemocratic, unaccountable waste of time.

[den]

GORDYWORDY ..your wrong dude!!!

mods ex mods or admin can say what they want....its like a certain admin chappie who thought it ok to adresss people as " a ###### stirring halfwit!" and then offer no apology !!! do as i say not what i do,springs to mind.

Abbey, this thread is a feedback of the minutes from the fans forum. The FF can only reasonably discuss the siting of the "multi faith" room and any effect it might have on the BBE supporters. They can also point out to the club, that in their opinion, the club is wrong if they try to impose any kind of positive religious discrimination. They really can't get involved with the evils of all those horrible Muslim people, - or do you think they can?

Unfortunately the topic is being dragged off course, and the reason why I ask that it's closed, is because everything that can be said, has been said. We're now verging [if we haven't already done] on the offensive side of this topic. Plus, if you want to have a go at me being able to say what I want without any responsibility to the mods, then you're wrong. The same rules apply to me, as they do to you.

[thenodrog]

but my point is that it is an undemocratic, unaccountable waste of time.

I'll have to concede on 2 out of 3 I suppose MCMC.

[mikeyliu]

Come on then mikeyliu.

You make some quite brazen and unsubstantiated assertions, supported by no reason or intellectual rigour.

I've answered you x 2 and yet you have absolutely nothing to offer in reply.

Where are you; too busy looking through Wikipedia??

I’m being called out? How sweet.

I haven’t made any brazen and unsubstantiated assertions as you have stated, but I can do now. The post you made earlier was deliberately and clearly written to be as full of racist, hate fuelled and provocative language as possible. That is clearly evidenced.

My point about christianity is that, yes, as with islam, there are a fair number of moderates, but there is still a lot of the world where you can’t have an abortion under any circumstances, wear a condom or bang a fella. As advised by the christian bible. But with islam, you have similarly singled out their most extreme abhorrences but equally applied it to every muslim in Blackburn.

I don’t want to get into an extended argument with you, I’m too hungover and do not have your ‘intellectual rigour’. Wikipedia or not. What do you want me to say to make you stop?

[American]

you do know that even christianity has it's fair share of nut jobs too?

But the club hasn't done anything to attract more Christians. How about turning down Sunday fixtures as not to interfere with the Sabbath?

You're pathetic.

Real mature, Dennis.

[den]

Real mature, Dennis.

I don't suffer racists easily American.

[67splitscreen]

I have a few points regarding the MFPR, I would like some opinion on.

Given it's new location.

I an really finding it hard to understand how it could ever have got past feasibility study.

1. Is it for Staff (who I assume have free access to all parts of the ground) if it is for all, then point 2 negates that IMO.

2, If it is for all, as you cannot move from one stand to another, how is access gained from Eg. JW stands. Then point 3. negates in my IMO.

3. If access is not permitted from other areas during match days, is this not religious segregation. or do you accept you will have to move to the River side stand to watch your football and use the MFR.

4. As another poster mentioned, how do females from Islam participate in prayer. Is this not in it's self. prejudicial.

These are just some of the points, when answered, would allow for me to make a fairer opinion on the merits of it's integration into the stadium.

Having said that I do not believe it will increase the fan base for our club, by one single season ticket, so unless it was installed purely for point 1. it is a complete waste of money, and space.

[leftfooter]

Abbey, this thread is a feedback of the minutes from the fans forum. The FF can only reasonably discuss the siting of the "multi faith" room and any effect it might have on the BBE supporters. They can also point out to the club, that in their opinion, the club is wrong if they try to impose any kind of positive religious discrimination. They really can't get involved with the evils of all those horrible Muslim people, - or do you think they can?

Unfortunately the topic is being dragged off course, and the reason why I ask that it's closed, is because everything that can be said, has been said. We're now verging [if we haven't already done] on the offensive side of this topic. Plus, if you want to have a go at me being able to say what I want without any responsibility to the mods, then you're wrong. The same rules apply to me, as they do to you.

1. the club is wrong if they try to impose any kind of positive religious discrimination:

So why then the inclusion of scripture from the Abrahamic/Patriarchal religions only?

That's discriminatory in itself isn't it?

Should the club not provide similar materials for: Hindus, Buddhists, Jains, Zoroastrians, Bahai, Scientologists etc…. so they might have access to their sacred literature?

2. We're now verging [if we haven't already done] on the offensive side of this topic:

Which supports the contention of those arguing that it's impossible not to cause offence to somebody when discussing or practicing one's religion. A Moslem encountering a Hindu praying before an idol of an animal is just about as offensive as it gets in Islam. There are laws laid down in the hadiths how one should react to such a situation.

The point is it should be an entirely private matter - certainly not one promoted by a local and publicly amenable football club. One only needs to look at the insidiously destructive role that religion plays in Scottish football ritual to realise how lucky we are in England, that religious tribalism is generally absent when we step into a football ground.

So why the siren calls to for its sudden introduction at Blackburn Rovers?

Besides, you weren't actually offended by what I wrote were you? You just did what most people do in this country when intellectually challenged (particularly what masquerades as the 'Left'); i.e: retreat from reason; revert to character assassination and thereby try to shut down legitimate debate.

[ABBEY]

Abbey, this thread is a feedback of the minutes from the fans forum. The FF can only reasonably discuss the siting of the "multi faith" room and any effect it might have on the BBE supporters. They can also point out to the club, that in their opinion, the club is wrong if they try to impose any kind of positive religious discrimination. They really can't get involved with the evils of all those horrible Muslim people, - or do you think they can?

Unfortunately the topic is being dragged off course, and the reason why I ask that it's closed, is because everything that can be said, has been said. We're now verging [if we haven't already done] on the offensive side of this topic. Plus, if you want to have a go at me being able to say what I want without any responsibility to the mods, then you're wrong. The same rules apply to me, as they do to you.

wasnt having a go you den ,if it came that way im sorry.But in your words of when you was a mod,let the mods mod,yet there ok when admin dish out personal attacks its ok..Den this club of ours has managed to attract fans from all races and communtities over the past 100 odd years without the need of a prayer room,why now in 2008? whats changed has this club suddenly thought weve all become bible bashing roverites? or is there hidden agendas.?

[mikeyliu]

But the club hasn't done anything to attract more Christians. How about turning down Sunday fixtures as not to interfere with the Sabbath?

I'm sure Sky would love that! Anyway, my point was there is bad christianity just as there is bad islam