[Archived] 2 Million Unemployed By Christmas

[jim mk2]

  Hughesy said:

Anyone on here trade in shares alot?

Trading in shares is a mug's game; investing in well-managed companies for the long term however can be extremely rewarding.

Sorry to be killjoy but day-trading get-rich-quick doesn't work.

[Hughesy]

Iv got a family friend is a multi millionaire from trading in shares and property. It cant be that much of a mugs game surely??

Do you invest in shares Jim?

[American]

  Hughesy said:

Iv got a family friend is a multi millionaire from trading in shares and property. It cant be that much of a mugs game surely??

Do you invest in shares Jim?

One of the few times I have to agree with Jim. The best way to consistently make money by investing in shares is to use someone else's money. That way you get paid no matter what.

[blue phil]

  jim mk2 said:

Sorry to be killjoy but day-trading get-rich-quick doesn't work.

It must be bloody working for someone - otherwise shares wouldn't be going up and down like a yo-yo in HBOS all day ! All that money's going somewhere - and didn't Soros make a few billion in a day or so a few years back ?

I suppose inside information and a big pot to start with does help a bit .

  Rovermatt said:

I don't recall anyone 'lobbying' for such threads to be closed, rather the mods took the initiative and even explained the reasoning again and again and again.

Good grief - you must be a selective reader , Matt . I refer you to the Fans Forum thread

[thenodrog]

  Rovermatt said:

The topics banned were those relating to religion, race and immigration. This was explained clearly at the time, yet STILL you are trotting out this line. These were hugely divisive threads that caused no little friction on the board. Things are a lot more civilised now that such things have been taken off the agenda. These are not the only topics constituting 'current affairs' though you continue, by design or not, to miss this point. I don't recall anyone 'lobbying' for such threads to be closed, rather the mods took the initiative and even explained the reasoning again and again and again.

Just a thought Matt....... if thats the case then why did you need to do it .... err... again?

You haven't designs on becoming a mod yourself have you?

  Rovermatt said:

The firm I work for had to lay off 5 people recently, including two solicitors (both of whom were conveyancers). The downturn in the conveyancing market - bread and butter, and cashflow, for any high street law firm - got the partners very twitcy and they took immediate action to protect the payments on their Porsche's, race horses and holiday villas. The banks were simply not lending (though they are loosening their purse strings a bit now) and thus people were unable to buy property, slowing the work flowing into the legal profession. This isn't something you hear much about on the news but I can assure it's a real problem.

Yeah Matt, I'm sure it is tough ........ for conveyancers.

[jim mk2]

  Hughesy said:

Iv got a family friend is a multi millionaire from trading in shares and property. It cant be that much of a mugs game surely??

Do you invest in shares Jim?

Yes, but indirectly through unit and investment trusts.

Dull but lucrative if you have a long horizon.

If you want excitement I suggest you stick to the nags ; day trading is shares is a good way of losing money.

[thenodrog]

  jim mk2 said:

If you want excitement I suggest you stick to the nags ; day trading is shares is a good way of losing money.

And betting on horses isn't?

[AussieinUk]

  jim mk2 said:

Trading in shares is a mug's game; investing in well-managed companies for the long term however can be extremely rewarding.

Sorry to be killjoy but day-trading get-rich-quick doesn't work.

You haven't clue.. stick to being a retired hack. Muppet!

You heard of Quant Trading? All banks prop trade

[AussieinUk]

I cannot edit my post above, for some strange reason.

So I'll continue...

Hughesy, you can be successful.. trust me. Day trading is based on 'short term' trading windows of 1-14 days, either going ‘short’ or ‘long’ in your positioning.

My advice;

1. Access to good information & key data, coupled with an understanding of market correlations, is very, very useful in one's approach. Having a decent start-up margin also helps.

2. It depends on the products you invest in. Options, Futures, CFD's (tax-free), Currency's, Indices or straight Equity speculation, can be extremely rewarding.

3. Being rigid in your approach and taking 'long term' views only, is being totally narrow-minded and illustrates complete ignorance... especially in this volatile market place.

I can recommend several good books/authors that can help you on this, if you want?

Btw - I work in investment banking for a tier 1 bank in Equity Derivs and have done so for the last 9 years, so I know what I am talking about... I also worked in Asset Management for 3 years, so I have a balanced approach.

[Hughesy]

Sounds good mate - please let me know want I need to be looking at.

Can you explain point 1 again please? What sort of info & key data are we talking about?

[AussieinUk]

  Hughesy said:

Sounds good mate - please let me know want I need to be looking at.

Can you explain point 1 again please? What sort of info & key data are we talking about?

No worries.

Briefly, access to Bloomberg data (technical indicators), Upcoming market release information (provided by most decent broker websites) and correlations of commodities/equities/indicies and currencies (this is very important). A good example of correlations was the massive drop on global inidices yesterday and the huge rise on gold futures (i.e these are inversely related).

I'll PM the books & authors and I'll explain a bit more on what key data is used/required and some good websites that will form a basis to work with. My recommendation is to digest the vast amount of information (which is always at hand) and paper trade to begin with.

I also have a correlations file that is very useful (its excel based).

[dave birch]

Aussie, whilst I understand that you know how these things operate, (I have had an FP licence in Aust), it's not the best to get someone who is a complete novice involved at a time where things are so unpredictable and change in seconds. It's a business that you need to be on top of 24 hours a day if you are going to trade.

Hughsey, only commit money that you can afford to lose, if that goes, give it away.

Having said that, I'm totally ###### off I haven't been trading currencies.

[AussieinUk]

  dave birch said:

Aussie, whilst I understand that you know how these things operate, (I have had an FP licence in Aust), it's not the best to get someone who is a complete novice involved at a time where things are so unpredictable and change in seconds. It's a business that you need to be on top of 24 hours a day if you are going to trade.

Hughsey, only commit money that you can afford to lose, if that goes, give it away.

Having said that, I'm totally ###### off I haven't been trading currencies.

I do agree with everything you have stated (Im CFA qualified), but as long as he reads up on the risks and takes baby steps, it is something that can be quite useful.

I had a mate (when I was at UBS a few years back) that deceided to leave and take this up full time (with wife and kids). He made enough crust to outweigh his banking salary by quite a margin. Although, becoming a day-trading junkie, he lost all his friends and never left the house. Was trading all markets at all times of the day.. After 14 months, had to get back to a '9-5' role, as the quality of life was not worth it.

It can become very addictive, but with all things in life its;

A. Find a balance

B. Never be too greedy

C. If, possible hedge/basket your risk

Personally, I am loving this volatility..

[Rovermatt]

  thenodrog said:

Just a thought Matt....... if thats the case then why did you need to do it .... err... again?

You haven't designs on becoming a mod yourself have you?

Probably as some people still don't grasp it. And no, I have no 'designs on becoming a mod'.

  Quote

Yeah Matt, I'm sure it is tough ........ for conveyancers.

That's what I just said.

[jim mk2]

  Hughesy said:

Sounds good mate - please let me know want I need to be looking at.

Can you explain point 1 again please? What sort of info & key data are we talking about?

I would strongly advise you not to get involved in day trading.

It's OK for professionals (and I use that term loosely because it is so-called professionals in the banking/investment world who are largely responsible for the current economic turmoil) gambling with other people's money but you could end up with serious losses. Remember this is your own hard-earned money you are gambling with.

Do your own research on the internet and you will find plenty of stories of those who have tried it and been burnt badly. If you have a sum that you are prepared to lose then go ahead, but be prepared to lose the lot.

I have been investing in the stockmarket for more than 40 years, seen umpteen crashes and asset bubbles but have stuck to my guns and done very well indeed. Investing for the long term works.

[broadsword]

It does pay to be risk-averse. Or at the very least, spread the risk with a variety of investments.

I've worked my azz off to get out of the red and into the black ... and what I have, I hold.

[Jimbo]

  Hughesy said:

If id of gone with my hunch yesterday then id of made myself £150 today on an investment of just £1000. Kicking myself now! Iv picked a few that im going to start analysing and monitoring performance.

Are you sure about that - The shares hit 88p yesterday morning would you have kept your nerve through it ? It's easy to say could have, would have, when you don't have stake in it, but it's a bit different if your £1000 is now worth £600.

Outside of the trading floor the only sensible option in investing in share is to take a long term view - in these volatile markets the price can jump all over the place and when you haven't got access to real-time data you are at least 15 minutes behind the curve and you will get burned.

Remember all prices you will see, will be delayed and in the case of the FTSE that's a minium of 15 minutes and NYSE 20, the market can have moved a lot in that time

[Billy Castell]

If I had money to speculate, I'd have some long term stuff, and a little to buy and sell shares or currency.

[Hughesy]

What went as low as 88p? Not the ones im monitoring! I got some sound advice so im monitoring a particular company.

Im monitoring them each day at the moment. Iv set myself up with a sheet to monitor the performance based on what buying & selling criteria I have set myself.

Yesterday I would of made £146 and today another £62.

Im just doing it paper/ fantasy based at the moment to get used to my strategy and see how it works.

[Jimbo]

Sorry I made the assumption you were talking about HBOS - but as they say caveat emptor - be careful out there, I'm sitting here watching the markets on my Reuters screen & I certainly wouldn't be chucking my money into that pot at the moment ( not that I know what I'm doing )

[ABBEY]

well alls i can say is i hope the biatch in the halifax in town loses her job and ends up on crack and prostituting her skanky ugly body on clayton st ,for not locking my joint account when asked to do so and allowing my ex to wipe me out 4 years ago...in the words of the messiah...ID LOVE IT.

[Billy Castell]

You should have wiped it out first Abbey. All's fair when you are divorcing a woman. Just be thankful you didn't marry Heather Mills.

[ABBEY]

it would have been cheaper billy!!!

wouldnt have cost her an arm and leg hahaha

just an arm

[grizfoot]

  Hughesy said:

Anyone on here trade in shares alot?

I'm good at Sportdaq does that count.

[thenodrog]

  ABBEY said:

well alls i can say is i hope the biatch in the halifax in town loses her job and ends up on crack and prostituting her skanky ugly body on clayton st ,for not locking my joint account when asked to do so and allowing my ex to wipe me out 4 years ago...in the words of the messiah...ID LOVE IT.

She's in the wrong union! You should have asked a bloke.