[Archived] Paul's Progress

[CrazyIvan]

  1864roverite said:

Rovers had 7 pre season games as well as 4 league games to acquire the said replacement, the fact is despite your claims we failed to get the player even though we had been trying for a number of weeks.

If Rovers had identified the player earmarked as a replacement, then you would have expected in this day and age that if number 1 priority failed then the number 2 option would have been followed up, like a plan B after plan A.

Apparently that is exactly what the club did. This is the same old ground and the same old argument thrown out in defense of a increasingly poor position.

[imy9]

  1864roverite said:

So what your saying DB is that all the time, pre season and right up to the deadline, you were happy in the "knowledge" that PI was looking to secure an aqequate replacement for Bentley and that you "happy" with the NEGATIVE outcome of those efforts ?

Rovers had 7 pre season games as well as 4 league games to acquire the said replacement, the fact is despite your claims we failed to get the player even though we had been trying for a number of weeks.

If Rovers had identified the player earmarked as a replacement, then you would have expected in this day and age that if number 1 priority failed then the number 2 option would have been followed up, like a plan B after plan A.

PPPPPP - is a pneumonic that really does have a meaning.

Prior Planning Prevents ###### Poor Performance.

It really is as simple as that IMO.

OK, so what is your reasoning behind Hughes not signing a defensive midfield or an attacking midfield player in the last two years? Surely having had FOUR years to assess the squad that was long enough for him to know what we the 'fans' already know?

What I am really happy about is that we havent spent £15 on Pavlechneko, £11 million on Elmander, etc in a blind panic, which is what you are potentially suggetsing we do when option 1 and 2, stop being options.

I want a right sided player, we NEED a right sided player but I dont want a panic buy and commend Ince for this.

[92er]

  imy9 said:

OK, so what is your reasoning behind Hughes not signing a defensive midfield or an attacking midfield player in the last two years? Surely having had FOUR years to assess the squad that was long enough for him to know what we the 'fans' already know?

MH signed Vogel as a defensive midfielder around January time-there were allegations he wanted to get someone better, but was denied funds.

I would suggest MH knew the deficiencies of the squad but didn't have the funds to bring in the attacking midfielder you suggest. Or he might have thought Dunn was the answer.

The more interesting question for me is why was MH, who had an exceptional record of bringing in players on the cheap and then along with his background staff helped increase the value of the players, not given anywhere near the funds that a rookie manager will have at his disposal in January and apparently had in August?

I have absolutley no idea, but I did find an article by Stewart Robson in the Sunday Telegraph a few weeks ago interesting; he was writing a preview of a Manchester City match in which he referred to MH's "dictatorial approach". It just made me wonder if he did have such an approach and if he had gotten up the noses of the people that run the Rovers. Very sad if it was the case.

[Exiled in Toronto]

  ABBEY said:

and if they do they would be wrong.

The press are usually wrong, but they don't care.

As Gumboots says; there is no other logical reason for the fans of a team in 9th place and in the cup to be booing a manager's every move, so the answer must be an illogical one.

Why do you think fans are so unhappy when we have made a better start than Hughes ever did?

[92er]

  Exiled in Toronto said:

The press are usually wrong, but they don't care.

As Gumboots says; there is no other logical reason for the fans of a team in 9th place and in the cup to be booing a manager's every move, so the answer must be an illogical one.

Why do you think fans are so unhappy when we have made a better start than Hughes ever did?

Another poster has recently stated that this time last season we had more points than we do now; we were also still in the cup.

I don't know who booed, I don't know how many people booed. I also believe that a lot of fans who go to the matches are not anti-Ince but are waiting to be convinced by him-I just presume some of the fans didn't want Villanueva to be replaced by Andrews.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

  92er said:

Another poster has recently stated that this time last season we had more points than we do now; we were also still in the cup.

I don't know who booed, I don't know how many people booed. I also believe that a lot of fans who go to the matches are not anti-Ince but are waiting to be convinced by him-I just presume some of the fans didn't want Villanueva to be replaced by Andrews.

I thought Villanueva was replaced by Derbs ?

[92er]

  DavidMailsTightPerm said:

I thought Villanueva was replaced by Derbs ?

You are quite right-I have just checked the LT. Sorry.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

  LeChuck said:

Not true at all. There's a direct quote from Ince somewhere about that fee, and it was in excess of 4 million. I worked out what it came to in pounds and it was 3.2 million. A lot of money for a distinctly average 28 year old.

LeChuck - I am interested, do you watch a lot of Italian football or are you judging Grella on 1/2 a match against West Ham ?

For all the Ince detractors on here - I can't remember any manager in Rovers recent history so willing to change the team and the squad around.

We have had so many different teams it is unbelievable. But for the first time - we are actually using the squad to its fullest. This has led to some reasonable performances by some youngsters - that had been patiently knocking on the door under MH.

I am undecided on Ince - but this aspect of his management does fill me with hope. Up to press - he seems to have picked sides to suit the opposition. His biggest - and most obvious plunders were against Arsenal and United - but there is no shame in that.

I still worry about where Ince is taking us - but feel strangely excited that we could have a really exciting young manager. Rovers only chance of being up near the top half of the EPL is to take a risk - they have with Ince - everybody with Rovers best interests at heart should be willing him to succeed, rather than wishing him not to.

  92er said:

You are quite right-I have just checked the LT. Sorry.

I think the decision to boo - is purely a reflection of how the fans view Carlos. He may be caught in possession too often, lose the ball etc etc. But as he nearly showed - one moment of magic and he can score - we don't have anyone else like that.

Personally I think Ince is introducing Carlos gradually - in many ways he should be applauded - rather than Carlos playing too long and picking up injuries.

[thenodrog]

  CrazyIvan said:

I've commented on people throwing the word 'thick' at Ince with no evidence to back them up so that statement is incorrect. This entire thing is one person trying to justify his random and unevidenced comments that denigrate Paul Ince and it has noting or little to do with being PC. No-one has mentioned PC as an issue here before now. The fact that Gordon thinks it's ok to basically use the term 'learning difficulty' as an insult sums up what's wrong with his ideas and if you think that it's ok for him to do that you also need to take a good look at yourself because it's childish and immature at the least. It's just like calling someone four-eyes because they wear glasses. You might joke with a mate about it but using it as an insult is the stuff of school playgrounds.

Am I the only person to see much irony in the criticism on the subject of what constitutes correct terminology from somebody who has chosen the name 'CrazyIvan'!

The term 'Learning difficulty' is recent and so PC it's untrue. Have you read my original post that stirred up all the girlies so much? The fact that it appears to be correct has you lot all stupidly lining up to fight a lost cause.

[thenodrog]

  Exiled in Toronto said:

Sooner or later the press are going to pick up on it, and there are only two possible interpretations:

i) who the f*** do the fans think they are, expecting Laudrup, Pele etc to be crawling over broken glass to be their manager.

ii) Racisim against Paul Ince

Both of which would give us a far worse press than we get even now.

Dont talk shyte and don't play that bloody race card again! I had you down for more intelligence than to fall back on pathetic shitstirring of that type. Obviously I was wrong.

Question for you EiT ............... Do you think I'd be any less scathing if the Wally with the Brolly had got the job (I am led to understand he very nearly did). Would I hell I'd likely be much worse... and he's a bloody ginner ffs! So just button it unless you have damned good reason and firm evidence. You have done yourself no favours.

[dave birch]

  thenodrog said:

The term 'Learning difficulty' is recent and so PC it's untrue.

Sorry, Theno, you're wrong, unless you think 30+ years is recent, and it's hardly "PC" as it's a perfect descriptor for someone with such problems.

[Dave S]

http://www.everychildmatters.gov.uk/delive...ry&id=22885

I think there is a bit more to the learning difficulties debate.

[thenodrog]

  gumboots said:

Don't think he said it was; only that the press may put that interpretation on it

Whatever gumboots but you certainly implied it.

btw for the record having just seen my two complete their education. In my experience many primary school teachers are absolutely clueless in defining or identifying racism. Metaphorically they simply lift up their skirts and scream 'mouse' without thought at every opportunity without putting their brain in gear first. What you are suggesting would be more accurately described as colour prejudice rather than racism but what the hey.... racism is much more emotive isn't it?

I know thats only my opinion but you must admit recent events prove that I'm fairly accurate.

[thenodrog]

  1864roverite said:

So what your saying DB is that all the time, pre season and right up to the deadline, you were happy in the "knowledge" that PI was looking to secure an aqequate replacement for Bentley and that you "happy" with the NEGATIVE outcome of those efforts ?

Isn't it obvious 1864 from his previous post that dinglebaiter must know the all the 'FACTS' and is therefore the only one on here qualified to comment.

[thenodrog]

  Exiled in Toronto said:

Why do you think fans are so unhappy when we have made a better start than Hughes ever did?

The myth continues amongst our resident goldfish members!

This season / last season EiT

http://www.statto.com/football/teams/black...08-2009/results

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/football/bla...ults/2007-2008/

Care to offer a very loud and public retraction on it's own thread EiT? Just so that no one else makes a fool of themselves.

btw

Just a thought on your irational condemnation of all things Hughes and glorification of Ince as well as suggesting that criticism of Ince is racist ....... you aren't of err 'african origin' by any chance?

[thenodrog]

  DavidMailsTightPerm said:

LeChuck - I am interested, do you watch a lot of Italian football or are you judging Grella on 1/2 a match against West Ham ?

A question which might just as easily be directed at Paul Ince DMTP.

[Exiled in Toronto]

  thenodrog said:

Care to offer a very loud and public retraction on it's own thread EiT? Just so that no one else makes a fool of themselves.

btw

Just a thought on your irational condemnation of all things Hughes and glorification of Ince as well as suggesting that criticism of Ince is racist ....... you aren't of err 'african origin' by any chance?

Have you been drinking?

Happy to retract that we are marginally worse off than in the last of Hughes' 3 full seasons at this point. But of course we are much better off than his first two where by now we were in the bottom 3.

  thenodrog said:

Dont talk shyte and don't play that bloody race card again! I had you down for more intelligence than to fall back on pathetic shitstirring of that type. Obviously I was wrong.

Question for you EiT ............... Do you think I'd be any less scathing if the Wally with the Brolly had got the job (I am led to understand he very nearly did). Would I hell I'd likely be much worse... and he's a bloody ginner ffs! So just button it unless you have damned good reason and firm evidence. You have done yourself no favours.

Can't you read? I said it was a possible supposition the scurrulous press might make based on the fact that, as far as I know, the only manager being barracked by his 'fans' is the black one in 9th place.

And I think the one who needs to button it is the empty vessel making the most noise right now

[CrazyIvan]

  thenodrog said:

Am I the only person to see much irony in the criticism on the subject of what constitutes correct terminology from somebody who has chosen the name 'CrazyIvan'!

The term 'Learning difficulty' is recent and so PC it's untrue. Have you read my original post that stirred up all the girlies so much? The fact that it appears to be correct has you lot all stupidly lining up to fight a lost cause.

Grow up Gordon. Look up CrazyIvan and what it is... It's a name I've had on the internet for years so get off your high horse for once and admit your original post was wrong and badly thought out.

[thenodrog]

  CrazyIvan said:

Grow up Gordon. Look up CrazyIvan and what it is... It's a name I've had on the internet for years so get off your high horse for once and admit your original post was wrong and badly thought out.

Aug 30 I suggested....... "The way this issue has developed implies possible learning difficulties"

Last week Paul Ince said "but the classroom just does my head in".

Better stop digging Ivan, otherwise you are in danger of sounding a little crazy.

[CrazyIvan]

  thenodrog said:

Aug 30 I suggested....... "The way this issue has developed implies possible learning difficulties"

Last week Paul Ince said "but the classroom just does my head in".

Better stop digging Ivan, otherwise you are in danger of sounding a little crazy.

You tend to ignore all the other posts you've put up regarding Ince and his alleged learning difficulties. Maybe I should list them all so you can remind yourself Gordon seeing as you seem to forget the more outrageous ones.

[thenodrog]

  Exiled in Toronto said:

Happy to retract that we are marginally worse off than in the last of Hughes' 3 full seasons at this point. But of course we are much better off than his first two where by now we were in the bottom 3.

Please write out 100 times EiT....

'I was completely wrong in my statement and I have to confess that I have been found guilty of fabricating the true facts. In future I will always endeavour to complete any research necessary.

Alternatively you could always go for a pint or two.

[brightonrover]

We've got a point away at Bolton and we're mid table and playing attractive football in patches, therefore it's time to sack the manager.

Have you lot got nothing better to do with your time?

[dave birch]

Theno, I know it's been said before, but what evidence do you have that Paul Ince has "Learning Difficulties"?

You state that it's a "recent" phenomenon, but give no evidence for this, You also state that it's "PC", whatever that means.

Ince has said that parts of the course "does his head in", have you ever been on a course that's like that? I can understand exactly what he means, and it doesn't mean that he doesn't want to be there for the whole course, it means that that particular aspect of the course is a pain. I can relate to that point alone, but it doesn't mean that I haven't got something from the WHOLE course.

Anyway, theno, I note you conveniently didn't answer my question earlier, how recent, is recent in your eyes, 30 years+ still recent in your eyes? How PC is calling it like it is?

I suggest that you get back on the golf course, and stop trying to convince everyone that you've been actually attending Ewood.

Let Ince prove himself, it's the least he deserves.

[jim mk2]

Gordon talking himself into a Lancashire Utd-type cul-de-sac here, and I must say I think he ought to withdraw gracefully on this one.

Mind you, the Toronto man shows an equally brainless approach by pointing the finger at the press.

[philipl]

There are four groups on here broadly speaking:

1) Consistently anti-Ince

2) Those who want him to succeed but are alarmed by some elements of his management which are in the public eye and concerned by some of the unsubstantiated stuff that is being whispered around the place

3) Withholding judgement

4) See backing Ince uncritically as being part and parcel of backing the club and cannot understand the fuss

As far as I am aware there was very little of the sort of gossip leaking out during the Hughes regime which seems to be continually emerging about the Ince regime. I am not the source of any of this stuff and the folks who are clearly have their own reasons for not going public, probably with the best interests of the club at heart, so I am not going to repeat anything I have not already seen in the public domain. I do not know whether it is a case of the rumour going round the world before truth has a chance to put his boots on or no smoke without fire but it is not good.