[Archived] Paul's Progress

[92er]

We were a solid club but when clubs that finished below us, e.g.

Fulham, Man City, Portsmouth, Spurs etc have spent a lot of money to improve their sides, we cannot keep purchasing cheap players and expecting miracles. PI recognised this and is now trying to develop the youth team as this is the way forward for Rovers as unless we get a rich sugar daddy we cannot succeed in any other way.

PI set up a loan deal for Carlos and it appears we will have to pay £5mil if we want to buy him.

PI tried, without success, to sign someone on transfer deadline-I imagine we would have been paying around £5 mil, but of course I could be wrong. So we as a club are willing to pay out reasonable amounts of money for players-and indeed those 2 deals would have represented more money than MH was allowed to spend in any one period. And you are right-Ince has not spent that money yet, but if he wants to buy Carlosito in Jan, he is likely to be spending £10 mil then.

He might well be looking to develop the youth team but it is not as the only way forward.

[den]

He might well be looking to develop the youth team but it is not as the only way forward.

You might agree here 92er, that PI isn't really in a position to develop the youth team. The academy is run as a seperate entity and stands on it's own two feet, under it's own management. The most Ince can do is give the youngsters a chance in the first team, in order to give them their best chance.

That isn't what I would call developing the youth team.

[92er]

You might agree here 92er, that PI isn't really in a position to develop the youth team. The academy is run as a seperate entity and stands on it's own two feet, under it's own management. The most Ince can do is give the youngsters a chance in the first team, in order to give them their best chance.

That isn't what I would call developing the youth team.

Yes I agree with you and I imagine that is what Imy meant.

Well done!

[Billy Castell]

Like I've said previously, I think this season will be less successful than the last two, as Ince and co. find their feet, get to grips with the squad and so on, and then next season we may see what he's made of. We won't be relegated, or get into that scrap, but we will probably be around 10th place or so. Hughes took practically every member of the back room staff, so this entirely new team needs time to gel. Ince will develop the contacts and the scouting network again, and possibly be more open to giving younger players a chance than Hughes. Things will probably take shape over the course of this season as Ince gains more of that vital experience, and things come together.

If we can avoid selling RSC or any other asset in January, I think things may pick up over the second half of the season and we'll be more consistent. It all needs to bed in.

[bennyboyt11]

im just worried about our attacking threats, we seem to be lacking unless benni can find his form and our "wingers" start to feed those type of balls that roque thrives off

[philipl]

Apart from Lee Grooby has written on the official site to the effect that Paul Ince doesn't fancy Vogel and that is the Manager's perogative I am pretty well 100% with the posts of 1864.

I could say that Ince doesn't fancy birds but that would open a whole new can of worms. (Vogel is German for bird)

[thenodrog]

3 yrs for a manager to build a team of his own, is the usual quote.

http://www.wbs.ac.uk/downloads/research/fo...nagers-0106.pdf

Re:Pages 10 & 11.

btw interesting cover pic.

[thenodrog]

DB dont be so daft of course I have an understanding of what JW is about and his role at the club.

He certainly will have the final say so on purse strings.

Personally I'd question that.

btw isn't JW from darnsarf somewhere?

[thenodrog]

http://www.everychildmatters.gov.uk/delive...ry&id=22885

I think there is a bit more to the learning difficulties debate.

Interesting definition DaveS. It suggests that I should actually have used the term 'learning disability'? Sounds a taj ott to me though.

[thenodrog]

Ince has said that parts of the course "does his head in", have you ever been on a course that's like that? I can understand exactly what he means, and it doesn't mean that he doesn't want to be there for the whole course, it means that that particular aspect of the course is a pain. I can relate to that point alone, but it doesn't mean that I haven't got something from the WHOLE course.

I suggest that you get back on the golf course, and stop trying to convince everyone that you've been actually attending Ewood.

If I had I'd no doubt have experienced difficulty learning anything.

Attending Ewood? Do you even rem where it is?

[colin]

Gordon,

We've done away with the words:

"Spaz"

"@#/?"

"Four eyes"

"Dumb"

"Deaf As A Post"

and all the other accusitive words to descibe people (& Rover's supporters) who are just like the rest of us but have a bit of a disability.

It's not "PC gone mad" or anything like that. It's just simple respect for your fellow human being who may have a disability.

I'm presuming that you don't laugh at people in wheelchairs.

Cheers

Colin

[thenodrog]

Gordon,

We've done away with the words:

"Spaz"

"@#/?"

"Four eyes"

"Dumb"

"Deaf As A Post"

and all the other accusitive words to descibe people (& Rover's supporters) who are just like the rest of us but have a bit of a disability.

It's not "PC gone mad" or anything like that. It's just simple respect for your fellow human being who may have a disability.

I'm presuming that you don't laugh at people in wheelchairs.

Cheers

Colin

What made you post that?

[den]

http://www.wbs.ac.uk/downloads/research/fo...nagers-0106.pdf

Re:Pages 10 & 11.

btw interesting cover pic.

I said it takes 3 years to build a team Gord.

I didn't say they last that long though.

[DingleBaiter]

I wish we could have a separate thread, 'Gordon's grumbles' or something, it's amusing to read the tittle-tattle

BTW - this thing about Ince's influence with the youth. It's a matter of record the club decided to sharpen the focus on the whole Academy overhaul over the next few years. Hughes spoke at length just after Easter on this, and it was well documented in the LT & elsewhere at the time.

This was also a strong factor in Ince's candidacy for the job, it made sense to pick someone who would have a closer involvement with the Academy - and it can be see at several levels already (not just in their involvement in the first team).

[jim mk2]

Attending Ewood? Do you even rem where it is?

[Mr Creosote]

If I had I'd no doubt have experienced difficulty learning anything.

Attending Ewood? Do you even rem where it is?

Do you? I thought you were golfing these days?

[Dave S]

Regarding Pauls Progress.

There is the old argument of Results v Performances

At the end of the season no one will be praising Spurs for their footballing ethos when they end up getting relegated.

Many coaches state that a manager shouldn't be judged until Christmas, I have heard other statements that the league begins to take shape after Ten games and is an indicator of what kind of season a team will have.

So I thought I'd look at some simple statts regarding Rovers.

So far this season Played 8 Points 11

Last season Played 8 Points 15

To compare like for like ie last season we drew at Everton. (I have replaced Hull with Derby, no other choice, bottom club replaced by playoff winners)

Played 8 Points 13

After 10 Games I think that the league will well and truly be taking shape.

Last year we had 21 points after a very good start.

Like for like we had 15 points.

Last year after such a good first 10 matches we actually only won ONE game in the next nine.

I think this really shows that the wait until Christmas theory has some credibility.

I will post further rivetting stats later in the season. (Don't hold yer breath)

[CrazyIvan]

Thanks for that Dave S, very informative!

[dave birch]

Do you? I thought you were golfing these days?

[Hughesy]

(Sorry Dooms day/ anti-Ince brigade)

A couple of good things about Ince that we have already learned:

He isnt afraid to sub or completley drop players if they are not pulling their weight. He also will consider dropping players totally based on the opposition, like he did with Gamst at the weekend. Where as Hughes stuck with his same team as much as he could, regardless of form. (i.e. Gamst or Roberts)

He is willing to give youth an opportunity and if they take it, he is then willing to give them more game time as a reward - unlike Hughes did.

I also think Ince is learning all the time:

- Our defence is looking stronger with each game and finally they seem to be on one wave length.

- He is also learning tactically - he got it spot on with Ooijer at Left back against Davies, he got it right with giving Warnock a chance in the centre of mid and is obviously looking to find Carlos' best position too.

[tonyoz]

(Sorry Dooms day/ anti-Ince brigade)

A couple of good things about Ince that we have already learned:

He isnt afraid to sub or completley drop players if they are not pulling their weight. He also will consider dropping players totally based on the opposition, like he did with Gamst at the weekend. Where as Hughes stuck with his same team as much as he could, regardless of form. (i.e. Gamst or Roberts)

He is willing to give youth an opportunity and if they take it, he is then willing to give them more game time as a reward - unlike Hughes did.

I also think Ince is learning all the time:

- Our defence is looking stronger with each game and finally they seem to be on one wave length.

- He is also learning tactically - he got it spot on with Ooijer at Left back against Davies, he got it right with giving Warnock a chance in the centre of mid and is obviously looking to find Carlos' best position too.

I have read a couple of times that Ince is the type of manager that will put his arm round a player when necessary. I know it doesn't seem to fit in with his image but I like to think it's true. Another quote I read earlier -from the man himself this time............something like:

"It's no good just telling a player that he's crap................he wants to know why he's crap - and what he can do about it." Sounds like a good policy to me. (Sorry I can't find the link - it was a while ago.)

By the way Hughsey.......I keep meaning to tell you........that is the best pic on the board.

[DingleBaiter]

I have read a couple of times that Ince is the type of manager that will put his arm round a player when necessary. I know it doesn't seem to fit in with his image but I like to think it's true. Another quote I read earlier -from the man himself this time............something like:

"It's no good just telling a player that he's crap................he wants to know why he's crap - and what he can do about it." Sounds like a good policy to me. (Sorry I can't find the link - it was a while ago.)

By the way Hughsey.......I keep meaning to tell you........that is the best pic on the board.

Cripes - two positive pro-Ince posts in a row; you will have the conspiracists fired up!

Nice to see someone acknowledging the positives for a change.

I feel confident Ince hasn't give up on a lot of the good stuff Hughes brought into the club - sports science, fitness etc. - but maybe doesn't seem to crow about it. Who knows, they may even have a far more simplistic view on things, rather than the scientific. Seems to me the biggest advocate of the ProZone-type approach happen to be the guys who promote the more agricultural, traditional, effort-based, long-ball, British-type game; Allardyce, Hughes, Pulis, Permatan Brown - coincidence? Does it promote a throwback to the Charles Hughes days, where we tended to rely on the Don Howes & Howard Wilkinson as the high-level coaches in the game? I can't imagine Arsene Wenger throwing percentages & stats at his players as the main focus of their coaching. God help us if this is what the coaching badge teaches them

[brfcs5359]

Cripes - two positive pro-Ince posts in a row; you will have the conspiracists fired up!

Nice to see someone acknowledging the positives for a change.

I feel confident Ince hasn't give up on a lot of the good stuff Hughes brought into the club - sports science, fitness etc. - but maybe doesn't seem to crow about it. Who knows, they may even have a far more simplistic view on things, rather than the scientific. Seems to me the biggest advocate of the ProZone-type approach happen to be the guys who promote the more agricultural, traditional, effort-based, long-ball, British-type game; Allardyce, Hughes, Pulis, Permatan Brown - coincidence? Does it promote a throwback to the Charles Hughes days, where we tended to rely on the Don Howes & Howard Wilkinson as the high-level coaches in the game? I can't imagine Arsene Wenger throwing percentages & stats at his players as the main focus of their coaching. God help us if this is what the coaching badge teaches them

Spot on. I believe it's why MH will always hit a glass ceiling and why Cook, is CEO had a dig at him about it. And it's why I like Ince because the Wenger route is the way I would want to see Rovers go. Good football, passing, possession skill and not LOL; the more agricultural, traditional, effort-based, long-ball, British-type game

[Majiball]

I remember reading that people where saying we where losing our battling principles. Well guess who's top of the league, sorry bottom (depending on your point of view) Rovers with 20 yellows in 8 games we're still the bully boys!!

[thenodrog]

Two smileys Dave? Hardly that funny.

In terms of humour it was just about worth one of these

He is also learning tactically - he got it spot on with Ooijer at Left back against Davies, he got it right with giving Warnock a chance in the centre of mid and is obviously looking to find Carlos' best position too.

Credit where it's due so I'll give you that .... but only up to a point with Warnock. However Carlos only really has one position imo.