[Archived] Paul's Progress

[philipl]

It's clear to a blind man on a galloping horse that Ince and his 4th division posse are completely out of their depth. After being completely outplayed by Chelsea he insisted that we should have got something from the game..which was b@llocks to everyone who watched the game. His bizarre team selection and tactics were unbelievable today. He just doesn't understand the level of performance that is needed to survive ( or prosper) in this league.

We will get nothing from the next three games therefore...

If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly

Unfortunately, with the board structure as it is nothing will happen. There's no real power lying with John Williams or Tom Finn and the trustees will be far more concerned with the aviation industry and Flybe.

If one man was in charge he would already have made the decision and canvassed Big Sam, as it is prepare for another decade or two in the wilderness.

Your comments about the board structure are completely incorrect.

If there is drift, it will be because there is a conscious decision to leave things be for whatever reasons. However, the Rovers will be under the tightest possible scrutiny from Jersey right now irrespective of what else might be happening to Trust assets.

[Zulu]

Get ready. Fat Sam's on his way up the A666. Tee hee!

[47er]

We were too proud to appoint Big Sam at the time. I'm sure the negative reaction of fans turned the club away from what was the obvious appointment. After all he'd not only kept a similar club to ours in the Premiership on less money, they were actually prospering. Time to swallow our pride?

[Claytons Left Boot]

If one man was in charge he would already have made the decision and canvassed Big Sam, as it is prepare for another decade or two in the wilderness.

I think it may happen a bit quicker than you think Wiggy. I said to my mate prior to the Sunderland cup game that it is the fans who decide, not the Chairman. The Chairman merely acts on what eminates from the terraces.

Ince lost the fans today and from all accounts appears to have lost the dressing room. One is bad, both is fatal.

[LeChuck]

That being said I think it is unrealistic to sack a manager at this stage of a season, we did it with Roy and we still got relegated.

Bolton and Wigan did last year and saved their arses. It's not unrealistic in the slightest.

If the board are to stick with Ince then they should make him remove Mathias, Winterburn and Knox from the staff and get in qualified and proven people at this level. There is something about Ince that suggests he could have potential as a manger, but he's got absolutely no chance with those deadbeats around and the club really need to force the issue on this.

That said, right now I can't say I'd be disappointed if the whole lot of them left.

[Bobby G]

Sam Allardyce was in Dubai 2 weeks ago and said that the reason the board didnt appoint him was that they were afraid of the adverse reaction from us the fans due to his notlob connections.

Bolton and Wigan did last year and saved their arses. It's not unrealistic in the slightest.

If the board are to stick with Ince then they should make him remove Mathias, Winterburn and Knox from the staff and get in qualified and proven people at this level. There is something about Ince that suggests he could have potential as a manger, but he's got absolutely no chance with those deadbeats around and the club really need to force the issue on this.

That said, right now I can't say I'd be disappointed if the whole lot of them left.

What are you on about Winterburn? He was on commentating on a game today LIVE, so it makes me wonder how many days he has actually worked with our defence since he "joined". Another mockery.

[Zulu]

Best manager you've never had, lads and lasses. You could do a lot worse.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Get ready. Fat Sam's on his way up the A666. Tee hee!

I've read many a trotter would have him back today,better not to take the p1ss when the locals are restless Mr Zulu!

JOG ON.......

[LeChuck]

What are you on about Winterburn? He was on commentating on a game today LIVE, so it makes me wonder how many days he has actually worked with our defence since he "joined". Another mockery.

You're right, to have a prominent member of the coaching staff (let's be honest, a competent defence coach is what we need most at the moment) commentating instead of being at a home game is terrible.

I remember the interview from the time he was appointed, he sounded as surprised as the rest of us. He didn't even have ambitions of going into coaching, he went in to media work instead of taking any courses or anything.

[tony gale's mic]

Sam Allardyce was in Dubai 2 weeks ago and said that the reason the board didnt appoint him was that they were afraid of the adverse reaction from us the fans due to his notlob connections.

If nicko is to be believed, and I'd say he is, this very website played a rather large role in that decision. I'll happily admit that I was one of those dead against his appointment at the time, but right now he is the only place we should be looking.

[dring1]

If nicko is to be believed, and I'd say he is, this very website played a rather large role in that decision. I'll happily admit that I was one of those dead against his appointment at the time, but right now he is the only place we should be looking.

i have said this before but would big sam actually come to the club know after we appointed ince instead of him.

[roversmum]

He'd probably want a fair bit of financial persuasion.

[imy9]

JHC and you'd have been one of those fiddling while Rome burned.

You try telling me I'm wrong yet I've just witnessed that debacle this afternoon, with respect where were you? You can say 'IF' all you want but the truth of it is we played an exceptionally poor team today and came off distinctly 2nd best over 90 minutes. We displayed no heart and no idea for 75% of the game and more worryingly showed absolutely NOTHING after the half time 'inspirational' team talk.

If you honestly believe Ince can get us out of this you're in a small and rapidly decreasing minority. Change has to come for the good of the club - simple as that.

Have I disagreed with the anything that people have said about the performance? It was dire, I have stated it a number of times, where you and I differ is that I would hope that the board will not make a rash decision, if we were in a position where we were consistently playing badly and losing and were moving adrift from the pack around us, I would want a change.

I will state again, I dont sit on a fence, I am backing Ince.... for now.

[Wiggy]

Your comments about the board structure are completely incorrect.

If there is drift, it will be because there is a conscious decision to leave things be for whatever reasons. However, the Rovers will be under the tightest possible scrutiny from Jersey right now irrespective of what else might be happening to Trust assets.

What an utterley nonsensical reply Phil. The Rovers are, more or less, run by committee..board and trustees. JW coud not sack Paul Ince without the trustees approval.

I maintain that if one man owned and ran the club he could make a quick decision. You seem to suggest you are in the know. I suggest you're not.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

i have said this before but would big sam actually come to the club know after we appointed ince instead of him.

I'm sure there was a bit of animosity on his part that he had effectively been 'snubbed' by Rovers?

[ihtd]

I would have Big Sam right now in a heartbeat. Ince has lost the fans, he's lost the dressing room, we might as well act now while we are not adrift and not wait until we get beat by Stoke at home. We are in big trouble at the moment and if people cannot realise that, then they clearly don't know a thing about football.

[philipl]

If nicko is to be believed, and I'd say he is, this very website played a rather large role in that decision. I'll happily admit that I was one of those dead against his appointment at the time, but right now he is the only place we should be looking.

I totally agree and add my own mea culpa in terms of having strongly opposed BFS. The only mitigation I can plea is that had I known the alternative was going to be PI, I wouldn't have been anti-BFS.

In the summer, we had just missed out on European qualification by a fluke and had every reason to be looking upwards so should have been appointing a Manager of European pedigree to match our European ambitions.

Now we are looking for someone who knows the market place, who is available and can keep us in the Premier League in the face of the expected loss of RSC and perhaps Warnock as well in January.

There is only BFS currently available who looks like a secure insurance bet to keep us in the Prem this season and in the future. Other than Mark Hughes, I cannot think of anyone else who would know as well as BFS where the players might be who could come to Ewood and do the job for us in the second half of this season.

[47er]

"I will state again, I dont sit on a fence, I am backing Ince.... for now."

I'm afraid that is sitting on the fence!

[Amo]

I don't have anything against Imy. I think it's quite admirable he's willing to stand by Ince. But for me the alarm bells are ringing. It's time for JW to admit he made a mistake overlooking Laudrup and appointing lower league personnel.

[tony gale's mic]

i have said this before but would big sam actually come to the club know after we appointed ince instead of him.

Yes, we're a good club for him to resurrect his career and I'm sure he knows it. No great expectations, taken a dip in fortunes after Hughes left so an opportunity to revive us etc.

[Blue blood]

Have I disagreed with the anything that people have said about the performance? It was dire, I have stated it a number of times, where you and I differ is that I would hope that the board will not make a rash decision, if we were in a position where we were consistently playing badly and losing and were moving adrift from the pack around us, I would want a change.

I will state again, I dont sit on a fence, I am backing Ince.... for now.

If we wait until we're adrift of the pack we'll go down you numpty! Blimey the premiership (bar top 4) is the tightest and most competitive it's been for years and you want to wait until we fall away before we do something. That's shutting the gate after the horse has bolted, or whatever the phrase is.

Let's recap:

No settled team - even the players who are available seem to be shifted about at random.

Too many players playing out of position on a regular basis.

Signings that don't move the club forward - Fowler, Andrews, Simpson are hardly the type of signing to cement a push for europe.

Not signing players for key positions.

A glut of injuries that seems too much for bad luck or coincidence.

Negative comments after playing the big 4 as if all we can expect to do is expect to loose.

The leakiest defence combined with hardly scoring at home.

Negative comments about this being a season of consolidation.

And now just to cap it off, rumours of dressing room unrest. As if we've not enough problems on our hands.

After 12 games the table doesn't lie.

Yes there has been positives, the robbo friedel switch now seems inspired, there's been the odd tactical stroke of genius (e.g. Ooijer at lb vs bolton) we're still in the league cup and youngsters are being blooded.

Is this enough? NO

Can Ince hack it at this level - probably not. Whether he'll finally come good is irrelivent - ROVERS CANNOT AFFORD TO TAKE THAT RISK.

I was against Big Sam in the summer, he doesn't seem to be the man to me who could take the club to the next level and get us regularly challenging for top 6. Sadly that's not what we need anymore, we need someone who can win a relegation scrap and keep us up. In a few months Ince has undone a significant amount of work that the previous regime did.

Finally, no true rovers fan is enjoying this, regardless of their stance on Ince. I'd love to be proved wrong about Ince, but all the indicators say I won't be. Does that please me - does it hell.

I'm worried about loosing our premiership status. I loved seeing us do over the big boys, I've loved us showing Newcastle and Tottenham they're not the massive clubs they think they are, I've loved watching us play in europe, I've loved some magical cup nights as rovers draw closer to lifting a trophey. I don't want to loose any of that and under the current regime I'm scared that we will.

[philipl]

What an utterley nonsensical reply Phil. The Rovers are, more or less, run by committee..board and trustees. JW coud not sack Paul Ince without the trustees approval.

I maintain that if one man owned and ran the club he could make a quick decision. You seem to suggest you are in the know. I suggest you're not.

JW is fully authorised to run the club day-to-day but there is the Deputy Chairman who is both the Trust representative and a Board member who when the chips are down would act as the controlling shareholder.

As in any company, the Board will pass the formal resolution but Rovers slimmed down the Board to just six members three years ago and no doubt can in practise convene (by telephone meeting if necessary) to vote on the wishes of the 99.98% shareholder at minimal notice.

That is 100% the reality both in fact and form and is totally in the public domain.

In practise JW will make his recommendation to the Trustees but if the Trustees have an ownership concern (bearing in mind they are responsible for fulfilling the letter and spirit of the Walker Settlement) they will make their position known very clearly and unhesitatingly to JW.

[LDRover]

Have I disagreed with the anything that people have said about the performance? It was dire, I have stated it a number of times, where you and I differ is that I would hope that the board will not make a rash decision, if we were in a position where we were consistently playing badly and losing and were moving adrift from the pack around us, I would want a change.

I will state again, I dont sit on a fence, I am backing Ince.... for now.

Sorry imy but if you think that my feelings are based on the last 90 minutes you're very much misguided.

Contrary to the propaganda spouted on here it's not been 'good football' (unless 5 yard triangles in your own half is your bag) for the majority of the season and today was the 'must win' game of the season so far. I'd like to think the manager knew that as the players should have (the fans certainly did) so to put in a performance of the standard of today is unacceptable and the manager has to carry the can.

You talk of a rash decision - hello - we're in the bottom 3 having been beaten by the team formerly occupying 19th position, AT HOME!!! What constitutes a decision not being rash? Do we have to be 6 points adrift at the bottom at Easter?

I've jumped off that fence you're sat on and now firmly believe that Ince must go.

I'll happily take all this back if he turns it round...but it won't happen. Not a bloody chance.

[Wiggy]

JW is fully authorised to run the club day-to-day but there is the Deputy Chairman who is both the Trust representative and a Board member who when the chips are down would act as the controlling shareholder.

As in any company, the Board will pass the formal resolution but Rovers slimmed down the Board to just six members three years ago and no doubt can in practise convene (by telephone meeting if necessary) to vote on the wishes of the 99.98% shareholder at minimal notice.

That is 100% the reality both in fact and form and is totally in the public domain.

In practise JW will make his recommendation to the Trustees but if the Trustees have an ownership concern (bearing in mind they are responsible for fulfilling the letter and spirit of the Walker Settlement) they will make their position known very clearly and unhesitatingly to JW.

Which is exactly what I said in my first post. No real power rests with John Williams. He is an employee. If one man owned the club he could and should act quickly.

[jim mk2]

.....................because I know you read this messageboard.

Today I witnessed a debacle that if allowed to continue will almost certainly lead to Rovers being relegated.

Phil Gartside acted quickly when he realised he had made a mistake last season so please, please accept your were wrong, swallow your pride and do what you must do to save our club.

There is manager named Sam Allardyce who can sort this mess out, and he is available now.

Leave it to January and it will be too late.