[Archived] Arsenal Preview

[LDRover]

You should have paid more attention to my postings in June then LD. I guess you were you on holiday.... right?

Funnily enough I was in Morocco when Ince was appointed yes.

I was never pro or anti Ince but I did think it was a great opportunity for the club to excite the fans, with the right appointment. I was of the opinion that this season was a no lose scenario because, looking at the strength of the other teams in the Prem, we should have more than enough about us to be well clear of relegation.

When Ince got the job I must say I was disappointed given the calibre of managers we turned down (Laudrup and HTC) but had faith in the board's decision.

I was worried after the draw at home to Hull, but this was tempered by the transfer window still being open but now after the Arsenal game and the capitulation in the 2nd half I'm quite concerned.

For me, the Fulham game is a must win already, there's no point thinking otherwise.

Most worrying thing for me is not so much what I see on the pitch at Ewood but what I 'feel'. You can sense the general malaise around the place from the fans to the players and even to the staff. It reminds me all too much of how it felt during the latter days of the Kidd era. The 'feel' I get is that the Fulham game for Ince could mirror the QPR game that signalled the end of Kidd.

[modes98]

He can't catch and has no control or command of his area. He doesn't shout or talk.

Even sound defenders (which is basically what we have) will look jittery.

Come on Adebayors second was 2 yards out when he headed it -Big Bad Brad. would have just caught it.

He can catch and he has very good awareness of the game around him. There have been a few situations where the throughball would have not been caught by the defenders and would have left the attacker one on one, but Robinson came out and gathered the ball. The only negative would be his positioning on certain shots but he is what he is. Brad had the same issue from free kicks and wouldn't come for crosses.

I wouldn't describe Nelsen or Samba as 'sound'.

Nelsen has been way out of his depth, since his injury, apart from a couple of games. He is slow, can't read the game and gives away penalties.

Samba has a great ability to recover but it is worrying that it is his best ability. IMO He is too exposed with the right back going forward and has to cover leaving a forward free.

Unless Brad or Robbo were in exactly the right position there would have been no chance. A point blank header should always find the back of the net, you have no time to react as a keeper.

[thenodrog]

Is that because you think by January we will be in so deep it will make no difference or that you believe we have no funds for transfers?

The latter.

a. It's mighty obvious that we have been tightening the purse strings and cheapening the product at Ewood now for some time.

b. If we are in deep trouble and it was my money I don't think I would be happy handing over MY cheque book to the current manager. If the worst came to the worst we could go for broke and quite easily still go down but with the obvious dangers of carrying major debt with us, or we could go down with a few bob in the kitty. Which would be your preferred option?

[den]

remove please.

[CrazyIvan]

If we are in deep trouble and it was my money I don't think I would be happy handing over MY cheque book to the current manager. If the worst came to the worst we could go for broke and quite easily still go down but with the obvious dangers of carrying major debt with us, or we could go down with a few bob in the kitty. Which would be your preferred option?

Relegation talk ALREADY!!!???

[Jan]

Relegation talk ALREADY!!!???

We're in the bottom 3 and at no stage have looked "too good to go down". So, relegation, yes.

So to sum up. The manager left, Paul Ince came in, the better players either said or re-affirmed they wanted to leave. 2 were allowed to do so. By losing 2 players (one of whom was replaced with allegedly similar quality) we've gone from top 7 to bottom 3. There can only be one reason. we were managed before by people the players respected, now we're not- and quite rightly too.

This is down to a complete brain-fart by the board. They should just admit they were wrong and that this isn't working and move on. I sincerely hope they do.

[CrazyIvan]

We're in the bottom 3 and at no stage have looked "too good to go down". So, relegation, yes.

So to sum up. The manager left, Paul Ince came in, the better players either said or re-affirmed they wanted to leave. 2 were allowed to do so. By losing 2 players (one of whom was replaced with allegedly similar quality) we've gone from top 7 to bottom 3. There can only be one reason. we were managed before by people the players respected, now we're not- and quite rightly too.

This is down to a complete brain-fart by the board. They should just admit they were wrong and that this isn't working and move on. I sincerely hope they do.

We are 4, yes 4 games into the season not 10 or 15 games but just 4! If we are in the bottom three a quarter of the way into the season I'll be getting worried but not after 4 games for crying out loud! This is utter madness!!!

[DingleBaiter]

We're in the bottom 3 and at no stage have looked "too good to go down". So, relegation, yes.

So to sum up. The manager left, Paul Ince came in, the better players either said or re-affirmed they wanted to leave. 2 were allowed to do so. By losing 2 players (one of whom was replaced with allegedly similar quality) we've gone from top 7 to bottom 3. There can only be one reason. we were managed before by people the players respected, now we're not- and quite rightly too.

This is down to a complete brain-fart by the board. They should just admit they were wrong and that this isn't working and move on. I sincerely hope they do.

So Roques not, in your view, one of our 'better players' then? I'd also like to see where anyone claimed, or realistically thought, Robinson - a player struggling for confidence/form - is of 'allegedly similar quality' than a beast of a goalkeeper who brought in at least 10 points a season alone, and never seemed to miss a game.

Your fundamental point doesn't seem to stack up; Brad was replaced with a lesser player who the regime consider to potentially a good replacement. If they could have kept Friedel, we wouldn't have got Robinson. He's a replacement for the position, as indeed Ince was when Hughes left. People need to be realistic to understand we'd have to manage our expectations to a more reasonable, lower level in the short term for (hopefully) long term benefit.

In saying that, I'm fair enough to admit it seems there are problems to be resolved - as one would expect though. Just don't kid yourself you could see this coming - you could possibly have expected it, and even (to some strange degree) welcome it to prove your initial bias and reservations.

If they'd took David Moyes on & he'd have done everything exactly the same, would you be lynching him or would his background generate a bit more patience & goodwill for you? Be careful what you wish for.

[Paul]

Which would be your preferred option?

Fortunately I don't have to make that decision but on the basis of what I've seen I'd keep the money in the bank. £30m parachute payment plus this season's money could give us a decent chance of getting back up. The more I see the more I believe Ince is a mistake, it may well be the quality of the other teams in the lower half of the table that decide our future. Just watching the management / coaching team on the touchline had me wondering on Saturday - they didn't look Premier League. Others have talked of a general atmosphere of malaise around Ewood. I'm beginning to see what they mean. A bad defeat to Fulham would make things very difficult.

Watching, albeit briefly and only bits of, the 07/08 DVD on Saturday made me realise the huge difference in our creativity in the EARLY part of last season and this.

[ABBEY]

I will stick up for jan here(there i said it out loud). You could see it coming there was grumblings coming out of brockhall all thru pre season and people have buried their heads up their arses and ignored it.Its ok saying we" tried "to sign x we tried to sign y at the end of the window...WHY WASNT THEY SIGNED IN THE LEAD UP TO SLAMMING OF THE WINDOW BEFORE THE SEASON STARTED.

If we had got david moyes we wouldnt of got fowler or andrews.We are not fighting for the ball and look woeful and for ince to say hes more bothered about a performence against fulham than position is baffling to say the least.Would fans want us to play crap and win or play good and lose ,i know which i prefer.

[Montfort]

The game against Arsenal was the worse performance that I have seen in a long time. We have been beaten by Arsenal before in recent years but have always given them a game before.

I thought Andrews was out of his depth. Whilst Simpson shows some promise he was miles away from his markers at times. I thought a few players had poor games for them, Warnock and Samba in particular. There was nothing creative coming from mid field and no defense in mid field. I thought the other players did nt trust Andrews and Simpson, started to compensate and then it all goes down hill. On that performance we will be lucky to beat anyone. We did have some good chances in the 1st half. In the second half we all looked lost and Arsenal won at a canter

The proof of the pudding is in the eating. But I am fearful on that display. How can a team that looked so good not so long ago look so poor.

[Athlete]

The game against Arsenal was the worse performance that I have seen in a long time. We have been beaten by Arsenal before in recent years but have always given them a game before.

I thought Andrews was out of his depth. Whilst Simpson shows some promise he was miles away from his markers at times. I thought a few players had poor games for them, Warnock and Samba in particular. There was nothing creative coming from mid field and no defense in mid field. I thought the other players did nt trust Andrews and Simpson, started to compensate and then it all goes down hill. On that performance we will be lucky to beat anyone. We did have some good chances in the 1st half. In the second half we all looked lost and Arsenal won at a canter

The proof of the pudding is in the eating. But I am fearful on that display. How can a team that looked so good not so long ago look so poor.

defence a shambles - warnock had a stinker , Simpson out of his depth , Samba ineffective

midfield a shambles - Andrews totally out of his depth , Pederson need I say more

Attack - Roberts back to goal as usual

couldnt fault Robinson for any of the goals , Santa came close and gave 100% Emerton did okish but some of his passing was wayward to say the least .

[waggy]

i'll write this before i read the views off everyone else,well saturday was a tonking by a very good team.warnock was at fault for 3 goals,is he this seasons benni.paul ince made the mistake off trying to play arsenal at there own game with inferior players.did steven ried pass the ball forward?andrews had a decent game,a little off the pace,at half time had it been 2-2 the arse could not complian.rocky should never have been allowed to go to south america last week,he played with jet lag.come back soon dunny

[den]

i'll write this before i read the views off everyone else,well saturday was a tonking by a very good team.warnock was at fault for 3 goals,is he this seasons benni.paul ince made the mistake off trying to play arsenal at there own game with inferior players.did steven ried pass the ball forward?andrews had a decent game,a little off the pace,at half time had it been 2-2 the arse could not complian.rocky should never have been allowed to go to south america last week,he played with jet lag.come back soon dunny

Do you think we missed Bentley Waggy?

[modes98]

rocky should never have been allowed to go to south america last week,he played with jet lag.

How can you stop him? He is playing for a Paraguay team who are doing very well at the moment and are in World Cup Quals. I don't think he would be to happy to be told he couldn't go.

[Hughesy]

Do you think we missed Bentley Waggy?

No. We made chances, just didnt take them. Defence was the big problem, followed by some bite in midfield (which Bentley didnt add anyway)

[ABBEY]

we didnt miss bentley.benni should start haha and you say i talk crap.

[Blue blood]

The second half was the worst performance I've seen at ewood for a long time. Embarassed is the only word to describe such a humiliating display.

The first half for all our chances - which incidentally we've not been taking in a few games this season, so the idea of being alright offensively is perhaps not as accurate as it might appear - we were woeful defensively. The midfield offered no protection and the defence was shambolic. Only Emerton, Santa Cruz and Robinson put in anything approaching a performance.

Warnock and Samba looked like completely different players to last season, and made a lot of errors. Nelsen looked ordinary and Simpson was a very mixed bag. Some good tackles were marred by utterly woeful marking on a regular basis. I'd say there's promise there but he certainly isn't it yet (and won't be during his time at rovers - all we're doing is manure a favour).

Midfield - Andrews was absymal. Can't tackle, and shocking touch. Didn't get involved and had no positional sense. Out of his league. Reid, tried hard, and tried to get the passing going, but sat much too deep. Passing isn't his forte and he needed to get further forward and get running at defenders which he's stronger at, rather than trying to pass it around. As it was rather than being box to box and effective he looked like an ordinary player having a poor game. Pedersen too wasn't even too great defensively, which he normally can be relied on to do, and his crossing was shocking. Emerton tried hard but couldn't do much on his tod against Arsenal.

Up front; it wasn't roberts type of game. He doesn't hold up the ball, and his fumbles often lost the ball. I'd have preferred McCarthy up front for this game, as it needed guile and a bit of trickery to keep the ball and make the passes. Can't blame roberts too much though as the support the front two had was none existant. Santa Cruz, did well, but with no real support was rendered ineffective.

Worryingly Arsenal weren't that good, they didn't really press rovers. If they had I dread to think what the score would have been. Most worrying for me was in the second half we utterly lost the plot. When we did get the ball in the second half, we had NO IDEA WHATSOEVER, what to do with it. That rovers utterly lost the plot and didn't have a clue other than to hoof it forward was more reminiscent of a second division side rather than a premier league outfit. More worrying is what it says for the mentality and mindset of the players and team in general.

The good news is it's early days, but I'm beginning to get worried. Good players - lots of them - are playing badly, and the players brought in as yet don't seem up to standard. We've a gaping hole in the right hand side of the midfield with no solution that doesn't weaken other positions. Moreover I've never seen a rovers team like on saturday that hasn't had the motivaiton to fight even if outclassed. A loss against Fulham and rovers could well be in for a long season.

[waggy]

Do you think we missed Bentley Waggy?

yes we did miss bentley,but he wanted to leave and leave he did.warnock according to nicko wanted to leave,he should have left,thats why i said he is this years benni.keeping unhappy players is not the answer

[waggy]

How can you stop him? He is playing for a Paraguay team who are doing very well at the moment and are in World Cup Quals. I don't think he would be to happy to be told he couldn't go.

he was injured at westham missed paraguays saturday game,but played on tuesday.he should have been told to stay at home

[den]

QUOTE (den @ Sep 15 2008, 13:08 ) *

Do you think we missed Bentley Waggy?

No. We made chances, just didnt take them. Defence was the big problem, followed by some bite in midfield (which Bentley didnt add anyway)

IMO, we missed him enormously. There was a massive lack of quality on Saturday, as there was against Hull. A big, big mistake allowing him to leave with no replacement. That decision alone could cost us millions.

As for the chances we did undoubtedly create in the first half, does anyone else think that was down to Arsenal simply not having a clue how to defend crosses? Not particularly great crosses either. We certainly didn't create the chances we did have, by tearing through the middle, with slick interpassing play.

[savage8]

Had a few days to reflect on Saturday and today was the first day I dared to read what had been written on here.

I'm not going to repeat what has been said by most of you, but what really worries me is this.

If i'm not mistaken, we played Arsenal at a similar stage last season (the game everyone goes on about Jen's howler, even though Brad made an equally bad mistake which was shamefully overlooked).

Last season the atmosphere was electric, the players were up for it, not taking one step backwards. We competed for every ball against superior Arsenal players, broke them down and then started playing some decent stuff. We thought we could win, not through quality, but through fight and the "physical" tactics that Rovers have been so slated the past 3/4 years. We were unlucky not to win, and the Gooners did not enjoy their day out at Ewood. The sight of Hughes parading on the touchline, and the way the players responded lifted the crowd and the place erupted when Dunny equalised.

Saturday couldn't have been much different. Arsenal enjoyed a pre season atmosphere, rolling over a team without really trying. No fight, no passion, no real quality, and more worryingly, no sense of teamwork. We had a few chances but i'm sure that Arsenal weren't too concerned, they would have backed themselves to score more than us. Ince seemed shellshocked, and had no answer - there seemed to be very little communication between him and the players on the pitch. Can anyone see him giving his players a bollocking at half/full time? More interestingly, can anyone see the players listening.

There wasn't any pressing of their players - how can you give a team like Arsenal that much time and space?

I am in no way suggesting he shouldn't have been sold, but what we needed was Sav running his socks off and at least stopping them try to play, or someone to play that role. Mokoena maybe?? The complete lack of any gameplan was laughable and was badly exposed by Arsenal's brilliance.

What alarms me is the lack of any personality in the team, the lack of "winners". We badly need Dunn back, or someone like Carlos (i'm praying he's good enough to be the answer) who can raise the players around him.

We need a moment of brilliance to bounce back, starting by beating Fulham. It won't be easy mind.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Interesting comments by Nelsen in the LET:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport...e_too_cavalier/

“It has been really frustrating the last couple of weeks because the performances have been good but we are just leaking some horrendously soft goals.

“It is just finding the right balance at the moment.

"We are trying to play nice attacking football, going forward, and probably don’t have the balance right at the moment and we are becoming a bit open.

“Cavalier is a good word but in saying that it is probably my fault and I should probably keep the reins on the horses a bit.

“We want to play, and play some entertaining football.

"It is a good attitude to have but we have been successful in the past by being tight at the back and we might need to get back to that.”

[Duffy]

In my opinion:

- Defense was poor (and have been particuarly bad at conceeding late on in halfs too);

- I wasn't even sure we had a midfield seeing as they sat off Arsenal and when we did have the ball it rarely went via the midfield (apart from Emerton);

- Up front: poor Rocque had no support and I kept shouting at Roberts to "turn" when he had the opportunity rather than staying with his back to the goal and losing the ball

It is absolute suicide to let Arsenal play with the ball, we should have got stuck in (despite Wengers inevitable winging if we had of they tried to stop us playing!) as this is what they hate.

I'm used to seeing 45 good minutes and 45 bad minutes but even though people are saying the first half wasn't bad there weren't that many real chances - overall vert dissapointing.

Why is it that with a striking coach (back in the Souness days) our strikers stopped scoring and now we have a defensive coach we conceed lots of goals??? 8 goals in 2 games is not good enough especially when they are mostly poorly conceeded ones, it doesn't matter how good we are going foward if we are going to conceed 4 a game we will probably lose anyway, cutting out these sort of errors has to be a priority and I think the midfield need to start helping the defense out a bit more than they have been doing of late.

[John]

Interesting comments by Nelsen in the LET:

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport...e_too_cavalier/

“We want to play, and play some entertaining football.

Not interesting, I find it disturbing.

It was pretty bloody obvious to me that we would start conceding goals like we have shown thus far. I had worries (and made them known) as soon as I heard that we wanted to play 'entertaining, attacking football' prior to the season starting.

Not wanting a medal for realising this, but if we want to remain in the Premiership, we need to become (or get back to) being hard to beat. Ince seemed to have woken up to this fact after the Arsenal match.

We are Blackburn Rovers, not Real Madrid. Unless there is a significant change in personnel & quality at the club, then if we are to pick up points, there will certain ways we have to play. And that way does not involve throwing too many men forward leaving us exposed at the back.