[Archived] Arsenal Preview

[92er]

Humiliating was the word I used during the match and I found it interesting it was used in the Sunday Telegraph report.Yes we could have scored 2/3, but they could have scored a lot more than they did. PI said Arsenal were clinical, but I thought they actually missed a lot of chances. Overall there was very little of merit from us, sadly, and the crowd knew it. It seems a long time since so many had left the ground before the end and the encouragement was muted, at best.

I stayed till the end and I watched as the players came off the pitch. The first players walked off at some distance from where Ince was standing and there was no acknowledgement from him. the first player he patted on the shoulder was Treacy, followed by Andrews and at least one other player, but I couldn't work out who that was.

[Iceman]

I think the other players were Bert, Simpson and Robinson. Reid looked as if he wanted to escape through a secret passage way, and i dont blame him.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

We're in the bottom 3 and at no stage have looked "too good to go down". So, relegation, yes.

I prefer to think we are only three points off a Champions League spot.

We have just got in a totally new management and coaching team - it is bound to disrupt the team as a new team pattern is instilled in the players. We will have a number of matches where it comes off (Everton) and some where it is a disaster (Arsenal).

But lets be realistic - all this talk of 8 goals conceded in the last two matches - one was against one of the best teams in the country who under that wonderful manager Hughes put 6 past us ! The other was as a result of two very late goals in a game we fully deserved at least a point.

I don't think everything in the garden is rosy - it plainly isn't - but these things do take time. It took Ince time to get things sorted at his previous two clubs.

Its a shame people on this MB don't support Man Utd - as AF would never have had the opportunity to create the United we see today.

For me, the reality is that this team has been playing increasingly poorly for approx 1/2 a season. Many of the problems in defence pre-date Ince - Nelsen was poor last season, as was Warnock. For those of us that made the trip to Wigan - we have seen worse defending than against Arsenal (funnily enough another bad day for Warnock). Maybe he recognised this when buying Grella - did anyone wonder why he invested so much time and effort in getting a defensive midfield player rather than a right winger ? Could he have picked up on how poor our defence is ? Many top teams play with two defensive midfield players - for me Grella and Vogel would fill those positions perfectly - and unlike t'Axe.both can find their own players and are comfortable on the ball.

[BuckyRover]

I prefer to think we are only three points off a Champions League spot.

We have just got in a totally new management and coaching team - it is bound to disrupt the team as a new team pattern is instilled in the players. We will have a number of matches where it comes off (Everton) and some where it is a disaster (Arsenal).

But lets be realistic - all this talk of 8 goals conceded in the last two matches - one was against one of the best teams in the country who under that wonderful manager Hughes put 6 past us ! The other was as a result of two very late goals in a game we fully deserved at least a point.

I don't think everything in the garden is rosy - it plainly isn't - but these things do take time. It took Ince time to get things sorted at his previous two clubs.

Its a shame people on this MB don't support Man Utd - as AF would never have had the opportunity to create the United we see today.

For me, the reality is that this team has been playing increasingly poorly for approx 1/2 a season. Many of the problems in defence pre-date Ince - Nelsen was poor last season, as was Warnock. For those of us that made the trip to Wigan - we have seen worse defending than against Arsenal (funnily enough another bad day for Warnock). Maybe he recognised this when buying Grella - did anyone wonder why he invested so much time and effort in getting a defensive midfield player rather than a right winger ? Could he have picked up on how poor our defence is ? Many top teams play with two defensive midfield players - for me Grella and Vogel would fill those positions perfectly - and unlike t'Axe.both can find their own players and are comfortable on the ball.

Or maybe Ince is just an idiot, his previous successes nothing more than a glitch?

Why do people expect instant results? I can't understand this attitude. Everyone is behaving like children. "I WANT SUCCESS AND I WANT IT NOW, NOW, NOW!!"

[Brfcrule1]

have just had a chance to properly look at that game and analyse the debacle that was at times schoolboy defending

Simpson: had an ok game made some important challenges but at times erratic when it comes to marking so still undecided. shows some promise tho with his ability to get forward needs to work on his crossing.

Robinson: had an ok game made some important saves from RVP,Eboue was unlucky not to save Ade's pen good to see passion in him then wish the rest could see their faults we might do better!.

Samba: got some important headers outs did not notice much in the way of mistakes from his end.

Nelson: Another poor game between him and warnolk cost us dearly this game as said we need to properly tighten up at the back become more hard to beat as he says way too cavalier!

Warnolk: Worst game by far some should tell him he is not a central mid. or a winger his priority is defending better and stopping their attackers from scoring. At fault I would say for all their goals as LB should have seen and come inside to block RVP off from scoring. For the header again needed to tuck in more as when nelson lost his marker warnolk should have tucked in and make it difficult,for the Pen was never going to get there that is just suicide he may have not clipped the bloke and the chap might have gone over a bit easily but going for a ball you have no chance of getting totally criminal!. Him and Nelson should have been a lot tighter for Ade's hattrick totally cavalier him and nelson for that one. Arsenal tho could have had more getting caught in the middle of the pitch and leaving us exposed from a corner which Walcott almost scored is not really good enough our defense should never be as exposed as badly as that and could have been more if not for Robbo should deffo be dropped for Olssen a liability at the moment.

Emo: Good effort tho is not a right winger crossing is poor never really hits the targets apart from once is better suited to RB!. Needs to track back better!

Reid: Should have scored header from corner poor set pieces free-kicks awful as well as corners needs to work better on these also needs to work back better give more protection to the back four!

Andrews: unlucky not to score was fortunate not to get a yellow card for late challenge and looks like a little boy lost needs to toughen up more and help out the back four! poor performance.

Pederson: needs to work on his crossing set pieces never hit the man corners as bad as always willing to get forward that is good but no end product needs to work on that and needs to track back to protect his defender!

Roberts: is this bloke allergic to shooting I counted two occasions with his back to goal if only he swivelled should really have had 2 goals also how many times you have to play on the shoulder of the last defender getting caught out in such a promising position poor on his part!.

Santa: should really have had a hattrick with left foot shot and 2 headers but can hardly blame him got no support whatsoever and was just foraging of scraps also looked very jet lagged should really be rested for the next game as he looks tired but good effort nonetheless gets into some good positions so still has the nack should do better from chances.

Subs:

Derbs: worked his socks off even tho he is not a right winger desperately need one in Jan.

McCarthy: did ok unlucky not to score got a good shot away for the bottom corner linked up better with Santa and created more for him when he came on could be our saviour this season!.

Treacy: did more than peds did all game worked hard should def. be given a start next game.

and that's how I saw it a lot to improve on but very few positives to take from this game have to win at all costs against Fulham and need a RW come Jan. as we lacked width oh and btw whoever suggested trying to get M.Ashley to takeover our beloved club they need to take off theri blue and white tinted sunglasses why on earth would we want an owner who would go behind the manager's back and would try and sell off our entire team in Jan and undermine our manager I would def. not want that!.

Rant over!.

[Stoic]

...(extensive summary of player performances)...

Covers everything pretty well I'd say, but I disagree with you on Emerton - he put in several pinpoint crosses. To add something positive about Samba, I thought he supported Simpson well on the right, getting across when needed. Finally, I feel Roberts didn't do too badly, but he's the sort of player who would do a lot better with an attacking midfielder supporting him, someone to whom he can lay off balls, or who can put him through on the turn with short passes.

[Iceman]

Nelsen should be dropped, he shouldnt even be captain. Dunny should wear that armband. Roberts works hard, but id let Derbs play up front with Santa Cruz. Vogel and Grella should also be in the team, or 1 of them at least to start off with. We have to play 4-5-1, get a few clean sheets and build up the confidence. For me Robinson has been outstanding, and to blame him for the goals is just being stupid. Once our defence is solid, and we combine that with the attacking game, ince wants to play then we wil stil be up the challenging a Uefa cup place.

[CAPT KAYOS]

I prefer to think we are only three points off a Champions League spot.

We have just got in a totally new management and coaching team - it is bound to disrupt the team as a new team pattern is instilled in the players. We will have a number of matches where it comes off (Everton) and some where it is a disaster (Arsenal).

But lets be realistic - all this talk of 8 goals conceded in the last two matches - one was against one of the best teams in the country who under that wonderful manager Hughes put 6 past us ! The other was as a result of two very late goals in a game we fully deserved at least a point.

I don't think everything in the garden is rosy - it plainly isn't - but these things do take time. It took Ince time to get things sorted at his previous two clubs.

Its a shame people on this MB don't support Man Utd - as AF would never have had the opportunity to create the United we see today.

For me, the reality is that this team has been playing increasingly poorly for approx 1/2 a season. Many of the problems in defence pre-date Ince - Nelsen was poor last season, as was Warnock. For those of us that made the trip to Wigan - we have seen worse defending than against Arsenal (funnily enough another bad day for Warnock). Maybe he recognised this when buying Grella - did anyone wonder why he invested so much time and effort in getting a defensive midfield player rather than a right winger ? Could he have picked up on how poor our defence is ? Many top teams play with two defensive midfield players - for me Grella and Vogel would fill those positions perfectly - and unlike t'Axe.both can find their own players and are comfortable on the ball.

What I find strange, is that its always us that seem to give Arsenal their best result of the season most of the time (except for Everton's thrashing the other season) and a goal of the season contender. No matter what formation we use we always seem to struggle in most of the games.

Agree on the aspect of playing poor for a while DMTP but you don't concede 8 goals in x2 matches playing well - regardless of the opposition. I have said it for the last two seasons , but we have been conceding goals far too cheaply and are not clinical enough when attacking - laborius springs to mind and has been labelled many a time even with Bentley in the fold.

We need to start working on the concentration and organistion within units - there appears to be a lack of communication all over the show even taking into the aspect of a new regime.

They are supposed to be professional - they look worse than a pub team after a heavy night out.

What I find even more alarming is why has the defensive coach not had time to work with them yet - bizarre?

Ince needs time but also needs to start knocking a few heads together and dropping players where necessary- most of the team are used to each other so no excuses really as should understand peoples strengths and weaknesses. I am sure he sees what we are seeing as fans but he now needs to start making strong decisions in order to get some assemblance of balance in the next four games.

[Hughesy]

Whilst Samba hasnt been perfect, I think against Arsenal he did well at his defensive duties (not his 2 mis-placed passes), I think this lad is getting alot of unfair stick for the likes of Nelsen & Warnock who have been absolute crap. Infact Nelsen has been crap since January!

[sambo]

Forgetting those on here with the hallucigenetic tendancies and those who need to lay off the anti - depressants awhile, there is a semblance of quality analysis yet again. As it seems to come from The Drog. I am putting myself in the former category.

Midfield

Andrews - did okay, tidy but a bit slow to the second ball but he might speed up. Axe can't play but can tackle and picks up second ball better than anyone at the club. He would have been in my team as there were increasingly big gaps between midfield and the defence and then in the 2nd half, midfield and defence and attack. Why Ince thinks we can out football one of the best footballing teams in the Universe with £2m fourth division player is beyond me - but there you go.

Incey - consolidate the way we play by playing with the capabilities of the players we have, not the ones you think we have (they are at Arsenal)

Attack

Looked okay to me and I would have started with that. Got lots of poor balls and made something from them in most cases. Benni Mac. Well he can do it (very slowly now) but he went for every ball that RSC went for. Can't play together I'm afraid and we all new that.

Incey - for my money your real first mistake was not to snatch £6m for him - you'll probably regret that.

Defence.

IT'S THE KEEPER STUPID! I disagree with everyone on this board I think here but I've played and anyone who thinks that Robinson is a professional keeper is Hallucinating now. This is the key problem. He can't catch and has no control or command of his area. He doesn't shout or talk. He ain't got time to get better and he won't. Even sound defenders (which is basically what we have) will look jittery. This is the first problem that has to be solved very quickly or were down in November. Has to go. He is the key problem we have to find a solution for. Come on Adebayors second was 2 yards out when he headed it -Big Bad Brad. would have just caught it.

Incey - spend £10m and we've a chance. Otherwise Charlie boy could be Maradonna and we'll still let 4 a game in.

Defence.

Is it me or has Warnock been replaced by Pederson. He just isn't a quality defender if he ain't there. Wing back if we play that way with 3 quick centre backs okay, but not a defender. It's a mental thing I think. A shame as he can defend well when he stays there but he really has a Damien Duff wannabe complex this guy.

Defence.

Nelson. Mmmmm... Has the injury slowed him down a lot or is it me?

Samba. Some scary passes but defended okay.

Right back - well we now have 2 but no quality right winger. Bert is an excellent right back and gets forward as much has he does when he's in midfield. Why change him? We just loose a man playing him there. The Kid did well but to me it's a pointless exercise.

One thing we did have left when Hughes went was a raft of competent defenders so this is sortable.

Tactics.

Well he can change those so not too worried here - he will try things over the next few weeks and so he should. Not much longer than that though.

Team Spirit.

Oh god. I thought heads went down after the first goal like I've not seen at Ewood since the half time Flitcroft argument with Souness. Why? My biggest issue now.

Still undecided and will still give the guy a chance...... but the we can soon look forward to Fat Robbie coming on. Ohhhhhhhh.......

Adebayor wasnt 2 yards out, it was awful marking!

Nelsen and Samba are the opposite of sound at the moment, same for Warnock.

Robbo is quite loud when you listen.

[Exiled in Toronto]

Ince needs time but also needs to start knocking a few heads together and dropping players where necessary- most of the team are used to each other so no excuses really as should understand peoples strengths and weaknesses. I am sure he sees what we are seeing as fans but he now needs to start making strong decisions in order to get some assemblance of balance in the next four games.

I agree with that, I think Ince has been too nicey nicey to date. It was at about this time, after two 4-0 drubbings that Hughes sent Gray to Siberia which sent a clear message out to the rest: the old days were over and it was his way or the highway. Ince needs o do the same, and where better to start than one of Nelsen and Warnock

[Hughesy]

Can this topic now be ended and allowed to drop so we can get the fulham one pinned?

Thanks

[Rover9]

Hmm I was thinking the same thing, but I am sure I saw it up the other day and when I came back to have a look it was gone?

[joey_big_nose]

I agree with that, I think Ince has been too nicey nicey to date. It was at about this time, after two 4-0 drubbings that Hughes sent Gray to Siberia which sent a clear message out to the rest: the old days were over and it was his way or the highway. Ince needs o do the same, and where better to start than one of Nelsen and Warnock

Considering they are in capability two of our best players we need to be careful how we handle them. Their confidence is low and the replacements we have are not brilliant.

All for knocking people's heads together but we also need to get these guys back to their best. Nelsen started off well against Everton, did alright against Hull but had two mares against West Ham and Arsenal. We don't want to compound this loss in form.

I would say it could be clever to drop Nelsen for Ooijer, yet he is injured. Zurab and Samba would be a scary pairing at the back! I can't see Olsson being ready to come in on the left though yet.

[LeChuck]

Come on Adebayors second was 2 yards out when he headed it -Big Bad Brad. would have just caught it.

Obviously the concept of a '6 yard box' escapes you.

Brad was many things, but a catcher of crosses wasn't one of them. There's no way he would have come out to claim that.

[thenodrog]

If i'm not mistaken, we played Arsenal at a similar stage last season (the game everyone goes on about Jen's howler, even though Brad made an equally bad mistake which was shamefully overlooked).

Thats cos Lehmans was well funny.

[thenodrog]

Not interesting, I find it disturbing.

It was pretty bloody obvious to me that we would start conceding goals like we have shown thus far. I had worries (and made them known) as soon as I heard that we wanted to play 'entertaining, attacking football' prior to the season starting.

Not wanting a medal for realising this, but if we want to remain in the Premiership, we need to become (or get back to) being hard to beat. Ince seemed to have woken up to this fact after the Arsenal match.

We are Blackburn Rovers, not Real Madrid. Unless there is a significant change in personnel & quality at the club, then if we are to pick up points, there will certain ways we have to play. And that way does not involve throwing too many men forward leaving us exposed at the back.

Points which would have been totally relevent to Bolton this time last year as it is to BRFC this season. Little Sam wanted to play 4-4-2 and attack teams with players singularly ill fitted to the job I seem to rem! And we all know how that ended! Little Sam was potted 17th Oct .... and they still only escaped relegation by the skin of their teeth. To all the 'give him till Christmas' brigade if Bolton had kept Sammy Lee till Christmas they'd have gone down with Derby without a doubt!

[Iceman]

Ever the optomist eh Theno. Hahaha but i agree with you. If things continue like this, at Fulham then JW and the board must seriously start to take note of whats happening. Ince has done nothing right, and he stil doesnt want to admit his mistakes, instead he constantly blames international games. Wil be interesting to hear his comments, if we should lose to Fulham this weekend. No excuses of players being away, PLEASE!

[philipl]

Oh dear, Jason and his missus took the 0-4 result very badly

[John]

Oh dear, Jason and his missus took the 0-4 result very badly

And who said the players do not care these days........

[LeChuck]

I hardly think going out on the lash to forget a bad performance counts as 'caring', if he was so worried about his performance he should have gone in early Sunday morning and practised how to kick a ball without toe-poking it.

[waggy]

i reckon moving warnock out off defence has repaired a lot off damage from this game,samba or nelson better take note