[Archived] Rovers V Everton

[Hasta]

Treacy didn't have the best of games. However someone said earlier in the thread that his head dropped. I don't think that was the case. He got clattered 3 times in the space of 5 minutes off Neville but kept getting back up and going at him again.

[Hughesy]

Absolute rubbish, Hughsey. Ooijer was outstanding as was Zurab. In fact Ooijer is the more classy defender. Those two are a MUST for central defence for every game until loss of form or injury dictate a change. Nelsen and Samba must wait their turn.

In the last league game Samba & Nelsen kept a clean sheet so im sure for now they will retain thier shirts.

In MY opinion Zurab is more comfortable on the ball than Ooijer, hence why I would choose him 1st.

[AggyBlue]

Bl00dy strange when Rovers receive more good comments on Evertons message boards than our own.

Shame some people would rather put Rovers down rather than look towards the good points. My ignore list is growing fast but it's making the messageboard a far better read.

I enjoyed the game, thought Rovers tried to play the right way and fully deserved to win the game.

I thought Olsson was MoM.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Warnock deserves special mention for he put in a captain's performance

This to me is a very important reflection - does anybody feel that Nelsen does the same and justfies it?

[thenodrog]

Bl00dy strange when Rovers receive more good comments on Evertons message boards than our own.

Shame some people would rather put Rovers down rather than look towards the good points. My ignore list is growing fast but it's making the messageboard a far better read.

I enjoyed the game, thought Rovers tried to play the right way and fully deserved to win the game.

I thought Olsson was MoM.

How does one do that?

[Mr Creosote]

How does one do that?

Oh, be nice

[ABBEY]

souns like tha av gettan a stalker gord owd lad

[waggy]

treacy has he done enough to dislodge mgp over the last two games,when neville started to rough him up,he never hid and got on with the game.he seems to be playing the easy ball instead off taking players on,but if ince picks him before mgp i think that will boost his confidence no end

[1864roverite]

Robinson?

Simpson?

Carlos?

Grella- injured.

Andrews- shown potential in all the games that he has played.

Fowler- first start, first assist.

So which signings do you speak of?

imy my dear friend

the lack of nouse that I am harping on about is this.

Rovers had the opportunity and the funds to make a serious midfield signing in the summer, INCE failed to make that signing. In that what I mean is that we could have bought a central midfielder who can create and score goals. An example I will use in comparison to the midfielder that he bought from MK Dons is Muamba from Birmingham big cfc.

He would have been a far better player than Andrews will ever be. Young, stylish and ethical midfielder who can score and create, tackle and defend.

Rovers could easily have signed another forward for money as well as selling either Roberts or McCarthy. It will bit eus in the financial stakes with the failure to offload McCarthy for the big money SAFC offered us.

Thats the nouse I am on about.

[BuckyRover]

imy my dear friend

the lack of nouse that I am harping on about is this.

Rovers had the opportunity and the funds to make a serious midfield signing in the summer, INCE failed to make that signing. In that what I mean is that we could have bought a central midfielder who can create and score goals. An example I will use in comparison to the midfielder that he bought from MK Dons is Muamba from Birmingham big cfc.

He would have been a far better player than Andrews will ever be. Young, stylish and ethical midfielder who can score and create, tackle and defend.

Rovers could easily have signed another forward for money as well as selling either Roberts or McCarthy. It will bit eus in the financial stakes with the failure to offload McCarthy for the big money SAFC offered us.

Thats the nouse I am on about.

He is learning. The team is doing well, and we (hopefully) have money to spend come January and Ince will know exactly what the team needs.

Nevertheless, if you wish to complain about him for not signing Muamba (5 apps 0 goals £5.75m), fair enough.

[imy9]

imy my dear friend

the lack of nouse that I am harping on about is this.

Rovers had the opportunity and the funds to make a serious midfield signing in the summer, INCE failed to make that signing. In that what I mean is that we could have bought a central midfielder who can create and score goals. An example I will use in comparison to the midfielder that he bought from MK Dons is Muamba from Birmingham big cfc.

He would have been a far better player than Andrews will ever be. Young, stylish and ethical midfielder who can score and create, tackle and defend.

Rovers could easily have signed another forward for money as well as selling either Roberts or McCarthy. It will bit eus in the financial stakes with the failure to offload McCarthy for the big money SAFC offered us.

Thats the nouse I am on about.

Ok what you actually said was: "just miffed with his signings and lack of nouse in the transfer market."

Now the signings that Ince has made are potentially good ones, could be great ones, eg. Carlos.

It is a shame you chose Muamba as an example, who cost nearly £6 million from a team that was relegated to the championship last year- ask Blues fans their opinion (I live in Brum and know plenty of season ticket holders) and they will say he was a decent player but nothing special. Score goals you say? He has scored TWO in his entire CAREER and had TWO assists last year!!

You say Ince has no nouse I would argue he has been quite clever. He could have dived in and purchased a dud but instead we have money to spend in January and have made a promising start to the season. This has been a silly transfer window, Elmander for £12 million is a prime example, better to wait.

Benny and Roberts are Hughes signings and Ince wants to keep the majority of his squad intact- which he has done. I would rather keep players who know the league than buy players who are unknowns.

[1864roverite]

Imy please answer me the following question.

If we as Rovers fans can see that we are short of a central midfielder and HAVE been since last season then why can Ince and the club not recognise that ?

Its no good saying he signed Carlos as he is not the answer to that position.

Grella is also NOT the player to take that position.

Robinson is a goalkeeper, Englands number 1 and quality. We knew that before Ince bought him as a replacement for Brad.

If you seriously believe Andrews is the answer to that position the fair play, I dont.

Rovers are lacking the midfield general that we crave. A player such as Muamba, Nolan, Guthrie, Barton to some extent, Benyaoun, Bowyer, Ireland, Davis, Kapo or Huddlestone are examples of players that we COULD have tried for.

That is the point I am trying to make. Opting for a Div 2 player rather than a player such as mentioned above shows a lack of nouse IMO. Antoehr thing I dont accept is this we came into the club late bit, he has had all pre season and more to look/get the players he wants/needs.

[BuckyRover]

I agree.

Why spend a few thousand on Andrews when we could spend a few million on Barton or Nolan?

What are you talking about? I could understand it if everyone was still under the impression that a League 2 player couldn't possibly do anything worthwhile on a Premiership football pitch, but after his first few appearances we all know that is not the case.

We should have just spent 14m on Fellaini and Castillo; they looked so MUCH better.

Luckily for us, Ince is a bit more careful with the cash.

[1864roverite]

Hey Bucky

I am talking about the quality required to take Rovers back into the top 6.

Before PI and his staff came we were Englands 7th top Premiership team, we no longer have the quality to keep us in that position.

if you think Andrews is a good acquisition then fiar play, I dont.

Is the penny dropping yet ?

[colin]

imy my dear friend

Young, stylish and ethical midfielder who can score and create, tackle and defend.

Thats the nouse I am on about.

What's an "ethical midfielder?"

[Tris]

Is the penny dropping yet ?

The penny dropped when you posted this -

I simply couldbnt be ar$ed to go to Ewood tonight such is my lack of interest.

Your hatred of Ince takes precedence over your support for Rovers.

Don't know why you still bother to post TBH. Have you sent the STs back?

[Paul Mellelieu]

A super display from a second string and much improved compared to the Fulham outing. Olsson was excellent, as was Warnock and Fowler. Top, prize, of course, goes to Tugay, who made everything happen; absolutely brilliant.

And well done Paul Ince; more of the same please.

[tonyoz]

All of Ince's decisions have been scrutinised and criticised on here. Many of them have been condemned in the strongest possible terms. Slowly but surely, however, he is showing that he knows something about this management game.

Annan and Castillo rejected.

Carlos introduced sensibly.

A young goalkeeper with high potential in Bunn.

Robinson, Andrews and yes, even good old Robbie recruited.

Chances for Treacy, Olsson and Simpson.

90 minutes for Tugay.

Duffer and Warnock given new responsibilities which they have relished.

For the first time in a long time we are starting to read match reports on here which show that the football has been well worth the entry fee. I admit that it's only been the Carling cup so far but it is encouraging isn't it?

After all the negative criticism, Ince has largely been proved right in his decisions. Because of this, I am confident that if the correct Bentley replacement had been available, Ince would have gone for him.

Many critics have been reassured I think but there is still some way to go for others. Next stop Newcastle!

[joey_big_nose]

Rovers are lacking the midfield general that we crave. A player such as Muamba, Nolan, Guthrie, Barton to some extent, Benyaoun, Bowyer, Ireland, Davis, Kapo or Huddlestone are examples of players that we COULD have tried for.

Ireland aside who looks brilliant (and we did according to Nicko have a serious look at)and Benayoun who is sometime brilliant I am not actually sure Andrews will be less of a footballer than any of them. He has all the attributes to do well I think. Good passer, good movement, can put a foot in. Give him 20 games to adjust and I would back him to be better than several of those mentioned, and certainly an improvement on the like of Reid and Mokoena.

And in regards to the "midfield general" you refer to, the guy who deserves the scrutiny is Grella who actually cost a fair bit. He is supposed to be our Barton/Mascherano/Makelele/Carsley. The water carrier with a bit of quality. He has been injured but when he is fit the Rovers side will be built around him I think. Personally he promises for me to be PI's biggest mistake (based mainly on his appearence at West Ham but then maybe that was due to fitness), but then PI has made a habit of proving us wrong (so far!) with his signings. i am looking forward to him coming into the team with interest.

For the money we got Andrews for he has been very good. The only reason he is playing is becuase Dunn and Grella are injured and Reid is now abysmalyet he has stepped in with assurance and has been no worse than dozens of players in the Prem. For now he will play as there are precious few options except Tugay's old legs.

[imy9]

Imy please answer me the following question.

If we as Rovers fans can see that we are short of a central midfielder and HAVE been since last season then why can Ince and the club not recognise that ?

Its no good saying he signed Carlos as he is not the answer to that position.

Grella is also NOT the player to take that position.

Robinson is a goalkeeper, Englands number 1 and quality. We knew that before Ince bought him as a replacement for Brad.

If you seriously believe Andrews is the answer to that position the fair play, I dont.

Rovers are lacking the midfield general that we crave. A player such as Muamba, Nolan, Guthrie, Barton to some extent, Benyaoun, Bowyer, Ireland, Davis, Kapo or Huddlestone are examples of players that we COULD have tried for.

That is the point I am trying to make. Opting for a Div 2 player rather than a player such as mentioned above shows a lack of nouse IMO. Antoehr thing I dont accept is this we came into the club late bit, he has had all pre season and more to look/get the players he wants/needs.

If the right player was not available then is it better to keep the current squad and try to blood youngsters or purchase dross like Castillo?

Grella IS our midfield general, when he is fit he WILL be the key player IMO in Ince's team.

As stated Ireland is the only decent player you have mentioned and we did scout him. Nouse is purchasing a division 2 player who everyone told you not to for £500K who clearly looks a player capable of performing on this level. I would go through other great examples of nouse shown by Ince but a poster has beaten me to it already!

[T4E]

The penny dropped when you posted this -

Your hatred of Ince takes precedence over your support for Rovers.

Don't know why you still bother to post TBH. Have you sent the STs back?

I could say the same for you. I can't remember the last time you said anything that wasn't a desperate attempt to defend the manager (one desperate attempt to defend Philipl aside). You do realise that you're perpetuating the so called "Anti-Ince" feeling by continually dragging it in to conversation, don't you?

[brfcs5359]

For the money we got Andrews for he has been very good. The only reason he is playing is becuase Dunn and Grella are injured and Reid is now abysmalyet he has stepped in with assurance and has been no worse than dozens of players in the Prem. For now he will play as there are precious few options except Tugay's old legs.

Interesting Times. Carling Cup Games have shown a more 'Paul Ince' inspired team whilst the Prem Lge performances have a a continuation of Mark Hughes.

+ Warnock - I agree with everyone who said he was awesome. I saw Bryan Robson dozens of times at at his peak and Warnock's display was of a similar nature. Driving forward relentlessly. Passing and moving to support a return to feet and pushing the ball forward again. Going backwards, reading the game, marking up, shouting like a captain should and tackling everything. He had everything and passed like a midfielder should (and we dont do it) immediate, and more importantly hard and fast making Rovers play into feet far to quick for Everton.

+Ooijar and Kinish - how defending should be. Organised and disciplined. They never had a problem all game. We never looked in real trouble.

+Olson - a better fullback than Warnock in the making. Pace, skill, athleticism, disciplined.

+Simpson slight improvement with every game

+Carlos - so skilful but a long way short of match fitness

+Andrews - give him 20 games and he'll be good enough for top half of prem. Good signing.

+Robinson had doubts but two world class saves v Fulham showed his skill.

-Treacy problems with attitude, work-rate and jibs tackles.

-Roberts looks like he his playing in wellies and a beach ball

-MGP - works hard mmmmm works hard...

+/- Fowler. Good squad filler for easy cup wins/Derbyshire/young players, brings experience, great touch, woeful fitness levels. Pay and Play so we won't be troubling the cheque book that often.

-Reid. Sloooowwwwwww thinking on the ball. Has little idea except to carry on in the direction he is facing (Jim Branagan/Ian Miller!!)

[Walls]

If we as Rovers fans can see that we are short of a central midfielder and HAVE been since last season then why can Ince and the club not recognise that ?

Grella is also NOT the player to take that position.

Rovers are lacking the midfield general that we crave. A player such as Muamba, Nolan, Guthrie, Barton to some extent, Benyaoun, Bowyer, Ireland, Davis, Kapo or Huddlestone are examples of players that we COULD have tried for.

To answer your 1st point. You have been watching Rovers for years. Ince hasn't. You knew the strengths and weaknesses of our squad from last season. Ince didn't. Fair enough he could have watched recordings of our games from last year but I would say most of the first month or so he spent trying to get the back room team together. Then he was straight into pre-season training. Whatever judgments he could have made from watching our previous matches he would still have wanted to judge for himself the strengths/weaknesses of each individual player. Look how Emerton has performed this season so far. Who would have said that he would have been our outstanding player so far based on last seasons performances? Not many.

How do you know Grella isn't the player we need in midfield. He has played 45 minutes FFS.

I would hardly call players such as Benyaoun, Ireland, Davis, Kapo and Huddlestone midfield generals. Quite the opposite in fact.

Most of the posters who are slagging Ince off illustrate exactly why football is going the way it is. Lack of patience and willingness to give players/managers time. 10 years ago people were willing to give managers and players time to settle into their new jobs. I was reading an article recently that stated it takes approx 6 months for people to fully perform at their full capacity after starting a new job. Why should football be any different?

Onto Andrews. I'm not saying he is going to have anywhere near the same level of success, but he reminds me a lot of David Platt! Platt was never the most technical of players and wasn't blessed with pace. He kept things simple and had a knack of arriving late into the box and scoring a goal. From what I have seen of Andrews so far he has a lot of the same attributes. When you see what we could have had with Castillo (£6m) and how Annan (£2m) has disappeared (look at how many people were slagging Ince based on what they had heard of him - not what they had seen - and just because he was then linked to Arsenal). Is it such a bad deal to take a punt for £500k? He just needs time to settle into playing a different game at a much higher level with players he doesn't know.

Judge him and Ince after 6 months not 6 weeks.

[RovertheHill]

What's an "ethical midfielder?"

They only buy fair trade coffee?

[thenodrog]

Reid. Sloooowwwwwww thinking on the ball. Has little idea except to carry on in the direction he is facing (Jim Branagan/Ian Miller!!)

The Golden rule of the Shankly/Paisley era at Liverpool. Receive the ball and play the way you are facing to a player who is unmarked and then immediately run into space to make yourself available. Shanks always reckoned that a Lpool player should have 3 men in space available to him as soon as he received the ball. Robotic passing football with tricks / skill / dribbling only allowed in and around the opponents penalty area. It worked too.

Onto Andrews. I'm not saying he is going to have anywhere near the same level of success, but he reminds me a lot of David Platt! Platt was never the most technical of players and wasn't blessed with pace. He kept things simple and had a knack of arriving late into the box and scoring a goal. From what I have seen of Andrews so far he has a lot of the same attributes.

I take your point but it's a bit odd that no other manager of one of the top 50 teams in this country has not seen his similarity to David Platt in the past 10 years or so Walls.