[Archived] The 2-1 Villa Preview Thread

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

If we lose, we haven't got the tactics right. If Agbonlahor out-sprints us for his goal, we've got the tactics wrong. His speed is far from being a secret.

It sounds like an encouraging performance all round, but as Gord says, playing well and losing is a great way to lose confidence. It has to be addressed, quickly. We'll see on Saturday if they've managed it.

I did say "on the whole". We could have been better defensively, I agree. However, between half time and full time, Ince couldn't physically do anything on the pitch itself. The fault lies on the players. If we had played a poor system, I would agree entirely with you. But the system worked and we dominated. We just couldn't score. In that respect, we need to improve. He was "inept", and nor was he faultless.

He'll still get excessive blame though.

[Hughesy]

If we lose, we haven't got the tactics right. If Agbonlahor out-sprints us for his goal, we've got the tactics wrong. His speed is far from being a secret.

Yes but serious question - what can we do about Agbonlawhore & young's pace? We cant sign up 2 olympic sprinters just to play in this game. You can only work with what you have, and apart from our full backs, we dont have great pace.

[bubblerrovers]

BBC are surely having a wind up, from the match report.....

"It forced Rovers boss Mark Hughes to make a last-minute change to his side, with McCarthy promoted from the substitutes' bench."

Shearer nearly scored and Sutton hit a post haha

[Amo]

OMG - Is that some of the blame being put on the players???? PLEASE - What about that Paul Ince Fella. Its called being realistic and not blaming Ince for the global economic credit crunch and everything else wrong in your life. Its not his fault your Wife doesnt like you anymore

Your attitude is completely immature and only serves to affirm how flawed your arguments are. You're not here to discuss the performance, you're just doing whatever you can (be it sarcasm or red herrings) to defend Ince. If you call that being a supporter, then good for you. But I for one would rather be honest to myself. I haven't proposed Ince should be hung drawn and quartered like some people, but I do believe he cocked up the result today with his team selection. We might have played well, but not well enough it would seem. You don't win anything for playing well, unless you can provide the goods.

[LeChuck]

Yes but serious question - what can we do about Agbonlawhore & young's pace? We cant sign up 2 olympic sprinters just to play in this game. You can only work with what you have, and apart from our full backs, we dont have great pace.

Sit deep then. And don't play your slowest, oldest, right-footed centre back at left back.

[ABBEY]

I did say "on the whole". We could have been better defensively, I agree. However, between half time and full time, Ince couldn't physically do anything on the pitch itself. The fault lies on the players. If we had played a poor system, I would agree entirely with you. But the system worked and we dominated. We just couldn't score. In that respect, we need to improve. He was "inept", and nor was he faultless.

He'll still get excessive blame though.

holy mallolli.........go on do tell us whats the point of having a manager if he cant do anything to help?

[T4E]

I did say "on the whole". We could have been better defensively, I agree. However, between half time and full time, Ince couldn't physically do anything on the pitch itself. The fault lies on the players. If we had played a poor system, I would agree entirely with you. But the system worked and we dominated. We just couldn't score. In that respect, we need to improve. He was "inept", and nor was he faultless.

He'll still get excessive blame though.

I'm sure on the whole he'll get the amount of blame he deserves.

This is what management is all about, and not just in football. The manager carries the can for his personnel. The manager has chance to plan in advance, and if those plans do not work, it is down to him. A manager does not blame his staff or look to shirk responsibility.

I'm sure Ince wont do that, and we shouldn't be doing it for him. On the whole tonight, he got it wrong. We know that, because we lost.

[Amo]

I'd like to know what possesses a so-called professional manager to play your 30+ centre-back as a full-back against a team that attacks with sheer pace, when even the man on the street knows it's suicide.

[Rovermatt]

We always do sh*t at Villa. They've far too much speed and power for a team of our limited abilities to deal with.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Abbey, did we play well? Yes. In that sense, Ince did what was asked. He set up a system and formation which played to our strengths and meant that we dominated over the opposition.

Did we win? No. But was that because we were sitting deep? No. Was it because we didn't score our chances? Yes.

Explain how Ince can force his players to score chances. I'm not saying we deserved to lose, in fact the opposite. But we can't rely on good football. We need to take our chances. We are creating chances. It isn't like Ince set us up 5-5-0 and tried to play for a point. Our system worked. We were unlucky. I am still behind the manager, even if you aren't.

I'm not suggesting Ince didn't do some things wrong, but the defeat wasn't his fault alone. His option of playing Ooijer was strange, and we pushed up too far looking for an equaliser which could be his fault (if he told them to).

It was a collective disappointment but there were positives. We just need to make sure we are more lethal up front. I think too much blame gets attached to the manager, that is all.

EDIT: You guys are too quick for me.

T4E. I hear what you are saying, but it depends how you qualify success. If we play well and Ince does everything in his power to win the game, but we don't score our chances, is it his fault? From what I could make out, our system, our formation and our mentality were all working because we dominated them. It is the fault of the players that we switched off and that we missed chances.

I feel like I am repeating myself here. I do understand what you are saying, but I thought the system worked. It just wasn't our day.

[Paul Mellelieu]

It's going to be a long hard season. Ince had better start to get some points on the board.

[LeChuck]

Did we win? No. But was that because we were sitting deep? No. Was it because we didn't score our chances? Yes.

Hang on...we scored twice. That should be enough to get at least a point. We lost because the defence was shambles and conceded three goals, and the blame has to lie squarely with Ince when it comes to that area.

[Hughesy]

Sit deep then. And don't play your slowest, oldest, right-footed centre back at left back.

I do agree on the left back tactical decision, but thats only 1 of the 3 goals. Who should we of played there? Warnock? Because if he was there, we wouldnt of even gone 1-0 up.

What happens when people say you should play your players in form, surely it would be unfair to drop Ooijer based on that? And same goes for Samba.

[RoverRich]

Relax people...

Look at it this way: We are 2 points behind Pompey and 1 behind Man City, we have the same number of points as Everton and West Ham and we are 6 clear of Tottenham. They are all teams who we should be in there mixing it with come the end of the season and as far as I am concerned we are in there mixing it with them now. Plus there is the small fact of only 28 games to go this season. If we are bottom 6 with 8 games to go, panic, shout and scream and call for Ince's head (if still here) but now is not the time. People who say we are gonna get relegated, stop being so pessimistic and be real Rovers fans. Yes I am p*ssed off that we haven't taken 2 wins from the last 2 games which we could and possibly should have done and yes I am annoyed we are dropping down the table but there is time to make it up. So instead of sitting here quarreling over whose fault it is and having a go at Ince, chill out and have faith in Rovers!

Oh and if people want to argue against these points, get a life and don't expect me to treat you with a reply! There is way too much of this season still to play for people to start fighting because we are not getting the results they want to see now. With Hughes there was a season where we were rubbish up until xmas but then went on an incredible run, caught other teams up and got well into the top half. It can happen so, like I say, get behind our club and never lose faith in what we can do.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Hang on...we scored twice. That should be enough to get at least a point. We lost because the defence was shambles and conceded three goals, and the blame has to lie squarely with Ince when it comes to that area.

Really? I'd have though Winterburn was the defensive coach, not Ince. But, y'know (see what I did there?).

That's the kinda thing I mean. All on Ince, eh?

[Rovermatt]

Luke Young gets his first Villa goal. F**king typical Rovers.

[LeChuck]

Really? I'd have though Winterburn was the defensive coach, not Ince. But, y'know (see what I did there?).

That's the kinda thing I mean. All on Ince, eh?

I don't think a part-time defence coach is to blame myself...but even if he is, it was Ince's decision to appoint a completely unqualified person to coach the defence.

The buck stops with Ince I'm afraid, whichever way you look at it.

[frosty]

Seems like we did okay most of the time, the key was letting them back in it right on HT. Just as the crowd were getting on their backs too.

Should be able to win at WBA on Saturday.

[AggyBlue]

On the whole tonight, he got it wrong. We know that, because we lost.

I wish my life was as simplistic as that

[Bobby G]

Disappointing and thats 4 on the trot where we havent won. When was the last time we were on such a run? Cant recall to be honest.

We played good football for about 60 minutes largely until Warnock had to go off.

But thats the sign of a good team and an average team, where you dont make your spell of domination count and we didnt. Plus we gave away two of the softest goals you can give away, which otherwise saw a good defensive display, especially from Samba.

Im utterly disappointed and with some of the other results tonight we are only 4 points off the drop but some people will say a win off 7th place. I still dont think we will go anywhere close to going down BUT we will fail miserably to get close to the heights of the last couple of seasons (a la challenging for a UEFA Cup place through the league).

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

I don't think a part-time defence coach is to blame myself...but even if he is, it was Ince's decision to appoint a completely unqualified person to coach the defence.

Since he has arrived, our defence has been solid, for the most part. See Bolton, Everton and Boro.

I feel like I'm talking to myself here so you might as well go and have a good moan and get it out of your system. When you're ready to support the manager, get behind the team and cheer them up the table, just say.

[ABBEY]

We always do sh*t at Villa. They've far too much speed and power for a team of our limited abilities to deal with.

SO THAT MAKES IT OK TO LOSE?

[LeChuck]

Since he has arrived, our defence has been solid, for the most part. See Bolton, Everton and Boro.

I feel like I'm talking to myself here so you might as well go and have a good moan and get it out of your system. When you're ready to support the manager, get behind the team and cheer them up the table, just say.

I'm actually feeling all right tonight, we've played well so that's something to build on.

I just don't get how Ince can get the credit for the team apparently playing well, but is absolved from blame when they concede three goals. I didn't agree with your assessment of us not getting anything from the game because we didn't take chances either. Like I said, two goals should get at least a point, it's at the other end the game was lost tonight, the forward line did it's job.

Edit: By the way, we've conceded joint second most goals in the league this year, the stats don't really support the argument of a solid defence.

[Amo]

SO THAT MAKES IT OK TO LOSE?

Pathetic attitude, isn't it? The same one used against West Ham, and also before we played Newcastle. It's turning the fans into a joke. We're just accepting defeat now.

[T4E]

T4E. I hear what you are saying, but it depends how you qualify success. If we play well and Ince does everything in his power to win the game, but we don't score our chances, is it his fault?

Absolutely it is. He is the manager - the buck stops with him. That is why he's in that position. For the rest of the week I'm sure he will concentrate on our finishing in training, and if it does not improve on Saturday it will again be his fault. It's a very very simple model of accountability - every structured company in the land works this way.

Now that I think about it, didn't Ince say that we'd been working on our finishing after the Bolton game as he was worried about our lack of shots on target? Again, if we know what the problem is but we're failing to address it, or we're not addressing it in an effective manner, then that's the managers fault.

That's not Anti-Ince by the way, the point would apply to any manager.