[Archived] The Sunderland Preview Mark II

[roversmum]

I've been reading in the matchday magazine about this performance analyst that we have. He collects all sorts of stats from each game from various technical stuff (not just pro zone but much more) and reckons we are leaders in using technology.

Strikes me that maybe too much emphasis is being put on this stuff - could it be that it is psychologically detrimental to the players? Something is not working for them; how can they change so much from half to half. We've seen this happening for a number of years but it is getting worse.

I was chided for saying that Wednesday's win was worrying. Although of course we would settle for a 'worrying win', the play and result today was exactly what I meant and I could see it coming. Sunderland, although a poor team, were fairly well organised and we managed to make them look much better than they actually are.

We need to get a settled team asap. Looking at the players available, the team virtually picks itself even taking injuries into consideration.

Disappointed, upset, with a feeling of inevitability of our fate come summer 2009. I hope I am wrong.

edit: oh, and I know it's partly sour grapes, but if I have to watch the opposition supporters standing throughout the match for much longer I think I am going to lose the plot. Start chucking them out, row by row, and they will soon learn. Rules are for all, Mr Newsham, stewards at all the other stadiums enforce them, why can't Rovers?

[47er]

Check the threads when we were discussing who should be our new manager, a clear majority don't want Allardyce near the club. I was one of them and my views haven't changed.

but circumstances have..........

[Blue blood]

Am utterly gutted. I was hoping that the win on wednesday was the start of the rovers revival. I was hoping that it was the corner that turned our season around. A side in worse form than us and having beat them with our reserves - I thought it was the sign of better things to come.

Ince has to go. Yes there are injuries, but I'm sorry, a team with the likes of Rocky, Robbo, Samba, Zurab, Ooijer, Peds, Tugs, and an improved Mokoena should be able to put up a better fight than what we did in the second half. Hell, we should have buried them in the first half, the fact that we're not finishing off/scoring many goals in the times that we are on top is just as worrying as our all too regular capitulations to teams, and again we saw both traits of Ince's team today.

A few questions for those who went - where was Nelsen? Not too gutted about him being dropped but wasn't even in the squad, injury? Also what was the reaction at the end of the game?

Am getting very worried now about our premiership survival. We've had a run of games from which we should hav had at least 10- 12 points and have come away with 3. If that isn't relegation form I don't know what is.

[Ricky]

Well guys and girls, just arrived back home in Leyland fromt he game, let me be the first to say that the second half was as bad as it will ever get

As I left Ewood, totally dejected, that big black relegation cloud has settled over the stadium and I for one cannot see anyway its going to be dispersed.

I thought about todays game being the one chance for 3 points in the next 5 matches, how wrong can one be. Rev, I missed you at the game so this is for you. Rovers are or should be the clearest relegation favourites since Derby County after todays inempt capitulation.

As the teams were read out, I was pleased to see a 4-4-2 formation. The team set up appeared right but I couldnt understand why young Olsson wasnt left back. Aside of Ooijer on the left, it looked balanced enough and cetainly, it seemed strong enough to get the 3 points on offer today.

So, the first half began as it ended, Rovers on top. !st minute should have seen Warnock smash the net but he missed a sitter and the plaudits for that chance has to be the header from Andrews to set it up. Rev take note of the applause for that chance.

After that it was a constant threat to the Sunderland goal and how we managed only 1-0 at half time only Sunderland can ask Lady Luck. We should have been 3 or 4 to the good and the game should have been wrapped up. Rovers were good for the lead, 4-4-2 solid even if Roberts wasnt exactly brilliant, he was causing mayhem in the Sunderland defence. The rest of the team looked ok, plenty of effort, plenty of movement and you could sense the team in Blue and White were set for the win we so much wanted to see. I cant recall any situtations that caused Rovers grief in the first half and I have to say that The Axe was playing superbly in the middle of the park, always running and always there to break up Sunderlands moves forward. The defence looked solid whilst up front we looked okay. Roberts ineffectiveness still troubled a poor Sunderland back 4.

As the teams came out for the second half, I considered what PI must have said to the team. Surely, it must have been "More of the same lads".

Within 20 seconds of the restart, we had given the ball away twice easliy and had conceded possession in our own half. No longer did we looked composed, no longer was there any movement and no longer did the defence and midfield look solid. 48th minute corner sees Sunderland get a gift as an equaliser nestles in our net.

We then saw the disintegration of our teams tactics and formation as Sunderland completely tore into us. Rovers couldnt win anything, they couldnt tackle and they couldnt pass to each other.

Thi was even more compounded when our manager made the two worst substitutions that I have witnessed this season. Instead of bulking up the team he weakens it by removing Roberts and Andrews and replacing them with Carlos and Sir Matty D, at the same time, he changes our formation to a 4-4-1-1 line up which instantly relieves the pressure from a previously overworked Sunderland defence. It was at THAT point that we imploded as a team.

This was even more compounded when a series of silly passes and bad defending lets in Cisse to score an easy winner. 2-1 game over and Rovers are set to drop into the bottom 3 of the top tier of football.

For the rest of the game, we saw huff, puff and long ball tactics, all of which produced a total of ZILCH. Only when we brought Tugay on, and again I say for the wrong player in Pederson, did we manage to go somewhere back to a 4-4-2 offering did we create anything worthwhile when from a corner The Axe had a chance deflected by the lucky Ferdinand.

The game was quickly finished as we throw 3 points to Sunderland giving them a massive lift in the process whilst Rovers now have given their own fand yet another totally abject and disgraceful result in the form of a defeat to what has to be one of the worst teams ever to visit Ewood in recent years. yes folks, Sunderland were dire at best and that emphasises just hpw bad Rovers were in the second 45 minutes.

You cant argue with the first 45 minutes although I could point out that Roberts was rubbish but again we already knew this. Rovers were good for a change and the signs were there that we could win the game.

You have to find fault with the management for what happened at half time. I do not know what the teamtalk was about but it didnt appear to have been anything positive. Was it the tea ? The coffee ? The biscuits ?

I have seen the anti Ince things written and you can fully understand them. I am certain that I have seen nothing to say or suggest that he has the quality or ability to get our team out of the trouble it finds itself in. For me, the time has come for a change before it is too late.

I say NOW because we now have yet another International week coming up and players will be away leaving the club short on training.

I say NOW because clearly there are issues in his management style and tactical awareness or lack of it.

I say NOW because his substitutions today were bloody awful along with the formation change.

I say NOW because we need a manager that can get the team back together whilst at the same identifying the players who will improve our current team.

I do not want to see us waste £5m on Carlos because as we saw today, he is ineffective against teams with height, he is ineffective against teams who battle and Rovers can ill afford to have a passenger in the team. I do not want to see Sir Matty D on the wings or in midfield, its like being in a team with 10 men such is his inability to be an effective weapon.

I dont want to see Ooijer playing left back any longer, I want to see a naturally left footed player there because it will balance the team in particularly the back 4. i dont want to see hoof it up football when RSC is stranded alone playing against 2 big defenders even more so when the support isnt there and I dont want to see 4-5-1 or 4-4-1-1 at home to teams we should be beating with ease.

The team today, on paper alone, was stronger than the team that beat Sunderland on Wednesday evening, so what happened ? It was virtually the same Sunderland team that outplayed a team containing 8 International players (OR MORE).

I simply cannot be bothered to give ratings such is my anger at losing today. I support BRFC but right now I dont support the management. It was a truly awful second half and many many fans left early. Such are the current inept managerial decisions that are being made, we are slowly seeing Rovers being managed to a lower division as the standard of our football subsides to barely watchable.

I do NOT want to listen to lame excuses for todays lack of points I want honesty.

Mr Williams and The Board, its over to you.

Well I was wrong about the chances but right about the result. Apologies to those around me in the JW when the second went in but I was a trifle upset.

The first half was very, very comfortable. Rovers totally dominated the game and a 3 or 4 - 0 scoreline would not have flattered us on chances created. It wasn't the greatest performance but it was controlled, we kept the ball and we put Sunderland's defence under a lot of pressure. Sunderland are not a good team or so we said at HT, neither are Rovers that good and truth be known I have to agree with the MB member who thinks much of this team wouldn't shine in the Championship. On the second half performance we are going to find out if he's right. The stark reality is take RSC and Robinson out of today's side and we've got little to excite.

I've seen some poor performances at Ewood in my time. The second half today ranks with the poorest I can recall - the 1 - 0 home defeat to Stockport in the League Cup. I cannot recall Rovers falling apart so dramatically in any other game. For the first 30 minutes of the second half we simply got worse and worse unti the team was totally disjointed, incapable of a pass of any sort, Warnock and Ooijer in particular. I felt really sorry for Ooijer I think he'd have been happy just to be taken off let alone subbed. Roberts was shocking throughout the game, every ball which came his way he failed to collect.

Let there be no mistake Rovers collapsed completely in the second half and it was only when Tugay arrived we began to resemble a football team - in that we had one player who could control and use the ball. On the touchline it was clear Ince could not understand what was happening nor did he know what to do. On at least two occassions he looked utterly lost.

I've a great deal of faith in JW, I said when Ince was appointed we had to hope JW saw things the fans couldn't. The time for the experiment to end has arrived, JW has to face up to reality. Paul Ince is not a PL manager, perhaps he will be one day but he isn't now and Rovers cannot afford to let him learn. Relegation could mean we never return to the PL and the club slips into obscurity. The board have to bite the bullet now. Paul Ince will not lead us away from relegation and he must be replaced at the first opportunity.

Please don't ask me who. I don't care who it is. I'll take Allardyce if it means safety because at the present Rovers are in total freefall and facing certain relegation.

John Williams has to get this right.

Well I'm home after a 12 hour day to watch that dross. I've quoted the two posts above from two Members who I respect and who have managed to put my feelings into words much better than I could have.

At present I can't see where our next points will come from, we have no passion, no fight, no desire..... 3 things I never thought I'd see from a Rovers team. It hurts to see how far this team has fallen in such a short time. I know we have injuries... but why do we have these big injury problems.. I don't buy into the 'luck' aspect. If players are fit and training well they shouldn't pick up so many niggles, we have half a squad missing with little niggly injuries.

Now it appears that Ince has lost the players, he's already lost the fans so what else is there for him to lose!!!!

I was one of the people who didn't want Allardyce... I'd welcome him with open arms at the moment.

I just hope John Williams, a man who has been excellent for this club, can look at what is going on unde his nose and sort it out.

[DingleBaiter]

Oh dear.

Hopefully, writing this may prove cathartic after witnessing one of the poorest, most worrying performances in years.

So, what was so bad about today?

FORMATION - Ince isn't learning from his mistakes - he's openly said Oojer prefers centre-back, and sometimes struggles at right back. So why play him at left back? Why not Zurab (who's played there before) and put Oojer at centre-back? Likewise Derbyshire - another played in a position he does nothing.

Andrews right midfield - the lad is keen as mustard to play and tries, but it was never going to work surely? He DID make a few good passes, but his keenness often led to him being out of position - at one point, he was double marking in the LEFT BACK spot?

To me, Ince put out a defensive-minded side today and it showed - badly. Roberts works hard, but there is zero threat to any goalkeeper from him.

CHANCES - We never looked like scoring today from open play at all. We had plenty pressure in the first half, some great-taken corners, and had a few chances, but all were 'dead balls' apart from Warnock's miss.

LACK OF FIGHT - Sunderland withheld our pressure for 45 mins, they pressured us from the second half kick-off & within a minute hit the crossbar. Minutes later, they equalised. We were encamped in our own half, at home until Tugay came on to stop us playing the long ball up to RSC.

SUBSTITUTIONS - Seemed to come from the same Tombola drum he uses to pick his team, and to take off Pedersen & leave us devoid of any left-sided attack was criminal.

TACTICS - So much for 'exciting' & 'attacking' football? Our passing game today was non-existent, particularly in the final third. It wasn't until a 38yo came on that we managed to play a more measured game, by which time we'd lost all the initiative.

MENTAL STRENGTH - Totally zilch. How many times this season have we 'switched off' and conceded? Perhaps we've lulled ourselves into a false sense of security, with a few 'fightbacks' and late goals?

INDIVIDUAL PERFORMANCES - Samba was excellent today, really had the stomach for the fight - pity nobody else seemed to. When we say The Axe was probably our best midfielder, be worried - be very, very worried.

POOR SUNDERLAND SIDE - Consider how bad we must have been to be outplayed by such a limited side. Granted, they had two forwards that will trouble other sides, but how many of their players would other clubs covet? Keane out-thought & out-inspired Ince, which led to a crap side outplaying us easily.

I can't help feel it's Kidd all over again sadly.

We've got players that probably can't wait to get away come January (RSC was starved once more of any decent service).

We've players out of position, injured & seemingly not knowing what tactics the manager is looking to play.

We can't raise our game at all.

We look like we will struggle to score in every game, and probably won't see a clean sheet all season.

We've a few players that are playing their hearts out, only to be dropped or become despondent at the dross around them.

We've a manager that just seems to have lost the plot; certainly there seems a distinct lack of leadership, or a plan, or any consistency.

Based on today alone, I'm worried the rot has well and truly set in, so worrying was what I saw. Lack of fight, lack of cohesion, poor body language, no tactics, no belief, no confidence, lack of interest etc. all are bad enough - but when the manager doesn't look like he wants to (or can't) sort it then the omens are doom I fear.

I'm worried that even if we did bring in Allardyce, it may be no better - but I'm seriously concerned it may even get worse than today.

[Dunnfc]

I call for everyone to be patient and calm and most important of all stay UNITED!!!

We arn't doing brilliant at the moment and of course we should be further up the league, but this year is all about change and adapting to it we are in a transformation period. I say for all those wanting INCE OUT i don't blame you but please think about what your saying.... The man is untested at PL like Southgate so he's still learning. We've got some good players out at the moment and i know you don't want to hear excuses but we've got to stick together and get through this.

When we got Ince i hated it as you all know but ive not said get him out just yet but i believe he's got two games to get at least 4 points from or hes gone, and rightly so, being in a relegation scrap means your in a result industry and Ince shouldbe grinding these out at the very least.

We didn't play well today at all but we all know that weve got to get results sooner or later, we are in a similar situation to West Ham, new manager needing time. Be patient and come back with your Ince's out if we don't pick up four pointsfrom our next six.

[Hughesy]

I have to agree with some of the more sensible posts from 1864 & co, Im worried and it is a very dangerous position we are in.

Today 1st half was comfortable, some neat football, much improved set-plays and Samba was imense, our second half was dreadful.

It was obvious Sunderland had been ripped into at half time by Keane - They took it like men and reacted. Our players get the same treatment after throwing away 3 pts and some take it bad according to some above. FFS!

Roque will be off in either January or Summer, unless he gets alot more support from his colleagues when attacking. Yes he is class, but we cant expect him to pull out a magic trick every game to win it for us.

1 player who didnt deserve to be on the losing side was Samba. He was immense, and you could see he was free to play his game and not have to worry about what Nelsen was messing up.

I can understand why Ooijer was at full back today, as during the week Jones targetted Olsson and won every single header against him, today we stopped that and he looked a much lesser threat in the air.

Its worrying times, there is 4pts between 10 positions in the league so it is still tight. I think Ince should be given the two games against Tottenham & Pompey to prove his worth. If we only take 1 pt or less, then he has to go. But please NOT BIG SAM or CURBISHLEY. That will affect the attendances by a massive drop.

[rover6]

Give Ince a chance. He has suffered from a plague of injuries to his squad. He hasn't been able to put out a settled team. Now is a time to take a deep breath and stick with the current regime and to see them come through.

The worst think that could happen is for excessive pressure to mount (perhaps, unavoidable now), Ince to get the sack and some no-mark kick and rush manager brought in to 'rescue' the squad, eg a Gary Megson type.

[DingleBaiter]

I call for everyone to be patient and calm and most important of all stay UNITED!!!

.....

We didn't play well today at all but we all know that weve got to get results sooner or later, we are in a similar situation to West Ham, new manager needing time. Be patient and come back with your Ince's out if we don't pick up four pointsfrom our next six.

Fair point, and don't want to sound patronising - but did you actually go to this game?

I shared your sentiments and balance until what I witnessed today - it truly was that bad. If you saw the complete disharmony, lack of leadership, absence of effort, tactical calamity & capitulation and still hold your opinions as posted, I salute you sir. That game alone has almost caused me to have a complete 'about face' about Ince's tenure and our future.

“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” (Bertrand Russell)

[Dunnfc]

Fair point, and don't want to sound patronising - but did you actually go to this game?

I shared your sentiments and balance until what I witnessed today - it truly was that bad. If you saw the complete disharmony, lack of leadership, absence of effort, tactical calamity & capitulation and still hold your opinions as posted, I salute you sir. That game alone has almost caused me to have a complete 'about face' about Ince's tenure and our future.

“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” (Bertrand Russell)

DB - Yes i went to the game mate and couldn't believe my eyes, i could have cried.

Perhaps everyones reaction today will give Ince a kick up the jacksie and we will move on up.......

Be optamistic!!!

[DingleBaiter]

I have to agree with some of the more sensible posts from 1864 & co, Im worried and it is a very dangerous position we are in.

......

Its worrying times, there is 4pts between 10 positions in the league so it is still tight. I think Ince should be given the two games against Tottenham & Pompey to prove his worth. If we only take 1 pt or less, then he has to go. But please NOT BIG SAM or CURBISHLEY. That will affect the attendances by a massive drop.

Good post; I think today was a breakwater though, & Williams MUST at least consider a contingency plan - there really was that much to worry about today.

I'm not sure getting rid of Ince on the basis of today's game is the solution, but at least he needs to be put on notice & Plans B, C, D, whatever to be considered.

I'm still unsure sacking Ince/recruiting Allardyce, or anyone else, would be the panacea everyone seems to think and is possibly excessive compared to how we've tended to act in the past.

I'm pretty sure it will be indicated to Ince though what he needs to achieve to remain in the position, and it's probably within the next two games as a 'cut off' to get a win. I'm also pretty certain that discrete enquiries will have been/will be made to relevant parties, like Spurs did with Redknapp, so we're not left in limbo should the axe fall.

Speaking of which, wonder if we get Jol from Hamburg? Whatever the contingency proves to be (if Ince goes), it's going to cost some money.

Looks like we're missing Emo far more than we thought we would.

[Waggy76]

We are going to get relegated , if we dont do something ...But I do not know what

[dingles staying down 4ever]

The second half was the worst 45 minutes of foot.....sorry you can't call it football, that I have had the mis-pleasure of seeing. I should pass on my views but, like the majority of the team, cannot be bothered.

Needless to say Rovers are in trouble!

[modes98]

centre midfielder shoved to the right wing ???????????????

Did you mind when that same CM hit a 20 yarder in the bottom corner against WBA, whilst playing Right Wing? Andrews did a job then, but our lack of RM options without Emerton has cost us, even Pennant would have offered something.

I can understand why Ooijer was at full back today, as during the week Jones targetted Olsson and won every single header against him, today we stopped that and he looked a much lesser threat in the air.

Its worrying times, there is 4pts between 10 positions in the league so it is still tight. I think Ince should be given the two games against Tottenham & Pompey to prove his worth. If we only take 1 pt or less, then he has to go.

If i heard Radio Rovers correctly Olsson was suffering from a sickness bug that had gone around a few players. I would then guess the lack of CM options meant that Warnock, who is out of the Spurs game, wasn't moving back to left back. Ooijer at left back offers nothing for me, he stifles all our speed when breaking forward because he has to come inside onto his right foot.

I would think if we take nothing from both games the media will be all over Ince and we will be rock bottom. Not the best places to go, but we are good on the road!

[Amo]

Did you mind when that same CM hit a 20 yarder in the bottom corner against WBA, whilst playing Right Wing? Andrews did a job then, but our lack of RM options without Emerton has cost us, even Pennant would have offered something.

Andrews scored - yes, but his performance that day was nothing to rave about.

If i heard Radio Rovers correctly Olsson was suffering from a sickness bug that had gone around a few players. I would then guess the lack of CM options meant that Warnock, who is out of the Spurs game, wasn't moving back to left back. Ooijer at left back offers nothing for me, he stifles all our speed when breaking forward because he has to come inside onto his right foot.

You mean the international former AC Milan midfielder that inexplicably never plays?? Ince is shooting himself in the foot not playing Vogel and trying to fit square pegs in round holes.

[AussieinUk]

Oh dear.

Hopefully, writing this may prove cathartic after witnessing one of the poorest, most worrying performances in years.

So, what was so bad about today?

FORMATION - Ince isn't learning from his mistakes - he's openly said Oojer prefers centre-back, and sometimes struggles at right back. So why play him at left back? Why not Zurab (who's played there before) and put Oojer at centre-back? Likewise Derbyshire - another played in a position he does nothing.

Andrews right midfield - the lad is keen as mustard to play and tries, but it was never going to work surely? He DID make a few good passes, but his keenness often led to him being out of position - at one point, he was double marking in the LEFT BACK spot?

To me, Ince put out a defensive-minded side today and it showed - badly. Roberts works hard, but there is zero threat to any goalkeeper from him.

CHANCES - We never looked like scoring today from open play at all. We had plenty pressure in the first half, some great-taken corners, and had a few chances, but all were 'dead balls' apart from Warnock's miss.

LACK OF FIGHT - Sunderland withheld our pressure for 45 mins, they pressured us from the second half kick-off & within a minute hit the crossbar. Minutes later, they equalised. We were encamped in our own half, at home until Tugay came on to stop us playing the long ball up to RSC.

SUBSTITUTIONS - Seemed to come from the same Tombola drum he uses to pick his team, and to take off Pedersen & leave us devoid of any left-sided attack was criminal.

TACTICS - So much for 'exciting' & 'attacking' football? Our passing game today was non-existent, particularly in the final third. It wasn't until a 38yo came on that we managed to play a more measured game, by which time we'd lost all the initiative.

MENTAL STRENGTH - Totally zilch. How many times this season have we 'switched off' and conceded? Perhaps we've lulled ourselves into a false sense of security, with a few 'fightbacks' and late goals?

INDIVIDUAL PERFORMANCES - Samba was excellent today, really had the stomach for the fight - pity nobody else seemed to. When we say The Axe was probably our best midfielder, be worried - be very, very worried.

POOR SUNDERLAND SIDE - Consider how bad we must have been to be outplayed by such a limited side. Granted, they had two forwards that will trouble other sides, but how many of their players would other clubs covet? Keane out-thought & out-inspired Ince, which led to a crap side outplaying us easily.

I can't help feel it's Kidd all over again sadly.

We've got players that probably can't wait to get away come January (RSC was starved once more of any decent service).

We've players out of position, injured & seemingly not knowing what tactics the manager is looking to play.

We can't raise our game at all.

We look like we will struggle to score in every game, and probably won't see a clean sheet all season.

We've a few players that are playing their hearts out, only to be dropped or become despondent at the dross around them.

We've a manager that just seems to have lost the plot; certainly there seems a distinct lack of leadership, or a plan, or any consistency.

Based on today alone, I'm worried the rot has well and truly set in, so worrying was what I saw. Lack of fight, lack of cohesion, poor body language, no tactics, no belief, no confidence, lack of interest etc. all are bad enough - but when the manager doesn't look like he wants to (or can't) sort it then the omens are doom I fear.

I'm worried that even if we did bring in Allardyce, it may be no better - but I'm seriously concerned it may even get worse than today.

Good post and analysis DB (and others, such as 1864), my thoughts have been nicely summarised by your posts. Watching Rovers performance yesterday, was truly bloody awful and painful at times..

[thenodrog]

I'm hearing a rumour several players stormed out of Ewood after a real ding dong with Ince after the game.......there may be more to come of this.

Bloody weird how things pan out ..........

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/...s-Football.html

[RevidgeBlue]

Blackburn manager Paul Ince:

"It was a mistake [from Robinson] as he just came at the wrong time. But he has been outstanding for us and we are all in this together. I have just had a go at the players as I am upset and angry.

"We could have been three or four goals ahead by half-time. We got punished in the second half. It was a diabolical performance and the players should be a bit embarrassed by what happened."

from bbc

pass the buck Paul, its YOUR fault you moron

I disagree with that to a large extent, yes, the buck stops eventually with the manager and he carries the can for results BUT the players let him down in quite spectacular fashion yesterday.

It seemed to me that after a reasonable first half they seemed to think they only had to turn up in the second half to win and never came out of the dressing room.

I never saw a defeat coming yesterday before the game, and I certainly didn't see it at half time!.

If I'd have been manager, I'd have been livid with "the performance" in the second half as well.

Whether Ince survives in the long term is probably open to question now but regardless of the results the players certainly owe him two or three big performances in the forthcoming games.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

So would you say there is a very big possibility Ince has lost the dressing room Rev?

[RevidgeBlue]

Just sat here, still glum as hell watching the Donny v Ipswich game.

Thinking about potential managers coming to Ewood.

Sam Allardyce

Alan Curbishly

Ruud Gullit

Gianluca Vialli

Aidy Boothroyd !

King Kenny

Souness

Riikard ?

managers who might be tempted at other clubs ?

Bruce @ Wigan ?

McCleish @ Brum ?

Mccarthy @ Wolves ?

Foreign managers ?

Jol @ Hamburg ?

Ten Cate @ Greece ?

There is not a lot about

That list is completely unrealistic, out of all those there's probably only Allardyce and Boothroyd (recently sacked by Watford) who would even consider coming to Ewood and Allardyce reputedly burned his bridges at Ewood by giving JW what for when overlooked last time.

So would you say there is a very big possibility Ince has lost the dressing room Rev?

To be honest not on the evidence of the season as a whole.

As for yesterday, if we'd been poor throughout the game I might agree but the first half was ok (without being brilliant) it just seemed to me the problem was one of complacency in the second half.

[1864roverite]

Come off it Rev you are talking absolute horse manure.

Of course the buck stops with the manager.

The players came out yesterday for the second half high fiving that showed they were up for it HOWEVER the formation had changed.

The team got sunk by an ineffective change of tactics, poor substitutions and a lack of know how.

A man as experienced as you are in being a Rovers fan should have expected defeat after the midweek game, it was written in the stars that SAFC would win at Ewood, especially after our inept displays at home.

As for being livid, I was livid, the man next door was livid. Ince should have been bloody furious but at the same time, must have realised that some players dont want to play for him. The dressing room always wins as its the manager that suffers and loses his job.

On the second half yesterday, it is clear that not ONE player, Samba apart, had a clue as to what formation they were playing.

COMPLACENCY ? You are not serious it was WOEFUL as it was BAD.

Even RSC held his arms out questionning the long ball tactics because he had no bloody support.

3 performances in the next 3 games ? Dont make me laugh.

Spuds will hammer us with Bentley no doubt leading the way.

Pompy will do very much the same with Crouch and Defoe scoring at will.

Liverpoo ? Its not even worth worrying about. You can bet yr bottom dollar Keane, Kuyt and Torres, not to mention Gerrard will all score as Rovers buckle big time in th biggest home crowd of the season.

[RevidgeBlue]

The players came out yesterday for the second half high fiving that showed they were up for it HOWEVER the formation had changed.

How so?

We never come out for the second half, conceded a quick equaliser, heads collectively dropped and we conceded an inevitable second but the tactics/formation were the same at that point as in the first half.

[1864roverite]

Well mate explain this.

How can a team so much on top in the first half and with a 1-0 lead capitulate within 20 seconds ?

Thats all it took for Rovers to give the ball away twice.

First Andrews and then Warnock, both failed miserably in finding a front player. Then we go backwards and backwards until the ball is onging around our area. the corner isnt defended well and were suddenly back to 1-1.

What happened in the next 10 minutes was shocking. A premiership team without guidance or leadership, the manager stood at the side the pitch with his hands in his pockets pondering and wondering how he can change it, he speaks with his staff and then effectively concedes the game by turning to 4-4-1-1, relieving the Sunderland defence of the requirement to defend against two big players whilst at the same time employing SMD on the right wing or right midfield berth with the midget Carlos playing just behind RSC in the hole that is swamped with at least 2 covering sunderland midfielders. The defence look for inspiration but dont get it as the midfield is overrun because Rovers cannot hold the ball up front, they cannot hold the ball in midfield, the long ball isnt working because RSC is now being marked by two Sunderland defenders, the righnt side of our defence is attacked at will because SMD is not tracking back whilst in the middle The Axe is coping with 2 players each time because Warnock is missing in action.

The we see the biggest inspirational or solution to the problem, Tugay coming on wasnt a problem but removing MGP was suicidal, for the following reasons, he won 95% of all headers, he can score, he can cross and he can defend. That move, in taking us bak to a more like 4-4-2 was simply atrocious because we now saw carlos having to be a midfidler who must work, run forwards, track back and defend, the latter 2 skills are not in his make up.

At that point, it was like having Rovers with just 9 men on the park.

Even though we conceded a quick goal, I am not sure that he needed to make those substitutions at that time. What he needed was for the team to regroup. Only then should he have made a change. Instead, a rush of blood, wrong formation, wrong tactics saw us take a hit and lose this game 2-1, it could have been worse as we should have seen at least 1 red card in Kish.

If you like, you can have my spare glasses at the next home game

[RibbleValleyRover]

In the Villa game we switched off just before half-time, let them get a goal which cost us the match. There are at least two other games iirc where this happened as well.

Ultimately managers live and die by their results, but I do believe this switching off can't be solely attributed to Ince. The players have to take some of the blame as well.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

I've avoided the board because I knew it would be like this. We were brilliant in the first half, I thought we lost a bit of drive when Andrews went off and Tugay came on too late.

The biggest problem is that the players keep making mistakes. Every player was guilty of sloppy passing and not running for the ball.

Something I did notice yesterday was how Andrews plays a little differently to the rest of the players. he runs TO the ball and doesn't wait for it, and he plays a good pass and move game. Could this be because he has played under Ince for much longer, so he already understands the style and how to play it?

It's disappointing, yes, but we missed so many chances we only have ourselves to blame. They were clinical, we were not.