[Archived] Paul Ince

[imy9]

Indeed it is. Hence my concern.

I dont think it will be an issue. We are pioneers in that we are the first PL to have hired a Black English manager. If he fails it is because of his flaws not because he is white/black, etc.

[tony gale's mic]

Hughes failed to qualify for a tournament when Wales had never qualified for any tournaments ever bar 1958. How is that possibly a fair stick to beat him with?! Shall we stick Sir Alex in charge of Lichenstein and see what happens?!!

He got Wales from 94th in the world to the top 50, how is that not a successful tenure? Toshack is doing a decent job but their world ranking is considerably lower than with Hughes and we shall see if he gets as close as Hughes did to that elusive first tournament. Is he bringing the players through, or is it the clubs? Considering he spends a few days a year with them, I would say it's the clubs that are bringing them through.

To call Hughes a failure as Wales manager is unbelievable and just plain wrong - why do you seem unable to admit this?. He was made Welsh Sports Personality of the Year. He had a bad start but took the team 50 places up the rankings. To compare it with Avram Grant is ridiculous - firstly Grant did a decent job and secondly it's not like he lifted Chelsea from relegation candidates up the table is it?

Success is relative. His success was at a much lower level so in the scheme of things is nowhere near as impressive as success up the leagues. Hughes WAS a success before Rovers and came up against teams like Croatia, Italy, Germany, Czech Republic and Argentina all in 2002 and didn't lose a single game against them that year with his Wales team. That is a much bigger indicator to success at the highest level than pitting your wits against League Two players and managers. I don't see how anyone can argue that.

Every team shows flashes of being good, but the results speak for themselves. We've also been lucky in a few games - late equalisers vs West Brom and Boro, coming up against a severely depleted Everton team twice, our current position is a fair indictment of where we are. I'm sure every team has and will show flashes of being good this season; West Brom at the bottom looked decent enough against us. This means next to nothing.

About player morale - surely anyone can see these interviews are as unreliable as scurrilous sources. There hasn't been an endless stream of gushing praise coming out about Ince, what's been said has been positive but only the most foolish players would come out with anything less than praise. Look at Steve McLaren's reign - players when asked got behind their manager in interviews but what's been said since has been completely the opposite. I'm making no conclusions either way other than to think the players can't be happy with our current predicament. Players being played out of position can't be that enthusaiastic about it, surely.

[Frisky Jim]

The first PL team to hire a black manager, hopefully we will be the first to sack a black manager.

But, alas, the latest in a long line of clubs to sack an incompetent one.

[ABBEY]

Stop shouting and slow down maybe people can understand what you are trying to say? LOOKS LIKE YOU UNDERSTOOD ,OTHERWISE YOU WOULDNT HAVE REPLIED WOULD YOU?

I have elderly parents who are virtually bed ridden which means I cannot drive 100's of miles up and down the country to watch Rovers live, I do try to watch them when they are local, e.g. West Brom game, does this mean that I am not a "proper" fan? I put in as much money into the Rovers coffers as I can be purchasing as much merchandise as possible...100'S OF MILES ITS 100 NOT PLURAL....SORRY IMY I APOLOGISE ...I HERBY NOMINATE YOU AS FAN OF THE YEAR

If your churlish attitude is whats needed to be a Rovers fan then thanks but no thanks. CYA THEN.....ITS YOUR ATTITUDE THAT BLOWS,SLAGGING FANS OFF LIKE YOU DO IMY NEVER WRONG IS IMY..................OH LOOK IVE MADE EM BIGGER

[imy9]

Stop shouting and slow down maybe people can understand what you are trying to say? LOOKS LIKE YOU UNDERSTOOD ,OTHERWISE YOU WOULDNT HAVE REPLIED WOULD YOU?

NO YOU WRITE SOMETHING WHICH RESEMBLED ENGLISH SO ASKED FOR CLARITY, SORRY IF THAT WAS RUDE BUT IT IS DIFFICULT YOU KNOW...

I have elderly parents who are virtually bed ridden which means I cannot drive 100's of miles up and down the country to watch Rovers live, I do try to watch them when they are local, e.g. West Brom game, does this mean that I am not a "proper" fan? I put in as much money into the Rovers coffers as I can be purchasing as much merchandise as possible...100'S OF MILES ITS 100 NOT PLURAL....SORRY IMY I APOLOGISE ...I HERBY NOMINATE YOU AS FAN OF THE YEAR

BIRMINGHAM TO BLACKBURN IS OVER 100 MILES PLURAL- CHECK A ROAD MAP.

YOU ARE THE FAN OF THE YEAR, SHOUTING AND SCREAMING ON HERE, YOU MAKE ME PROUD TO BE A ROVERS FAN WHEN YOU ELEQUENTLY PUT YOUR POINT OF VIEW FORWARD

If your churlish attitude is whats needed to be a Rovers fan then thanks but no thanks. CYA THEN.....ITS YOUR ATTITUDE THAT BLOWS,SLAGGING FANS OFF LIKE YOU DO IMY NEVER WRONG IS IMY..................OH LOOK IVE MADE EM BIGGER

WHERE HAVE I SLAGGED ANYBODY OFF? I HAVE BEEN REFERRED TO AS A MUPPET AMONG OTHER THINGS BUT NEVER RESPOND AS WHATS THE POINT, ITS QUITE LAME REALLY. IT SEEMS THAT IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION WHICH IS IN FAVOUR OF INCE THEN IT IS OK FOR YOU TO BE ATTACKED.

Tony you stated: "Every team shows flashes of being good, but the results speak for themselves." so end the Hughes thing, I merely ask how many games did he win as manager of Wales and how many did he lose and draw, as you said the results will speak for themselves. Toshack has promoted the likes of Bale and Ramsey from the U21's into the senior squad ,when they performed they got transfered to bigger clubs, he gets the credit for that.

[ABBEY]

NO YOU WRITE SOMETHING WHICH RESEMBLED ENGLISH SO ASKED FOR CLARITY, SORRY IF THAT WAS RUDE BUT IT IS DIFFICULT YOU KNOW...

WHERE HAVE I SLAGGED ANYBODY OFF? I HAVE BEEN REFERRED TO AS A MUPPET AMONG OTHER THINGS BUT NEVER RESPOND AS WHATS THE POINT, ITS QUITE LAME REALLY. IT SEEMS THAT IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION WHICH IS IN FAVOUR OF INCE THEN IT IS OK FOR YOU TO BE ATTACKED.

1. whats claer?

2.look at your 16.20 post.

3.noone attacking you because you support ince people do it because you make yourself look like a love sick ince groupie and you talk rubbish....thats why.sorry if thats rude buts its difficult you know.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Abbey, I'm "Pro Ince", well, I'm "Pro-Anything-Rovers", which includes the manager. And I go to games too. I was just as disappointed and angry as you, but people are being overly negative and dramatic. Knee jerk town.

And I have pretty much the same opinion as Imy, it's too early to sack or praise him, and we should get behind him and stop panicking. It's fine to be concerned, I'm concerned too, but screaming to sack him after 13 games is something you'd expect to hear outside St James Park or White Heart Lane.

[roverfanuk]

The first PL team to hire a black manager, hopefully we will be the first to sack a black manager.

But, alas, the latest in a long line of clubs to sack an incompetent one.

Ruud Gullit... Chelsea...?

[ABBEY]

its not knee jerk,its been on the cards for weeks .How can you get behind him when his selections are baffling and his tactics and substitutions are bordering on idiotic.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Because he's the manager of my club.

Go and have a boo Abbey, I'm sure that'll change things.

[imy9]

1. whats claer?

you ever used a keyboard its called getting the a and e muddled up, as a dyslexic it can happen, what is you excuse? I think you will find that most of what I write is pretty accurate.

2.look at your 16.20 post.

?

3.noone attacking you because you support ince people do it because you make yourself look like a love sick ince groupie and you talk rubbish....thats why.sorry if thats rude buts its difficult you know.

talk rubbish? I tell you what, why dont you make a point and I will respond to it- if you look back on previous threads you seem to buckle at that point (it works better than shouting), I apologise if you found what I said about your English rude but it helps when you are trying to communicate.

Because he's the manager of my club.

Go and have a boo Abbey, I'm sure that'll change things.

[ABBEY]

i buckle???? dont talk bloody rubbish.

[Frisky Jim]

Ruud Gullit... Chelsea...?

Jean Tigana... Fulham.

Either way...

INCE OUT!

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

He was replying to me there Abbey.

He replied to you in the quotes.

[ABBEY]

did yesterday not warrent a boo then?

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Oh it did, absolutely.

Boo the players. They looked like they couldn't be arsed and they knew it.

You can boo after a bad performance, I have no qualms with that. But the best way to END poor performances isn't to boo all 90 minutes and start up inane chants of "Ince out Ince out", it's to get behind the team and cheer them on.

Ewood is like a graveyard these days. No wonder we play better away.

[Presty On Tour]

Stop shouting and slow down maybe people can understand what you are trying to say? LOOKS LIKE YOU UNDERSTOOD ,OTHERWISE YOU WOULDNT HAVE REPLIED WOULD YOU?

NO YOU WRITE SOMETHING WHICH RESEMBLED ENGLISH SO ASKED FOR CLARITY, SORRY IF THAT WAS RUDE BUT IT IS DIFFICULT YOU KNOW...

I have elderly parents who are virtually bed ridden which means I cannot drive 100's of miles up and down the country to watch Rovers live, I do try to watch them when they are local, e.g. West Brom game, does this mean that I am not a "proper" fan? I put in as much money into the Rovers coffers as I can be purchasing as much merchandise as possible...100'S OF MILES ITS 100 NOT PLURAL....SORRY IMY I APOLOGISE ...I HERBY NOMINATE YOU AS FAN OF THE YEAR

BIRMINGHAM TO BLACKBURN IS OVER 100 MILES PLURAL- CHECK A ROAD MAP.

YOU ARE THE FAN OF THE YEAR, SHOUTING AND SCREAMING ON HERE, YOU MAKE ME PROUD TO BE A ROVERS FAN WHEN YOU ELEQUENTLY PUT YOUR POINT OF VIEW FORWARD

If your churlish attitude is whats needed to be a Rovers fan then thanks but no thanks. CYA THEN.....ITS YOUR ATTITUDE THAT BLOWS,SLAGGING FANS OFF LIKE YOU DO IMY NEVER WRONG IS IMY..................OH LOOK IVE MADE EM BIGGER

WHERE HAVE I SLAGGED ANYBODY OFF? I HAVE BEEN REFERRED TO AS A MUPPET AMONG OTHER THINGS BUT NEVER RESPOND AS WHATS THE POINT, ITS QUITE LAME REALLY. IT SEEMS THAT IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION WHICH IS IN FAVOUR OF INCE THEN IT IS OK FOR YOU TO BE ATTACKED.

Tony you stated: "Every team shows flashes of being good, but the results speak for themselves." so end the Hughes thing, I merely ask how many games did he win as manager of Wales and how many did he lose and draw, as you said the results will speak for themselves. Toshack has promoted the likes of Bale and Ramsey from the U21's into the senior squad ,when they performed they got transfered to bigger clubs, he gets the credit for that.

Please read my earlier post about Wales.

Toshack had nothing to do with neutering of Ramsey, he went through the Cardiff City ranks and has only played for the Welsh youth sides. The transfer to Arsenal was based on talent at a young age and scouting, nothing to do with Toshack. Similar story with Bale but from Cardiff to southampton and eventually Spurs. Brian Flynn has a lot to do with their success.

If Hughes was still in charge of the national side, I think it's a safe bet they would be in his squad as they are to of the countries best young players. The Fact they were only in their young teens when Hughes was in charge makes your point irrelevant.

[ABBEY]

Oh it did, absolutely.

Boo the players. They looked like they couldn't be arsed and they knew it.

You can boo after a bad performance, I have no qualms with that. But the best way to END poor performances isn't to boo all 90 minutes and start up inane chants of "Ince out Ince out", it's to get behind the team and cheer them on.

Ewood is like a graveyard these days. No wonder we play better away.

was behind the team and apart from where we sit noone else in the ground was.I again have no voice left and hurts like hell.

[tony gale's mic]

Tony you stated: "Every team shows flashes of being good, but the results speak for themselves." so end the Hughes thing, I merely ask how many games did he win as manager of Wales and how many did he lose and draw, as you said the results will speak for themselves. Toshack has promoted the likes of Bale and Ramsey from the U21's into the senior squad ,when they performed they got transfered to bigger clubs, he gets the credit for that.

And I said that I didn't have the exact figures but it's hardly a fair assessment in football when Wales have never been a strong side. The results do speak for themselves, if a manager came in and took a team 50 places up the league ladder then would you say their reign was a success? Seriously you're clutching at straws here, we both know Hughes wasn't a failure as Wales manager, how many failures have got their country's sports personality of the year award for their managerial successes?

Bale was 15 when Hughes left and Ramsay wasn't even on the radar. They got transferred to the club mainly because of their constant performances and rave reviews at club level rather than a few performances at u21 level. Hughes would have done the same, so really that's no way of comparing them.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

was behind the team and apart from where we sit noone else in the ground was.I again have no voice left and hurts like hell.

A return for the drummer is clearly in order.

[imy9]

And I said that I didn't have the exact figures but it's hardly a fair assessment in football when Wales have never been a strong side. The results do speak for themselves, if a manager came in and took a team 50 places up the league ladder then would you say their reign was a success? Seriously you're clutching at straws here, we both know Hughes wasn't a failure as Wales manager, how many failures have got their country's sports personality of the year award for their managerial successes?

Bale was 15 when Hughes left and Ramsay wasn't even on the radar. They got transferred to the club mainly because of their constant performances and rave reviews at club level rather than a few performances at u21 level. Hughes would have done the same, so really that's no way of comparing them.

If someone takes a team 50 places down then another 50 up is that a success.

Toshack has blamed a lot on Hughes and you can see why.

Regardless he was a success at Rovers

[ABBEY]

A return for the drummer is clearly in order.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Abbey, I'm "Pro Ince", well, I'm "Pro-Anything-Rovers", which includes the manager. And I go to games too. I was just as disappointed and angry as you, but people are being overly negative and dramatic. Knee jerk town.

And I have pretty much the same opinion as Imy, it's too early to sack or praise him, and we should get behind him and stop panicking. It's fine to be concerned, I'm concerned too, but screaming to sack him after 13 games is something you'd expect to hear outside St James Park or White Heart Lane.

I agree with your sentiment - I still think we could have an excellent manager - but I am not as convinced as I was. I still like the way he seems to be nuturing and giving the young players the confidence to make the step up - which is absolutely essential at a club like ours.

His interview on RL post match worried me - I could have forgiven him complaining about the ever increasing injuries and illness (lets be honest - a fully fit RSC playing all matches this season, or even David Dunn, and we wouldn't be in the position we are in at the moment) I could have even allowed a mention of lady luck (as the ball doesn't seem to be dropping for us in the final third at the moment). However, when he started to complain about the lack of financial resources in comparison to other clubs, I lost a little more of my faith in him. He knew what he was taking on (in terms of finances), he inherited a solid side, and had more finances than MH had in all his time at Rovers.

If the club are sensible - PI has until mid-December to stop the rot - this is the ideal time to bring in a new manager - when he has time to assess his squad and then use the January window to good effect.

For all those that criticise - give him time - carry on supporting the club (doing anything else won't help the players confidence). We have to hope that JW can make the right choice over the next month - I wouldn't like to be in his shoes, as I couldn't say yet whether Ince should stay or go - but hopefully he will have a better idea of how the players genuinely view PI - and IMO this should have a major bearing on his decision.

[tony gale's mic]

If someone takes a team 50 places down then another 50 up is that a success.

Toshack has blamed a lot on Hughes and you can see why.

Regardless he was a success at Rovers

When he started his job at Wales they were 94th.

When he left they were in the top 50.

That isn't 50 places down and another 50 up...

[John]

I agree with your sentiment - I still think we could have an excellent manager - but I am not as convinced as I was. I still like the way he seems to be nuturing and giving the young players the confidence to make the step up - which is absolutely essential at a club like ours.

His interview on RL post match worried me - I could have forgiven him complaining about the ever increasing injuries and illness (lets be honest - a fully fit RSC playing all matches this season, or even David Dunn, and we wouldn't be in the position we are in at the moment) I could have even allowed a mention of lady luck (as the ball doesn't seem to be dropping for us in the final third at the moment). However, when he started to complain about the lack of financial resources in comparison to other clubs, I lost a little more of my faith in him. He knew what he was taking on (in terms of finances), he inherited a solid side, and had more finances than MH had in all his time at Rovers.

If the club are sensible - PI has until mid-December to stop the rot - this is the ideal time to bring in a new manager - when he has time to assess his squad and then use the January window to good effect.

For all those that criticise - give him time - carry on supporting the club (doing anything else won't help the players confidence). We have to hope that JW can make the right choice over the next month - I wouldn't like to be in his shoes, as I couldn't say yet whether Ince should stay or go - but hopefully he will have a better idea of how the players genuinely view PI - and IMO this should have a major bearing on his decision.

Agree, good post.