[Archived] Paul Ince

[thenodrog]

Given we have a liking for contract clauses, I hope we put one in Ince's. I thought he was on 1.5M over three years, so about right 3-4M. Don't forget though we would also have compo for the ones who are booted out as well. I wouldn't be surprised if sacking Ince and co if thats where we end up costs about 5M+, thats a decent premiership player!

I don't necessarily believe that majiball. Given the gamble of employing a 4th div manager and his 4th Div back-up team I would be gobsmacked if there was not a severance clause involved in his contract which would protect BRFC by allowing us to get shut on the cheap if it wasn't working within a certain timescale.

[thenodrog]

I have grave concerns over any future that involves the Bolton Butcher at my club. However, I've now grave concerns over the present under Ince as I see our future being in the Championship, based on too many basics wrong yesterday.

Allardyce hasn't a great history apart from Bolton - he's taken two clubs down (one when he came late on) - so it's not a given he's a relegation battler. One look at his Newcastle tenure clearly shows the same faults Ince faces (injuries, players out of position, instant unpopularity with fans, unsettled dressing room, strange tactics, stubborness & lack of leadership) so it's nowhere near a given he'd be a solution.

My preferred choice of Allardyce as replacement is based on the fact that he has a successful record in the Prem BUT if the worst case scenario happens and we are relegated then he would prob be the best man to manage us in the Championship. All these 'exotic' foreign names would not know what the hell 2nd Div std football is all about and the unthinkable drop of 2 divisions could quite easily come about.

[gumboots]

Some of the names being touted on this thread are seriously deluded. Take a look at who other clubs of our ilk managed to recruit when in dire straits:

Wigan - Brucey

Bolton - Megson

Mighty Newcastle - Kinnear

Even Top 4 next year Spurs went for their least exotic manager for yonks.

We had our chance to shop in Harrod's in the summer; now we're in Aldi. Beggars can't be choosers.

This is our problem isn't it? I so wanted Ince to be a success and I haven't quite given up hope yet but yesterday was appalling. Warnock looked like he'd already left for City or at least thought he had and if Chris Samba hadn't decided to put in his best performance for ages we'd have lost even more heavily. But who is there to get us out of this mess? Who would come? Would the players respond to whoever that was? Could we afford it when we need new players? I can't vote sack him because I just can't see any logical other manager option. Spurs had obviously thought about it, and before sacking Ramos must have had a fair idea that they might get Redknapp, but who would it be for us? If it was Allardyce he'd almost be able to name his conditions and then if it didn't work out we'd be even worse off. Curbishley doesn't fill me with delight either. And who else? Perhaps I can have the job since my team swept all before them with a display of disciplined defending, confident midfield play and well-taken goals from the strikers meaning we were undefeated in 5 and didn't concede. We scored 2 penalties to the opposition 1 in the final too and didn't need to take our 3rd. Mind you they did mainly organise themselves and they are 11 year old school boys.

[Majiball]

I don't necessarily believe that majiball. Given the gamble of employing a 4th div manager and his 4th Div back-up team I would be gobsmacked if there was not a severance clause involved in his contract which would protect BRFC by allowing us to get shut on the cheap if it wasn't working within a certain timescale.

I hope your right.

Sorry Theno you will never convince me BFS is the answer, he comes with too much baggage and Newcastle was a disaster similiar to our current one. Yes he maybe a sound option should we go down, but we're not down yet!!!

[roverfanuk]

Look, in the terms of next manager, i think Curbs and Sam would be at the top of the list.

Curbs managed to do allot with not much of a budget at West Ham. He managed to appropriately blood new youngsters and buy some decent players. Granted he had a bit of a injury nightmare with his players which i think he might have learned from. Saved West Ham from relegation.

Sam, spent allot of money comparibly at the Toon, and his signings all flopped as far as i can see. He played a horrible long ball game which the Newcastle fans learned to hate him for... Almost made Newcastle relegation candidates well and trully!

[den]

This is our problem isn't it? I so wanted Ince to be a success and I haven't quite given up hope yet but yesterday was appalling. Warnock looked like he'd already left for City or at least thought he had and if Chris Samba hadn't decided to put in his best performance for ages we'd have lost even more heavily. But who is there to get us out of this mess? Who would come? Would the players respond to whoever that was? Could we afford it when we need new players? I can't vote sack him because I just can't see any logical other manager option. Spurs had obviously thought about it, and before sacking Ramos must have had a fair idea that they might get Redknapp, but who would it be for us? If it was Allardyce he'd almost be able to name his conditions and then if it didn't work out we'd be even worse off. Curbishley doesn't fill me with delight either. And who else? Perhaps I can have the job since my team swept all before them with a display of disciplined defending, confident midfield play and well-taken goals from the strikers meaning we were undefeated in 5 and didn't concede. We scored 2 penalties to the opposition 1 in the final too and didn't need to take our 3rd. Mind you they did mainly organise themselves and they are 11 year old school boys.

At this stage GB, it doesn't matter who's available. The board really only have one question to ponder - "do they believe Paul Ince can turn the situation around?"

If the answer is "no", then they will have to sack him. There is no other choice.

[vyeo]

Prospects for a voluntary resignation by Paul Ince are poor. There is absolutely no sign that Ince will resign. Looking at his history, he is likely to be too proud a character to admit he is not up to the job. Instead of accepting that his motivational skills, training methods and tactics are inadequate, he is blaming the players. Ince is getting his excuses in. According to soccernet, he said leadership and inspiration "can't always come from the staff and the management, it has got to come from them. They are the ones out there.'' His usual refrain about not having money to spend is also well documented. Again, he said yesterday that "we have not spent the most money in this league, probably the second lowest." This man is all about being negative. Hughes is evidence that things can be done on a budget.

Hopefully, he will be booted out. Unceremoniously.

[roverfanuk]

Couldn't have put it better myself vyeo!

[Frisky Jim]

I know one of the first team players well (he is not a 1st team player yet).

he tells me that the players are in revolt, Ince is a bully and an amateur

sorry but no names.

PS. can anyone send a link of this page to the LET

INCE OUT

I'm not surprised - Paul Ince is destroying the football club.

Is that it? Wow, what a shock - NOT.

Your contradiction in the first line suggests your 'source' is somewhat less than objective. How about substantiating this more so that it doesn't sound like sour grapes from your 'mate', or someone trying to make a name for themself in posting tripe anyone could guess at, whilst being so vague and tenuous it sounds laughable?

No-one needs to send a link of your page anywhere - add some flesh to the bones (no names needed) in describing the situation and the 'bush telegraph' will do the rest.

I'd suggest you give a bit more elaboration though so it doesn't sound like something you'd dreamed up.

How incredibly naive.

[Bobby G]

Would be interesting if nicko was around to comment...

[LDRover]

At this stage GB, it doesn't matter who's available. The board really only have one question to ponder - "do they believe Paul Ince can turn the situation around?"

If the answer is "no", then they will have to sack him. There is no other choice.

Totally agree Den, if he stays we'll go down anyway so the board HAVE to take action.

[Jan]

As I said in the Matt Jansen thread, anybody who is really serious about becoming a manager starts his badges before he takes a job. Even Matt has them. Ince is not a manager, he's a waste of money. Get shot now. Or just shoot now. Not too fussed actually. (Shooting would be cheaper)

[andrew92]

As I said in the Matt Jansen thread, anybody who is really serious about becoming a manager starts his badges before he takes a job. Even Matt has them. Ince is not a manager, he's a waste of money. Get shot now. Or just shoot now. Not too fussed actually. (Shooting would be cheaper)

and we love our cheaper options!

[gillibrand]

Look, in the terms of next manager, i think Curbs and Sam would be at the top of the list.

Curbs managed to do allot with not much of a budget at West Ham. He managed to appropriately blood new youngsters and buy some decent players. Granted he had a bit of a injury nightmare with his players which i think he might have learned from. Saved West Ham from relegation.

Sam, spent allot of money comparibly at the Toon, and his signings all flopped as far as i can see. He played a horrible long ball game which the Newcastle fans learned to hate him for... Almost made Newcastle relegation candidates well and trully!

Hughes did well for us on a tight budget, but now he has a lot more to spend he does not seem to be doing so well for City, like Sam at the Barcodes.

[gumboots]

At this stage GB, it doesn't matter who's available. The board really only have one question to ponder - "do they believe Paul Ince can turn the situation around?"

If the answer is "no", then they will have to sack him. There is no other choice.

And who would you have as caretaker bearing in mind that most on here think less of his backroom squad than they do of Ince? We need a manager for next week even if only interim so unless we've got a good idea of who as Spurs had and have a reasonable idea that they can get him I don't see how we can simply sack Ince. When there was Tony parkes in the background it wasn't a problem. He might not have been up to management on a longer term basis but for a few weeks he could keep things ticking over and even win the odd game but who now?

[tony gale's mic]

Look, in the terms of next manager, i think Curbs and Sam would be at the top of the list.

Curbs managed to do allot with not much of a budget at West Ham. He managed to appropriately blood new youngsters and buy some decent players. Granted he had a bit of a injury nightmare with his players which i think he might have learned from. Saved West Ham from relegation.

Sam, spent allot of money comparibly at the Toon, and his signings all flopped as far as i can see. He played a horrible long ball game which the Newcastle fans learned to hate him for... Almost made Newcastle relegation candidates well and trully!

It's unfair to judge Sam on Newcastle. This is a club that has sacked King Kenny and Bobby Robson amongst others, almost every manager has failed there. Newcastle were 12th or something when Sam left and it has only been since then that Keegan turned them into actual relegation candidates like they were last season.

[Exiled in Toronto]

At this stage GB, it doesn't matter who's available. The board really only have one question to ponder - "do they believe Paul Ince can turn the situation around?"

If the answer is "no", then they will have to sack him. There is no other choice.

Ridiculous. To sack him without any plan for a replacement would lead to certain relegation.

Any clown could just sack Ince and then scratch their nuts wondering what to do next. Williams get paid a quarter of a million a year and has to earn that in the next 8 weeks by solving what is a very bad situation.

[gillibrand]

I hope your right.

Sorry Theno you will never convince me BFS is the answer, he comes with too much baggage and Newcastle was a disaster similiar to our current one. Yes he maybe a sound option should we go down, but we're not down yet!!!

I think that there are people on here that would not approve of Big Sam even if he took us to the top of the Preimership and into Europe.

[den]

And who would you have as caretaker bearing in mind that most on here think less of his backroom squad than they do of Ince? We need a manager for next week even if only interim so unless we've got a good idea of who as Spurs had and have a reasonable idea that they can get him I don't see how we can simply sack Ince. When there was Tony parkes in the background it wasn't a problem. He might not have been up to management on a longer term basis but for a few weeks he could keep things ticking over and even win the odd game but who now?

Fair comment Gumboots. I don't know who would, or could step in on a temporary basis, but that can't alter any decisions on Ince. If the board don't believe he can turn this situation around, he will have to go. Now that could be done in a way that doesn't call for a caretaker - I don't know.

This is the question the fans should be asking as well. It's all well and good comparing Ince's record with that of Hughes, but that doesn't help anyone. The fans must ask "do I think he can turn it around"? Personally, I don't think he's close to it. I could be wrong, but there haven't been any signs of it to me.

Ridiculous. To sack him without any plan for a replacement would lead to certain relegation.

Where did I say they should?

[LDRover]

Ridiculous. To sack him without any plan for a replacement would lead to certain relegation.

Any clown could just sack Ince and then scratch their nuts wondering what to do next. Williams get paid a quarter of a million a year and has to earn that in the next 8 weeks by solving what is a very bad situation.

I'd like to think that Williams has spent the last day or so sounding out potential replacements EIT. The longer it goes on the more I think that he's just hoping it'll go away.

Comes down to one thing - has he got the balls to do what has to be done and to right the wrong that he is ultimately responsible for?

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

To be fair that is more to do with injuries than choice. I am pretty sure if he could this is the team he would put out and stick to:

--------------Cruz--McCarthy

Pedersen---------Dunn---------Emerton

-------------------Grella

Warnock---Nelsen---Samba---Simpson

------------------Robinson

Injuries have meant that he can't do that and has to pick a new team every game. That said dealing with injuries is part of the game. And Ince has not coped well- rushing players back and so on.

I can't altogether agree with you there Joey, take the back four situation, we have Samba , Nelsen, Ooijer and Zurab to fill the positions . How many permutations has he tried up to now ? has he tried Ooijer and Samba yet ? He must have tried all the others. He watches the training , he may even have a run about with them , he's got to know his best pair by now, just stick with them !

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

On the other hand, Zurab was awesome against Everton and terrible yesterday. So it's not as simple as Football Manager might want you to think.

[Parsonblue]

I am neither pro nor anti-Ince but I am pro-Rovers. I admit that Ince would not have been my choice for manager in the summer as I believed at the time – and still do – that Big Sam would have done an excellent job at a club like ours. However, the only opinion that matters at the moment is that of John Williams and his fellow directors. If John Williams believes that Paul Ince is capable of guiding to team to a position outside of the bottom three then he must stay. If not then he must go. However, I suspect that John Williams and his fellow directors simply aren’t sure if the manager has the ability to keep us up and therein remains the biggest danger to the future of the club.

Last week I suggested that Ince be given more time to prove himself but his inclusion of Andy Haworth at Sunderland – ahead of Doran and Judge – and yesterday’s debacle have really made shaken by confidence in his ability to guide up to a position of safety. At the moment I would happily settle for fourth off the bottom at the end of the season.

With a third of the season gone we are in the thick of the tightest relegation battle that anyone can remember. We are approaching the most crucial stage of the season for, apart from Liverpool, December and January would appear to give us our best opportunity to get some points on the board with fixtures that ought to be winnable. However, yesterday’s game should have been winnable and yet disintegrated into a complete and utter shambles – largely due to the manager’s poor use of substitutes. If we keep faith with Ince through December and January and it goes wrong I honestly don’t believe that there will be a way back for whoever is asked to pick up the pieces.

I really do fear for the future as I believe relegation will be the end of the Rovers as a top flight club for a generation for more.

Although, like Rev, I believe it unfair to judge him on the next few games I really can’t see how the manager can survive if we lose against Tottenham, Portsmouth and Liverpool. With just three points from the previous 21, suddenly the safety line of 40 to 42 points looks a very long way away. However, I do agree that if we decide to change the manager it must be done in the same manner and with the same speed that Tottenham carried out their changeover.

Nonetheless, I will travel to Tottenham next week still hopeful that the manager can turn it around but the signs are beginning to look ominous.

[John]

We had our chance to shop in Harrod's in the summer; now we're in Aldi. Beggars can't be choosers.

True - the club went for the cheap option. However, the reason they went for the cheap option is that we don't have any money (or do not want to spend any money which is their prerogative).

Ince has looked out of his depth at this level and has already told us that we are in 'for a long tough season'. What a positive vibe that must create around the place. In addition, there have been a number of things to suggest he really is not sure what he is doing. Right back was the abosutely priority position in the summer, then it became a box to box central midfielder when we all knew that Bentley was off. Have the players he has brought in actually improved the quality of the squad?

Fair enough, you expect mistakes to be made, but there seems a lack of direction/focus in what he is trying to do. One minute he is talking about Brazilian football, the next it is all about results.

We need to be careful though as the league is very competitive this year, and there is not much separating a lot of the teams. It is natural for us to be worried at the moment but I think he should be 'given more time'. Plus looking around, the alternatives look pretty average.

[1864roverite]

I think the deafening wall of silence from Ewood suggests that the time for Ince's exit may not be too long in forthcoming.

No comments or quots from Ince

The sacrificial article from Matthias

Silence from the Senior Management

Very Very little comments or quotes from players

Its a bad bad sad time time at Ewood Park where a clean sweep from a new broom is required urgently.