[Archived] Sam Allardyce

[tony gale's mic]

How is Ten Cate doing in Greece? We couldn't have gone for Laudrup if his 'Spanish team release clause' was true, as he may have been offered the Real Madrid job. And Shhhhhhteve McClaren would have been plain wrong however well he is doing in Holland. Would have been better than Ince though.

ten Cate's been doing very well from what I hear. And with the Laudrup thing I've never got that argument. If he was doing well enough for Real Madrid to come in for him then we would've needed to be doing pretty well with him in charge surely and at least amongst the European slots, so either way wouldnt have been a bad situation.

Anyway I'm sure we would've been okay had Sam took the reins in the summer and I've backed him unequivocally since he came to the club and, as you can see from the start of the thread, wanted him to replace Ince. But I think the issue was appointing Ince (and potentially Shearer) rather than not appointing Sam...we did have other options.

[DE.]

The Ince choice was a disaster, a very, very big mistake by our board which very nearly cost us our premier league status and cost them both in compensation paid out to Ince and money paid to Sam in order to keep us up. I don't think they'll be making that mistake again any time soon.

I imagine in the summer it came down to cost, sadly. Ince & Shearer were undoubtedly cheaper options than Allardyce or ten Cate or Mancini. As others have said, there's no f'n way Ince's interview could have been better than the aforemetioned.

[JAL]

According to Williams, they had a choice to go with inexperience and promise over experience and expense. It worked with Hughes, it failed with Ince. The expectation was that we would slip a little bit, but not as much as we did.

When you use that philosophy when buying players, you can afford a few duds. When you do it with managers, you can't afford a single dud.

Yes, but American, Hughes and his team had the highest qualifications possible in coaching professional footballers aided with coming up up against and working with the highest calibre of footballers that were out there in the professional game.

Ince had absolutley nothing to compare against Hughes and his team for this the board were extremely negligent. Williams and the board very nearly cost the club its future for me thats something that shouldnt be overlooked, they just didnt come across as smart guys capable of making critical decisions.

[Billy Castell]

ten Cate's been doing very well from what I hear. And with the Laudrup thing I've never got that argument. If he was doing well enough for Real Madrid to come in for him then we would've needed to be doing pretty well with him in charge surely and at least amongst the European slots, so either way wouldnt have been a bad situation.

Anyway I'm sure we would've been okay had Sam took the reins in the summer and I've backed him unequivocally since he came to the club and, as you can see from the start of the thread, wanted him to replace Ince. But I think the issue was appointing Ince (and potentially Shearer) rather than not appointing Sam...we did have other options.

So you would have settled for a manager who doesn't want to be here, and is just keeping himself busy until someone else comes along. I don't know what your marital status is Bazz, but I'd be a bit worried for you! Rovers thrives on stability, and having 3 managers in such a short space of time doesn't sound good. Obviously all this is hypothetical, but I'd like my club to seem like more of a respectable place to build something rather than somewhere a manager can crash out for a few nights and then shove off as soon as they get a phone call. We'd have looked a really soft touch if a second manager within a year scuttled off to a 'bigger club'.

It was odd that Ince AND Shearer were the two leading candidates. Neither had any experience at all, and even Steve McTulip would have been a better option. Like others have said, Williams must have hoped lightening would strike twice. It didn't.

[American]

Yes, but American, Hughes and his team had the highest qualifications possible in coaching professional footballers aided with coming up up against and working with the highest calibre of footballers that were out there in the professional game.

Ince had absolutley nothing to compare against Hughes and his team for this the board were extremely negligent. Williams and the board very nearly cost the club its future for me thats something that shouldnt be overlooked, they just didnt come across as smart guys capable of making critical decisions.

Hughes had no experience at club management. It was a big risk.

[Inta Beaver]

Well done Big Sam on keeping us up, I look forward to seeing who he brings in the summer, it will be his team/players next year.

Well done to John Williams and the board for getting rid of Ince when we did, especially when alot of other managers were saying 'he needs time' Rednapp, he would of loved us to go down. I hear Ince might be lined up for the Port Vale job, it is his level!

[thenodrog]

Shearer was first choice. Ince was second. Our board were unfathomably stupid.

An excellent summary. Very worrying that golden boy John Williams will likely be given the task of finding a manager when Allardyce inevitably leaves in the next couple of years.

Well done Big Sam on keeping us up, I look forward to seeing who he brings in the summer, it will be his team/players next year.

Well done to John Williams and the board for getting rid of Ince when we did, especially when alot of other managers were saying 'he needs time' Rednapp, he would of loved us to go down. I hear Ince might be lined up for the Port Vale job, it is his level!

The issue is more about why an intellectual pygmy like Ince was ever appointed than a 'well done' pat on the back for potting him. Rem word is that JW wanted to give him more time ffs!!!

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Well don Sam on turning around a situation that looked terrible under Ince....my only wish now is that the board back you with coin come the Summer break.

[philipl]

After the dark days of November and early December, the only thing to be said is

Thank you Sam

[The Prof.]

What I can't understand about it is how Ince came across so well in the interview that we gave him the job. The man had no staff, little knowledge of attainable targets for Rovers, no real cohesive strategy. I can't imagine his interview was anywhere near as impressive as Sam's or Hughes'. Seeing as he had no top level managerial experience his interview would have been the main thing the board would have to go on. He either is a far more eloquent and thought out guy face to face than he appears to be from the fans point of view. Or the board just decided to roll the dice.

The latter is unacceptable.

No, no no - he was the cheapest.

Happened to me at a job near Ewood in a petrol station years ago. four of us went for the job (mates) and the owner kept asking what our minimum wage would be. Ended up at 40p an hour to a dyslexic pal who couldn't do the prices!

[AlanK]

Thanks Sam. You did it

[philipl]

Ince I believe was on £1.5m a year. That is more than the £1m a year Shearer is asking from Newcastle and not too differet from Hughes' and Allardyce's wages at Ewood.

Ince was NOT selected because he was the cheap option irrespective of how much certain posters want to believe it.

[The Prof.]

Ince I believe was on £1.5m a year. That is more than the £1m a year Shearer is asking from Newcastle and not too differet from Hughes' and Allardyce's wages at Ewood.

Ince was NOT selected because he was the cheap option irrespective of how much certain posters want to believe it.

God lord - who the heck WAS the cheap option Nicko mentioned? John Coleman?

[thenodrog]

Ince I believe was on £1.5m a year. That is more than the £1m a year Shearer is asking from Newcastle and not too differet from Hughes' and Allardyce's wages at Ewood.

Ince was NOT selected because he was the cheap option irrespective of how much certain posters want to believe it.

If that is true then JW should be clearing his desk. Any 4th div manager should walk a mile over broken glass to manage in the Prem. To pay him in line with Prem managers need only happen once he has proved himself. Horrible how some people can chuck around other peoples money isn't it? I must say that I am losing more and more faith in our chairman after some of the events of this season.

btw I thought AS was on a huge bonus if he kept em up?

[tony gale's mic]

I know £1.5m a year is a lot but on the other hand it's 30k a week which is what you'd be paying a regular first team player.

[thenodrog]

I know £1.5m a year is a lot but on the other hand it's 30k a week which is what you'd be paying a regular first team player.

Not in the 4th Div you wouldn't. That was the standard of players that he was managing and that is the standard of manager that he is........ on a good day.

[thenodrog]

Some of SA's biggest detractors have gone mighty quiet since the end of yesterdays match! Is that silence actually the sound of licking wounds?

waggy, Tris and eddie must be sooooo disappointed now that safety has virtually been assured and that we will be in the Prem next year with lardarse the gum chewing slug still at the helm!

btw has Ince got the Port Vale job yet or have they found a better option from the ranks of Potteries park football?

[tony gale's mic]

True but when hiring a manager we had to pay him Premiership wages. It's not like signing a 4th division player - you pay him less on the assumption that you're probably going to play him less. The wages weren't a mistake - signing him was the big mistake.

Anyway the latest post-Sam league table:

It's over half a season now so is a very good indicator as to how good we currently are. Extrapolated over the course of a season we wouldve got 54 points which would usually see us 9th or some seasons 8th.

What's apparent is that there's the top 4, then there's a middle group of clubs which we've been used to being part of in recent years (but who we're not part of in the actual table), then starting at Stoke there's a bottom group of 9 or so teams.

Going on that table we're a top 10 side again this season since the Ince era should be regarded as a horrible anomaly. That means we've been a top 10 club for 4 seasons in a row now and that should play a role in our targets for next season. We definitely shouldn't just aim to stay in the league. If you look at the clubs below us, with the exception of Villa, chances are they're going to be pretty poor again next season.

Only problem is that it's hard to see us finishing above many of the teams above us either. Villa will strengthen and regroup this summer and have money to spend too. I can only really see us potentially finishing ahead of Fulham and West Ham (especially if their financial troubles kick in) if we have a good season, and they both have excellent managers. But then, having said that, we are only 5 points away from Everton in 5th so really if we can do good business this summer then who knows what might happen.

[Bobby G]

We are the only team to have drastically improved its form in the second half of the season by my reckoning, along with Man City and Stoke and thats testament to Big Sam.

[Eddie]

Some of SA's biggest detractors have gone mighty quiet since the end of yesterdays match! Is that silence actually the sound of licking wounds?

waggy, Tris and eddie must be sooooo disappointed now that safety has virtually been assured and that we will be in the Prem next year with lardarse the gum chewing slug still at the helm!

btw has Ince got the Port Vale job yet or have they found a better option from the ranks of Potteries park football?

Not licking wounds, I'm pleased and enjoying the 700 pounds I won on the game. I've never said that I thought we would go down. Hasn't changed the concerns that I have though.

Ince I believe was on £1.5m a year. That is more than the £1m a year Shearer is asking from Newcastle and not too differet from Hughes' and Allardyce's wages at Ewood.

That is much too much for a relatively unproven manager, but at the same time Allardyce is on 40k a week here, so it's quite a difference. Still shocking that Ince could have been on that much.

[John]

Not licking wounds, I'm pleased and enjoying the 700 pounds I won on the game. I've never said that I thought we would go down. Hasn't changed the concerns that I have though.

Says the man who thinks Ince would have turned things around, ha!!

[Eddie]

Does that go against the statement I made?

[John]

Does that go against the statement I made?

Not sure but pretty embarrassing, hang your head in shame!

[yoda]

Does that go against the statement I made?

no, only your judgement

[JAL]

Hughes had no experience at club management. It was a big risk.

Hughes had employed International standards that were being brought down to league management, risk, maybe, but he had some quality contacts to aid him.

What did the big ego have? Mathias and Knoxx! many posters were posting at the time how alarming this was and questioning the validity of their appointments.

The board were negligent in appointing Ince and co. there was no risk, risk should'nt become part of the evaluation process the board just didnt do their jobs properly.