[Archived] Sam Allardyce

[AggyBlue]

Might have had more chance if the scousers had not turned em over this aft!

Thanks Gord.

[Steve Moss]

be serious, none of them are available on loan, cloud cuckoo land the players from arsenal and real and its more than likely huge wads of cash to buy before you try on the others and untried chelsea nippers will not be the answer..............worst post ive read in a long time

If Chelsea would loan us Di Santo to get some experience, I think it logical that other clubs, both here and abroad, might be willing to do the same. Gets their players who would otherwise sit on the bench some top level experience at our expense. Doesn't hurt to ask.

[Miker]

I think a good comparison to Sam and Blackburn is Megson and Bolton. I remember there was a lot of criticism over Megson and the results he was getting for Bolton, trying to fight off relegation. He had the same questions asked of him when he purchased Elmander, who was a complete flop.

HOWEVER, a season later, we see Megson enjoying some relative success and consistency. They are putting in some very nice performances and are battling against teams like we once were. Megson didn't do this after one full season, he did it in his second full season in charge... and honestly I am not surprised. Managers need time, as do the players. We have seen quality from the majority of our players at some point throughout the season. We showed our battling characteristics against Arsenal, even though we ended up losing 6-2, but the point is that the potential is there, it's up to Sam to exploit it and I think in the end he will. He must be given time though. Losing to some quality teams away isn't the end of the world. This season is going to be topsy turvy and there won't be too many games where you can see a clear winner.

People go into panic mode every time we have a shocking performance. Unfortunately that's just football, no matter how you employ tactics, you can still get beat if the team is just too good for you. Watching Liverpool vs United yesterday, I noted how much pressure was put on Torres... he was essentially kept out of the game for the majority of the time, but Liverpool kept chipping away and in the end, Torres broke through and scored. It's all about player battles and when a team like ours is played, against what I think will be this season's champions, then all the players have to either play to their utmost best or be punished for it. Missing Samba, Dunn, Di Santo and Chimbonda would be demoralising, having the flu would be highly irritating... so for them to play at their best, it is a big ask.

[dulwich]

While in principle we can agree on targetting games, we're realists after all, we aren't likely to get anything against the top 4/6, what happens when the rest doesn't quite go to plan?

If we get nothing from the top 4/6 we're already 24/36 points down. Now add to that defeats against Sunderland away and Everton away, and the home draw against West Ham, that leaves us 32/44 points down.

The point is that nothing is guaranteed in football, if we can guarantee we'll get the points against the bottom 10, as seems to be the plan as Hughesy pointed out, then all well and good, but we can't guarantee that. Allardyce has already laid the blame on Saturday firmly at the door of the players, who's to say that they'll carry out his instructions in the future?

Why bother with cup games in fact? If targetting games is the future, won't that mean an end to the fairytale of cup upsets? Should we believe that Peterborough have targetted tomorrow nights game as "unwinnable", or shall we believe that, quite rightly, they'll be coming to give their all against the bigger club with the aim of causing an upset?

[philipl]

Square football debate on Sam I hadn't appreciated just how awful our away record is.

[Hughesy]

Cant really argue with what Sam said about the players........

“At the moment they are not good enough. Bottom line. Mentally resilient not there.

"Physically challenge to the opposition not there."

We need to get back to being hard to beat....at 1-0 if we could have kept it to that - 20 mins to go we could have been abit more adventerous and gone to get a late equaliser...instead the players shipped 4 goals in 20 mins!

[Big Fat Sam]

Cant really argue with what Sam said about the players........

“At the moment they are not good enough. Bottom line. Mentally resilient not there.

"Physically challenge to the opposition not there."

We need to get back to being hard to beat....at 1-0 if we could have kept it to that - 20 mins to go we could have been abit more adventerous and gone to get a late equaliser...instead the players shipped 4 goals in 20 mins!

Who sets the mentality at the club? Who is the man supposed to be able to motivate and direct his players? Who is the man responsible for keeping them fit?

For me its Sam and his team.

We employ a sports psychologist, what is he doing to solve this issue its his territory. Sam was hailed by many on here as a scientific football coach, yet we haved loads of little injuries this season. We don't look as fit as the other teams in the league. We cannot start games, we've conceded a number of goals in the first 10 again what are they doing? I'm fed up with him blaming everyone when we lose and claiming he's an expert when we win, he's responsible for both. Sam did well to keep us up last year, and for now he should remain but I do expect better for the United game. I'm keen to see what we can do in November and am willing to wait until then.

[Hughesy]

Who sets the mentality at the club? Who is the man supposed to be able to motivate and direct his players? Who is the man responsible for keeping them fit?

For me its Sam and his team.

We employ a sports psychologist, what is he doing to solve this issue its his territory. Sam was hailed by many on here as a scientific football coach, yet we haved loads of little injuries this season. We don't look as fit as the other teams in the league. We cannot start games, we've conceded a number of goals in the first 10 again what are they doing? I'm fed up with him blaming everyone when we lose and claiming he's an expert when we win, he's responsible for both. Sam did well to keep us up last year, and for now he should remain but I do expect better for the United game. I'm keen to see what we can do in November and am willing to wait until then.

Im more than happy to blame Sam when he gets it wrong... its just when we win he doesnt get the praise. You cant have it one way and not the other. IF Sam told the players to keep it tight at 1-0 then he gave them the correct tactics, its hardly his fault that the defence went to sleep for 20 minutes and committed suicide...

You have raised some very valid points.

- Sams team need to stop early/ late goals against... a job for the psychologist

- Injuries? I dont see a problem with them so far this year at all. Much improved on last season. 6 league starts in a row for Dunn kind of backs that up. Emerton & Reid also fit. NO long term injuries.

- Fitness - I do agree with you on this point, we dont look as fit as some teams and im not quite sure why that is.

[JAL]

Some lovely quotes from Allardyce after yesterdays game:

"They are listening because of what happened in the first half but what they are deciding is that when they are 2-0 down, they try and score three. That is a bit naive to say the least.

"It is Stamford Bridge. Scoring one is hard enough. Chelsea have only conceded one all season. I told them all about that and if they were going to get a result, it was going to be a 0-0.

"The object is not to let the opposition score and that is the best way to get a result at Stamford Bridge.

As a player, if the opposition score one, then you know you've got to score two. If the opposition score two, then you know you've got to score three. Some misleading messages coming out from big Sam.

After the Burnley game, Rovers come from a goal behind to go two ahaead, we the fans are baying for blood looking for the KILL and then Allardyce sends out a negative second half message to his players.

In the space of one and half games Allardyces credibility has been shot at. Allardyce more than anything now needs a positive performance against United to redeem himself or he and Rovers will face big problems going into january.

[dulwich]

BUT HE PLAYED THEM.Like I said earlier, Sam is incapable of adapting the formation for the players he has. And his substitutions are also rather baffling. He doesn't play Kalinic when we're outplaying Wolves, but he does when Chelsea are spanking us silly?

Thank you, a point I've been trying to make for some time now. Chelsea worked out how to defend against our only attacking threat on Saturday, after this there was no plan B. In Big Sam's early games last year, when we got an opportunity to launch one of Pedersen's long throws into the box, for the first time we saw Samba lurching forward as a target. I thought "at last", we had a manager who thinks of how to best utilise what we had. Since then, I've not really seen much more evidence of this.

Don't forget he had the superb Campo in deep midfield defending deep and marshalling the other players around him.

Perhaps then it is time to try Salgado in this role. Apart from the obvious similarities with Campo (age, position, previous club), perhaps his "nous", shrewdness will see us becoming harder in the centre. Someone who knows when to close a game out, when to attack, when to defend, and perhaps most importantly, will see danger before anyone else.

[tony gale's mic]

As

After the Burnley game, Rovers come from a goal behind to go two ahaead, we the fans are baying for blood looking for the KILL and then Allardyce sends out a negative second half message to his players.

Why do so many people like yourself think you have a direct hotline to the Rovers dressing room? You have no idea what Sam said.

[Tris]

Why do so many people like yourself think you have a direct hotline to the Rovers dressing room? You have no idea what Sam said.

Allardyce post match interview -

And I calmed the players down at half time and said, you know, the bottom line is lads, if Burnley don't score we've won this game

[tony gale's mic]

Allardyce post match interview -

That's not that negative though. If we poured forward looking for a fourth and let Burnley score early in the second half and then pull level there'd be far more criticism of the tactics...and it'd actually be justified.

[Miker]

Get a grip guys, there isn't some sort of conspriacy of Sam throwing games just because he doesn't think we'll win, he just has a less gung ho strategy for them - go figure

[Tris]

That's not that negative though. If we poured forward looking for a fourth and let Burnley score early in the second half and then pull level there'd be far more criticism of the tactics...and it'd actually be justified.

On the other hand, Burnley were stunned, on the canvas, asking for a right good pasting, and desperately poor.

Rovers should have gone out and murdered them in the second half - it would have prepared the goal difference column for the inevitable mauling it took against Chelsea.

[den]

On the other hand, Burnley were stunned, on the canvas, asking for a right good pasting, and desperately poor.

Rovers should have gone out and murdered them in the second half - it would have prepared the goal difference column for the inevitable mauling it took against Chelsea.

Rovers outplayed them in the second half Tris - as so many on here have said and went on to win the game. What exactly do you want from the team? What happened to the "don't criticise the manager" stance, from the Ince days?

[Hughesy]

As a player, if the opposition score one, then you know you've got to score two. If the opposition score two, then you know you've got to score three. Some misleading messages coming out from big Sam.

After the Burnley game, Rovers come from a goal behind to go two ahaead, we the fans are baying for blood looking for the KILL and then Allardyce sends out a negative second half message to his players.

In the space of one and half games Allardyces credibility has been shot at. Allardyce more than anything now needs a positive performance against United to redeem himself or he and Rovers will face big problems going into january.

Misleading? Id love to know how many players we had on that day that believed we could outscore Chelsea at the Bridge...I think you will find the answer and correctly would be 0.

Negative message? Defending a lead is negative?!

Credibility shot at because we defended a lead and beat our biggest rivals? Some people I just dont understand! Like its been said many, many times - had we conceded early on and then late on against the Dingles, what would of the reaction of been then??

[Miker]

What people need to do is start asking questions of Sam's half time team talk because obviously it's going horribly wrong or the players aren't mentally or physically fit to compete for the full 90 minutes.

[Billy Castell]

The way we keep capitulating to big 4 teams is sickening at times. We seemed to have more grit and determination under Hughes. We should bring back Savage and Dickov!

[Hughesy]

We should bring back Savage and Dickov!

= Championship football.

[JAL]

Misleading? Id love to know how many players we had on that day that believed we could outscore Chelsea at the Bridge...I think you will find the answer and correctly would be 0.

Negative message? Defending a lead is negative?!

Credibility shot at because we defended a lead and beat our biggest rivals? Some people I just dont understand! Like its been said many, many times - had we conceded early on and then late on against the Dingles, what would of the reaction of been then??

We had a team consisting nearly of Internationals playing at the bridge, many have been winners for most of their footballing lives, they are professional Hughesy. They would have known that the task of a victory was going to be hard but not out of reach, their professional pride and spirit would not have accepted defeat so easily - would they ?

Allardyce has a career history of trying to defend a lead Hughesy its in his persona we dont have the players to defend a lead so why focus the players this way maybe Sam needs a pyschologist to help him.

[Big Fat Sam]

Im more than happy to blame Sam when he gets it wrong... its just when we win he doesnt get the praise. You cant have it one way and not the other. IF Sam told the players to keep it tight at 1-0 then he gave them the correct tactics, its hardly his fault that the defence went to sleep for 20 minutes and committed suicide...

You have raised some very valid points.

- Sams team need to stop early/ late goals against... a job for the psychologist

- Injuries? I dont see a problem with them so far this year at all. Much improved on last season. 6 league starts in a row for Dunn kind of backs that up. Emerton & Reid also fit. NO long term injuries.

- Fitness - I do agree with you on this point, we dont look as fit as some teams and im not quite sure why that is.

Whilst I agree with what you've said I don't like it when we start splitting up the team. In my opinion manager, coaches, support staff and players are all acountable as at the end of the day they are a team. Sam has laid blame at the players feet and hasn't once said perhaps I could have done something different. It just gets on my tit's and if I'm being honest. If I was playing and everytime we lost the manager just blamed us it wouldn't be long before I as a player would stop listening to him and stop respecting him.

Sam said that the players are not yet mentally resiliant, I want to know why they are not? The shrink we employed is the ryder cup man is he still at the club? Our poor starts as much as the shrink could help could just as well be down to poor warm-ups and preperation. This was a trait that started under Ince and has not gone away. I'm wondering if Howard the man who does our warm-ups is maybe not quite getting it right?

Injury wise, no we haven't had any long terms and we've even managed to keep Dunn on for a full 90 so they deserve some credit but we've had one or two picking up hammy's and ligament issues. This was very common at the start of the season and is something we can't afford. Hopefully they can sort it out.

Fitness well at the end of the day we're obviously not doing the same things as the other teams. Are we embracing all the new sciencetific methodolgy's?? Or are we just using the tried and tested.

[tony gale's mic]

Whilst I agree with what you've said I don't like it when we start splitting up the team. In my opinion manager, coaches, support staff and players are all acountable as at the end of the day they are a team. Sam has laid blame at the players feet and hasn't once said perhaps I could have done something different. It just gets on my tit's and if I'm being honest. If I was playing and everytime we lost the manager just blamed us it wouldn't be long before I as a player would stop listening to him and stop respecting him.

How many times have you heard a manager say 'i got the tactics wrong today?'. Maybe a Keegan would say that but few others would.

[Big Fat Sam]

How many times have you heard a manager say 'i got the tactics wrong today?'. Maybe a Keegan would say that but few others would.

Sorry I've worded that wrong. I'd like to hear as oppossed to the players being blamed and singled out why not use the term "we" they are a team. I could just as easily ask, why didn't you tell them not too push forward?. Sam can say the players went chasing the game trying to score three, but he could just have easily said we went chasing the game but it didn't work out. If he feels the players made the wrong moves then why not keep that where it belongs in the dressing room and away from the public world.

Just as I would never publically tell someone off at work, I think Sam should do the same. If the person/persons involved are at fault do it privately. Wenger is a master at this he never blames his players in the press, he will say I never saw it or something akin to that. Wengers players in the main show him some serious loyalty and I know he would be a better boss for me than the one who does it so all can see.

[JAL]

Sorry I've worded that wrong. I'd like to hear as oppossed to the players being blamed and singled out why not use the term "we" they are a team. I could just as easily ask, why didn't you tell them not too push forward?. Sam can say the players went chasing the game trying to score three, but he could just have easily said we went chasing the game but it didn't work out. If he feels the players made the wrong moves then why not keep that where it belongs in the dressing room and away from the public world.

Just as I would never publically tell someone off at work, I think Sam should do the same. If the person/persons involved are at fault do it privately. Wenger is a master at this he never blames his players in the press, he will say I never saw it or something akin to that. Wengers players in the main show him some serious loyalty and I know he would be a better boss for me than the one who does it so all can see.

Precisely, you wonder if he Allardyce is going to earn or maintain the respect of the players if hes publicly blaming them and not himself.

Is Sam part of the team ?

Good points big fat Sam.