[Archived] Sam Allardyce

[Billy Castell]

The fact is for reasons we have gone over many times we have a 1st division budget, in a league that sees clubs with the backing of some of the richest people in the world. The football may be crap at times, but we are in the right league, and are in all likelihood going to avoid fighting relegation, whilst other teams that have over spent and have had dodgy owners who have not delivered will be. It took Sam a good few years to make Bolton a stable Premiership team, and he is doing the same for us. Hughes was a great manager for us, but Sam is the best we could have hoped to follow him. There is also Paul Ince to consider. His brief spell really damaged Hughes' legacy. So in short, things may be a bit crap right now, but we have had a number of awful away fixtures to wade through.

[CrazyIvan]

Out of interest, and I'm not trying to have a dig, but can you or anyone else name a single occassion when the long throw has created a Rovers chance or goal? I can't think of one, which is why I believe the tactic is a total waste

I can think of a really good one. About 24 seconds in... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRKdtm6LjSs

Actually, it's a good excuse to watch it again really...

[Exiled in Toronto]

The parallels between Hughes and Allardyce are uncanny, as IMO both play similar football, have similar philosophies on how to set teams up, and both have relied on a decent sized back room team to act alongside them.

The final point I mention is currently something Allardyce is currently working without, and it would be interesting to see how Hughes would do without his preferred team around him.

You seem to have forgotten the biggest difference - most of Hughes' money signings came straight into the team and made an immediate impact. Who of Allardyce's signings played any role in the turnaround last Sat? Chimp and Givet; N'Zonzi was on the pitch but did nothing; the rest aren't playable. Hughes' men won the game for us.

Huighes signed Nelsen, Samba, Benni and RSC for less than Sam paid for a Croatian scuffler.

Managers live or die by their signings, and Hughes is clearly ahead at the mo

[Hughesy]

is 14th near the bottom or top,anelka was a big risk .

if i was jw i would sack lardarse at the end of the season

replace him with

TUGAY

COYLE

GRAYSON

CURBISHLEY

BILIC

just a few for you to rip to peices

I agree totally with Bringing back Big Col & Tugay in some sort of coaching role....however I dont agree with Sacking Sam and replacing him with any of the above? None of them have proved anything!

And you would want that dirty dingle 'Coyle' as our manager??

Glad JW is in charge and not you!!

[Billy Castell]

I wouldn't be against Coyle moving to us sometime, perhaps after a few more seasons' experience. Curbishley is slightly worse than Sam, Bilic has no experience of club management, and has not qualified for the world cup, Grayson is in the same boat as Coyle and Tugay has no coaching experience whatsoever.

[thenodrog]

Have to disagree with this - yes they both set us up as being difficult to beat first and foremost, but the difference is in when we have the ball. Under Hughes we would try and keep possession, working our way up the pitch playing the ball through midfield/out wide. Under Allardyce we punt the ball upfield as quick as possible, hoping that either our stiker can hold it up, or that we can win the 2nd ball - but meaning that more often than not we squander possession far too cheaply and the ball just comes straight back at us.

Can anybody verify that statement with OPTA or similar facts? I'd bet if there is a difference it's more down to Tugay's presence rather than the influence of Mark Hughes / Sam Allardyce. Without Tugay in Hughes's side there was little difference imo.

[thenodrog]

why should i turn up,his football is no different from his lotnob days

Your spelling is laughable at the best of times waggy and I tend not to criticise but to spell an intentional miss-spelling wrong is absolutely hilarious.

........... Unlesss I've just got an odd sense of humour.

[thenodrog]

He's done well with what he's had to work with and if there is any beef to be had it is with the "funders".

Funders being the Walker Trust AND the people of Blackburn who will not pay the going rate for ST's (unless of course they are at Old Trafford).

[PAFELL]

is 14th near the bottom or top,anelka was a big risk .

if i was jw i would sack lardarse at the end of the season

replace him with

TUGAY - No coaching badges / Great player, but has never managed

COYLE - Still learning, but not quite ready

CURBISHLEY - yesterday's man and over hyped up like O'neil

GRAYSON - Still learning the ropes, needs more experience

BILIC - never managed a club side

just a few for you to rip to peices

[thenodrog]

is 14th near the bottom or top,anelka was a big risk .

if i was jw i would sack lardarse at the end of the season

replace him with

TUGAY

COYLE

GRAYSON

CURBISHLEY

BILIC

just a few for you to rip to peices

Without checking chapter and verse on Curbs I'd be very suprised if any of them have a managerial record that comes even close to Sam Allardyce let alone one at top level. You must have checked waggy so who has gained more managerial points between those two?

One of them has no managerial experience whatsoever, and another in all probability wouldn't even come for an interview.

[Gav]

Allardyce has to the most unpopular manager in most peoples living memory, this despite the fact he saved us from relegation last season.

We play some decent football in patches, and as I’ve said many times, he’s a victim of the current financial restraints pout upon us as a club, but you just can’t warm to the guy.

His celebrations after the game last week did nothing for his cause either. You could tell he wanted to walk down the touchline and say “I told you so” but that would have been suicide.

Simply the guy is living on borrowed time, but I’d not sack him, who’d replace him? But I’ll wager he’ll be lucky to still be here in 12 months time.

[philipl]

Well there is one thing Sam could never be accused of/congratulated for- uniting the Rovers fans behind him!

The guy is doing what it says on the tin to use the wooden cliche:

- playing percentage football and getting points

- keeping us up

- bringing in or trying and failing to bring in his old favourites

- signing a pensioner from Real Madrid

- using technology

- ripping up the Hughes inheritance

The five away defeats were against teams where the odds were against us getting something from any of the games:

Sunderland- played well, defended badly ended up losing unluckily

Everton- horrible performance after 35 okish minutes

Arsenal- swine flued yet in it until we got reffed out of the game on 50th minute then joined the likes of Everton in getting by-passed and hammered

Chelsea- never in it and got clobbered like Atletico Madrid did

Man U- held out a long time and had a perfectly OK consolation goal ruled out

We have a great home record in terms of league points but oh so patchy in terms of performance:

Man City- best two halves performance of the season aesthetically but gave away two soft goals

West Ham- abysmal negative tactics at home against possible relegation rivals. Awful stuff.

Wolves- comfortably beat a poor side without looking classy at any stage

Villa- went behind and showed commendable second half grit to pinch the win

Burnley- went behind but exploited their weaknesses too quickly for any fan insurrection to get going and stuffed them with some panache in the first half. Then treated to a West Ham style second half.

Pompey- worst performance in a season of terrible halves countered by a gamble of a double substitution at ht their manager was too dumb to counter leading to a win at a canter.

So by my reckoning, Rovers' fans have endured 12 truly awful halves out of the 22 we have played so far this season in the league. Probably there have been seven halves where the team gelled and played attractively well and ironically four of them came in games we lost (two v City, one v Sunderland, one v Arsenal).

You cannot take the last 8 of the League Cup nor being in 14th after a particularly grim set of away fixtures. But equally those 12 grim halves are doing nobody any favours.

No wonder Sam is dividing the fans!

[Iceman]

is 14th near the bottom or top,anelka was a big risk .

if i was jw i would sack lardarse at the end of the season

replace him with

TUGAY

COYLE

GRAYSON

CURBISHLEY

BILIC

just a few for you to rip to peices

Do you enjoy a good movie or a nice day out Waggy? Something away from this board?

[thenodrog]

Huighes signed Nelsen, Samba, Benni and RSC for less than Sam paid for a Croatian scuffler.

Managers live or die by their signings, and Hughes is clearly ahead at the mo

See my sig EiT! In fairness in the department of discovering talent on the cheap and selling at the top of their value Hughes and Wenger stand alone and way above the rest of all Prem managers never mind SA. Rem Sam is also constrained by having to reduce the wage bill! To the best of my knowledge Hughes wasn't

BUT lets introduce some perspective which is sadly missing in some of the closed minds on here.....

Hughes didn't sign any of those that you mentioned in his first 6 months did he? Sav, Nelsen and Axe were first in and in that respect I'm sure that you will agree they are fairly equivalent to EHD and Givet in quality and effectiveness.

[thenodrog]

Allardyce has to the most unpopular manager in most peoples living memory, this despite the fact he saved us from relegation last season.

Like me you obviously do not accept Ince as a football manager!

btw since when did the Rovers job become a popularity contest? Just as an aside to many who met him St Mark Hughes was viewed as an unpleasant and uncommunicative type but if SA were to leave I'd accept him back in an instant.

[cn174]

See my sig EiT! In fairness in the department of discovering talent on the cheap and selling at the top of their value Hughes and Wenger stand alone and way above the rest of all Prem managers never mind SA. Rem Sam is also constrained by having to reduce the wage bill! To the best of my knowledge Hughes wasn't

BUT lets introduce some perspective which is sadly missing in some of the closed minds on here.....

Hughes didn't sign any of those that you mentioned in his first 6 months did he? Sav, Nelsen and Axe were first in and in that respect I'm sure that you will agree they are fairly equivalent to EHD and Givet in quality and effectiveness.

If you are comparing Savage to Diouf, then Savage wins in the effectiveness and quality categories easily imo. Nelsen and Givet are similar. And the Axe, erm, yea

[broadsword]

Allardyce has to the most unpopular manager in most peoples living memory, this despite the fact he saved us from relegation last season.

I wouldn't entirely agree there Gav, I'm sure Jim Iley, Brian Kidd, maybe Bobby Saxton, Paul Ince would be in contention to be more unpopular?

I think the thing worth noting however, is that for many people, they find it very difficult to warm to him. he's got what I would call a repellant personality. I'm also not so sure that he has a feel for what the club is about, I'm not sure why, it's something intangible.

I'm not sure it will end up being his downfall though, all that seems to matter is results on the pitch. We could hire Fungus the Bogeyman and the Wicked Witch of the West in charge but they wouldn't get the sack if we finished 17th every year.

[thenodrog]

If you are comparing Savage to Diouf, then Savage wins in the effectiveness and quality categories easily imo. Nelsen and Givet are similar. And the Axe, erm, yea

Well EHD has far more ability than Sav but Sav was supremely effective in harrassing (and aggravating ) opposing midfielders of quality and influence out of a game.

I wouldn't entirely agree there Gav, I'm sure Jim Iley, Brian Kidd, maybe Bobby Saxton, Paul Ince would be in contention to be more unpopular?

Saxton??? Thats harsh Bryan.

[Stonesrick]

I wouldn't entirely agree there Gav, I'm sure Jim Iley, Brian Kidd, maybe Bobby Saxton, Paul Ince would be in contention to be more unpopular?

Bobby Saxton did a very good job in difficult times with very limited resources. Certainly does not deserve to be mentioned with those other three.

[broadsword]

It's very harsh, 'cos he hardly had any cash to work with.

I wasn't living locally at the time, it was just an impression that I'd got years later that he wasn't that rated? Maybe I'm mistaken on that one.

[47er]

Shocked to hear that Waggy would sack our manager asap! Quite true that we would all prefer Hughes who is as good a manager as we've ever had imo and arguably the best in living memory based on budget considerations. However he left because he wanted to and we move on. We need all the support we can get Waggy, time to end your vendetta.

[Gav]

I wouldn't entirely agree there Gav, I'm sure Jim Iley, Brian Kidd, maybe Bobby Saxton, Paul Ince would be in contention to be more unpopular?

I think the thing worth noting however, is that for many people, they find it very difficult to warm to him. he's got what I would call a repellant personality. I'm also not so sure that he has a feel for what the club is about, I'm not sure why, it's something intangible.

I'm not sure it will end up being his downfall though, all that seems to matter is results on the pitch. We could hire Fungus the Bogeyman and the Wicked Witch of the West in charge but they wouldn't get the sack if we finished 17th every year.

Kidd and Ince started off as popular managers and deteriorated into hate figures as time/tactics and results went against them. Lets face it they didn’t have a clue…..

Jim Iley took over at a time when Rovers fortunes couldn’t have been any lower, he was certainly dislikes at the end, but not from day 1 like Sam.

[thenodrog]

Jim Iley took over at a time when Rovers fortunes couldnt have been any lower, he was certainly dislikes at the end, but not from day 1 like Sam.

Surely the most anonymous manager in living memory. A strange appointment whose tenure was fortunately eclipsed a few years later by the escapades up the road. The Turf Moor careers of Martin Buchan and John Bond are legendary on the civilised side of Accy.

[Exiled in Toronto]

See my sig EiT! In fairness in the department of discovering talent on the cheap and selling at the top of their value Hughes and Wenger stand alone and way above the rest of all Prem managers never mind SA. Rem Sam is also constrained by having to reduce the wage bill! To the best of my knowledge Hughes wasn't

BUT lets introduce some perspective which is sadly missing in some of the closed minds on here.....

Hughes didn't sign any of those that you mentioned in his first 6 months did he? Sav, Nelsen and Axe were first in and in that respect I'm sure that you will agree they are fairly equivalent to EHD and Givet in quality and effectiveness.

Allardyce had been a Prem manager for 10 years before coming here whereas Hughes was a novice. I would have expected the vastly more experienced man to make more and better early signings.

EHD is a waste of space who has had negligible impact on our team; Savage defined our team from the day he got here - no contest. Givet and Nelsen are a wash. Hmmm, a few hundred thou on T'axe,who did a job for us especially in his first 6 months, or two kings ransoms on Salgado and Kalinic who have yet to put in a decent shift between them - let me think about that one.....

[Tom]

If you are comparing Savage to Diouf, then Savage wins in the effectiveness and quality categories easily imo. Nelsen and Givet are similar. And the Axe, erm, yea

I still think the Axe was a good signing, next to nothing and played a vital role that season, he stayed a season or two too long but I honestly think with him in rather than Andrews this season a few goals would have been stopped. Namley he may well have closed down the shooter on the long range efforts

Maybe a few more would have been conceded as well though