[Archived] Fat Sam's Training Methods

[Roverall]

So we can assume that Ince's training sessions under Uncle Archie and Cousin Ray amounted to some light jogging and the occasional game of tag around Brockhall.

What will our Sam bring to the table? He's fond of using a megaphone and likes Prozone. Anybody know much more? Will the players be dining on Sam's favoured fare of Pie n Chips?

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Ince actually used Pro-Zone more than Hughes, so I think you'd best take your foot out of your mouth and get your coat.

[T4E]

Ince actually used Pro-Zone more than Hughes, so I think you'd best take your foot out of your mouth and get your coat.

Of course he did. Far more thorough than Hughes as well, wasn't he? I mean, the club said so, and they would never lie, would they?

[Roverall]

Simmer down, chief, it wasn't serious...

[The1mattjansen]

I think Ince probably used Pro-Evolution more than anything.

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

I don't see why John Williams would say it directly to peoples faces if it wasn't true. I mean, sure, he can lie, but he did mention it without being asked. I can't see him lying for the sake of it somehow.

[T4E]

I don't see why John Williams would say it directly to peoples faces if it wasn't true. I mean, sure, he can lie, but he did mention it without being asked. I can't see him lying for the sake of it somehow.

It wasn't for the sake of it, it was to defend Ince while he was our manager. How do you know the context of it btw? Wasn't it in private to a member of this messageboard?

Do you honestly believe Ince was more thorough than Hughes?

[trs]

Like Richard Dinnis has just said on Radio lancs, you are going to get one of the most forward thinking and organised managers in this country

[Anti-Dingle-Brigade]

Yeah he said it in private, but said person came out and told everybody didn't they?

I didn't say he was more thorough at all T4E. I was simply pointing out it had been stated, by the chairman, that Ince was a bigger user of Pro-Zone than Hughes, when the original post was suggesting he neglected it altogether.

[Roverall]

I'd say he should get his coat, myself...

[Kelbo]

I don't see why John Williams would say it directly to peoples faces if it wasn't true. I mean, sure, he can lie, but he did mention it without being asked. I can't see him lying for the sake of it somehow.

Sam will use the modern training methods, based upon the three minute rule, three minutes and then a breather, this mimics a match on Saturday or whenever, the ball rarely stays in play for more than three minutes so the players learn to take their 'breathers' then. Unlike the Ince backroom who were the jogging and pressup brigade, that I am afraid went out with Nelsons eye!!!

You will find as well as pro zonework there will be lots of other new methods and Ice baths will be brought back along with Sparkys inflatable men for free kicks.

I am saying nothing here but just wait till you hear the players now ince has gone, they despised the training, it was poor and amatuerish to say the least and on Saturday, one member of the coaching mstaff was telling Roberts to go down the middle and the other telling him to play out wide whilst our so called manager said nothing!!!!!

All the Sh** will come out soon and when it does you will be amazed at what has been going on!

[SundayMondayHabibBeye]

These are his training methods:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zmzp1Wt3tkU

He had the Newcastle players the least fit I had ever seen them. Half the team were incapable of running in the second half.

[philipl]

Having buttoned my lip on here for a very long time and kept it buttoned, I think it would be advisable not to put the gory details on a Rovers web site until we know for sure that the club and Ince have settled the separation agreement.

I agree, what happened under Ince was off the scale in terms of being shambolic.

[RovertheHill]

Maybe our tame wanderer Mr Zulu could provide a bit more insight into what we can expect? Is he on?

[Roverall]

Fair enough, Philip. Please fill us in though, when you're comfortable. I'm eager to know what day-in day-out "work" could lead to the dross we've been served for the last few months.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Unless we hear rumours about there being problems with his training, or if it came to a point where the number of injuries points out to possible problems, there really shouldn't be any speculation about his training methods imo.

Surprising to hear the Newcastle fans saying their team was unfit under Allardyce, i saw Bolton several times under Allardyce and they looked a very fit side.

[SundayMondayHabibBeye]

One of the first things Keegan said when he took over at Newcastle was that the players were unfit, and that they needed double sessions to get in shape.

Allardyce's main fitness boast was not very many injuries, that certainly was the case, but there is a balance and he got it wrong.

You've got to consider his 2007 record at Bolton and Newcastle, it was terrible, and can be linked to him losing a lot of key staff to Chelsea or more senior posts at other clubs, and then losing any more due to Bolton refusing to let staff come here.

On his own, without the likes of Phil Brown and other less well known coaches around him, he's looked below ordinary at Bolton and Newcastle.

Sorry if I'm being over negative about all this. I can't find it (search isn't working) but I did make a long post in the summer about why Allardyce is a bad manager.

[tony gale's mic]

One of the first things Keegan said when he took over at Newcastle was that the players were unfit, and that they needed double sessions to get in shape.

Allardyce's main fitness boast was not very many injuries, that certainly was the case, but there is a balance and he got it wrong.

You've got to consider his 2007 record at Bolton and Newcastle, it was terrible, and can be linked to him losing a lot of key staff to Chelsea or more senior posts at other clubs, and then losing any more due to Bolton refusing to let staff come here.

On his own, without the likes of Phil Brown and other less well known coaches around him, he's looked below ordinary at Bolton and Newcastle.

I've made this point in another section but:

He improved your league position from the season before he took over, from 13th to 11th, and from 5 points off relegation to 9 points off relegation. Which Keegan then promptly reversed and then some.

Also after Phil Brown left Bolton he finished 8th and 7th in the Premier League. Hardly ordinary. Brown has said himself he learned his trade from Allardyce and he's further proof that those methods work.

[SundayMondayHabibBeye]

Here is Sam's injury guru:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Taylor_(footballer)

He's a Sam disciple, and the new staff member you are most likely to get now allardyce is here.

[SundayMondayHabibBeye]

I've made this point in another section but:

He improved your league position from the season before he took over, from 13th to 11th, and from 5 points off relegation to 9 points off relegation. Which Keegan then promptly reversed and then some.

Also after Phil Brown left Bolton he finished 8th and 7th in the Premier League. Hardly ordinary. Brown has said himself he learned his trade from Allardyce and he's further proof that those methods work.

There are two reasons this statistic is very misleading.

Firstly, if you consider the results he got in the 2007/08 season to the results we got against the same teams in the 2006/07 season he was actually worse. He got to play the easy fixtures.

Secondly, he started off by letting the players play how they were accustomed so that he could have a look. It was when he started interfering about six weeks in, voicing unhappiness at conceding in wins versus Spurs and Everton that we all suddenly realised what a bad manager he was.

Would you want a manager who had a team looking like they were playing for a draw against DERBY COUNTY, in two matches, and only pick up one point?

[tony gale's mic]

There are two reasons this statistic is very misleading.

Firstly, if you consider the results he got in the 2007/08 season to the results we got against the same teams in the 2006/07 season he was actually worse. He got to play the easy fixtures.

Secondly, he started off by letting the players play how they were accustomed so that he could have a look. It was when he started interfering about six weeks in, voicing unhappiness at conceding in wins versus Spurs and Everton that we all suddenly realised what a bad manager he was.

Would you want a manager who had a team looking like they were playing for a draw against DERBY COUNTY, in two matches, and only pick up one point?

I'd want a manager who achieved results. And the man did achieve results at Bolton. And didn't have the time to do anything at Newcastle.

I've heard a few Newcastle fans say this Derby thing, and yes it would've ###### me off but just beause they were "looking like they were playing for a draw" it doesn't mean that they actually were. It just means he got bad results against Derby but he must have done alright in other games. Hughes lost to Larissa and Coventry City (4-1) last season, but only the idiots on this board use that as a stick to beat him with when you look at his overall record.

Had Ince taken us to where Sam took Newcastle last season (11th), there's no way we wouldve wanted him out. Despite the Fowler and Andrews signing, the idiotic interviews, the dodgy tactics, the third rate management team etc. Despite the fact he had no previous Premier League track record. And despite the fact he wouldve actually taken us significantly down (from 7th) rather than up the table. We would've given him time. But he was sending us hurtling towards the Championship and we had no choice.

But you were under no real threat of relegation, teams pretty much never get relegated from your January position so you could have afforded a man with a

proven record a chance to build something at the club, to learn from his mistakes like countless managers who've looked a bit dodgy to start with have before. But as usual you were impatient, got him sacked, called on Keegan and nearly got yourselves relegated.

[SundayMondayHabibBeye]

I'd want a manager who achieved results. And the man did achieve results at Bolton. And didn't have the time to do anything at Newcastle.

I've heard a few Newcastle fans say this Derby thing, and yes it would've ###### me off but just beause they were "looking like they were playing for a draw" it doesn't mean that they actually were. It just means he got bad results against Derby but he must have done alright in other games. Hughes lost to Larissa and Coventry City (4-1) last season, but only the idiots on this board use that as a stick to beat him with when you look at his overall record.

Had Ince taken us to where Sam took Newcastle last season (11th), there's no way we wouldve wanted him out. Despite the Fowler and Andrews signing, the idiotic interviews, the dodgy tactics, the third rate management team etc. Despite the fact he had no previous Premier League track record. And despite the fact he wouldve actually taken us significantly down (from 7th) rather than up the table. We would've given him time. But he was sending us hurtling towards the Championship and we had no choice.

But you were under no real threat of relegation, teams pretty much never get relegated from your January position so you could have afforded a man with a

proven record a chance to build something at the club, to learn from his mistakes like countless managers who've looked a bit dodgy to start with have before. But as usual you were impatient, got him sacked, called on Keegan and nearly got yourselves relegated.

I could say that Ince didn't get enough time though, but it doesn't take fans long to suss out a bad manager.

You seem to have missed the point I was making about the 11th place, it was 11th because we had played easier teams, and we had done better in the previous season in those corresponding fixtures. The reality was that the team has collapsed and was in complete freefall, just like you are now.

I'd expect allardyce to have an initial positive effect by the way, as he likes to do things one step at a time, so the negativeness about him won't be so bad. When he's made too many steps, probably this time next year, you'll all want rid.

[tony gale's mic]

I could say that Ince didn't get enough time though, but it doesn't take fans long to suss out a bad manager.

You seem to have missed the point I was making about the 11th place, it was 11th because we had played easier teams, and we had done better in the previous season in those corresponding fixtures. The reality was that the team has collapsed and was in complete freefall, just like you are now.

I'd expect allardyce to have an initial positive effect by the way, as he likes to do things one step at a time, so the negativeness about him won't be so bad. When he's made too many steps, probably this time next year, you'll all want rid.

...Or you were just going through a bad run of form? You were still NINE whole points from the drop, I know you played easier teams but we sacked Ince because of our current position. Additionally Sam deserved more benefit of the doubt because he HAD achieved good things in the League with Bolton, both before and after Phil Brown's reign. He deserved more time because you weren't in immediate danger.

You can't compare our current position to yours under Sam. You were much closer to relegation the season before he came, weren't in any immediate danger and had a man with a proven track record. We're looking likely to go down right now, have been an established top 10 side for the last three seasons and had a man with no Premier League experience to draw on. Fact is countless managers have looked even worse than Sam did, been kept on and gone from strength to strength.

Firing Sam and getting Keegan in was the reason why you ended up the way you did last season.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Just maybe Rovers fans dont demand success like some,we are not one of the (self proclaimed) 'biggest clubs in the world' and know it.

I think some of the Geordie nation 'faithful' might just be realising that too now about the Toon 'MASSIVE'.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Who would you rather have in charge now at St James Park matey, Keegan, Kinnear or Allardyce ?