[Archived] Liverpool Preview

[Mr. E]

I was gone for the weekend, and came back to this result.

I hate football.

[Majiball]

Just a quick question for those who where at the game. Who took the warm-up??? And is it really true we did the shooting again??

Sorry stuck up in Scotland at the mo.

Cheers in advance.

[roversmum]

Yes, we did do the shooting, and it provided great entertainment for the Liverpool fans who were bombarded with the balls. Most embarrassing. I think the coach did the warm up but there was too much going on for me to take much interest in it.

[Dave S]

In the Liverpool programme from Saturday there was a photo of Heskey shooting past a Rovers player with a number 25 shirt.

I was asked who it was and I had to admit I didn't know. So I have just looked it up.

Of course you will all be saying it's obvious.

The game was from the 2003/04 season Liverpool v Rovers 4th April 2004. Almost five years ago to the day.

I have similar feelings to this team and this season as I did then.

Rovers lined up on Saturday,

Robinson, Andrews, Ooijer, Nelsen, Givet, Dunn (sub Villanueva), Mokoena (sub Doran), Tugay (sub Grella) Warnock, Treacy, Samba.

Five years ago

Friedel, Babbel, Todd, Short (sub Johannson), Gray, Emerton, Tugay, Flitcroft (sub Reid), Andresen, Stead, Gallagher (sub Cole).

I thought then and do now that the team needed an overhaul. Souness survived and the team was eventually overhauled by Hughes. I feel that Allardyce is in time to do the same thing without allowing an under strength side begin the next campaign.

Both sides are similar in that some players are just not good enough. Borrowed players, some coming to the end of their contracts and careers.

Both matches were lost 4-0.

Torres on 7 minutes and Owen on 6 minutes killing the dream of an away point early on.

Five years ago this left Rovers 16th 31 games and 31 points

the season ended with Rovers 15th 38 games and 44 points

We currently are 16th 32 games 34 points. So quite similar. I think that we can avoid the drop and have a full close season to rebuild. Unlike last time.

Oh and as you all know the number 25 was worn by Martin Andresen.

[roversmum]

If I remember, the Rovers fans did not stop singing throughout the whole match. They did us proud.

[Ozz]

We sung the whole match, indeed RM. Best support of the season, for the worst performance.

[Guest Vinjay606]

Should have been letting them know that performance isn't good enough for Blackburn Rovers Football Club. That counts as support for the club not glossing it over.

[imy9]

Ironic given the tripe you're coming out with at the moment.

Fair enough thats your opinion.

Big Sam instructs a group of professional premier league players to play a certain way for a big game against a team challenging for top spot in the league, this does not happen, Sam states:

“When your players don’t even try to implement the game-plan, that makes me angry," snapped Allardyce.

“We’ve got Stoke next week and I will make sure the players stick to the game-plan this time. They need to listen — that’s all they need to do. That’s what they are paid to do.

“None of those guys are ever going to be as good as I am at what I do because they are only players and I am the manager, so make sure you listen to me.”

So if players are not listening to the instructions of the manager what are the possible causes? I thought of the following:

1. Refusal to listen to the manager.

2. Not particularly smart.

3. Big Sam did not explain properly.

Right, number 2 sounds wrong as most of these players have played premier league football for years and there only a certain number of formations/style of play and Sam has played a similar way for a while now.

3. Big Sam has managed in the premier league for years, I seriously doubt that he has issues with communication, he has passed his Pro License

So back to number 1, there have been rumours abound already that the players are not keen on the long ball and Dunn himself has said that he does not want to play in that manner so I infered from Sam's statement that they were refusing to follow instructions.

Any other ideas?

[Mr. E]

I have similar feelings to this team and this season as I did then.

Rovers lined up on Saturday,

Robinson, Andrews, Ooijer, Nelsen, Givet, Dunn (sub Villanueva), Mokoena (sub Doran), Tugay (sub Grella) Warnock, Treacy, Samba.

Five years ago

Friedel, Babbel, Todd, Short (sub Johannson), Gray, Emerton, Tugay, Flitcroft (sub Reid), Andresen, Stead, Gallagher (sub Cole).

Kidding? The team 5 years ago is many, many country miles better than this one, in every area of the field except left back.

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

so imagine that you were in Sam Allardyce's position ....... what solutions would you offer, what team would you have put out and in what formation?

Just to give you my views Gordon - On the Friday before the game I would have shown the players a video of Stoke's 0-0 draw at Anfield earlier in the season. (Incidentally it was a strong Liverpool side that day containing Torres and Gerrard in the starting line-up.)

I would have told the players that sometimes shock results can happen, but if they are to have any chance at all of repeating Stoke's result they must match the determination, passion and fighting qualities that Stoke showed that day. I would have impressed upon the players the importance of concentration and closing down the opposition tightly from the opening whistle and not giving Liverpool an inch of space.

This unfortunately didn't happen on Saturday. Although the opening goal was a world-class finish from Torres, Liverpool were allowed to play a simple long ball over the top to a big gap in defence between Ooijer and Nelsen. Torres had too much space in a wide gap and the long ball should have been better dealt with.

I would have emphasised to the players that it is imperative our goal difference doesn't take a hammering and that the players must be prepared to put their bodies on the line and to work like trojans to prevent Liverpool from winning the game easily. I also would have emphasised that the first 20 minutes are absolutely crucial and that the players must do everything possible not to concede an early goal. So closing down the opposition tightly is of paramount importance.

For team selection my priority would have been the defence. Keith Andrews is not suited to playing right-back, especially away from home against a team like Liverpool. Andrews was very poor at right-back facing Riera. Moving Chris Samba up front weakened us further in defence.

So my defensive line-up would have been either Ooijer or Zurab at right-back, Nelsen and Samba in central defence and Givet at left-back. I would have played a five-man midfield with Benni McCarthy up front - with the South African given instructions not to play fancy flicks or backheels, but to concentrate on trying to hold up the ball.

You may argue that McCarthy isn't suited to this position and I would agree that it certainly isn't his best role being alone up front. But my priority for this game would have been the defence. I think that Big Sam's decision to have Andrews at right-back and move Samba up front weakened the defensive unit.

Allardyce had Keith Andrews, Treacy and Samba all out of position. I would have picked all the players in their "normal" positions with the exception of McCarthy who would have been asked to do a job alone up front for which he is not ideally suited.

The one decent chance that Rovers had during the match, when the scoreline was 2-0 to Liverpool at the time, came to Samba in the penalty box, but he had a very tame weak shot on goal. Who knows - if the chance had come to McCarthy maybe Rovers might have been able to score from that chance.

It was only thanks to Paul Robinson making some decent saves and also some wild wasteful shots from Benayoun, Torres and Riera that the scoreline was only 4-0 at the end. It could have easily been 7 or 8 nil to Liverpool. I was embarrassed by what I saw.

Liverpool's third goal from Daniel Agger was an excellent long-range shot, but again we gave Liverpool too much time and space and Agger should have been closed down much more tightly to prevent the shot.

I thought it was a gutless half-hearted performance from Rovers and the players must take a big share of the blame for that. Crosses were allowed to come into the box easily, we didn't close down the opposition tightly and we gave the ball away far too cheaply.

I'm not necessarily suggesting that we would have done fantastically better with Samba in defence and McCarthy up front - but it surely can't have been much worse than the shambles we saw on the pitch on Saturday.

Clearly we have big problems with a very poor level of quality in the squad. To make up for this woeful lack of quality it is imperative that we try to work harder than the opposition. Unfortunately this didn't happen on Saturday.

I would not have picked Mokoena in midfield because I think he's one of the worst midfielders in the Premiership for giving the ball away. I'll be delighted to see the back of him in the summer.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Playing out of position here eh Theno

AESF 4 V 0 Theno

Two thing sums up Saturday (without even mentioning Samba)

Andrews - not considered by the majority as good enough for the P/L in his natural position yet deployed at RB by the supposedly experienced fool sorry BS (btw I don't have a problem with Andrews in midfield) -

Treacy - not good enough in his normal position (questionable to what level also he would be) and is played on

the right hand side

I'm with Abbey & co on this -Saturday was nothing else than an embarrasment for for the club in general and the fans, especially those that spent good money to actually go to the game - wonder how many backing the fools selection actually went to the game.

The excuses when the cup games where about was that players where rested to prepare them for the fight to stay in the P/L - yet on Saturday in a game where it had been given up before even being played - we deploy players out of normal position - if its all about next week and the so called 'winnable' games why didn't we use the so called fringe players in normal positions rather than a jumbled up mess where nobody actually appeared to know what to do.

One thing we do know now is what BFS actually stands for now is it any wonder the players look clueless given the lineups we keep putting out with no continuity what so ever.

If that is what the P/L is about its no wonder the fans are turning their backs on it.

Absolutely unacceptable and professional performance players and manager alike - A DISGRACE TO THE CLUB

[broadsword]

The one thing that does come to mind is that when Ricky Sbragia took over at Sunderland, I think his first game was Man Utd away.

He packed the midfield and set the team up to get a draw. He very nearly did it as well.

We can't go round giving up on eight games a season. If we're going to do that then the players should be paid for those games, and they can play 11 supporters instead.

In some sort of mitigation, it has to be said that our squad is wafer-thin. However, that doesn't mean that you should give up before you've even started. Losing can become a habit, especially if we go into games wioth a defeatist attitude.

[Hughesy]

Emerton, Reid, Diouf, Pedersen, Santa Cruz, Roberts all out injured.

Dunn/ Grella/ McCarthy not match fit.

+

Wafer thin squad = A very weak side. + A goal conceded after 5 minutes. Its no wonder we caved in.

We badly missed our 'energy' players (Pedersen, Diouf, Emerton, Roberts) and that helped Liverpool get much more time on the ball.

This game meant far more to Liverpool than it did to us (Carragher "Most important game in my 13 years"), add to that the emotion of the anniversary, and when you take out all our injured players its almost impossible for us to compete. Imagine Liverpool at Old Trafford without Torres, Gerrard, Mascherano & Kuyt - we could all predict that result now. Im not agreeing with our poor performance im just saying It was half expected given the circumstances of the game.

[alexanders]

Why didnt Diouf play?

I have to say I missed him.

[roversmum]

Apparently he was 'unwell'; but we did wonder if it had anything to do with the fifth yellow he might have received if playing...

[alexanders]

Clever move if true. He will then receive it against Stoke instead

[waggy]

the worst thing about saturday was the 4 goals we conceded,we virtually throw away our goal difference conceding 4,in other words it was like giving the teams around us a piont

[Hughesy]

Apparently he was 'unwell'; but we did wonder if it had anything to do with the fifth yellow he might have received if playing...

Thought the yellows didnt matter at this stage of the season?

[roversmum]

There was something about it, but no-one seemed sure, Hughsey?

[rovgers]

It wouldn't have had anything to do with the yellow card.

On February 28th the Football Assocation allowed a yellow card amnesty for players who'd reached five bookings, meaning that any player who gets booked after this date will not receive a one-match suspension should he reach the threshold of five bookings. Any player who accumulated a total of 10 cautions before April 12th would have still been hit with a statutory two-game ban.

[DanLad]

the worst thing about saturday was the 4 goals we conceded,we virtually throw away our goal difference conceding 4,in other words it was like giving the teams around us a piont

Waggy made a post without using the word 'lardarse'!

Doesn't that deserve a round of applause or something?

[rovgers]

Waggy made a post without using the word 'lardarse'!

Doesn't that deserve a round of applause or something?

It would if he didn't need to use the rovers smillies at the begining and end of each message, maybe he needs to use them to convince people that he actually is a rovers fan!

[DanLad]

It would if he didn't need to use the rovers smillies at the begining and end of each message, maybe he needs to use them to convince people that he actually is a rovers fan!

I'm well used to that. I just view it as Waggy's own personal punctuation! I'd be suspicious if they disappeared!

[Eddie]

I actually think Allardyce has approached virtually every game we've played in the same way, which worries me greatly. We've been thumped by Liverpool and Arsenal without ever looking dangerous (particularly in this match where it could have been 10) because we took a defensive approach that we are unsuited to and set ourselves out in a way that getting forward wasn't even really an option. Can someone explain to me exactly how the side we put out on Saturday was going to score? Even if Samba had dominated in the air who was going to get to the second ball? We were basically only going to pose a threat from a set-piece and we continue to be terrible at them, especially when you consider that our two normal set-piece takers (Diouf and Pedersen) were not there and arguably our best taker was on the bench (Villanueva). We didn't even have a side out there capable of damage limitation. It was clueless and I think everyone would have known from the minute the team was announced that we were in big trouble, but then why not play Benni? Why not play Villanueva? Why not put something out there capable of winning a match.

As for the United match, well I think it is a result that we will actually live to regret. We were terrible against United until we got a goal and could easily have been out of the game after 20-30 minutes and well on our way to a thumping similar to what we got at Andfield and the Emirates. Of course our performance from that moment on was impressive, but so far it stands alone as far as good looking performances in this current set-up go. We are clearly more suited to playing 4-4-2 and our best performances this season have been when we have been using it and yet Allardyce continues to stick to what he knows and because of what he has followed on for and his success at Bolton he is receiving little criticism. I struggle to remember ever seeing a performance as bad as that by any side in the premiership, regardless of the squad available. Stoke and the like may not have had as many out when they've shown grit and determination, but they'd take quite a few of the players we had a chance to play on Saturday.

We'll stay up based on how we do against the weaker sides and I'm still pretty confident that we'll get what we need. I certainly didn't expect anything from the game, but I hoped to see fight, at least a minimal threat and that we would make Liverpool break sweat. I continue to fear the direction we're headed in under Allardyce and remain unconvinced about his ability as a manager. I am a firm believer in the fact that some managers our one club guys and I still think he is in that group (think Curbishley).

I've always been proud to support a club that for the most part has tried to play reasonably attacking football and has always been committed to the cause and on Saturday I saw neither of those things. We rolled over and died after 5 minutes and those around me actually felt embarrassed for me. I don't care how much flack I get for my views or if I'm painted as trying to undermine the club, but I'll stick to what I've felt all along and I don't like what is happening at our club. Just because we are close to the bottom doesn't mean we have to set our stall out to purely defend. Just because we have a small budget doesn't mean we can't play with a bit of flair and creativity. Just because we were in the relegation zone in NOVEMBER doesn't mean that the manager who took charge then is untouchable.

[Hughesy]

Just because we are close to the bottom doesn't mean we have to set our stall out to purely defend.

Look at the players we had available on saturday - who do we have on our books that has attacking ability that will worry the likes of Carragher?? Il think you will find that they were all out injured. Apart from that we had Benni & Carlos, players Sam obviously felt would be better playing next week rather than against a team who havent lost at home all season.

Just because we have a small budget doesn't mean we can't play with a bit of flair and creativity.

Thats the problem - we lack creativity - that is something Sam needs to resolve in the summer - but his first priority was to stabilise the club and sort out the silly mistakes against poor teams.

Just because we were in the relegation zone in NOVEMBER doesn't mean that the manager who took charge then is untouchable.

He is far from untouchable - but so far we have only lost to top 4 sides (when we played them) under allardyce. With a little bit more luck - we would probably be 8 points better off (Boro, Sunderland, City & Bolton) and looking at pushing for 7th, rather than looking down. Im pretty confident he will prove you wrong next season and we wont be in our current predicament in 12 months.

Under Ince we would be bottom of the league, level with West Brom and probably 1 or 2 games away from certain relegation.