[Archived] Manchester United Vs Rovers

[beerwins]

What the hell was samba doing for the second goal? this guy wasnt fit and was nowhere near rooney for the second goal, also how many times did the bbc mention how our goal wasnt offside .......... not once, absolute disgrace.

[only2garners]

Bottom line I hate watching us at the moment. Doesnt matter who we play we are making excuses. We have played the top three teams way recently.OK but we have lost ten away from home. The players look confused and look scared to go forward in case they get hit on the back of the head with the ball. Benni has obviously pi5%#@ed Sam off for some reason but he is a proven premier goal scorer. Put him on with one of the rookies and they can learn from him.

If you want two strikers clap your hands

If you want two strikers clap your hands

If you want two srikers, clap nice and loudly

and maybe our manager will understand.

Perhaps you and all those who wanted 2 up front can explain why when our 5 in midfield can't hold on to the ball that 4 are going to do better? 2 up front means 4 in midfield. As soon as we had 2 up front we conceded the second goal.

Also perhaps all those who booed Di Santo's substitution by Kalinic might like to rethink. Kalinic in 15 minutes won more ball than Di Santo in 75. as well as scoring a perfectly good goal.

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

What the hell was samba doing for the second goal? this guy wasnt fit and was nowhere near rooney for the second goal, also how many times did the bbc mention how our goal wasnt offside .......... not once, absolute disgrace.

Because it made no difference to the result.... Other games had just as many contentious decisions, and the commentator did say that it was offside.

Im assuming Samba had cramp as if he had just stuck a leg out he would have prevented the second goal. Regardless of that, I thought he made a big difference today. Givet did well also.

Sam's got to experiment with 442. Play Dunn at the head of a diamond in the midfield with Kalinic and Di Santo up top. 451 relies on Dunny getting great service and him playing a blinder. That wont work against decent opposition or if Dunn has an off day.

[RoyRover]

Yes, we were beaten by the Champions, but I don't think I have ever seen such a lacklustre Man Ure team...Rovers of old would have taken them to the cleaners but, as people rightly comment, this is not Rovers of old !

This Rovers team is no where near as good as the team Mark Hughes left...but some of those same players remain today ?

Under Hughes there was a real dynamism about our play at times. We had players who could get around the pitch (Reid, Emerton), guys who could deliver killer passes and a great final ball (Bentley, Pedersen) and we had guys who could score goals (Santa Cruz, McCarthy). Sadly these players have either moved on, lost form or had bad injury problems. Either way, we are now a big, slow team, that hoofs the ball up the pitch and hopes that a scramble ensues in the oppositions box and we are lucky enough for the ball to fall to one of our players to attempt to score. I was begging for Big Sam last season to come in and fix us and I haven't turned on him at all. But there are players like Diouf, Andrews and Pedersen who contribute nothing to our team. The only reason these guys are getting games is because of our lack of options and funds to bring in any other alternatives.

[beerwins]

Perhaps you and all those who wanted 2 up front can explain why when our 5 in midfield can't hold on to the ball that 4 are going to do better? 2 up front means 4 in midfield. As soon as we had 2 up front we conceded the second goal.

Also perhaps all those who booed Di Santo's substitution by Kalinic might like to rethink. Kalinic in 15 minutes won more ball than Di Santo in 75. as well as scoring a perfectly good goal.

Strangest post ever When we have the ball in midfield we plonk it out wide for diouf or peds to lump it up to our 1 striker who has to hold it up for eons before our slow midfield catches up to them, dont you understand that to play 4,5,1 you have to have the correct players, we dont, how many times did you see nzonzi have the ball and struggle to make a pass to a rovers player, we have 5 in midfield yet he couldnt pick a pass out to anyone in a beneficial area WHY , because we had no player in a more advanced area apart from di santo who was mobbed by defenders, the only option nzonzi has is to square the ball to another midfielder that when pressured passes it back to a defender in turn passes it back to robbo then its lumped to di santo to work a frigging miracle.

Kalinic did no better than di santo in holding up the ball he only looked better becuase soon he was partnered by benni who stretched the centre backs and gave him more room (if people booed the sub then we have braindead fans, maybe they booed because they wanted a midfielder to be taken off instead of a striker) and yes they scored the second goal when we played 4,4,2 , but we also scored too and it looked like a game of football rather than some kind of chess match.

[Rover Down Under]

I actually agree with Sam - we should not make ANY effort against the Big 4, it's completely pointless. COS EVEN WHEN WE DO SCORE IT IS DISSALLOWED!

Just seen that decision, if they "rest" the beachball ref then that linesman needs putting down.

Apart from that I hope Sam notices what formation we were playing when we 'scored'.

[Paul]

I have nothing to say about the match other than this. Last time I went to Old Trafford we had a really good go at them, took the lead and then lost 3-1. I can't remember if that was under Ince or Allardyce, either way it was a good day. I didn't enjoy yesterday at all. As for the Kalinic goal I though he was offside but judging by the comments on here perhaps he wasn't? Defensively we seemed better.

Stewarding, now there's a question. Approaching the ground we were faced by far more stewards than I recall from previous visits. I know the away support is heavily stewarded but a line of orange jacketed stewards to check your ticket and then having to run the gauntlet of the yellow jackets to be searched is too much. My son was frightened and pulling away from the stewards. Fortunatley one young man spotted this and allowed us to go through to the gate without a search. Big thanks to him. Plus a got my bottle of water in for the first time in years!! Note to terrorists - if you want to bomb OT go in the home areas and you won't be searched.

Inside the ground? A lot of fans stood up which meant we couldn't see the game and neither could the children behind us. My son is so short he can't see when standing up. We had six teenagers in front of us and I give them full marks for doing something when we asked them to sit. Three sat down and three moved along the row and stood in front of only2garners but he's tall so it didn't matter!!!! No steward or policeman spoke to these three lads and they stood for the whole of the first half. They were a bit of a pain but just teenagers really. We were right next to the Utd fans and these lads just sang for Rovers, I don't think they sent any abuse at the Utd support. At half-time the police turned up and threw them out, which I felt was grossly unfair as they didn't appear to have been warned at all. They trooped out so meekly it was clear they weren't up for any sort of trouble, just trying to have a good time.

About five rows in front of us where two older lads and a young woman. I've seen them all at away games as part of a group. These three were up and down throughout the game, abusing the Utd support and spoken to several times by stewards but were allowed to stay in the ground. There doesn't seem to be any consistency in the way these rules are applied.

The stewards I spoke to were very helpful and offered us help when we needed it. (though I still find the show of force outside completely unacceptable). I saw several stewards trying to engage both home and away fans in conversation, with a clear smile, when asking people to sit. Seems to me there is a decent element of training here but judging by the way the police manhandled a few if you complain you'll get slung out with a fair degree of force.

[Paul]

Made me laugh, from The Independent:

"Analysing the defeat at Anfield, Ferguson said that for the second successive weekend United were up against a wounded animal. The wounded animal Blackburn most resembled was a hedgehog. They curled into a ball, stuck out their spines and hoped they would not be steamrollered."

[Majiball]

Well at least it wasn't 5.

To be fair Uniteds midfield was a lot better than against Liverpool, they where very quick to close down. Defensively I thought we did better than against Chelsea at least we put pressure on the ball. But I'm slowly getting a little fed up when we have the ball:

Generally we have 3-4 passes before we hit it up to the front man lose possession and have to defend.

We desperately need to work on what we do when we have the ball and add some dynamism into our play. yesterday we had the ball 41% of the time and with possession like that we are always facing an up-hill struggle. This is something we must address and quickly.

Personally I thought we looked better when Emo moved into the middle, but by that time our link player Dunn was absolutely knackered. Its a better performance than Chelsea and hopefully we don't set a new record in our next away game. But now our home form is crucial and a win against Pompey is a necessity.

Very disappointed for Kalinic, I had a feeling he'd nick one, its just a pity the USELESS lino stole it off him. For me its just yet another example of why video evidence needs to be used.

[imy9]

We have lost ten away games but you know the saying "There are lies, damn lies and then there are statistics".

Our away defeats:

Arsenal 4 Blackburn 0

Liverpool 4 Blackburn 0

Stoke 1 Blackburn 0

Man City 3 Blackburn 1

Chelsea 2 Blackburn 0

Sunderland 2 Blackburn 1

Everton 3 Blackburn 0

Arsenal 6 Blackburn 2

Chelsea 5 Blackburn 0

Man United 2 Blackburn 0

SEVEN losses out of TEN against top FIVE opposition and the other losses? Sunderland, Stoke and Man City who all have fantastic home records, so maybe some people need to open their eyes up, lets judge the away performances between now and the end of the season where realistically we can pick points up.

Certainly we were better defensively yesterday but take into account Samba and Dunn have been recovering from swine flu and it showed at various points of the match.

Lets start with 4-4-2 and play:

Robinson

Chimbonda Nelsen Samba Givet

Diouf Grella Dunn MGP

McCarthy Kalinic

[Paul]

Last time I went to Old Trafford we had a really good go at them, took the lead and then lost 3-1. I can't remember if that was under Ince or Allardyce, either way it was a good day. I didn't enjoy yesterday at all.

Just checked, it was 2-1 last season under Allardyce.........so he can do it if he wants to?

[Iceman]

Feck strikers, January we need 1 or 2 midfielders who can hold onto a ball for longer than 5 seconds. And a midfielder who can pass a ball more than a few feet away.

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

We have lost ten away games but you know the saying "There are lies, damn lies and then there are statistics".

Our away defeats:

Arsenal 4 Blackburn 0

Liverpool 4 Blackburn 0

Stoke 1 Blackburn 0

Man City 3 Blackburn 1

Chelsea 2 Blackburn 0

Sunderland 2 Blackburn 1

Everton 3 Blackburn 0

Arsenal 6 Blackburn 2

Chelsea 5 Blackburn 0

Man United 2 Blackburn 0

SEVEN losses out of TEN against top FIVE opposition and the other losses? Sunderland, Stoke and Man City who all have fantastic home records, so maybe some people need to open their eyes up, lets judge the away performances between now and the end of the season where realistically we can pick points up.

You have highlighted my biggest fear for the season. Last season we got the home games against the big four/five out of the way in the first half of the season. This left us with a relatively easy home run in - a big factor in why we stayed up. This season we will be playing the big four at home in the second half of the season - that is four home matches we are likely to lose - leaving a huge emphasis on our away form.

[thenodrog]

Just checked, it was 2-1 last season under Allardyce.........so he can do it if he wants to?

Course he can and he just did!..... but for an incompetent and inept half wit with a flag running the line.

It's all been glossed over but there would quite rightly have been hell to pay in the Chelsea and Arse boardrooms if Rooney had not just made it 2-0. MU had the whip hand all the time but two flashes of brilliance and a huge slice of luck from possibly the 'quietest' men on the pitch given their reputation and ability were our undoing.

Nice to see the problem of the gap between the defence and midfield has almost been solved and them almost working as one entity. If Dunny had managed to close Evra down quicker and prevent him shooting then the lino's contribution to the MU cause would have been immense.

btw For our ranks of knowledgeable football 'experts' Rooneys goal was the result of a massive

'hoofball'.

[rover6]

Feck strikers, January we need 1 or 2 midfielders who can hold onto a ball for longer than 5 seconds. And a midfielder who can pass a ball more than a few feet away.

Captain Marvel, Mokoena's lost his place in the Pompey team...

[Paul]

Course he can and he just did!..... but for an incompetent and inept half wit with a flag running the line.

It's all been glossed over but there would quite rightly have been hell to pay in the Chelsea and Arse boardrooms if Rooney had not just made it 2-0. MU had the whip hand all the time but two flashes of brilliance and a huge slice of luck from possibly the 'quietest' men on the pitch given their reputation and ability were our undoing.

Nice to see the problem of the gap between the defence and midfield has almost been solved and them almost working as one entity. If Dunny had managed to close Evra down quicker and prevent him shooting then the lino's contribution to the MU cause would have been immense.

btw For our ranks of knowledgeable football 'experts' Rooneys goal was the result of a massive

'hoofball'.

Sorry theno but I don't understand your point. Simple words please.

[thenodrog]

Sorry theno but I don't understand your point. Simple words please.

You said "Just checked, it was 2-1 last season under Allardyce.........so he can do it if he wants to?"

And my point was that yesterday's result was 2-1 in reallity.

[Hughesy]

2 pieces of quality the difference - from 2 players who cost £50m between them.

Yes United had lots of the ball, but apart from that they didnt have alot much else. Obertan missed a sitter, but thats football.

Our defence was much improved on the Chelsea & Arsenal game....which came as no suprise to me given that Samba was playing.

Chimbonda was excellent, as was Givet - 2 very good signings from Sam. Samba also played decent, but you could tell he was struggling late on. Nelsen for me is the weak link in that back 4 - but probably the best we have to take that 4th spot at the moment.

Midfield was our real weak spot. Andrews I watched closely and whilst he slowly closes people down, he very rarely actually puts a challenge in, just closes the angle.

I also felt Di Santo looked like he struggled too, Brown was all over him like a rash every time he recieved a ball to hold up.

Shame for Kalinic that his goal didnt stand, as it wasnt offside either.

[only2garners]

Kalinic did no better than di santo in holding up the ball he only looked better becuase soon he was partnered by benni who stretched the centre backs and gave him more room (if people booed the sub then we have braindead fans, maybe they booed because they wanted a midfielder to be taken off instead of a striker) and yes they scored the second goal when we played 4,4,2 , but we also scored too and it looked like a game of football rather than some kind of chess match.

I agree that McCarthy being there may have given Kalinic more options when he has won the ball but he has to hold on to it first. That was what he did and Di Santo didn't yesterday. I know it's a thankless task playing as lone striker in a team looking to just defend but time and again the ball went to him and he couldn't hold on to it. Kalinic did this at least four times in his brief cameo. Ane of course he scored (or should have done). I don't think anyone booed the subs but there plenty complaining and a lot were complaining about Kalinic being useless - presumably based on their vast experience of seeing him play, which at Premiership level has been little more than an hour at Sunderland when he wasn't properly fit.

[LeftWinger]

We've got a nice run of fixtures coming up - we could be comfortably midtable after the next four games.

A few points I'd like to make to defend the team yesterday. We only lost 2-0, to two world class finishes. That's the sort of finishing you get from a strike force that cost £57.75m. Our centre-halves cost a combined fee of around 400k. United's midfield 4 and two strikers cost £127.35m. On our side we had Diouf 1.0m (Sam has said this is how much he cost), Emerton 2.5m, Andrews 1.3m, N'Zonzi 0.5m, Dunn FREE (I'm classing him as free as although we paid 2.2m for him, we sold him for 5.5m, so I could even call it a minus) and Di Santo (Loan). That's a grand total of 5.3m. If Ferdinand and Vidic had of played yesterday, there team would have come close to 175m. I've had a quick look through our transfer records and estimate we've spent just under 192m in our entire 134 year history. The 14.7m that bought our entire starting eleven yesterday, wouldn't buy you half a Berbatov (30.75m) and just about half a Rooney (27m). It wouldn't even buy you a Carrick (18.6m), Valencia (16m), Anderson (17.3m) or even a Nani (17.3m).

There is a massive gap between what United can afford and what we can. Would I want an extra 50,000 silent 'prawn sandwich type' fans in our ground, if it meant competing at the top? Personally no. Manchester United has become a soul-less corporate entity. Coaches lined the streets outside after the game going to Surrey, Nottingham etc. I doubt half of their 'supporters' even knew who Blackburn Rovers were.

So before people start criticising Sam and the team - just have a think about the limitations the club has. We're punching well above our weight - and for that reason I'm proud to support Blackburn Rovers.

[thenodrog]

We've got a nice run of fixtures coming up - we could be comfortably midtable after the next four games.

A few points I'd like to make to defend the team yesterday. We only lost 2-0, to two world class finishes. That's the sort of finishing you get from a strike force that cost £57.75m. Our centre-halves cost a combined fee of around 400k. United's midfield 4 and two strikers cost £127.35m. On our side we had Diouf 1.0m (Sam has said this is how much he cost), Emerton 2.5m, Andrews 1.3m, N'Zonzi 0.5m, Dunn FREE (I'm classing him as free as although we paid 2.2m for him, we sold him for 5.5m, so I could even call it a minus) and Di Santo (Loan). That's a grand total of 5.3m. If Ferdinand and Vidic had of played yesterday, there team would have come close to 175m. I've had a quick look through our transfer records and estimate we've spent just under 192m in our entire 134 year history. The 14.7m that bought our entire starting eleven yesterday, wouldn't buy you half a Berbatov (30.75m) and just about half a Rooney (27m). It wouldn't even buy you a Carrick (18.6m), Valencia (16m), Anderson (17.3m) or even a Nani (17.3m).

There is a massive gap between what United can afford and what we can. Would I want an extra 50,000 silent 'prawn sandwich type' fans in our ground, if it meant competing at the top? Personally no. Manchester United has become a soul-less corporate entity. Coaches lined the streets outside after the game going to Surrey, Nottingham etc. I doubt half of their 'supporters' even knew who Blackburn Rovers were.

So before people start criticising Sam and the team - just have a think about the limitations the club has. We're punching well above our weight - and for that reason I'm proud to support Blackburn Rovers.

Will you just buggger off and stop talking sense leftwinger? The likes of you are no longer wanted around here!

[Kelbo]

Left winger, I am inclined to agree with you with one exception, I am 63 yers old,

when I started playing football, skill was the important part of the game, the abiltiy to beat

a man, thread slide rule passes through to split defences, ability to cross a football and

hit the right areas.

Things began to change in 1966 with our world cup victory and wingers disappeared almost!

Work rate and 442 system replaced the old system which to a degree was 2 wingers,

2 inside forwards and 2 wing halves, along with a centre forward.

We were then educated, and still are, that football is a simple game, with simple things

done quickly, Ok, I will run with that also!!

So here is my question, what are the simple things?

In my mind it is the ability to pass a ball accurately, especially in midfield which is the engine room and the area in which a game is dictated, so, why, (Dunny apart and I dont class Emerton as a Central midfielder

are e unable to retain possession or pass accurately? I watched with horror yesterday as For the first thirty minutes

Keith Andrews contibution was 27 finger points to his team mates, lots of hard work from the lad

but at no time was he visible actually on the ball!! Why? what is the thinking going on here,

because, and I mean this in all honesty, whatever level a player has come from, in midfield, you simply must

have the ability to pass the ball, if you are unable to do that, you have no chance, couple that with

the fact he cannot head a ball, is slow and a poor tackler,why does Sam continue to play him?

There simply must be better than him at the club or we are realy doomed!!

[martmitch]

did anyone else feel that after mccarthy came on we actually looked like we could offer something going forward (not just because of the disallowed goal), he may not be 90 minutes fit but hes extremely good at holding the ball up and making himself space, hopefully he and kalanic could form quite a formidable partnership, left the game wishing he'd been bought on at half time not just for the last 10 mins

[Kelbo]

did anyone else feel that after mccarthy came on we actually looked like we could offer something going forward (not just because of the disallowed goal), he may not be 90 minutes fit but hes extremely good at holding the ball up and making himself space, hopefully he and kalanic could form quite a formidable partnership, left the game wishing he'd been bought on at half time not just for the last 10 mins

I would agree with that point entirely again with one exception, if we do go down that route, where do we play Dunny who has been successful playing just behind Di Santo?

[LeftWinger]

I would agree with that point entirely again with one exception, if we do go down that route, where do we play Dunny who has been successful playing just behind Di Santo?

4-3-1-2 maybe? Emerton, Grella, N'Zonzi, with Dunn behind a front two? You colud argue this would give Dunn more space.