[Archived] Xmas Number One - Do Your Bit!

[mellison24]

While Joe was a better singer, I prefered Olly and think he will go higher (esp, with Robbie Williams at his side). Olly can sing well enough, but is a good dancer too. I prefer entertainers to singers. I also liked Jedward! They just picked the wrong show. They'd have WALKED BGT.

[Mc Love]

Can people from Ireland win BGT?

[mellison24]

Can people from Ireland win BGT?

Good question actually. Although I'm sure they can. They are belfast aren't they? So that's Northern Ireland = UK, should be (have been) fine.

[brian_gallagher85]

There you go again with the self opinionated terms (glorified, manufactured crap). May I cite Will Young as lasting more than two years? Leona Lewis will obviously be a star for a lot longer. Not a bad track record when you look at the shelf life of pop singers these days. Girls aloud have not done too badly either and if you include other similar shows Jamie Cullum aint done too badly.

Would you like more or is that enough to justify the shows' existance?

I'll give you that Will Young and Girls aloud have lasted longer than 2 years, although neither are Cowell's "creation".

Lewis has had how many "original hits?

The original programs where bad enough but some of the stuff that happens on them now is just a blatant money making scam - making £3.5 million from a karaoke competition just isn't music in my eyes.

Each to their own though, but I would love to see the look on Cowells face if he lost out just once

[Stuart]

There you go again with the self opinionated terms (glorified, manufactured crap). May I cite Will Young as lasting more than two years? Leona Lewis will obviously be a star for a lot longer. Not a bad track record when you look at the shelf life of pop singers these days. Girls aloud have not done too badly either and if you include other similar shows Jamie Cullum aint done too badly.

Would you like more or is that enough to justify the shows' existance?

It's all well and good calling people self-opinionated (which I don't think is really what you mean) but I am leaning towards Brian's view over yours Al.

That's not because I'm trying to make myself sound clever but because I shudder at the thought of all those poor musicians who scrape a living after having spent years learning to play an instrument or bothering to write down something which actually means something to them.

This as opposed to Cowell scouring the world (including Americal Idol) to find people who can sing but have no clue about life or love or loss, let alone having the balls to stand up to him. "You WILL sing this song I have picked for you - I made you I can destroy you, mwah ha ha", etc, etc. Anyone who does stand up for themself is quickly discarded in favour of someone more puppet-like.

These same performers then release an album of covers by contemporary but mostly MOR artists who actually did put some effort into it.

X-Factor is already at a point where the 'wrong' artist is credited with a song, when one of them sang "Run by Leona Lewis" it was cringe-worthy. It won't be long before we have an X-Factor winner singing a song by a previous winner who put their own spin on the 'Leona Lewis hit', which was 'made famous by Robson and Jerome' who covered the 'classic Jane McDonald' track but which we all know is an original Boyzone song 'Father and Son'. If Cat Stevens was dead, he'd be turning in his grave.

Jamie Cullum is one of the few exceptions but he's another one not brought to our screens through the razamataz of the X-Factor. He was a struggling musician (yes, musician) who got his big break on BBC's Fame Academy after playing in pubs for years. I'm not a fan of his music but have nothing but respect for what he's done for himself - not least because he actually has musical talent.

By the way, being pedantic, neither Will Young nor Girls Aloud where winners of X-Factor. Girls Aloud weren't even winners.

(Apologies for the rant, nothing personal against you!)

[Ste B]

Leona Lewis. Top Top class singer. Discovered by the X Factor though, NO.. Manufactured, as shed been through enough talent schools already beforehand and was "encouraged" to audition.

The little git (Joe ?) who won this time almost got through that year, but has been manipulated enough since into TV material before getting slaughtered on live telly.

Its all a joke. If the lemmings watching the program cant see this, then thats just a shame.

Same however goes for those who buy RATM just to annoy Cowell.... Nobody bought it when it was relevant, so why now. You're just as bad.

[Al]

It's all well and good calling people self-opinionated (which I don't think is really what you mean) but I am leaning towards Brian's view over yours Al.

That's not because I'm trying to make myself sound clever but because I shudder at the thought of all those poor musicians who scrape a living after having spent years learning to play an instrument or bothering to write down something which actually means something to them.

This as opposed to Cowell scouring the world (including Americal Idol) to find people who can sing but have no clue about life or love or loss, let alone having the balls to stand up to him. "You WILL sing this song I have picked for you - I made you I can destroy you, mwah ha ha", etc, etc. Anyone who does stand up for themself is quickly discarded in favour of someone more puppet-like.

These same performers then release an album of covers by contemporary but mostly MOR artists who actually did put some effort into it.

X-Factor is already at a point where the 'wrong' artist is credited with a song, when one of them sang "Run by Leona Lewis" it was cringe-worthy. It won't be long before we have an X-Factor winner singing a song by a previous winner who put their own spin on the 'Leona Lewis hit', which was 'made famous by Robson and Jerome' who covered the 'classic Jane McDonald' track but which we all know is an original Boyzone song 'Father and Son'. If Cat Stevens was dead, he'd be turning in his grave.

Jamie Cullum is one of the few exceptions but he's another one not brought to our screens through the razamataz of the X-Factor. He was a struggling musician (yes, musician) who got his big break on BBC's Fame Academy after playing in pubs for years. I'm not a fan of his music but have nothing but respect for what he's done for himself - not least because he actually has musical talent.

By the way, being pedantic, neither Will Young nor Girls Aloud where winners of X-Factor. Girls Aloud weren't even winners.

(Apologies for the rant, nothing personal against you!)

You will have your own way but as you say you are being pedantic. Both Will Young and Girls Aloud were from shows involving Cowell and Fame Academy was a copy of the Cowell shows.

If you are going to criticise the songs they record you have to criticise every cover version by every artist, including Buble and Rod Stewart. Hardly fair is it.

[Eddie]

All these shows have done is expose a different side of the music industry to the general public. Do you think when he isn't involved in x-factor that Simon Cowell isn't telling his artists what to sing? The fact is that if you can't write your own music that you'll have little say in what you perform until you make a name for yourself and have a bit of weight to swing around and even then it can be difficult. Even for artists who write there own stuff their albums are heavily influenced by the record labels. We'd all like to think that the music we hear has been worked on by some group in their garage, but it rarely happens.

[Al]

Leona Lewis. Top Top class singer. Discovered by the X Factor though, NO.. Manufactured, as shed been through enough talent schools already beforehand and was "encouraged" to audition.

The little git (Joe ?) who won this time almost got through that year, but has been manipulated enough since into TV material before getting slaughtered on live telly.

Its all a joke. If the lemmings watching the program cant see this, then thats just a shame.

Same however goes for those who buy RATM just to annoy Cowell.... Nobody bought it when it was relevant, so why now. You're just as bad.

Come on Ste. Every artist is manufactured. How many singers have not been to stage school or had singing lessons? Even Subo had been taught to sing.

The folk who watch the shows do so because they are entertained and IMO the vociferous critics do so because they think it is trendy to be in the minority.

They are not the lemmings it's the trendies who have that honour.

[LeChuck]

Every artist is manufactured.

Nonsense, absolute nonsense. You must live in a cocoon to think that.

Also, why are you struggling to separate a television show with music? I can understand why people watch X Factor (it's essentially the new Big Brother), but that doesn't mean the music charts should be dominated by it.

It's a glorified karaoke competition. If that's how you want your music to be made then it says a lot more about you than it does people who want music that actually means something.

[Stuart]

I think you are right to include Buble and Rod Stewart. There is a market for this kind of entertainment and Cowell is shameless in his exploitation of it but I don't blame Cowell as he is clearly a fine businessman. Imagine being able to test all of your protypes in a market reaching up to 20 million people and then pick the best half a dozen to use as cash cows - and being able to repeat this cycle every year.

However, most of these 'entertainers' are only there because they look the part or have a sob story which can be exploited.

The problem is that the public are so apathetic towards music that they will buy whatever record Cowell decides. The charts have become a laughing stock for anyone who actually appreciates music.

The more sinister part of X-Factor is the turnover of 'stars' who are told at 18 years old that they are fantastic, have two years to prove that they can sell millions of records, and are then given more money they they know what do with, or they disappear. Shane Ward, anyone?

It's all part of our media culture these days to create these heroes, put them on a pedestal before shooting them down again and destroying their character. And all in the name of selling advertising through TV, Newspapers and Magazines. If it wasn't the case, X-Factor wouldn't make the front pages.

The country is going to the dogs and people are being conditioned to celebrate mediocrity and reward failure. 'Jedward' should be the dictionary definition of this.

X-Factor's 'feel-good factor' is the means to numb the pain for the masses.

[Tom]

Anybody else loving the delicious irony of people trying to stick it to the man by doing exactly what they're encouraged to do? F you i will do what you tell me.

[brian_gallagher85]

It's not about "sticking it to the man" though, (if we wanted to do that we'd just download the song illegally ). It's about causing Cowell just the tiniest bit of hard break by denying him his usual spot of Christmas number 1

[Tom]

I'm sure cowell isn't too worried, does he not even own the rights to the ratm song? It wouldn't surprise me if he masterminded the campaign

[brian_gallagher85]

Sony own both, not Cowell. Although he probably does have a share in Sony (and I did say a little bit of heart break)

[Hughesy]

I might buy Joes single just to spite this lot!

[Al]

I might buy Joes single just to spite this lot!

Don't bother Hughsey. They are just jumping on the trendy 'anti Cowell' bandwaggon.

[brian_gallagher85]

As opposed to the pro Cowell wagon that you're on Al?

[Mc Love]

People who are buying RATM are also supporting Shelter! 20k has been raised so far for the agency!

[Stuart]

Don't bother Hughsey. They are just jumping on the trendy 'anti Cowell' bandwaggon.

Yes Al. That's what it is.

[bellamy11]

Don't bother Hughsey. They are just jumping on the trendy 'anti Cowell' bandwaggon.

That's such a narrow-minded viewpoint for somebody who usually comes across as intelligent. Why are you struggling with the concept that not everybody opposes the X-Factor because they are trying to be cool?

[mellison24]

That's such a narrow-minded viewpoint for somebody who usually comes across as intelligent. Why are you struggling with the concept that not everybody opposes the X-Factor because they are trying to be cool?

Indeed. I oppose the X Factor because its BS. I can cope with BGT and the x factor crap auditions cos it's funny. But the live shows are a bore.

[SouthAussieRover]

Even back in the 1960's, the equivalent of the Cowells of this world didn't always realise the talent in front of them!

http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/music/article6959424.ece

[Mattyblue]

I like how the same people that over the years have told me 'football's only a game' have nightly vigil's around xfactor, discussing it endlessly!

The program is an orchestrated money making machine. The sunday night show always makes me larf. The guest star will always be from Cowell's record label, next week that person is top of the charts.

The man is a master of all his surveys, good on him. Its an entertainment show, a good 50% of those who watch it, see it as just that, if you havent got the talent, you'll quickly fade away, don't get too hot under the collar about it!

[CrazyIvan]

I thought Al was a mite more independant of thought... I've grown up listening to music that is not manufactured in the way a large number of artists in the current charts are. What annoys me about Cowell, X-Factor and the like is the 'stuff it down your throat, you WILL like this' of it all. No matter what anybody says, the music world has always had the manufactured band or the chosen person The problem is that there are so many of them in the charts these days.

Bland, corporate pop is the culture being fed to kids these days. Does anybody think that this situation is entirely self-propagating and reduces kids to consumers with little thought or choice? That annoys me a lot more. I'd rather hear a band that writes their own music, plays in their own style and has something to say than be fed a McDonalds Chicken Nugget of pop that does little but propagate the same choice. Having more choice leads kids to think individually eventually...

I choose to buy this record because I wish to have a choice about what bands music I can buy and among the corporate manufactured bands there isn't one in there. The genuine talents that are out there but don't get heard because they are not play-things of the music industry and can't sell 10,000,000 records (because they're never heard!) might get picked up by a label but then get dropped because of that self-propagating situation etc etc...

I'd rather listen to Foo Fighters, Linkin Park, Mark Knopfler, James Taylor, Chris Rea, Muse, Green Day all of whom right their own songs...