[Archived] Time Up Pompey?

[DeadlyDirk]

85 people made redundant at Pompey

only '1 or 2 players' have taken a pay cut (BBC)

I'm not sure i could live with myself if i was on 30k a week and people lost there jobs because i wouldn't shave even a few grand a week off my wage

I see what you're saying but I always think footballers get a bad rep for things like this.

Okay they earn far too much compared to the average wage but they don't choose their wage, they don't force clubs too buy them. If the Pompey board want to sign the contracts agreeing to pay Player X a certain amount then the player is entitled too it. As I said they earn a lot but they don't force anyone to pay it and while it's sad too see people going out of work it's not up to them to save other peoples jobs by taking a paycut themselves.

I certainly wouldn't be willing to shave 10% or so of my wages just so other people could keep their jobs unless I was particulary fond of the club/organisation or at least friends with the people who's jobs are at stake. The majority of Pompey players probably haven't even been there a year and have no affiliation to the club or the various backroom staff.

Footballers earn a lot of money and the majority of them will then therefore spend a lot of money, be it on houses, cars, holidays, gambling as well as many other things I'm sure like nannies, cleaners, as well as the essentials which no doubt are going to be slightly more of the luxury brands compared to ourselves. Any paycut they have take wouldn't mean they are going to particularly struggle in life of course but it would mean a change to their spending and lifestyle which is something that's hard to do once you've been accustomed to it.

That might mean they have to go without a new car for 3 months or so which to for majority of us wouldn't be an issue, but once you've grown used to these things it's very hard to change your lifestyle and in some ways would be no difference in comparison to the likes of us doing without a mobile phone or maybe taking the bus for a month. Would you be prepared to change your habits and lifestyle for someone you've known a few months, I wouldn't and while there are a minority that would, the majority if they are honest would not.

Footballers are paid too much, lots of other people are not paid enough, doesn't mean it's their jobs to fix the problem. Unless you are content with what you currently earn in life you'll always want more, that's just human nature. You'll always find a way to spend the money, although once we get in to the 100k+ a week wages I do start to wonder!

[yoda]

The shop will re-open tomorrow.

The saddest thing here, is that the people who have lost their jobs are just about the only people who aren't to blame for this mess.

Storrie has wanted it known that he has dropped his salary by 40%, while the players wages can't be got at by the administrator, because the players union has ensured that their wages are protected.

Normal employment rules apply Den,

Any forced change would open up a legal minefield, constructive dismissal etc

[American]

Why athletes go broke (from an American perspective):

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/index.htm

[Amo]

Hard times for Peter Storrie. He's on the breadline with a reduced £10,000 a week salary.

How this guy is still employed at the club is a mystery...

[broadsword]

I see what you're saying but I always think footballers get a bad rep for things like this.

Okay they earn far too much compared to the average wage but they don't choose their wage, they don't force clubs too buy them.

I certainly wouldn't be willing to shave 10% or so of my wages just so other people could keep their jobs unless I was particulary fond of the club/organisation or at least friends with the people who's jobs are at stake. The majority of Pompey players probably haven't even been there a year and have no affiliation to the club or the various backroom staff.

They don't hold a gun to anyone's head, that's true. But they're given a lot of money at a young age for (let's face it) not doing very much at all. It spoils a lot of them, if they weren't spoiled already.

I think it's a bit sad that you wouldn't be willing to take a paycut of say, £3k on a £30k a week salary to help safeguard jobs and perhaps even keep the organisation going when it is the bedrock of the community. What do you need the £3k a week for? Try looking at the bigger picture.

[philipl]

This situation at Pompey makes footballers look even worse!

Chester gone while Cardiff and Southend hang on by the thinnest of threads

[broadsword]

Is Peter Ridsdale still involved at Cardiff? If so, that figures.

[T4E]

Is Peter Ridsdale still involved at Cardiff? If so, that figures.

Yep - and after the Pompey thing is resolved one way or t'other I bet you Peter Storrie gets a job somewhere else, too.

[joey_big_nose]

The shop will re-open tomorrow.

The saddest thing here, is that the people who have lost their jobs are just about the only people who aren't to blame for this mess.

Storrie has wanted it known that he has dropped his salary by 40%, while the players wages can't be got at by the administrator, because the players union has ensured that their wages are protected.

I agree. If I was a player and I knew that taking 10% or 20% off my wage could employ 10 people I would seriously look at it. If you wanted to be cynical about it the PR would be incredible for yourself. It would be better if you just did it out of the generosity of your character, but still.

That said the other side of the coin is yuou could take the wage cut and the administrator would sack the staff anyway to cut costs? It hink the administrator would be obliged to do so?

[T4E]

That said the other side of the coin is yuou could take the wage cut and the administrator would sack the staff anyway to cut costs? It hink the administrator would be obliged to do so?

I think you're spot on here Joey - the administrator has clearly decided that the club can do without the 85 employees, as such the players taking a pay cut probably wouldnt have saved any jobs. Paycuts could potentially save the club though, and as such would still be worthwhile volunteering for. That the players seemingly havent done so says as much about the state of football in this country as anything that has happened to Pompey so far.

[broadsword]

I would've imagined that that's right, the administrator would've gone ahead anyway and binned the lot, even though that does seem a drop in the ocean, every little helps I guess.

The players would've put themselves in a better light though if they'd all clubbed together and agreed to take a joint pay cut as a gesture of goodwill. I guess that's not their primary concern tjough.

[T4E]

I doubt it was ever put to the players that "to save 85 jobs will you take £5k-£10k per week pay cut lads?". I doubt they'd have been involved in these job cuts talks at all - remember, these guys are contractors, not employees. I think expecting them to volunteer pay cuts is OTT because they are not expected to have affinity with the club, just play for them under the terms agreed in the contract. As with every other type of contractor in the world.

As I said previously, I don't think you can blame the players for Pompey getting in to this position. However, they are collectively armed with the shovels to help dig them out.

I agree for the most part with what you say, but once again we're making the footballer/real World comparison. I am a contractor myself so am well on board with the "sell yourself to the highest bidder" philosophy, but as with most contractors we're talking about no more than a few hundred pounds a day at most. It's still a "real World" salary. Comparing that to millionaire footballers, who are on several thousand pounds per day, is folly in my opinion. A regular contractor couldnt afford to give up enough to make a realistic difference, but a Premier League footballer could.

[broadsword]

Surely no-one could work their way through 30 k a week, that's daft.

I know you always live to your income, but how would they manage to get through all that money?

[T4E]

Similarly with you, as a contractor, would you be willing to take a 30% pay cut to save a permie's job? I would struggle with that one because 30% is a lot of spending / saving money down the pan.

OK, using really rough numbers -

A Premier League footballer on £50k a week could lose 30% (and therefore earn £35k a week) and free up circa £60k over the course of the month, and therefore £360k over the course of a year. I wonder how many of the 85 redundant employees per annums that would have covered?

In reality, I would have to give up atleast 30% to even come close to keeping just one permie employeed. A Premier League footballer on £50k a week (£2.6m p.a) could have the same impact by giving up 1%.

[American]

Surely no-one could work their way through 30 k a week, that's daft.

I know you always live to your income, but how would they manage to get through all that money?

I'd suggest reading the link I posted a page or so back. Amazing how many pro athletes end up skint.

It is all relative, though. Neil, people out there would look at what you make and say that you could easily afford to give up 30% of your pay.

These guys (Moko excluded) have skills that very few in the world have to be able to be playing at the level they are, plus a shorter earning window.

[T4E]

It is all relative, though. Neil, people out there would look at what you make and say that you could easily afford to give up 30% of your pay.

This is my point though - its not just about the effect it would have on me. Yeah, maybe I could afford it, but would it be enough to save a permies job? Unlikely. Likewise, a Premier League footballer could afford the same % cut - difference is they could save countless jobs by doing so.

[American]

This is my point though - its not just about the effect it would have on me. Yeah, maybe I could afford it, but would it be enough to save a permies job? Unlikely. Likewise, a Premier League footballer could afford the same % cut - difference is they could save countless jobs by doing so.

I don't think they could at this point, though. It's not like they need to find say 10-20% of the wages, they need to find 100% of the wages.

[gumboots]

I don't think they could at this point, though. It's not like they need to find say 10-20% of the wages, they need to find 100% of the wages.

Was just about to say something along those lines. Portsmouth have no cash therefore not paying players that 30% just means that they don't have to find as much cash they don't have. Doesn't mean they have that cash spare to pay anybody else. the time for cost cutting in a business is earlier when a paycut might make a difference to cashflow and ease pressure, not when they are already skint and you're lucky if you get any pay at all.

[T4E]

No I agree - as was said previously the administrators would likely have made the job cuts anyway.

Point is, its been reported that "1 or 2 players" had taken voluntary pay cuts - this is a shockingly poor show IMO. It would still benefit the club (and the fans) if they did so, even if the redundancies were unavoidable.

[gumboots]

No I agree - as was said previously the administrators would likely have made the job cuts anyway.

Point is, its been reported that "1 or 2 players" had taken voluntary pay cuts - this is a shockingly poor show IMO. It would still benefit the club (and the fans) if they did so, even if the redundancies were unavoidable.

And it would have made them look and feel good too and made fans feel better about their club. Thing is it wouldn't have needed to be the 30% being talked about here - a smaller amount if they all did it would have ahd a similar effect.

[DeadlyDirk]

They don't hold a gun to anyone's head, that's true. But they're given a lot of money at a young age for (let's face it) not doing very much at all. It spoils a lot of them, if they weren't spoiled already.

I think it's a bit sad that you wouldn't be willing to take a paycut of say, £3k on a £30k a week salary to help safeguard jobs and perhaps even keep the organisation going when it is the bedrock of the community. What do you need the £3k a week for? Try looking at the bigger picture.

I just think it's one of those things that is easy for us to say because were not in their position. I can't imagine what it would be like to earn 30k a week, I could safely say that I myself would be happy to shave 3k off that if I was earning 30k a week, but like I said, it's incredibly easy for me to say that considering I don't earn 30k a week and most likely never will.

If I actually was earning 30k a week maybe I'd find things to spend it on and get used to having that sort of cash around and then when asked to suddenly cut it I might feel I can't change my lifestyle just to help some people I hadn't even met 6 months ago.

It's also worth pointing out that anyone on 30k a week is going to be paying almost half of that on tax so are likely to be taking home closer to 15k a week. Still a lot of money yes but they also have to think about their futures. The majority of footallers won't go into coaching or management and only have around a 15 year playing career where they can command that sort of wage. Most players will be retired at around 35 and without looking up the stats I would imagine the life expectancy of an athlete is higher than the average person so they also need to look at how they get by for the next 50 years.

Let's say a player earns 30k a week for 15 years of his career. (Aged 20-35) As I said they will then pay almost half of that in tax so lets say they take home 15k a week, over the 15 years of his career that will earn them a little under £12 million. If you then divide that by 65 years (The start of their playing career until death) then that works out at around £180,000 a year.

That's still a lot of money I admit but it quickly shows you how 30k a week can soon go. I'd imagine the majority of players will earn a fair bit on top of that through signing on fees and sponsorship but I doubt average premiership players have the most extravagant sponsorship deals.

Of course when they finish their playing career they can still look for work like anyone else but many of them either won't be good enough for careers in coaching, scouting, management, punditry or simply fancy an early retirement and too enjoy life. You could say that's slightly selfish but then many of us don't enjoy our jobs at all, would you work extra years in life when you could take an early retirement just to help someone else out you don't know. Who knows what plans or career options the likes of Bouba Diop, Mokoena, Hreidarsson and the rest have after they finish their playing career, I have no idea because I've never met them, I think it's unfair to judge them without knowing their full story.

The players at the club now are not too blame for the financial problems of the club, the people who caused this mess should be the ones who are looked at first, why not ask the likes of Redknapp to take a paycut and give someone to Pompey, how about Diarra, Johnson, Defoe etc, at least they were there when the financial problems started, plus they more than likely know the people who's jobs are at stake a lot better than the current crop of players, the majority of which have been their a little more than 6 months.

For those that missed it, American posted a very good link to an article about how athletes can soon lose their money. The first fact is astonishing in itself even if it is not football related, '78% of NFL athletes after being retired for 2 years find themselves in bankcruptancy or under financial stress.'. Here is another link to the article.

[philipl]

Players are reported to be paying the wages of 8 backroom staff who otherwise would have been fired.

[yoda]

looks like Storrie has pulled off the old reveolving door trick, stood down in the best interests of the club.

Still getting paid and carrying out duties!

Unbelievable, the Pompey fans must be completly ###### by the whole thing.

[thenodrog]

looks like Storrie has pulled off the old reveolving door trick, stood down in the best interests of the club.

Still getting paid and carrying out duties!

Unbelievable, the Pompey fans must be completly ###### by the whole thing.

Standing down but staying on as a 'consultant'. In other words keep the money coming but get me out of the firing line ffs.

Surely this is a supply and demand issue. Nobody in their right minds would have him anywhere near their clubs so there is no need to offer more than the minimum wage at best............. Oh wait there are people out of their minds who are willing to employ such... I've just remembered Peter Ridsdale.

[Stuart]

Presumably Storey becoming a 'consultant' makes him self-employed and therefore reduces Pompey's tax liability...?