[Archived] Stoke Vs Rovers

[G Somerset Rover]

But these are the same tactics which won us the games against Fulham and Wigan and saw us almost beat West Ham away from home. Our away form is shocking, no doubt, but looking at the formation and tactics used on saturday i fail to see where Allardyce went wrong as most of us would have chosen the same team. And the formation was the same which had done us well in the 3 previous games.

Obviously in hindsight we can point out the flaws but if you picked any XI for Rovers right now i guarantee that i could pick 4/5 flaws in it. Im gutted that we lost, dont get me wrong, i just dont understand all this anger towards Allardyce when he picked a side which we were all happy with before the match and in a formation which had worked well in the past 3/4 games. That is why im standing up for him.

Almost? You've nicked that one from the Big Sam school of post-match interviews!

Also with regards to your second point, I for one wasn't happy with the formation because why is a target man playing right wing/off the striker? It was a ridiculous decision. Square pegs into round holes.

Allardyce is forcing his formation and tactics onto players who don't know how to play the way he wants.

[waggy]

i was in 2 minds wether to venture to the pub to watch this game,but the lure proved too much,god line up,from conceding a early goal,well done chimp,too conceding one in the 3rd minute of injury time we ran the game,then bloody samba gets sent off again,what was he doing.game over.what happened on the concourse at half time just leaves me dumbfounded

[Gav]

Wasn't directing any of that to any specific member Majiball. However, on the whole there was an obvious undertone to all this. My post was merely to outline the over pedantic nature of the argument and that it seemed to be ongoing despite reaching somewhat of an end.

Also, keeping women out of football....

Keep blacks off our buses?

Don't let old people work?

Don't listen to cripples, what use is their opinion?

I was under the impression that bigotry was dying out. How naive.

Why does every thread descend into this sort of cr@p these days????

Give it a rest FFS

[RIML]

Why does every thread descend into this sort of cr@p these days????

Give it a rest FFS

When there's a comment like "keep women out of football" I think he has a point.

Beerwins has got it spot on. Enough said.

The argument is void anyway, if you looked up a strikers role is in the dictionary it would probaly mention scoring goals somewhere in there, none of ours do so it really doesnt matter where they play.

Abolish the offside rule so Sam can sit 2 on there goal line while we whack the ball up to them, at least it would clear up the point as to the position the STRIKERS are actually playing

[Neil Weaver]

I’ll keep it (fairly) brief and try to keep to the game.

Without covering what’s already been said by the likes of Ivan, Beerwins, Azuri (and 1864, though I don’t agree with his views on Andrews and Allardyce), after spending about 12 hours and 75 quid to witness Stoke on Saturday, I won’t be taking in many more away games for a while. Burnley, if I can get a ticket, that’ll be it.

Being a Rovers fan means we see poor performances, but I find it hard to justify spending that money/time on what seems to be increasingly poor efforts from our lads. First half was OK apart from dismal defending but second half was appalling. About the only bright spark – and that’s stretching it – was I thought Reidy did OK when he came on. Other than that, we were totally outworked and outbattled. I remember during the 2nd half we had the ball on the Stoke left about half way in their half (so probably Bert). He was under pressure so passed it back (to Salgado I think). Immediatley he was pressed by Stoke so back it went to Nelsen. Fuller (or whoever) was immediately on him, so back it went to Givet who was pressured so back it went to Robbo : cue long ball upfield to no-one in particular. That’ll bring the crowds back.

If Stoke hadn’t taken their foot off the pedal at 3-0, they could have easily had another 1 or 2.

What’s most frustrating for me is that I really don’t think our players are a lot different to the likes of Stoke, they were simply outbattled and even we know about Stoke’s strength at home, I find it hard to stomach the degree that happened on Saturday.

On more serious matters, sympathies to all involved with the fan who didn’t make it home.

Oh, and thanks to the 'supporters not spectators' just behind me who were shouting obsceneties at those within earshot who dared to sit down. Ironic (?) that they buggered off after the third went in?

[roversmum]

I can't remember the game, due to the horror of the half-time incident. Whether or not this has been mentioned (I cba trawling through the pages) there was a brief return of the 'Owen Coyle shags P***s' chant. Contrary to my assumptions it was sang by men who were ALL older than 40. It was my first real away day against stoke and it'll take a while for me to go again. Horrible day. Our away fans are mad and stupid.

Excuse me? Most of the away fans are neither.

There are things that need clamping down on. One is the assumption that there is a 'right' to stand up, there is not. Mindless chants. Personally I dislike excessive swearing, particularly that which seems to be incorporated into chants. Banter is entirely different. Another is for those who think that being drunk out of your senses is the way to go. Why? Why pay good money to be totally unable to control your own actions, make fools of yourselves and embarrass other fans and your club - to say nothing of later having no recollection of the match. No problem whatsoever with folks who enjoy a pint or two.

[Commondore]

Almost? You've nicked that one from the Big Sam school of post-match interviews!

Also with regards to your second point, I for one wasn't happy with the formation because why is a target man playing right wing/off the striker? It was a ridiculous decision. Square pegs into round holes.

Allardyce is forcing his formation and tactics onto players who don't know how to play the way he wants.

Put your strongest header against the opponents fullbacks, who are likely to be much weaker in the air than their center halves. It's classic Sam Allardyce.

@RIML: Believe me when I say it isn't the first time attitudes such as that has been hinted at or blatantly exposed on this forum. Britain just seems to be forever stuck in the 1940:s on some levels.

[Gav]

When there's a comment like "keep women out of football" I think he has a point.

Not on a bloody Rovers v stoke thread he doesn't, and I'm not having ago at him only, its every thread these days and I for one am what does that mean? sick of reading the usual suspects spouting the usual cr@p thread after thread after thread........

If you want to slag off women at football start another thread, its simple.

Rant over

[ABBEY]

Not on a bloody Rovers v stoke thread he doesn't, and I'm not having ago at him only, its every thread these days and I for one am what does that mean? sick of reading the usual suspects spouting the usual cr@p thread after thread after thread........

If you want to slag off women at football start another thread, its simple.

Rant over

YOU NEED big CAPS FOR A REAL RANT:p

[Gav]

YOU NEED big CAPS FOR A REAL RANT:p

[jim mk2]

. Our away fans are mad and stupid.

Speak for yourself.

This may be a difficult concept for you to understand but it is possible to go to an away football match and have a good day despite losing without 1) getting drunk 2) fighting 3) swearing, chanting racist songs and generally behaving in a boorish manner.

In my experience, 95 per cent of Rovers away fans behave properly.

[Paul Mellelieu]

Speak for yourself.

This may be a difficult concept for you to understand but it is possible to go to an away football match and have a good day despite losing without 1) getting drunk 2) fighting 3) swearing, chanting racist songs and generally behaving in a boorish manner.

In my experience, 95 per cent of Rovers away fans behave properly.

[/quote

Maybe 90%, but point taken.

[only2garners]

Oh, and thanks to the 'supporters not spectators' just behind me who were shouting obsceneties at those within earshot who dared to sit down. Ironic (?) that they buggered off after the third went in?

We must have been sat close to each other (or there are a lot like them). One guy behind me was going spare at the beginning of the second half when everybody sat down. He then said to his mates "we're off when the clock gets to 68 minutes" but then couldn't even manage that when the third goal was scored. What was special about 68 minutes I don't know.

[sweet]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/gamecast?id=269798&page=features&cc=5739&league=ENG.1

Dunno if you guys are familar with this tool, but it has an average position feature. It actually has Di Santo on the right and Pedersen seemingly partnering Kalinic upfront at the stoke game.

[mellison24]

Speak for yourself.

This may be a difficult concept for you to understand but it is possible to go to an away football match and have a good day despite losing without 1) getting drunk 2) fighting 3) swearing, chanting racist songs and generally behaving in a boorish manner.

In my experience, 95 per cent of Rovers away fans behave properly.

I don't quite understand why you insist on targetting me about it.

1: I didn't get drunk, I had a single solitary pint.

2: I didn't fight. I went to the toilet and then saw a man bloodied in the head (as did many others) as I came out.

3: I only swore in the way everybody does in chants at oppo fans.

At no point did I chant a racist song or behave like a tosser. But when somebody dies at a football match, someting is bloody wrong. Yes, my statement was a bad generalisation, but the half-time incident completely cut me down. I genuinely cannot remember a single point of the game because of it. I agree that 90 or so % of away fans behave, but we cant escape the fact that a man with a child has died. Little Jacob won't see his Dad come home. I'll take back my statement, but that game was horrific purely because of that one incident where some pisshead decided it wise to throw bottles and a bin in the air. I'll not be attending an away game for a long while after that. Horrible.

[jim mk2]

I don't quite understand why you insist on targetting me about it.

Not criticising you per se and I understand that witnessing yesterday's event must have been upsetting.

There seems to be a general conception that all away fans are neanderthal drunks when the majority go to watch the match and have nothing stronger to drink other than a half-time cup of bovril.

Rovers have few enough away fans without more refusing to attend because of misinformation about supporters' behaviour.

[mellison24]

Not criticising you per se and I understand that witnessing yesterday's event must have been upsetting.

There seems to be a general conception that all away fans are neanderthal drunks when the majority go to watch the match and have nothing stronger to drink other than a half-time cup of bovril.

Rovers have few enough away fans without more refusing to attend because of misinformation about supporters' behaviour.

Are we not one of the best set of away fans in the Premier League? I always thought we had fairly big following (especially considering to our size). But I do agree that mis-information shouldn't deter fans from going (and I apologise for my sweeping statement). But I will wait until next season to go to an away game again. And then I'll join in with any fan who wants get the scum minority out of our away following. Get them pointed out to stewards and chant obscenities at them as they are led out of the ground. If they want to give it, they should take it too.

[1864roverite]

Having just done a few sums, recalled the memory banks and had a chat with my fellow travelling Rovers fan, I reckon I have been to nearly 510 away games, the sum is possibly higher and with England I think I could safely add a further 25 matches.

I have drunk, drunk some and more, I have never once had to get involved in a fight one on one, gang on gang and that includes venturing to games, 30 lads in a tranny van, when footie hooliganism was at its height. Abbey has been with us on many occasions.

I go to away games to have a day out. I travelled Europe with Preston Blue, we got bevvied but didnt need to go looking for trouble, we simply had a laugh. Granted, the fare on offer has been poor but we still go to enjoy the games even if we have too much to drink its about football. Its about our club, our fans and our "joy" at following the shirt.

We have a set of inbred morons who have latched onto BRFC. We witnessed them in Cologne, We saw then in Rotterdam and Salzburg when they attacked Rovers fans who stood up to them. We have seen them at Bolton recently and we now have this moronic racist chant which some seem to sing without really thinking or understanding what it is they are saying. The few, and they know where they come from and who they are, are tainting good fans with their racist brush. Their behaviour, as drunken as it is, is harming our reputation as being good footballing fans and for me I have simply had enough of them.

At Bolton I fronted them out, I am able to do that with confidence. At other grounds, as in Stoke, some fans fronted them out. I witnessed them in some of the bars in Manchester and then the train, they are complete and utter w*nkers who bring nothing but misery. They think its is hard to front out women supporters, to block the views of the disabled and to chant the racist and idiotic chants that in reality only they understand.

It is time we got rid of them.

I urge any decent Rovers fan to video them on their phone and cameras and then if they dont want to do anything themselves about it, email or pm me and I will arrange the video to go to the club or even better, the Police then they can root out these fools.

I am prepared to assist anyone who can help us.

[mellison24]

Having just done a few sums, recalled the memory banks and had a chat with my fellow travelling Rovers fan, I reckon I have been to nearly 510 away games, the sum is possibly higher and with England I think I could safely add a further 25 matches.

I have drunk, drunk some and more, I have never once had to get involved in a fight one on one, gang on gang and that includes venturing to games, 30 lads in a tranny van, when footie hooliganism was at its height. Abbey has been with us on many occasions.

I go to away games to have a day out. I travelled Europe with Preston Blue, we got bevvied but didnt need to go looking for trouble, we simply had a laugh. Granted, the fare on offer has been poor but we still go to enjoy the games even if we have too much to drink its about football. Its about our club, our fans and our "joy" at following the shirt.

We have a set of inbred morons who have latched onto BRFC. We witnessed them in Cologne, We saw then in Rotterdam and Salzburg when they attacked Rovers fans who stood up to them. We have seen them at Bolton recently and we now have this moronic racist chant which some seem to sing without really thinking or understanding what it is they are saying. The few, and they know where they come from and who they are, are tainting good fans with their racist brush. Their behaviour, as drunken as it is, is harming our reputation as being good footballing fans and for me I have simply had enough of them.

At Bolton I fronted them out, I am able to do that with confidence. At other grounds, as in Stoke, some fans fronted them out. I witnessed them in some of the bars in Manchester and then the train, they are complete and utter w*nkers who bring nothing but misery. They think its is hard to front out women supporters, to block the views of the disabled and to chant the racist and idiotic chants that in reality only they understand.

It is time we got rid of them.

I urge any decent Rovers fan to video them on their phone and cameras and then if they dont want to do anything themselves about it, email or pm me and I will arrange the video to go to the club or even better, the Police then they can root out these fools.

I am prepared to assist anyone who can help us.

I'm with you on that last bit. But only when I start going away again.

[BuckyRover]

Very well said 1964. It usually is a minority that ruin it for the rest. But people need to remember it is a minority and they can be defeated.

[47er]

Not criticising you per se and I understand that witnessing yesterday's event must have been upsetting.

There seems to be a general conception that all away fans are neanderthal drunks when the majority go to watch the match and have nothing stronger to drink other than a half-time cup of bovril.

Rovers have few enough away fans without more refusing to attend because of misinformation about supporters' behaviour.

Rovers have fewer away fans than they would have if a couple of hundred or so scum of the earth weren't there masquerading as Rovers fans. I won't travel away anymore because I just don't want to be associated with them. I know there are many more decent Rovers fans but they tend to be over-shadowed don't they?

[roversmum]

So, decent fans will be over-shadowed if we don't stick together, 47er, and keep going to away matches. Why should they tarnish the reputation of our club? Why should they get away with it? Please, keep coming, voice your concerns. The club is aware that there are problems and are looking to sort them out.

Unfortunately we are quite often away from our own fans in whatever disabled area clubs see fit to put us, which does occasionally lend us to abuse from home supporters and means we cannot go into a concourse, but hey, it won't stop us from going!

[Shabani]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/gamecast?id=269798&page=features&cc=5739&league=ENG.1

Dunno if you guys are familar with this tool, but it has an average position feature. It actually has Di Santo on the right and Pedersen seemingly partnering Kalinic upfront at the stoke game.

Quite an eye opening tool

Ollsson appears to be playing right midfield

Di Santo attacking left mid

Kalinic MGP upfront

Salgado CB

Givet RB

No wonder we lost....

[sweet]

The right and the left are the wrong way about for some reason, or at least I am assuming so!

What is clear, though, is how deep our midfield and forwards appeared to be, escpecially compared to stoke's. So even despite the fact we were losing, we still sat back and allowed them to attack us. Which would be all well and good if we were say villa, who had the pace and strength to hit them on a counter attack. However we clearly do not!

[philipl]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/gamecast?id=269798&page=features&cc=5739&league=ENG.1

Dunno if you guys are familar with this tool, but it has an average position feature. It actually has Di Santo on the right and Pedersen seemingly partnering Kalinic upfront at the stoke game.

It shows we were utterly rigid and had no width.

The heat maps are instructive- you can see what Stoke were doing when in posession of the ball whereas Rovers' complete team heat map looks like spotted dick with not enough currants.

Taken together, it looks like the players didn't really know what they were doing,