[Archived] Hull Preview

[Exiled_Rover]

In 50 plus years of watching BRFC not once have I set off for a game expecting or wanting to be entertained.

I go to support my team and I want my team to win. End of story.

That's a strange stance to have. Why follow football if it doesn't entertain you?

[Alan75]

Strong?

I've never seen a rovers striker fall over so easily.

Paul Dickov - although that was self inflicted.

[super_arran]

That's a strange stance to have. Why follow football if it doesn't entertain you?

He's saying he follows his team rather than the style of football they play.

eg. Last year when Oojer scored in the last minute and we won 2 - 1 (was it spurs?)

I was happy because my team had won even though we played awful.

Other people were probably unhappy due to their team not playing pretty football; even tho they won.

IMO the latter is called supporting the style of football rather than the team.

[grizfoot]

Game by game there appears to be a massive chasm between people's opinions on here. On one hand you've got people saying the Rovers are 11th in league which is very good with the resources available to Big Sam and if we improved our away form/been more clinical infront of goal we'd have been pushing for a Europa league spot. Then in contrast you have the anti-Big Sam brigade who think Big Sam has squeezed any sort of passion, creativity and flair from our play and as only the one tactic, "hoof ball", which has on a number of occassion earnt us home wins but overall performances have been poor and we've not been entertaining.

From my viewpoint I agree with aspects from both sides of the arguments. Last night's game was very open to debate on whether it was a good Rovers performance or not. You could easily argue had it not been for Myhill we could have won by a larger margain, but the fact still remains we never really convincingly saw out the game by grapping a second goal. I'd say it was very similiar to performances in past home games, not outstanding but we did enough to merit all three points. That seems to be a reocurrence in our home games, as does the fact that when vital important games come up under Big Sam we always seem to come away with the all important three points. Bit of a cliche but football is a results game, at the end of the season it doesn't matter how well you've performed in each individual game it's all about the number of points you gained and where that puts you in the league. This is where I share the optimistic outlook if you like, in saying that we are 11th in the league and all things being considered that's a satisifcatory position for the club. On the other hand I do to some extent agree with the people who say that we are playing a breed of football which could be deemed boring and lacking imagination. I'd like to remind thoose people however that we did play some good football in the first half against the Dingles and in the second half against Pompey. We also performed fairly well during our Carling Cup run scoring plenty of goals in the progress. I would agree however that recentley some of our games in terms of entertainment have been non-existant. I'd like to see us get the ball down and pass it more often because we do look more dangerous whenever we do play that way in my opinion. Don't bring the fact our players aren't able to do that because if Coyle can get Notlob playing football down the road then surely we can expect our lot to practise some of the same football. Nobody is suggesting we play like Arsenal or Barcelona but more the point that we need to add more variation in styles to our game instead of becoming too one dimensional with aerial bombardments.

Back on subject to the game, In real time I thought the red card was a bit harsh and watching the replays proved me correct. Boateng did lead with his arm but it was harsh in my opinion as there was no intention to cause damage. I think we still would havel won if it was 11v11, Hull look a very poor outfit and their passing is worse than ours and I wouldn't be at all suprised to see them go down. Looking at individual performances I'll leave the Diouf and Andrews discussions for other people to bicker about, I thought there was a few players who stood out for me. Olsson had a very good game from left-back and obviously got the important goal (or assist if it's deemed an own goal), Nzonzi also had a very good second half and won the ball back well on a number of occassions. The centrebacks looked solid but where never really tested that much.

However the quote of the night for me as to go to Michel Salgado who was on RadioRovers replying to a common question on the differing tempos between the Premiership and LaLiga, he said something along the following lines "In Madrid we play possession ball, but in England we kick and run".

[unluckymorton]

could not be bothered even going to the pub to watch it last night,1 up front against ten men is a disgrace,but a win is a win

Thanks for your input wag, we're discussing the game last night not whether you did or didn't go to the pub.

What's your verdict of the highlights on MOTD? How did we play?

[Gav]

In 50 plus years of watching BRFC not once have I set off for a game expecting or wanting to be entertained.

I go to support my team and I want my team to win. End of story.

Interesting comments Jim, you seem to have changed over the years, don't forget I've been around for a while also

Taken with pinch of salt

People go to football to be entertained, in many cases that doesn’t happen, but still that’s a fundamental reason for attending.

If we are relegated, playing cr@p football, and fall through the leagues, the support will decrease drastically, not because people don’t support the club, but because they’re not being entertained.

[Gav]

We won!!!

Yes sorry, its the change in Jim mk2 that has me all confused

[Montfort]

In real time I thought the red card was a bit harsh and watching the replays proved me correct. Boateng did lead with his arm but it was harsh in my opinion as there was no intention to cause damage.

From where I was sitting in the Darwin End , looking down the pitch Boateng jumped late and into the player. I agree I was a little suprised when he was sent off but not that suprised.

[nicko]

A certain Mr Nixon's report say it was Olsson's first goal in senior football, come on Nicko check the facts

First Premier League goal...my apologies.

[den]

If we are relegated, playing cr@p football, and fall through the leagues, the support will decrease drastically, not because people don’t support the club, but because they’re not being entertained.

Gav, the attendances would have fallen drastically after Ince's debacle - if we hadn't have sold the third cheapest ST's in the whole of English football. It's not all down to Allardyce.

The reason the football is crap to watch is because we have sold every, single, good player we have. These players just aren't made to play, or are capable of playing entertaining football. They are a bunch of lads who give their best, but a group of Paul Gascoignes' they are not.

Unless you're Jonnolad of course and revel in watching Keith Andrews giving us a Tugayesque masterclass.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

I go to support my team and I want my team to win. End of story.

Spot on Jimbo.Personally 'entertainment' comes a distant second to seeing my club win.I understand your points Gav but come on fella,we have seen a damn sight worse than this my good man and you know it!

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

The reason the football is crap to watch is because we have sold every, single, good player we have.

Nothing more to say really is there Den!..I'm just glad we are winning games and are where we are because of the present standard of our players,once again...what do some of you expect??

Champagne tastes on Beer money anyone

[broadsword]

I agree, it's a minor miracle we've stayed up.

How much of this is down to the division (bar top six) being poor rather than Rovers defying gravity is up for debate, but regardless of the quality of football played you have to take your hat off and say it's some going.

More or less all the family silver has been sold off, a 'keeper who blows hot and cold brought in under previous regime, a back-four that arguably that you would struggle to perm from the available players, a midfield where the less that is said the better, and a set of forwards who had at least one positive attribute each, but taken separately none of them has been good enough until the emergence of Kalinic ... but most importantly, absolutely sod all money.

By rights we should be lower than we are, look where Sunderland are right now.

No-one could say that things have been perfect, but equally they could be so much worse!

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

That's right Bryan,there's a total loss of perspective and reality on here at times.All this talk of season tickets not being renewed even at the low prices etc WTF!....where's the backbone folks?

[MarkBRFC71]

Whatever you think about Sam's hoofball tactics, they are sometimes effective and while we are without our key midfielders, I am quite happy to persist with it if it means it will get us points. I don't know what people expect really, this isn't indoor football for us to be passing it on the ground. If you've ever played football for any sort of club, then you will know that playing it in the air is the most challenging thing for a player. Anyone can kick a ball, it takes a lot more skill and effort to send accurate high balls in and win them.

We aren't sending high, accurate balls in and winning them, we are lumping it into the proverbial mixer. A big difference. And if that's so much harder to do, why are we making it more difficult for ourselves playing that way?!?

It's far more difficult to play, short, passing football hence why the teams who have risen to be the best in World football over the years have all played that way (Brazil 1970 & 1982, current Barcelona team, Holland/Ajax in the 70's, Liverpool in the 70's/80's etc etc.)

We are playing pure percentage football, i.e. get the ball into the box as quickly as possible, because the greater the number of times it's lumped in, the greater percentage chance of us getting a lucky knockdown, or there being a defensive slip, or us winning a header etc. There is in no way as much skill involved in this as playing proper, pass and move football.

And all our players could play a passing game, and would no doubt prefer to. Put yourself in their position - you are a highly paid professional footballer, who's trained for years at every aspect of the game. But instead of letting you play to your best ability, and use the skill you've gaine over many years all your boss wants you to do is kick it high and long and early. Wouldn't you be a bit p*ssed off?

[LeChuck]

Put yourself in their position - you are a highly paid professional footballer, who's trained for years at every aspect of the game. But instead of letting you play to your best ability, and use the skill you've gaine over many years all your boss wants you to do is kick it high and long and early. Wouldn't you be a bit p*ssed off?

I'd be ###### off, yeah.

Thankfully that isn't what's happening.

[den]

Paul Dickov - although that was self inflicted.

That was the game plan Alan.

[den]

I disagree with this Den. Most of the time this season has been about being too calculated in the tactics, creating fairly drab football. First half yesterday we battered Hull and there was hardly a long ball in sight. It was good to watch and we're just short of a consistent goal-scorer. Second half was awful, probably because of what the manager said at half time, and that's the point I think.

We do have a lot of talent at Rovers. They're just not always allowed to express that talent - rightly or wrongly.

Fair enough, but take away Dunny and where are the players who are going to "entertain" us? Where are the "pass and movers"? Where are the goalscorers?

[John]

Whilst we could mix up our play more, how many other clubs would want some of our players.....?

I would think not many, that's why I don't get it when people say we have a talented squad - we have some OK players, but would not get carried away.

I am talking about our current squad - no doubt, in the past, Bellamy/Bentley/Santa Cruz/Warnock were class acts.

[Drunx2002]

An interesting debate...

As Bryan hinted, the big factor in this is that the Premiership is not what it used to be. We now have the big four, the inconsistent chasers (Man City, Spurs, Villa and potentially Everton) and then the rest. Who would have thought a few years ago that we'd have Stoke, Sunderland, Birmingham, Wigan, Wolves, Fulham and Burnley in the Premiership?

My opinion for almost the whole season has been that we have to be better than at least two of those (with Pompey already down) so will be safe.

I expect us to lose virtually every away game.

I expect us to lose heavily home and away to the big four

I expect us to struggle at home against teams in the top half

and I expect us to play dire football in an attempt to win home games against the teams in the bottom half.

I hate that we rely so heavily on set pieces - play the DAMN GAME!

I agree with Gav about entertainment being important. I have always supported Rovers and until my move south was a season ticket holder. I used to head north for a few home games a season and try and get to as many away games as I could. Now I hardly bother as I don't like watching the tripe that I've seen when I have gone especially when the opposition are either equally as poor or thrash us.

On Allardyce, I don't like the guy. I went to the 3-1 win against Portsmouth this season and found his smug attitude hard to take after his half time tactic change turned the game around. We shouldn't have started the game with 1 up front against the bottom team in the first place! He was similarly smug after the match I saw over Christmas against Sunderland. He is one-dimensional and has always tried to mould his teams into playing this unattractive football. I'd prefer that we had a manager with the ability to shape and mould a team with plans B, C, and D to turn to if plan A isn't working. I simply can't see us playing any better or progressing with him at the helm.

Loads of us feel this way......look at the number of people last season who put up with this football so long as it kept us up. And surprise surprise, we're still playing it!

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

Fair enough, but take away Dunny and where are the players who are going to "entertain" us? Where are the "pass and movers"? Where are the goalscorers?

Goal - brilliant hold up play, superb pass from Pedersen, Olsson at pace scores goal. Though bad goal keeping - it was still an excellent goal - and no Dunny in sight.

Sometimes I think too many people watch Arsenal and United and expect us to play like them. Last night we were in control for most of the match - and there were moments of excellent play (Diouf's ball for Emerton was excellent). On another day we could have won by 3 or 4 goals - against a team that has just had excellent results against City and Chelsea - and who many Rovers fans thought we would struggle against.

People are too hung up on the myth around Sam's style of play. Maybe Robinson does launch every free kick into the box - and every throw in is a long one - but in between we actually played some reasonable football last night against a team who weren't afraid to put the boot in. I think we are too one dimensional at times - maybe Dunny or Basturk will change that - but the football last night was entertaining and nowhere near as bad as some people are making out. Unfortunately the anti-Sam people can't seem to get beyond our current manager and just take the team at face value.

[mellison24]

An interesting debate...

As Bryan hinted, the big factor in this is that the Premiership is not what it used to be. We now have the big four, the inconsistent chasers (Man City, Spurs, Villa and potentially Everton) and then the rest. Who would have thought a few years ago that we'd have Stoke, Sunderland, Birmingham, Wigan, Wolves, Fulham and Burnley in the Premiership?

My opinion for almost the whole season has been that we have to be better than at least two of those (with Pompey already down) so will be safe.

I expect us to lose virtually every away game.

I expect us to lose heavily home and away to the big four

I expect us to struggle at home against teams in the top half

and I expect us to play dire football in an attempt to win home games against the teams in the bottom half.

I hate that we rely so heavily on set pieces - play the DAMN GAME!

I agree with Gav about entertainment being important. I have always supported Rovers and until my move south was a season ticket holder. I used to head north for a few home games a season and try and get to as many away games as I could. Now I hardly bother as I don't like watching the tripe that I've seen when I have gone especially when the opposition are either equally as poor or thrash us.

On Allardyce, I don't like the guy. I went to the 3-1 win against Portsmouth this season and found his smug attitude hard to take after his half time tactic change turned the game around. We shouldn't have started the game with 1 up front against the bottom team in the first place! He was similarly smug after the match I saw over Christmas against Sunderland. He is one-dimensional and has always tried to mould his teams into playing this unattractive football. I'd prefer that we had a manager with the ability to shape and mould a team with plans B, C, and D to turn to if plan A isn't working. I simply can't see us playing any better or progressing with him at the helm.

Loads of us feel this way......look at the number of people last season who put up with this football so long as it kept us up. And surprise surprise, we're still playing it!

So we didn't mix it up last night? Our best chances didn't come from open play and good movement and passing? Our WINNING GOAL didn't come from open play and good movement and passing? I thought last night was better even than some of Hughes' football! That was an entertaining game by ALL accounts. The only long balls I recall are from when we had to clear our lines. In terms of creating chances, most if not ALL were from simple passing football. I would have agreed with your post before the 2nd half of the first leg vs Villa. Not afterwards though.

I think the players giving Sam a piece of their minds vs Citeh has made him have a think and I believe we are playing much better football as a result. We play when we can, and go direct when we cant. Just like every team barring LeArse. I think some need to take off the Anti-Sam blinkers for now until we actually play a game full of long-ball. I have seen a small but adequate change from the long ball tactic since the Citeh game.

The only grates I still have are Robbo's technique in collecting crosses and the throw-ins. Everything else is okay. Not fantastic, but okay. And certainly not the constant hoof that some people 'see'.

[Drunx2002]

Let's not forget we were playing against Hull City who haven't won away from home all season and were down to ten men. If we hadn't been able to pass the ball between them I'd be worried!

Aside from that we've recent wins against Fulham at home (they have 1 away win all season) and Wigan (surprisingly with three!). The Bolton game for me is crucial - win that and we're safe.

Once the big boys come knocking near the end of the season our one dimensional play will be shown up once more. Thankfully by then we'll hopefully have enough points to be safe.

[Gav]

Gav, the attendances would have fallen drastically after Ince's debacle - if we hadn't have sold the third cheapest ST's in the whole of English football. It's not all down to Allardyce.

The reason the football is crap to watch is because we have sold every, single, good player we have. These players just aren't made to play, or are capable of playing entertaining football. They are a bunch of lads who give their best, but a group of Paul Gascoignes' they are not.

Unless you're Jonnolad of course and revel in watching Keith Andrews giving us a Tugayesque masterclass.

I'm trying not to blame the manager for everything to goes on at Ewood, we don’t invest in the team, and sell our best assets, we’re only going one way given time, and that’s not the managers fault.

But you have to look at the style of play and the away form which to me is criminal. Ask anyone who made the trip to Anfield last season about the managers approach to away games. I don’t think we put a tackle in all day, and those poor sods that made the trip must have been fuming, the lads I know that went haven’t been away since.

I maintain, you have to be entertained, or see players giving 110%, as that’s entertainment in itself, but far to often, especially away from home, they don’t put the effort in. People have spent hundreds of pounds, and the manager is to blame for that lack of effort in my opinion.

This site is a tiny cross section of supporters in reality and doesn’t give us a true reflection of how the supporters are feelings. I can honestly say, in the real world, I have never known a manager hated by so many, and that is where I gage opinion.

[mellison24]

Let's not forget we were playing against Hull City who haven't won away from home all season and were down to ten men. If we hadn't been able to pass the ball between them I'd be worried!

Aside from that we've recent wins against Fulham at home (they have 1 away win all season) and Wigan (surprisingly with three!). The Bolton game for me is crucial - win that and we're safe.

Once the big boys come knocking near the end of the season our one dimensional play will be shown up once more. Thankfully by then we'll hopefully have enough points to be safe.

You can only beat what's put in front of you. I really don't understand those who won't give credit when it's due. You'll probably retaliate with 'I don't understand those who give credit regardless' but I wanted Sam gone after the Citeh game. He's proven me and others wrong. We AREN'T playing one dimensional football!!! We've PROVEN that since the City game! How biased against the manager ARE some people?