[Archived] Rovers Might Have Been Sold?

[Majiball]

Some people will create any "logic" rather than what is the OBVIOUS.

Does that mean there's a cloaked Wessel hiding near-by????

Well this thread is an interesting read, pirate day at work sounds like fun did anyone walk the plank? no-idea what to make of it all but its always nice to know.

Guess its hunting day at Ewood today and its highly amusing that the targets still ginger.

[philipl]

'drog is going to get a lot of free drinks out of this if he plays his cards right!

[Brfcrule1]

Nicko, quick question is there any more info in today's people about any potential takeover & who the parties might be?

thanks for your valuable info.

[ewoodpo]

Is there no chance that he is actually Dan Williams, posing as one of his employees?

Very good point it could be him knows way too much for an employee.

[Sysagent]

To give total clarity here - I am Isaac Cheung, formerly of Plainfield.

Surprised nobody has picked up the above, the poster of all this intriguing information is not employed anymore by the former interested parties, now this can be either

1. A "plant" and he is still employed by Plainfield and is doing some preliminary "testing of the water" to see if the fans are receptive to an approach by them again
   
2. A genuine ex-employee who left on good terms and want's to keep his bridges intact with his former employer and therefore is posting all this up here to keep in with them so to speak
   
3. Dan Williams under an alias
   
4. Somebody who is just taking the proverbial yellow stuff at our expense
   
5. Or he is who he is and is just passing on the information in a genuine and bona fide fashion
   

My heart goes with the first option if the below was going to be the future of our team, if this was the situation and the truth then words defy me for what could have been:-

Secondly, the view that Plainfield took was that this represented a chance for steady growth over a 5-year period of 15-20% in value, given that the club owned land (Brockall) that would appreciate - oh how we missed that particular storm - and there was potential for development in and around Ewood. The idea was to develop the Riverside Stand in to a three tier (to match the ground) multi-use facility with a similar seating capacity but increased revenue potential from the other uses (retail, office, leisure were all considered). Oh and through a friend of either Plainfield or I think maybe even Williams, there was a preliminary discussion with Tescos about them buying part of the car part behind the away end to build a Tesco Express maybe (not sure if I have the brand right, we don't have Tescos here but I think I am right in saying Williams knew a guy who was best friends with Lord McLauren/McLaurrin???)

Then there was the matter of the US TV rights coming up, of the development of African, US and Asian academies for the club - Williams D had several interests and connections in African and US football - and to try to use the large suite facilities for more than just match days - weddings (especially some non-Christian weddings which are traditionally large affairs requiring big facilities), conferences etc. The investment group were also looking at bringing over some of their other businesses to the area to stimulate jobs and growth in Blackburn and around which could have had a knock-on effect. On a DCF (discounted cash flow, means anticipated money adjusted for risk) or NPV (means Net Present Value, figuring out how much future income is worth today adjusted for interest/inflation costs) basis it is impossible to value an entity like this, what was intriguing was the potential for steady growth, a pretty solid asset base, some debt reduction and, for Plainfield, the chance to scale out of our investment at a profit by selling more and more of the club to Williams and/or other similarly minded people over time. Certainly EBITDA (which is Earnings before Interest, Tax, Depreciation or Ammortization - basically net revenues) is useless since the EBITDA of a club is extremely low if you strip out the one-off monies for sale of players. No matter what multiple you attach you're not getting anywhere near 25mm

My brain goes for the last one, but thanks to Rivercider (strange name) for putting the facts on the table and correcting the pontificators on here who think they are "all knowing".

But as we say up North...

Woe betide you if it is a load of crap.

[47er]

My brain goes for the last one, but thanks to Rivercider (strange name) for putting the facts on the table and correcting the pontificators on here who think they are "all knowing".

I told you-------RiverSider

[thenodrog]

Oh, and 4 - there is no way rivercider is a better writer than me.

I knew you'd bite!

Just a couple of points for the usual consipracy theory bores...

.........................................................................................

This latest development is odd to say the least. Somebody is clearly playing games.

The background stuff about the Dan Williams affair is as accurate as I have seen and is obviously from someone involved at the time.

If I was in that mob I would be slightly relieved that I didn't overpay for Rovers at the time.

Whether Dan Williams or Plainfield can come up with £25 million and cover the debts PLUS find cash for improvement NOW is another story.

Hang on Alan! You have just backed up a conspiracy theory....... Mine.

This thread is bizarre to say the least.

I don't want to get into the ins and outs of what going on, but a Dan Williams is certainly the sort of guy we need to take charge of the club.

He's obviously a fan and that ticks all the boxes for me.

I see Riversiders PR has certainly worked as intended with some.

[thenodrog]

...but nice riposte to the silly jibe from a predictable source.

Nice riposte??? Grief your standards have slipped. You've closed ranks I see. Same union obviously.

Personally I though the jibe was better than your sub editor attempt, and AN's riposte put together, but then I would wouldn't I?

[philipl]

Unless anyone reveals anything pointing to the contrary, then we should accept Rivercider at face value as:

- a former senior executive of Plainfield who was party to financing Dan Williams bid to buy Rovers which failed in March/April/May 2007 and certainly was completely dead before anything hit the press.

- and now a passionate Rovers fan.

He says himself that these posts have been a matter of historical record and that there is no way they are going back to bid for the Rovers.

That is just as well as the two examples of Americans buying English Prem clubs with borrowed/other people's money are hardly anything to make us sleep easily at night at the prospect of American ownership of Rovers.

[thenodrog]

'drog is going to get a lot of free drinks out of this if he plays his cards right!

Power dressing for today Gunner....... Suit and tie and a Kenny coat for the match and of course my pre match sojourn into the Fox and Hounds should do the trick I think.

[thenodrog]

That is just as well as the two examples of Americans buying English Prem clubs with borrowed/other people's money are hardly anything to make us sleep easily at night at the prospect of American ownership of Rovers.

The third is Villa who are doing OK, but I don't imagine that Lerner has made much money out of his 'investment' yet.

[thenodrog]

I find it hard to believe a person extremely close and involved in the situation 3 years ago would break their silence. If they did I would consider such a person untrustworthy and unemployable in the business world. Would you trust a person like that to own Rovers? I wouldn't as I could not trust them.

I haven't checked the dates but if they stack up then rivercider has stuck faithfully to his confidentiality clause and is therefore trustworthy.

Discreet might be a more appropriate word than trust in this instance.

[thenodrog]

Has Rivercider been on this weekend?

Maybe Mr Williams' PR Man doesn't work weekends?

Good old conspiracy theories!

Interestingly (to me at least) he's been on but not posted since my 'less can be more' comment.

He's certainly stimulated the board this weekend though.

[Blackburn Ender]

To follow up Nicko's point, I'm rather glad I started this topic now, although when I first heard there was possibly some movement in the sale, it was Middle East interest, not from the US.

I'm fairly certain my info came from the same source as the Maple Leaf blogger.

So, I'm somewhat amazed at the turn of events since Rivercider began posting!

I did speak to Dan Williams briefly last time around and beleive I was able to be fairly helpful.

He (and/or Rivercider) are welcome to PM me if they want any more information.

[Fylde Coast Fan]

Plainfield won't be buying anyone, and if Dan Williams had the money on his own wouldn't he have come on his own 3 years ago?

Since 2007, football has got significantly more expensive and the world economy has got significantly tougher.

[thenodrog]

To follow up Nicko's point, I'm rather glad I started this topic now, although when I first heard there was possibly some movement in the sale, it was Middle East interest, not from the US.

I'm fairly certain my info came from the same source as the Maple Leaf blogger.

So, I'm somewhat amazed at the turn of events since Rivercider began posting!

I did speak to Dan Williams briefly last time around and beleive I was able to be fairly helpful.

He (and/or Rivercider) are welcome to PM me if they want any more information.

A grey February morning.....

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/media/article7069738.ece

Philip's link from the other thread might be an indicator for the sudden desire of the trust to take less and get rid. They must see the writing on the wall.

[broadsword]

The third is Villa who are doing OK, but I don't imagine that Lerner has made much money out of his 'investment' yet.

Randy Lerner's used his own cash, so he has no wolves to keep from the door/ masters to please.

Little bit harsh from Philip I think, Plainfield made their own cash and were happy to sink the money in, not as a philanthropic gesture, but as a long term investment. Of course, we have no way of knowing for sure what would've happened, but the Glazers/ Liverpool pair, don't seem like a comparable case.

At least there would've been a cash injection over and above what is required to keep us going.

[philipl]

Randy Lerner's used his own cash, so he has no wolves to keep from the door/ masters to please.

Little bit harsh from Philip I think, Plainfield made their own cash and were happy to sink the money in, not as a philanthropic gesture, but as a long term investment. Of course, we have no way of knowing for sure what would've happened, but the Glazers/ Liverpool pair, don't seem like a comparable case.

At least there would've been a cash injection over and above what is required to keep us going.

My point exactly- Lerner used his own cash and therefore is not a good exception. The two purchases with borrowed American money are green and yellow scarf jobs.

Dan Williams was using Plainfield's money- rivercider indicated that was Plainfield's exit route.

However, I believe Brian goes wrong in talking about Plainfield's cash. Their web site home page states:

Plainfield Asset Management LLC was founded in February 2005 by Max Holmes. The firm manages investment capital for institutions and high net worth individuals based in the United States and abroad. Plainfield currently employs 85 people among its offices in Greenwich, Connecticut and Summit, New Jersey.

Plainfield Asset Management LLC is a registered investment adviser with the United States Securities and Exchange Commission. Plainfield Asset Management LLP is authorized and regulated by the Financial Services Authority in the United Kingdom. Plainfield is a QPAM for ERISA fiduciaries.

Seems to me Plainfield were going to use other people's money under management with them to finance Dan Williams' attempted purchase of Rovers. As such they must have been going for a commercial return on the deal- Rivercider acknowledges as such saying Rovers at least wouldn't have been as disastrous as some of the other deals they ploughed their investors' money into in the heady pre-crash days of 2007.

Rivercider hasn't answered my questions about Plainfield's target returns and what happened to their failing investments- he was eloquent talking about Rovers when out of NDA but not yet forthcoming on those aspects of his erstwhile employers.

[gumboots]

My point exactly- Lerner used his own cash and therefore is not a good exception. The two purchases with borrowed American money are green and yellow scarf jobs.

Dan Williams was using Plainfield's money- rivercider indicated that was Plainfield's exit route.

However, I believe Brian goes wrong in talking about Plainfield's cash. Their web site home page states:

Plainfield Asset Management LLC was founded in February 2005 by Max Holmes. The firm manages investment capital for institutions and high net worth individuals based in the United States and abroad. Plainfield currently employs 85 people among its offices in Greenwich, Connecticut and Summit, New Jersey.

Plainfield Asset Management LLC is a registered investment adviser with the United States Securities and Exchange Commission. Plainfield Asset Management LLP is authorized and regulated by the Financial Services Authority in the United Kingdom. Plainfield is a QPAM for ERISA fiduciaries.

Seems to me Plainfield were going to use other people's money under management with them to finance Dan Williams' attempted purchase of Rovers. As such they must have been going for a commercial return on the deal- Rivercider acknowledges as such saying Rovers at least wouldn't have been as disastrous as some of the other deals they ploughed their investors' money into in the heady pre-crash days of 2007.

Rivercider hasn't answered my questions about Plainfield's target returns and what happened to their failing investments- he was eloquent talking about Rovers when out of NDA but not yet forthcoming on those aspects of his erstwhile employers.

I had a quick look at the article next to the link and found the 10 youngest billionnaires. Since one is the guy who started facebook and we've already seen the influence facebook has on Rovers then perhaps we could persuade him he'd like to invest.

[nicko]

Tried to take in some of the bizarre events of the last couple of days around here.

The rivercider incident has been very amusing/interesting in its own way, but...that was three years ago.

I am not sure what relevance any of it has to what needs to be looked at just now.

The big differences between then and now seem to be.

1 - The trustees and their selling agents want less.

2 - Potential buyers are hard to find - even at a reduced price.

3 - Nobody is making money out of football any more and the signs ahead suggest that will become even harder.

[broadsword]

Has anyone ever made money out of football (except latter day players).

[Stuart]

At least there would've been a cash injection over and above what is required to keep us going.

And at a time when Mark Hughes was still manager...

Still not sure about the turn this thread has taken yet. I'm a firm skeptic as a rule and that's not changed yet. I keep asking myself why, what does this achieve?

Can't help but thinking that if there had been investment in 2007 then we may have been even more of an albatross to Plainfields than we seem to be to the Walkers. Without the protection of the Trust things could have been worse.

Having said that, with Hughes in charge it might have been enough to see us reach the Champions League (if only temporarily).

It is funny though, as another poster pointed out, that we seem always seem to look on the negative side of things when opportunities come along, and take a "grass would've been greener" view when they pass us by.

The lot of a Rovers fan, eh?

Still, let's not have any regrets, the deal wasn't right at the time or it would have been done.

[EwoodGlory]

Has anyone ever made money out of football (except latter day players).

Freddie Shepherd

[Paul Mellelieu]

http://themarpleleaf.blogspot.com/2010/03/where-are-blue-and-white-knights.html

interesting stuff.

[PAFELL]

http://themarpleleaf.blogspot.com/2010/03/where-are-blue-and-white-knights.html

interesting stuff.

Maybe interesting, but it is old news. The maple leaf thing has been mentioned on here a few weeks ago.