[Archived] Election

[koi]

The people giving the love for Hoyle have obviously never worked with him that's for sure. The only positive thing I can say about him is that there's not much going on between those ears of his, if there was I'd be very very worried.

By the way, if you ever want to meet the guy let him know you're opening something, an envelope for example, he'll be there in a flash with photographer close behind. Just don't quote what he says because his PR lets you know what he really should have said straight after

[Exiled_Rover]

Well I didn't vote for him...

[koi]

Maybe we need to look at further devolution; maybe give the Scots the full parliament they so desire. I wonder if the Labour party would welcome a separate election for England and Wales?

[speeeeeeedie]

It's now going on 8pm the day after, labour have lost 90+ seats, are 50+ seats behind the Tories, and are millions behind in the cumulative count yet Brown hasn't offered his resignation. He is no longer the leader of the majority party, it's time for him to fall on his sword.

As far as local seats; it's good to see Janet Anderson lose. Burnley goes to the Lib Dems with the BNP getting nearly 10% of the vote. If half those went Labour they would have won. Some independent got nearly 2,000 votes too. Hyndburn stayed Labour, but not by much. If the Tories had got their act together they could have won that one but infighting, and a candidate who'd never set foot in the borough didn't set them up well.

I also see that Labour won Bolton West by 92 votes.

[Amo]

Surely all of the big three's leaders should be booted? None of them came out smelling of roses, did they? Cameron thought the election would be cakewalk, yet failed despite Brown's implosion, and Cleggmania proved to be a flash in the pan (though I still suspect mail tampering).

[koi]

Surely all of the big three's leaders should be booted? None of them came out smelling of roses, did they? Cameron thought the election would be cakewalk, yet failed despite Brown's implosion, and Cleggmania proved to be a flash in the pan (though I still suspect mail tampering).

Disagree. I doubt Cam thought it would be easy; he needed one of the biggest swings in political history due to the boundary bias towards Labour. I'm not saying he wont be disappointed but the result is not exactly bad. Brown is being propped-up by his core vote in Scotland plus a couple of pockets in England and Wales. The Lib Dems really lost it in final week, they simply got tangled up in their own web of lies.

[jim mk2]

What is also perfectly clear is that the electorate appear not to understand the voting system.

Thank you Nick Robinson for that insightful analysis. The voting system is perfectly clear to most 5-year olds.

From what I have read there are two non-negotiable conditions for the Lib Dems to prop up a minority Tory government: a pledge to hold a referendum on reforming the voting system and that Gordon must step down as PM.

The inference from statements by Cameron and Gordon is that only Labour can or will deliver voting reform (Cameron's promise of an inquiry won't satisfy Lib Dems) while the PM's colleagues say he would not give up the office as the price of forming a Lib-Lab pact.

So in other words, it could well be impossible for the Lib Dems to form a coalition or even a pact.

Stories are also emerging that the die-hard Tory rank and file are seething at Cameron's abject failure to secure an outright majority and at this moment are trying to scupper any deal with the Lib Dems.

There are also Liberals of 40-plus years standing threatening to leave the party if Clegg sells out to the their old enemies, the Tories. This could go on. Election drama could soon become election boredom.

[thenodrog]

"The best government for Britain is a minority Conservative government" Francis Pym Defence Sec on the eve of the 1983 election.

A furious and vengeful Margaret Thatcher publically refuted this and quickly consigned him to the back benches in her new Govt.

This is possibly the best way to move forward with the swingeing measures which need to be taken so that no one party cops for the blame.

[Paul]

If you really believe that he's the one that will represent you best whatever the situation (and I think you are right in this case btw) then Labours Lindsay Hoyle of course. Be daft and self harming not to.

Don't be suckered into the politics of hate with this type of skewed logic..........

Voting for a party you don't necessarily support in order to keep out / defeat one you do not want to see in government. So in my case if I thought the Labour candidate was certain to lose I would vote Lib Dem in the hope of keeping out the Conservative candidate.

You know perfectly well I was using that as an example. Do you have anything worthwhile to contribute apart from your usual bile? BTW I don't hate anybody or thing, it's not an emotion I recognise.

[koi]

Thank you Nick Robinson for that insightful analysis. The voting system is perfectly clear to most 5-year olds.

From what I have read there are two non-negotiable conditions for the Lib Dems to prop up a minority Tory government: a pledge to hold a referendum on reforming the voting system and that Gordon must step down as PM.

The inference from statements by Cameron and Gordon is that only Labour can or will deliver voting reform (Cameron's promise of an inquiry won't satisfy Lib Dems) while the PM's colleagues say he would not give up the office as the price of forming a Lib-Lab pact.

So in other words, it could well be impossible for the Lib Dems to form a coalition or even a pact.

Stories are also emerging that the die-hard Tory rank and file are seething at Cameron's abject failure to secure an outright majority and at this moment are trying to scupper any deal with the Lib Dems.

There are also Liberals of 40-plus years standing threatening to leave the party if Clegg sells out to the their old enemies, the Tories. This could go on. Election drama could soon become election boredom.

ConservativeHome was doing a poll earlier I didn't take part because I don't know what I really think.

Hear the Spectator is threatening to fight Cameron if he goes ahead and does a deal with the Libs.

[only2garners]

It's now going on 8pm the day after, labour have lost 90+ seats, are 50+ seats behind the Tories, and are millions behind in the cumulative count yet Brown hasn't offered his resignation. He is no longer the leader of the majority party, it's time for him to fall on his sword.

He is still the Prime Minister and can't resign until he (and the Queen and her advisers) are sure that there is someone else who can command a majority in the House of Commons. It's an entirely understandable constitutional convention that he remains in office for the time being. Either Clegg will work with Cameron or will turn him down and look to Labour - that's when Brown would offer to resign to make the agreement work.

[grizfoot]

I heard this quote don't know where it came from but it perfectly sums up this general election I think.

"The people have spoken but we don't know what they've said."

[1864roverite]

Jim

I am sure that EACH and Every Tory is happy with the swing vote percentaqe, its just a shame that they couldnt get over the line with the extra 19 seats. They were close but not close enough BUT still managed to achieve the biggest swing ever.

[colin]

Apologies for the lack of reference but I read earlier today that for

every 35,000 votes Labour received, the party got a Parlimentary seat.

every 37,000 votes Conservatives received, the party got a Parlimentary seat

every 119,000 votes Liberal Democrats received, the party got a Parlimentary seat

I'm not a Lib Dem voter, indeed their manifesto has pledged to put me out of a job, but I don't think anyone can suppoort that electoral system.

Just to add, I wasted my vote in Gorton South where Gerald Kaufmann romped home again with a 15,000 majority. My vote meant nothing. Similarly a colleague at work commented that the Conservatives could have put a blue rosette on an ape and it would have won in his constituancy. It was only in the marginals that any one's votes mattered.

Time for some serious proportional representational voting system where evey vote counts.

On a lighter note, good to see Tim Farron kept his Westmoreland constituancy, and on a massive 75% turnout. But by the closest of margins. Good to have a second Rovers fan in Parliament.

[BuckyRover]

Why don't you move to a deprived urban area?

They might have different voting preferences

[tcj_jones]

I know that the Tories have held government for the majority of the last 100 years or so, and for that reason alone might not want to change the electoral system, but when they they have the support of the majority of the population, why not reform it?

[Ray-Von]

On a lighter note, good to see Tim Farron kept his Westmoreland constituancy, and on a massive 75% turnout. But by the closest of margins. Good to have a second Rovers fan in Parliament.

The new Hyndburn MP, Graham Jones, is a big Rovers fan too.

[only2garners]

Why don't you move to a deprived urban area?

They might have different voting preferences

What - more deprived than Gorton South? There's a challenge for you Colin.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I know that the Tories have held government for the majority of the last 100 years or so, and for that reason alone might not want to change the electoral system, but when they they have the support of the majority of the population, why not reform it?

Do Turkeys vote for Christmas ? They'd never be in power again, ever.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I can't believe the Lib-Dems are prepared to get into bed with the Cameronite public school clique. They'll be split from top to bottom. They'll be back to the days when all their M.P.s could fit in a London Taxi.

[thenodrog]

The new Hyndburn MP, Graham Jones, is a big Rovers fan too.

I heard a rumour that the new LibDem MP for Burnley Gordon Birtwistle is a Rover!

[RibbleValleyRover]

I can't believe the Lib-Dems are prepared to get into bed with the Cameronite public school clique. They'll be split from top to bottom. They'll be back to the days when all their M.P.s could fit in a London Taxi.

Well sounds like Brown could have frucked up any chance to do a deal. According to the BBC he spoke to Clegg last night over the phone in what was described as an angry ‘diatribe’. He reportedly shouted and ranted at Clegg and tried to bully him into a deal. Clegg not very happy with the angry exchange if reports are correct.

I personally don't think the Lib Dem's will go into a coalition with the Conservatives, at the same time i can't see how they could with Labour. I think it’s looking like its going to be a minority Conservative government with some sort of arrangement on key issues with the Lib Dem's. We will probably see another election within the next 2 years.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Well sounds like Brown could have frucked up any chance to do a deal. According to the BBC he spoke to Clegg last night over the phone in what was described as an angry ‘diatribe’. He reportedly shouted and ranted at Clegg and tried to bully him into a deal. Clegg not very happy with the angry exchange if reports are correct.

I personally don't think the Lib Dem's will go into a coalition with the Conservatives, at the same time i can't see how they could with Labour. I think it’s looking like its going to be a minority Conservative government with some sort of arrangement on key issues with the Lib Dem's. We will probably see another election within the next 2 years.

Brown's position vis-a-vis the Lib-Dems is obviously stronger than Clegg realises. That's what you get when you send a boy to do a mans job. Any alliance with the Tories however loose will leave the Lib-Dems tarred with a rather nasty brush.

My best mate voted Lib-Dem and he's spewing at the moment. I've refrained from saying " I told you so " at present but he'll get both barrels shortly.

[thenodrog]

Brown's position vis-a-vis the Lib-Dems is obviously stronger than Clegg realises. That's what you get when you send a boy to do a mans job.

I take it you mean Gordon Brown ringing Clegg instead of Labour's top man Peter Mandelson?

[LeChuck]

Why don't you move to a deprived urban area?

They might have different voting preferences

You think that's a fair way to run the system?

Colin's post is an excellent one. Any vote for a party that doesn't win in your local constituency is essential a lost vote - it counts for nothing if you don't back the winner.

The whole system is wrong. There are only 3 countries in Europe who try to govern with overall majorities like we do - this 'hung parliament' situation with heavy negotiation is the norm in 30 other European countries.

Also, some of the worst cases of expenses abuse came from politicians in very safe seats. Our current system breeds contempt.