[Archived] Election

[BuckyRover]

www.factsonfees.com

Cameron is not a lightweight. He is an impressive statesman. Something we have been lacking for quite some time.

Jim predicting the demise of the Lib Dems is very predictable. Only today news has come out that says that the coalition is likely to continue after the next election. With only Liam Fox being against an election pact in 2015.

Ed Miliband vs Con/Lib

Good luck with that.

[jim mk2]

Cameron is not a lightweight. He is an impressive statesman.

[Nate]

Bit of light reading Fee Facts

[BuckyRover]

Bit of light reading Fee Facts

Thanks Nate. I posted that earlier but it's good that people are finally starting to listen.

Someone on my wage, will be paying less per month than I am now. Meaning they will have more money to spend on their mortgage repayments. They will be paying for longer than me but they will have more money month on month to spend. Thats what matters surely.

[Nate]

Thanks Nate. I posted that earlier but it's good that people are finally starting to listen.

Someone on my wage, will be paying less per month than I am now. Meaning they will have more money to spend on their mortgage repayments. They will be paying for longer than me but they will have more money month on month to spend. Thats what matters surely.

It sounds exactly like the system we have here. Except our threshold is $45k or so, which is about £34k. Also here, you can pay up front, partial or defer to student loan. If you take the first two options you get a 25% discount per subject. I paid partial all the way through my degree to help lower my final debt.

Also, anyone earning under £21k will continue to have the interest on their loan subsidised by the government.

[BuckyRover]

The interest is not subsidised here but the debt is written off after 30 years regardless.

[Nate]

The interest is not subsidised here but the debt is written off after 30 years regardless.

That is you guys, not us. Under the new system, debt under 21k will be subsidised.

Anyone earning under £21,000 will continue to have the interest on their loan subsidised by the government. A real rate of interest will be applied to the loans of graduates earning £21,000 or more. The rate of interest will rise gradually as a graduate’s earnings increase, reaching a maximum of the RPI (Retail Price Index) + 3 per cent for those earning £41,000 or more. This will provide extra revenue and mean that those who earn more, pay more.

[BuckyRover]

Ha.

It's even more generous than I thought.

[BuckyRover]

“I say to my right hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Ladywood that Dearing was first minded to go for a graduate tax. He did not do so because he felt that the graduate contribution scheme that we are introducing through the Bill was superior, for two basic reasons. The first was that graduates paid their contribution towards their education and did not continue to pay for the rest of their lives. The second was that lump sums can be paid up front under a graduate contribution scheme to get the money paid off quickly. Dearing said that the graduate contribution scheme was income contingent, as with the graduate tax; that it was paid through the Inland Revenue, as with the graduate tax; and that if earnings fell below a certain level, the graduate would cease to pay, as with the graduate tax. That is why I believe that the Dearing report is at the nub of the debate.”

 

Alan Johnson 2004 (after top up fees were first introduced)

 

He now thinks a graduate tax is a good idea (even though when he was appointed Chancellor, he said it was unworkable and not the right choice.

[den]

That's rich Bucky. Mind quoting the promises made by the Lib Dems at the last election?

You have to remember that the trebling of University fees isn't part of the debt reduction programme. The debt will be sorted within a relatively short time frame, while these University fee changes will last for many years after the debt is brought down.

It's what the Tories wanted to do, but daren't say so in their election manifesto. and the Lib Dems have been caught hook, line and sinker.

[BuckyRover]

The Tories said so in their manifesto, as did Labour. This isn't being claimed as a deficit reduction policy, it's people paying their own way. I'm thinking of doing some further professional qualifications at a cost to myself of about £15k, fancy sending me a cheque if you are so keen on a free education? It will benefit society as I will earn more. What's the problem?

The quote above was from the Government at the time who had made promises while in Government that they reneged on. The Lib Dems made promises as a small party who had never seen power before.

[den]

The Tories said so in their manifesto, as did Labour. This isn't being claimed as a deficit reduction policy, it's people paying their own way. I'm thinking of doing some further professional qualifications at a cost to myself of about £15k, fancy sending me a cheque if you are so keen on a free education? It will benefit society as I will earn more. What's the problem?

Nice argument there for total, private education. If that's what you believe in, then fair do's. You're in a tiny minority.

There was no need to treble University fees. The opinion polls will tell you that the vast majority of the country don't want it. The Lib Dems don't want it and the Labour party don't want it.

[RibbleValleyRover]

Scumbags urinating on and defacing Churchill's statue will do the students cause no favours.

[modes98]

This isn't being claimed as a deficit reduction policy, it's people paying their own way.

Maybe someone should have told the Tory and Lib Dem MPs then. I've watched the whole debate so far and just about every Government Minister has mentioned it as a reason.

"Opening a noisy debate in the Commons, Mr Cable said the fees plan would "maintain high quality universities in the long-term, tackle the fiscal deficit and provides a more progressive system of graduate contributions based on people's ability to pay"" BBC

Shame that the returns from the increased fees won't be felt for a long time, if at all. One MP said that they expect 70% of loans to not be fully repaid, so that means that the taxpayer will pick up the difference. So why not just bite the bullet and fund it from the start like now and not put these financial concerns in the minds of students. I have a £6k tuition fee debt that I see increasing year on year with interest, I couldn't imagine getting a statement through with £40k on it and the interest growing on that, especially when there is no need to do it.

Encourage universities to offer a better, more efficient service which doesn't require them to use up so many resources.

I hope this is defeated and that the government can go back and re-evaluate the proposal. Eitherway Clegg has just ended the Liberals contribution to politics for the foreseeable future.

[chaddyrovers]

The fees might go up but it is up to the universities what they charge!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11483638

Also I bet half of the people who are protestsing are not students or go to University when they are older enough to go to! They just want to fight the police and be on Television to look good!

Also why should people who don't go to uni and get a job or a Modern Apprentices pay for people who do go to uni! We should help poorer students but not the students who go just so they don't have to get a job or come from wealthy families!

You should only go to Uni if you know what you want to do has a job like a lawyer or accountant and going to uni will help you with the professional that you want to go into! Too many students go to Uni and do a course that has nothing to do with the job they do after Uni!!!

[JAL]

If parliament votes in favour of raising tuition fees you can foresee ugly scenes unfolding outside Westminster tonight.

[thenodrog]

Tuition fees will only be high enough when this list is reduced to sensible proportions. So much of this stuff is just a sad joke.

http://search.ucas.com/cgi-bin/hsrun/search/search/StateId/QC1PBojRuyDBO--DuciBe00zTGCWG-3iNK/HAHTpage/search.HsKeywordSearch.run

Time they reviewed the use of the term 'Honours' too.

[jim mk2]

The Tories said so in their manifesto, as did Labour. This isn't being claimed as a deficit reduction policy, it's people paying their own way. I'm thinking of doing some further professional qualifications at a cost to myself of about £15k, fancy sending me a cheque if you are so keen on a free education? It will benefit society as I will earn more. What's the problem?

Typical right-wing ideology turning the education clock back to the 1930s that will see your favourite party defeated at the next election but please carry on and dig your own grave.

Disgraceful scenes of police brutality at the students' demonstrations but one has to have sympathy for the police with their reduced numbers owing to the public spending cuts.

[chaddyrovers]

If students think that they have the support of ther public, then I don't think that they do?

Fighting the police is NO WAY RIGHT!

ATTACKING THE POLICE WITH METAL STICKS AND BARRIES IS NOT RIGHT!!!

[JAL]

Tuition fees will only be high enough when this list is reduced to sensible proportions. So much of this stuff is just a sad joke.

http://search.ucas.com/cgi-bin/hsrun/search/search/StateId/QC1PBojRuyDBO--DuciBe00zTGCWG-3iNK/HAHTpage/search.HsKeywordSearch.run

Time they reviewed the use of the term 'Honours' too.

Thenodrog, we have the highest unemployment rate of kids between the ages of 16 and 24 in Europe WTF ! and being a father of two in this bracket, higher education at least gives them something to do and a small hope for the future but to put the fees up by this ridiculous amount which is way, way, above and beyond inflation the protesters have my deepest sympathies.

The politicians have lied, there plan is to load the debt onto these children, the children of our future whilst £100billion per year goes missing most of it out of the country.

I'm raging at the way this country has gone over the past decade, or so. I'm told today that Canary Warf or London docklands was built partly on stolen money from the Brinks Matt gold bullion robbery did you know this, now that says it all about us as a nation.

[chaddyrovers]

not everybody has to go to uni, they are some good careers out there without go to uni? why not go and do a modern apprenticeships out there like plumbing or electrician or car mechanic a painter and decorators. good career ith good money paid for those jobs

[thenodrog]

Typical right-wing ideology turning the education clock back to the 1930s that will see your favourite party defeated at the next election but please carry on and dig your own grave.

Disgraceful scenes of police brutality at the students' demonstrations but one has to have sympathy for the police with their reduced numbers owing to the public spending cuts.

When Margaret Thatcher was privatising the massive nationalised industries in the 80's the Labour opposition promised to renationalise the lot if only the public would vote them into power. Despite 13 years in power New Labour never even considered it. Oddly the unions seemed quite happy to stay quiet too.

Tonight Peter Allen of 5 Live discussed this with Ed Milliband and after listening to his condemnation of the ConLib action he put forward the qusetion "If you get back into power will you reverse this action?" Ed spluttered that he couldn't promise that and would have to revue the financial position of the country. Cue on air scoffing from Allen. Surely 'Rabbit in Headlights' Millband hasn't forgotten that his lot left the country in the desperate financial straits that now necessitates these harsh measures..... Or is he just pretending too?

As for suggesting police brutality? How about commenting on demonstrator violence? That would have come first I'm sure.

[BuckyRover]

Load debt? You don't have a clue. How is it debt when you only ever pay 9% of anything over 21k that you earn? They will be paying less than me month on month, when they are just starting out in their careers. If you just want to go to Uni and study, and not go on to get a well paid job, you can and you will never have to pay anything back.

Incredible.

Like I said earlier, anyone willing to pay for my post graduate qualifications? It's going to cost me a fortune, but im happy to pay (and I will have to pay for it myself, on top of my current student loan contributions which are higher than they will be in the future)

Any takers?

[thenodrog]

Thenodrog, we have the highest unemployment rate of kids between the ages of 16 and 24 in Europe WTF !

IF students are classified as not being in employment then it's no wonder. A graph revealing the %age increase of A level students going on to a University course would show a steep upward curve over the past 30 years.

Looking around at I see so much wasted time, money and resource in sending so many kids to uni and loading them with unecessary debt simply to study some abstract subject that they have absolutely no intention of using in later life.

[chaddyrovers]

attacked car containing Prince Charles and Camilla is well over the top! These students are THUGS!!! AND NOTHING MORE!!!

If you think that the British Public are going to back your campagin against the government over universities fees, you are having a laugh!!! You are wrecking buildings and burning christmas trees in London!!!

Students in London have gone over the top AGAIN!!!